Second Life Forums Archive - secondlife.com/vote database exploration and suggestions

Angel Fluffy

Very Helpful

Join date: 3 Mar 2006

Posts: 810

06-08-2006 20:28

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----- What is this document? -----------------------------------
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A list of URLs for secondlife.com/vote proposals that require Linden attention, either because they :
1) are personal requests (like "unban me from SL please"

which don't belong on the feature voting system.
2) are duplicates of already existing proposals (and thus need their status updating or at least linking between proposals).
3) are already under consideration or implementation, or are already implemented, but are not marked as such.
4) are very, very good ideas which LL should take notice of.

This list was made up by me (Angel Fluffy) on 09/June/05, by viewing each of the 1469 proposals in the database proposal list, and examining interesting ones in more detail. I did an ascending sort by proposal ID, opened each set of 15 pages of proposals as a new firefox tab, then opened each interesting (good,bad,outdated, etc) proposal in a new tab from there. Then repeated the process with the next 15 pages of proposals.
The idea for doing this came from /139/15/112410/1.html - I realised that if I was going to do it by email, I should send more then just a few pages. Oh, and I ended up posting this on the forum anyway, because :
1) more people can see it - and giving the public information is always a good idea
2) the forum makes the URLs clickable - which is more efficient then using copy/paste to open them.

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--- Proposals that can be closed now for being pointless or just need a quick explanation
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

* Spoons
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=379 (reject - pointless)
* Reduce Lag
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=284
* Rez only what's on same parcel as you - (tell them about changing draw distance?)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=364
* expand llTakeControls
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=37
* better tools for land purchases
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=24
* add 'fab' template (I have no idea what this means)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=909
* request community STFU about Bush Guy
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=896
* sarcastic proposal about build limits
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=857
* an animation that allows an av to scratch their genitals (close, tell poster to post in 'help wanted')
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=849
* more fun things to do in SL
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=841
* contradiction - both advocating and discouraging banning via land tools
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=799
* fix bugs in SL
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=745
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=705
* make av movement smoother
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=964
* test
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1455
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1135
* tails for avatars
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1372 (suggest they move their votes to "multiple attachment points per av" proposals like http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1178 )
* Did not get referral bonus
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1124
* Unban me
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1341
* Explain prim limits
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=701
* Explain Ginko Financial
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=702

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---- Proposals that relate to LL economic policy which you may be interested in
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

-----> Questions which beg for things
* Assigning residents jobs
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=665 (post a link to http://secondlife.com/tiki/tiki-index.php?page=GJSL instead?)
* Demand for money (stipends)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=951
* Demand for more money (stipends)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=950
* free land for premium members
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=606
* refunds for deleting textures
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=962
* lower tier cost
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1077
* bring back dwell
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=834

----> Serious? Economic Questions
* LL Taxes
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1430
* Fine ToS/CS violators
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1433
* paying for islands with Linden
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1305
* Tier payments via Linden
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1304

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---- Proposals that (AFIAK) are (I think) already/being implemented but aren't marked so
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

* Send objects to groups
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=321
* Have more then 15 groups
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=416
* Send announcements to groups
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=418
* allow voters to comment on proposals (tell them about using forum "discuss this proposal" links?)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=426
* Kiss attachment
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=451 (already exists inworld)
* returned objects go back to last folder they were in in inventory
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=271
* Friends list
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=264
* group owned land
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=180
* Estate Managers
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=133
* let users choose their home, and respawn at it
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=31
* Searchable second life database accessible from SL website
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=19
* relinking of objects to change root prim
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=16
* allow instant messaging to scripts without using listen ???
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=935
* only parcels of >206m appear in find (there is now a 'min parcel size' search)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=915
* select entire building at once (can't this be done by 'show objects on parcel owned by owner X"?)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=884
* muting ims from certain avs
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=870
* allow parcel owners to set telehubs on their land
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=845
* "Force (mid)Night" option
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=734
* let anyone set your land as home (is this already possible?)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=651
* allow direct teleporting to places people list in their profile picks
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=641
* allow IMs to all friends online (done : via right clicking your calling card folder)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=627
* close proposals that need closing (oh, the irony that I'm writing this!)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=589
* changing 'force sunset' option without restart
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1076
* more group roles then member/officer
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1445
* Ability to purchase more than one week of classified.
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1179

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---- Proposals that relate to entrenched LL policies - from interesting to futile ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

* Increase prim limits
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=305
* "restraining orders" policy
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=934
* make sitting avatars no longer immune from push
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=926
* Allow legal wills in SL
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=923
* Allow some textures to have priority over others in rezzing
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=920
* same prioritised rezzing for objects...
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1236
Ideas that indicate ignorance / need an explanation
* removing scripts from objects should reverse the effects of those scripts
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=945
* let vechiles go over 1000m
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=876
* let builds go up to infinite height
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=871
* allow changing of names
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=868
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=672
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1052
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1434
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1330
* bring back easier use of region search
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=842
* courts to handle complaints, rather then LL
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=822
* let partners share land (can groups have only 2 members after the changes?)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=818
* allow multiple partners - obviously a good idea, but there was another proposal just like this, which were closed for the sake of simplicity
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=790
* request for a new sandbox
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=759
* shift calculation of many things to client
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=739
* devolve 'rating' control from sim to parcel owner
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=986
* delink forums from SL world in terms of banning
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1053
* remove shout command
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1075
* objects that overlap into your land should be subject to your auto-return
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1114
*Support epassporte as a way of withdrawal besides PayPal
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1037
* bring back negative ratings
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1239
* add "paint" to SL
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=958

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--- Proposals I suspect (but do NOT know) are in development / being considered
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* add a dialog to confirm emptying trash (with "don't show this box in future"

option
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=903
* adding more 'picks' space in profiles
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=619
* Allow scripts to send each other messages without use of listens
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=608
* group teleporting
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=602
* llSetBuyPrice
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=600
* llGetParcelName & llGetParcelDesc
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=595
* Detailed 'granted' rights for people on land
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=588
* IMs during logout saved
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=587
* easy way to find land you own on main map
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1118

----------------------------------------------------------------------
-- Proposals that advocate things which are (AFAIK) Impossible.....
------------------------------------------------------------------------

* editing notecards with LSL
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=947
* revive dead sims
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=887
* save/restore parcel contents
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=885
* write to notecards from LSL (apparently LSL can't create assets?)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=859
* stop anyone who doesn't pay firing any object that pushes
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=858
* llTakeSnapshot (apparently LSL can't create assets?)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=765
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1161
* RL teleporting (I have no idea why this was proposed...)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=636
* "undo" for object movement
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1106
* POSSIBLY impossibly notecard generation
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1307

Angel Fluffy

Very Helpful

Join date: 3 Mar 2006

Posts: 810

continued

06-08-2006 20:29

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
----- Proposals that advocate things which you *might* be interested in
---------------------------------------------------------------------

* Treat trees as prims, not as a seperate class of object
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=955
* Allow muting of groups
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=342
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1068
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1418
* Pony Linden for the Teen Grid
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=487
* Single user / offline mode for learning controls / building?
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=507
* llHowManyAvatarsInSim()
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=560
* Bind objects together, without linking
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=156
* Clearer ToS, specifying penalties
/13/ad/42830/1.html#post456139 http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=145
* Scriptable clothes
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=83
* Let scripts rotate an av
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=29
* Physics for attachments
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=27
* Detect which face of touched object is touched (helps cut down on prims for things like control panels)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=918
* group objects into categories
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=906
* Allow deletion of Library items
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=659
* Give estate owners shell access
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=657
* LSL function to detect where an av is looking
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=648
* Friends ticker
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=618
* notecard overlays
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1097
* llGetRegionNameCoordinates and llGetRegionFromCoordinates
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1045

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Proposals which I think are definate good ideas and which LL should definately look at
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

=== Crucial
* Let prims be set so that it is impossible to move a camera through them (without this there is very little privacy in SL)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=276
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1048
* Let people send IMs from the SL website or another program to their friends (so many people requested this I have to put it here)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=948
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=836
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1050
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1360
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1363
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1119
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1222
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1197
* llTeleportAvatar() (would make a lot of difference for avatar movement)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=519
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=642
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1187
* "allow residents on parcel to hear chat by residents on other parcels" option for land (stops griefers standing just outside parcel and shouting abuse)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=681
* llReturnObject() for owner's land (stops prim pollution, devolves prim returning to people landowner picks)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1016
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1278
* COMPLETE access to one's OWN transaction history via SL website, downloadable for whole SL account history (how do businesses live without this?)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1007
* Longer profiles (obviously... we don't get enough space as is)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=998
* last login time for each user displayed in their profile (atm, we have to use groups to find it...)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=996
* more security tools for mainland sim owners (they're just not adequately protected against griefers)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1134
* mass setting of permissions (content creators love this)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=991
* Add parentage to objects, with a 'delete children' option to delete all prims spawned from another object (to help combat grid attacks and griefing)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1337
* Parents control hours their teen can spend playing second life (to keep teens sane and encourage parents to let their teens explore SL)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=586

=== Very useful
* Karma system to replace ratings
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=316
* Allow presetting of permissions on bulk uploaded textures
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=383
* DetectPush() / Pushed() event for objects
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=500
* Put groups into categories (land owning groups should have a minimum of *2* people, to allow partners to share land)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=504
* give inventory to group from LSL script (with big sleep time)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=892
* Provide a maximum L$/sqm filter option for the land sales tab
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=877
* LSL function to set buy price
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=751
* define prim limits PER AV on land
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=749
* have multiple groups for land with different access permissions (like ability to set home)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=652
* Encrypt dangerous data held by SL client ( /13/3c/85602/1.html )
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=978
* "switch" / "case" statement in LSL
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1022
* allow emotes in IMs
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1450
* post SL time on secondlife.com
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1143
* allow teens access to the adult grid with parental permission
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1029
* split resell/transfer permissions
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1018 /13/6d/87792/1.html#post890481
* select multiple objects at once and assign permissions to them all
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=886
* Whiteboards / blackboards
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=139
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=77
* option to allow land access when owner / landowning group officers are offline
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1398
* unite the SL wikis! (I suggest TikiWiki)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1406
* gender (and other) info retrievable by LSL
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1167
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1186

=== Would be nice, but not essential
* Longer chat messages (or automatically split long ones into multiple lines in the client, like MIRC does)
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=963
* show "X is typing" when someone is typing in an IM conversation
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=438
* Allow landowners to disable display of names / minimap dots for people on parcel
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=214
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1272
* Allow avs to have 'family trees'
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=561
* Allow scripts to add lines to existing notecards
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=570
* light control per-parcel
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=129
* allow landowners to edit land via web interface
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=60
* less cumbersome way of handling IMs
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=936
* Targetted gestures
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=928
* Gestures could attach/detach things from av
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=888
* allow users to blacklist certain textures or objects by a target so they don't load for that user
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=866
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=1032
* add landowner option to prevent avs taking snapshots when av or camera is on the parcel
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=783
* all snapshots should go to snapshots folder
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=643
* Land owner can make parcel dividing lines visible even in the air
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=582
* see name/details/permissions of prims within objects
http://secondlife.com/vote/index.php?get_id=961
* show actual item cost in 'purchase lindens' dialog that appears when you lack funds to buy something ("Item #A costs #B Lindens, you only have #C Lindens, you need #D more Lindens, the cost will be #E..."

Frans Charming

You only need one Frans

Join date: 28 Jan 2005

Posts: 1,847

06-19-2006 00:15

Wow Angel, that must have taken some time.
Allways good to see that someone takes the innitiative instead of moaning and whining. *applauds*

_____________________

PetGirl Bergman

Fellow Creature:-)

Join date: 16 Feb 2005

Posts: 2,414

06-19-2006 00:24

I have no votes to place..

)

How many votes do you have.. and per what time of weeks, months a year?...

Or are girl not allowed to vote in this country?

)) (Joke..)

I have used 10 so far.. . since I joined...

/Tina - EXAKT upp till kamp!

_____________________

Zi Ree

Mrrrew!

Join date: 25 Feb 2006

Posts: 723

06-19-2006 00:44

A related compilation, mostly based on my own pet-features list:
http://zi.furhome.net/features.html

_____________________

Zi!

(SuSE Linux 10.2, Kernel 2.6.13-15, AMD64 3200+, 2GB RAM, NVidia GeForce 7800GS 512MB (AGP), KDE 3.5.5, Second Life 1.13.1 (6) alpha soon beta thingie)

Blog: http://ziree.wordpress.com/ - QAvimator: http://qavimator.org

Second Life Linux Users Group IRC Channel: irc.freenode.org #secondlifelug

Angel Fluffy

Very Helpful

Join date: 3 Mar 2006

Posts: 810

06-28-2006 11:13

From: Frans Charming

Wow Angel, that must have taken some time.
Allways good to see that someone takes the innitiative instead of moaning and whining. *applauds*

Thank you.

From: PetGirl Bergman

I have no votes to place..

)
How many votes do you have.. and per what time of weeks, months a year?...
Or are girl not allowed to vote in this country?

)) (Joke..)
I have used 10 so far.. . since I joined...
/Tina - EXAKT upp till kamp!

You have 10 votes. You can move votes between proposals, but you can only ever have 10 votes allocated at once.

From: Zi Ree

A related compilation, mostly based on my own pet-features list:
http://zi.furhome.net/features.html

Some comments :
1) proposal 1229 on that list is dead. You should encourage people to shift their votes to proposal 1228.
2) "longer chat lines" needs a vote/forum source, it's a damn good idea (or at least, longer chat lines should be automatically split by the client and sent as seperate IMs).
3) "make it possible to write to a notecard, even if it's a pain to implement

Vote 570 Vote 69" has basically been dismissed by LL as impossible to implement as assets are seperate from scripts.
4) "script storage non volatile memory Forum" needs more attention. A good idea, I'll add it.
5) "show attachment point in context menu *before* the object gets attached Vote 813 Vote 361" A good idea, I'll add it.
6) "search / replace for all text related tasks (notecards, scripts) Vote 177 " - Another good idea I will add.

forum topic 116713 has been merged into this topic, as it is on a similar theme and also by me. Please read this other topic too.

Nekokami Dragonfly

猫神

Join date: 29 Aug 2004

Posts: 638

06-28-2006 11:31

I'm impressed by your organization (and dedication)!

I'd like to suggest that you add this one:

Prop: 203 - Support local devices beyond mouse and keyboard

1 - It would solve many problems at once, by allowing a wide expansion of ways of getting input into SL. It is intended to be flexible and generic, rather than for a specific single alternate controller.

2 - I don't see how it could harm anyone, as it's an alternate method of providing input to existing functionality. Permissions would be controlled through each user's local client, most likely.

3 - Several people have proposed straightforward ways of implementing it using known standards. It would also leverage the abilities of the community of residents by letting residents help create the interfaces for the different devices, minimizing the extra work required by LL.

4 - It would give residents more control over their environments by giving them more ways to exercise that control.

5 - It is functional, rather than cosmetic (unlike my beloved capes/cloaks/et al)

I hope this helps,

neko

_____________________

Help build InnerLife, a biofeedback adventure in Second Life
Please Vote:
Prop: 203 - Support local devices beyond mouse and keyboard
Prop: 201 - Scriptable Avatar Prims/NPCs/Mannequins/Animals
Prop: 199 - Capes, Cloaks, Coats, Veils, Belts, etc.

Angel Fluffy

Very Helpful

Join date: 3 Mar 2006

Posts: 810

my current suggested features list

06-28-2006 11:37

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

---> Current major improvements in the pipeline :
*) new anti-griefer controls (ban line heights, better muting, LSL-queriable account statusses, llPush limits, etc)
*) increasing group limits from 15 to 25, and having a fine-grained permissions system in groups
*) increase height of ban lines to 768 - partially

implemented
*) longer profiles

--> Major new ideas with greatest need for debate :
fine people who break the ToS/CS

--> Feature Suggestion list
Suggestions here are rated as importance (on a 1 to 3 scale where 1 is highest) followed by ease of implementation (on a 1/3 scale where 1 is easiest).
So, 1/1 is very important and very easy, 3/1 is good but not important, and very easy. 1/3 is very important but more difficult to implement.

1/1 don't render inaccessible parcels for people who can't go there
1/1 copy protection for notecards and written works -

forum topic
1/1 Allow an unlimited number of 1 point votes per resident
1/1 Give more votes per person in the secondlife.com voting system

1/2 allow creative commons licencing
1/2 let prims be set so camera can't be moved through them for privacy

redux
1/2 give mainland land owners serious security tools
1/2 a ban list for public groups bans for groups, again
1/2 fine-grained permissions system for push - forum

topic
1/2 allow bans on parcels/sims to affect and account's alternative avs
1/2 allow rating of proposals from "strongly for" to "strongly against"
1/2 complete transaction history access

1/3 overall suggestions to improve SL voting system
1/3 Open the SL codebase to community contributions

forum topic
1/3 fine-grained permissions system to replace 'friends' list
1/3 huge list of changes needed in groups!
1/3 /13/04/112653/1.html
1/3 Karma system without money

2/1 more anti-griefer security tools - warning on damage enabled land/sims, personal ban lists
2/1 let proposers cancel their proposals
2/1 redirect people to voting system when grid is down
2/1 link from feature suggestions forum to voting system
2/1 let proposers cancel their proposals
2/1 last login time for each user displayed in their profile
2/1 LSL commands to alter parcel attributes forum

topic
2/1 subscription payments from one avatar to another
2/1 show attachment point in context menu *before* the object gets attached

and again
2/1 llReturnObject() for owner's land redux

2/2 longer profiles
2/2 better handling of notecards sent to someone who is offline
2/2 allow printing and saving of notecards
2/2 remove modify permission inheritance
2/2 non-volatile memory for scripts
2/2 search / replace for all text related tasks (notecards, scripts)

forum topic
2/2 support for symlinks in inventory and again

forum topic
2/2 parental control for teen grid

3/1 allow an 'other' option besides male and female for avatar gender
3/1 allow gender to be retrieved by LSL scripts
3/1 categorise groups

3/2 Forum Topic : an 'continual walk/run' button
3/2 allow easier use of non-human avs
3/2 Forum Topic : allow scripted attaching/detaching of attachments
3/2 multiple attachments to each body part #1
3/2 multiple attachments to each body part #2
3/2 multiple attachments to each body part #3
3/2 allow swimming
3/2 split the resell and transfer permissions
3/2 allow an option for fair use copying

3/3 llInviteToGroup function to invite avs to a group from a script
3/3 allow emotes in IMs
3/3 allow payment via Egold, or other systems apart from paypal
3/3 Support local devices beyond mouse and keyboard

Other sources :
Zi Ree's list of suggested features

Angel Fluffy

Very Helpful

Join date: 3 Mar 2006

Posts: 810

updated version of my list

07-02-2006 12:19

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

---> Current major improvements in the pipeline :
*) new anti-griefer controls (ban line heights, better muting, LSL-queriable account statusses, llPush limits,

etc)
*) increasing group limits from 15 to 25, and having a fine-grained permissions system in groups
*) increase height of ban lines to 768 -

partially implemented
*) longer profiles

---> Well-known ideas currently stalled
*) allow the muting of groups (with response by LL)
*) copy protection for notecards and written works -

forum topic

LL response
*) Allow writing to notecards by LSL script. Currently on hold because it's very

hard for LSL scripts to interface with the asset server.

--> Major new ideas with greatest need for debate :
fine people who break the ToS/CS

--> Feature Suggestion list
Suggestions here are rated as importance (on a 1 to 3 scale where 1 is highest) followed by ease of implementation (on a 1/3 scale where 1 is easiest).
So, 1/1 is very important and very easy, 3/1 is good but not important, and very easy. 1/3 is very important but more difficult to implement.

1/1 don't render inaccessible parcels for people who can't go there
1/1 Allow an unlimited number of 1 point votes per resident
1/1 Give more votes per person in the secondlife.com voting system

1/2 allow creative commons licencing
1/2 let prims be set so camera can't be moved through them for privacy

redux
1/2 give mainland land owners serious security tools
1/2 a ban list for public groups bans for groups,

again
1/2 fine-grained permissions system for push -

forum topic
1/2 allow bans on parcels/sims to affect and account's alternative avs
1/2 allow rating of proposals from "strongly for" to "strongly against"
1/2 complete transaction history access
1/1 redirect people to voting system when grid is down
1/1 link from feature suggestions forum to voting system
1/1 let proposers cancel their proposals

1/3 overall suggestions to improve SL voting system
1/3 Open the SL codebase to community contributions

forum topic
1/3 fine-grained permissions system to replace 'friends' list
1/3 huge list of changes needed in groups!
1/3 /13/04/112653/1.html
1/3 Karma system without money

2/1 more anti-griefer security tools - warning on damage enabled land/sims, personal ban lists
2/1 let proposers cancel their proposals
2/1 last login time for each user displayed in their profile
2/1 LSL commands to alter parcel attributes

forum topic
2/1 subscription payments from one avatar to another
2/1 show attachment point in context menu *before* the object gets attached

and again
2/1 llReturnObject() for owner's land redux
2/1 'no outside sensor' flag for land
2/1 provide better financial options for estate managers
2/1 "disable channel 0 listens by objects not owned by parcel owner" setting
2/1 option to logout without quitting SL

2/2 longer profiles
2/2 better handling of notecards sent to someone who is offline
2/2 allow printing and saving of notecards
2/2 remove modify permission inheritance
2/2 non-volatile memory for scripts
2/2 search / replace for all text related tasks (notecards, scripts)

forum topic
2/2 support for symlinks in inventory

and again forum topic
2/2 parental control for teen grid

3/1 allow an 'other' option besides male and female for avatar gender
3/1 allow gender to be retrieved by LSL scripts
3/1 categorise groups

3/2 Forum Topic : an 'continual walk/run' button
3/2 allow easier use of non-human avs
3/2 Forum Topic : allow scripted attaching/detaching of attachments
3/2 multiple attachments to each body part #1
3/2 multiple attachments to each body part #2
3/2 multiple attachments to each body part #3
3/2 allow swimming
3/2 split the resell and transfer permissions
3/2 allow an option for fair use copying

3/3 llInviteToGroup function to invite avs to a group from a script
3/3 allow emotes in IMs
3/3 allow payment via Egold, or other systems apart from paypal
3/3 Support local devices beyond mouse and keyboard

Other sources :
Zi Ree's list of suggested features

Angel Fluffy

Very Helpful

Join date: 3 Mar 2006

Posts: 810

Link to related topic

07-11-2006 07:13

Link to related topic

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Angel Fluffy

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Posts: 810

section 1 : list version July 12th, 2006

07-12-2006 16:24

Feature Voting Tool ideas list by Angel Fluffy, 12th July 2006.
Notes :
1) Items on this "to-do" list that I suggest LL implement are rated using stars, from 1 star "*", to 5 star "*****" - where 5 stars is what I consider the most important.
2) The star rankings are based on several factors : urgency (how badly the feature is needed), popularity (how badly people want it), who it helps (general tools have priority over tools for niche interests), if it is functional or cosmetic (functional changes have priority over merely cosmetic ones) and which of the 3 types of change it falls into (bug fix, new feature, or policy change). I make no claim that this is an unbiased list. It is biased in favour of functions to enhance the security of Second Life (due to recent griefer problems), ensure privacy for residents, and make some very commonly done things (like inviting people to groups) more convenient.
3) Where I do not have enough information to review an idea, I have put it in the group of ideas that need Linden feedback to find out if they are workable or not.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

---> Current major improvements in the pipeline :
*) new anti-griefer controls (ban line heights, better muting, LSL-checkable account statuses, llPush limits, etc)
*) increasing group limits from 15 to 25, and having a fine-grained permissions system in groups
*) increase height of ban lines to 768 - partially implemented
*) longer profiles

---> Well-known good ideas currently stalled
*) allow the muting of groups (with response by LL)
*) copy protection for notecards and written works - forum topic LL response
*) Allow writing to notecards by LSL script. Currently on hold because it's very hard for LSL scripts to interface with the asset server.

--> Major new ideas with greatest need for debate :
264 : see your friends' friends - interesting if friends' names are one colour, and their friends another?
1433: fine people who break the ToS/CS
1430: LL levying a tax on content/transactions

--> Ideas I do not understand but that sound interesting :
grandparent prims
a LSL feature similar to llLinkMessage but for attachments

---> Permissions

* 383: pre-set permissions on bulk uploads
** 681: soundproof parcels
807: Allow renaming of objects with no modify contents
*** 966: Creative Commons Licencing
* 991: set permissions en masse
* 1389: notecards should be printable and savable to local disk

---> Client Options
** 582: option to make property lines visible all the way up
*** 892: "give invite to group" option, say in the pie menu
** 988: packed/unpacked objects should have different inventory icons, to avoid box-on-head problems
* 992: history of visited places
*** 989: bigger, static object/texture/download cache
** 993: 'popular places' list should show more than top 20
* 1069: increase the maximum particle count
** 1469: "logout without quit" option

---> Builder tools
* 77: brushes to generate textures on the fly
** 886: change multiple objects' properties at once
* 961: easier manipulation of linked prims
* 1206 : more shapes for prims

---> Avatars, Profiles and relationships
*** 200: non-human avatars
*** 530,1178,1271: multiple attachments per body part[/url]
** 561: Include a 'family tree' section of profiles
*** 971: allow avatars to bill other avatars on a reoccuring cycle.
*** 996: profiles should display the last logged in date of their Resident
** 1306: a 'no gender' option for avs.
** 1544: friends list should contain both friend names and last online dates
* 1601: disable tying sound via preferences

---> Security
**** 134 : land bans should affect alt accounts
**** 276: stop camera moving through prims into homes
*** 586: let parents control how much their kid plays SL
***** 703 : objects in inaccessible parcels should not render forum discussion
** 866: per-av texture blacklist
**** 1016: llReturnObject, returning objects via scripts
**** 1032: mutes should apply to objects owned by muted Residents, too
***** 1278: llReturnObject.... return objects via a script, for security
* 1337: delete a prim and all its children
***1048: stop camera moving through prims into homes
***** 1386: Seronis Zagato's secure push proposals
**** 1480: ability to turn off mapping for friends
**** 1597: bans on avatars should also affect their objects

---> Estate Tools
*** 657 : better diagnostic tools for estate owners (like shell access)
**** allow estate setting where either estate owner only pays tier on land they own, or they can auto-bill residents

---> Land
**** Have built-in tools to rent land, as we do with selling land
* 129: per-parcel ambient light setting
* 214: disable nametags option for parcels
* 783: disable snapshots on parcel option
** 789: per-av prim limits on land
** 885: save/restore parcel contents
** 1077 : Lower tier cost and stop giving away L$ free
* 1118: display land you own on the world map
* 1240: trading land option
* 1458: water sandbox
* 1507: neighbours get first choice of buying land up for sale
** 1582: limit number of scripts per av, parcel setting
**** 1585: block outside sensors option for parcels

---> LSL
***** 117: search/replace in notecards/scripts
** 500: pushed() event.
** 519: llTeleportAgent
*** 525: llInviteToGroup
** 560: llRequestNumberOfAvatarsInSim - used to power down scripts if many agents are present
* 570: llPutNoteCardLine
* 595: llGetParcelName, llGetParcelDesc
** 600: llSetPrice
** 751: llSetBuyPrice
*** 765: llTakeSnapShot
*** 859: llWriteNotecard
*** 916: llInviteToGroup, llEjectFromGroup
** 947: llEditNotecard
** 995: llSitOnTarget
* 1022: "switch" statement
* 1089: llDropFromAvatar
* 1097: llSetPrimNotecard
* 1161: llTakeScreenShot
**** 1167: more agent data accessible via scripts
**** 1182: body/clothing manipulation by scripts
** 1185: /* block comments */
** 1186: gender accessible via LSL
*** 1307: support notecard generation from LSL
**** 1365: llSetMass for objects
** 1538: LSL commands to set no-build/no-script on parcels during griefer attacks
*** 1592: push detection via LSL event

---> Offline/"out of SL" tools :
*** 203: support for local devices beyond mouse/keyboard
** 507: offline building/learning tool
*** 618: news/friends ticker

---> IMs
** 483: "_____ is typing a message" notice, as IM protocols have
****

836,948,1050,1119,1197,1222,1360,1363:Allow people to send IMs without being in SL
*** 963: longer IM message limit - or... allow them to type more, but make the client break it up and send it as multiple IMs.
** 1232: /me emotes/actions in IMs.
** 1450: /me emotes/actions in IMs.

---> Groups
**** 342: muting group chat
**** 567: banlist for groups
**** 1068: muting group chat
**** 1418: togglable "can send IM to group" role permission, muting of group chat - needed!
** 1555: allow the downloading of a group member list in text format
*** 1558: option to hide the groups you are a member of in your profile
***** 1600: clientside group IM muting

---> SL Website
** 1143: put a SL-time clock on secondlife.com's front page
*** 1406: Merge the wikis

---> Inventory
*** 461: test uploads which are time limited and free
**** 573,1165: inventory symlinks
** 1116: notification of notecards recieved when offline
* 1459: inventory sort by date

---> Voting system :
*** 426: allow commenting on proposals - or better yet, require forum topic for all proposals
*** 551: allow proposers to delete their proposals - or at least give them the voting system admin's contact email.
**** 653: link to SL feature suggestions forum from voting system pages
**** 984: more votes per player
* 639: allow votes against a proposal
**** 1349: redirect people to voting system when grid is down
** 1366: allow voting on acknowledged proposals
***** 1402: unlimited single votes, limited bonus votes.

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Angel Fluffy

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Join date: 3 Mar 2006

Posts: 810

section 2 (Linden Section) : list version July 12th, 2006

07-12-2006 16:34

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Jeska Linden

Administrator

Join date: 26 Jul 2004

Posts: 2,388

07-14-2006 15:21

Wow! Thanks for all of that, I spent about an hour or so today removing some of the older ones you mentioned and marking some in progress. Hope to have more time to spend on this next week as well!

Angel Fluffy

Very Helpful

Join date: 3 Mar 2006

Posts: 810

07-16-2006 08:18

From: Jeska Linden

Wow! Thanks for all of that, I spent about an hour or so today removing some of the older ones you mentioned and marking some in progress. Hope to have more time to spend on this next week as well!

You're welcome

I could make an even more useful list if I knew some things, such as what exactly is "on topic" for the voting system?
So far, I've gathered from the comments on proposals like 407: bill of rights that you don't want policy questions on the FVT, and you don't want bug reports. It's just for technical code changes that implement new features. That's a hard line to draw, with cases such as charge a tax on all monetary transactions in SL as they are both code and policy. For now I stick the clear 'policy' ones in 'suggested closures' and the vague/economic ones in 'maybe close these?' category.

There are two other things I would suggest : it is far easier for you to edit my posts and mark the ones you have closed as closed, say, by putting a ` or other character in front of their lines, than it is for me to recheck them all after you have gone through part of the list.
I would suggest doing this for two reasons :
1) it's the fastest way of keeping the list up to date.
2) I've noticed a lot of complaining on the SL forums lately that LL doesn't listen to Resident feedback. I was thinking that if you posted that you'd gone through my list and acted upon it, marking the ones you changed, it would send a clear signal to the Residents on the forums that LL *does* listen, which would be good for LL's image and might result in less angst on the forums.
If you do this, please say so. A lot of the good effects come from the saying so

If you want to do more on the voting system, I think one of my next projects is going to produce a list of ways to boost the voting tool, rather like the vote I proposed a few days ago, 1632: list of ways to boost banning powers in SL. If you're the FVT/website admin/coder, then it makes sense for you to take a look at parts of this list - several of the changes fall into the "very useful but such a small change that few people will vote for it in the FVT" category, so tend to get missed despite the fact they'd only take a few minitues for a coder to put in place and would probably save a LOT of hassle for people in future, such as :
1) 653 : link to SL feature suggestions forum from voting system pages, to encourage people to use it.
2) 1143: put a clock on secondlife.com so we can see the SL time when we're not using SL.
3) 1349: redirect people to voting system when grid is down to stop them bugging Lindens about when it'll be back up and encourage them to use the voting tool.
4) The "URL" field viewing as a "Discuss This Message" link when viewing multiple proposals in a list should also be viewable when viewing a single proposal, to make sure the proposals are connected to the forum and to thus encourage Resident discussion of proposals and thus higher quality proposals overall.

Thanks for taking notice and using the proposals. I hope that lists like this one could turn into a sort of shared work list, to:
1) Efficiently sort out problems with the voting system, and thus...
2) Restore Resident confidence in LL desire to get and use feedback.

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Jeska Linden

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Join date: 26 Jul 2004

Posts: 2,388

08-01-2006 13:09

I've got a list of all of the proposals I've updated in the last few weeks (in numerical order):

19 (website)
24 (rejected, informational)
31 (explained homepoint/landing points)
130 (MARKED DONE)
133 (estate managers)
180 (in progress - groups)
217 (In Dev - Name Change)
231 (In Dev - Name Change)
271 (pointed to info)
284 (rejected - added info)
305 (policy -explained)
307 (In Dev - Name Change)
321 (in progress - groups)
364 (rejected - explained)
379 (rejected -pointless)
416 (in progress - groups)
418 (in progress - groups)
426 (added info about proposal linking)
451 (pointed to info)
589 (done)
626 (marked done)
627 (done)
641 (done)
672 (in dev - name change)
701 (closed, explained tier system)
702 (pointed to ginko)
705 (closed, pointed to release notes for fixed bugs)
734 (done)
745 (closed, pointed to release notes for fixed bugs)
769 (marked done)
790 (can't do)
799 (noted improvments in ban lines)
818 (in dev - groups)
822 (pointed to thread about resident review panel)
833 (In Dev - Name Change)
841 (closed, routed to "fun stuff in SL' page)
842 (done)
845 (done)
849 (closed, recommended posting in forums)
857 (marked done, not clear)
868 (In Dev - Name Change)
870 (done)
884 (done)
896 (Griefing, deleted)
915 (done)
923 (closed, not doable)
926 (closed, not doable)
934 (policy - explained)
958 (can't do - pointed to other resources)
964 (closed, mentioned avatar improvements and a/o)
986 (ack, explained ratings on estates)
1011 (In Dev - Name Change)
1052 (In Dev - Name Change)
1053 (policy, can't do)
1076 (MARKED DONE)
1124 (routed to support)
1135 (deleted)
1179 (done)
1232 (in dev)
1239 (policy, marked can't do)
1297 (In Dev - Name Change)
1330 (In Dev - Name Change)
1341 (deleted)
1372 (closed, pointed to 117

1415 (in progress - groups)
1434 (In Dev - Name Change)
1445 (in progress - groups)
1450 (in dev)
1455 (deleted)
1476 (marked done - already possible)
1484 (marked done - already possible)
1490 (in progress - groups)
1616 (In Dev - Name Change)

Draco18s Majestic

Registered User

Join date: 19 Sep 2005

Posts: 2,744

08-01-2006 16:22

Wow, that's quite a list. Thanks Jeska.

Frans Charming

You only need one Frans

Join date: 28 Jan 2005

Posts: 1,847

08-01-2006 21:39

*Send some Forum Love to Jeska*

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Angel Fluffy

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UPDATE : 21st August 2006, parts 1 and 2 of 4

08-23-2006 09:12

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UPDATE : 21st August 2006, part 3 of 4

08-23-2006 09:16

======= Part 3 : My list of suggestions for reforming the feature voting tool

It has been noted by several residents that many people get fed up with the feature voting tool.
In many cases, residents have uttered ideas as to what they think would improve SL, and I have suggested that they use the FVT to express these ideas.
Over 90% reject the idea. Let me say this clearly : When I refer people to the FVT, I get more people saying LL won't listen than I get people willing to use it. This indicates a serious problem with communication between LL and residents.

The reasons they give for not liking the FVT mostly boil down to :

1) Residents think that the Lindens ignore resident feedback on the FVT. This problem can be fixed.
2) Residents consider the FVT awkward and difficult to use. This problem can also be fixed.

In this part of my post, I'm going to explain both the problems, and what we can do about them.

FVT Problem #1) Residents think that the Lindens ignore resident feedback on the FVT. This problem can be fixed.
You wouldn't believe how many people genuinely feel that the Lindens don't listen to what Residents say on the FVT. People tell me this all the time.
Several high-profile forum posters (examples : 1,
2,
3) have said as much. It does not help that Prop 1503 is the highest-voted proposal in the voting system, yet is marked "can't do" with a poor reason. Prop 1523 is also very highly rated... yet residents felt that LL completely ignored both proposals.
There is a definate perception amongst SLers that LL only listen to residents when what residents say fits in with LL's own plans. This perception needs to change, or a lot of otherwise helpful residents will remain silent and not offer the useful feedback they otherwise would have, as they feel they are being ignored.

FVT Problem #2) Residents consider the FVT awkward and difficult to use. This problem can also be fixed.
There are a few classic examples of this:
2a) "Discuss This Proposal" links show up on the list of proposals, but not on the detail page for each proposal.
2b) Proposals have a rather low maximum character count, and aren't editable after being posted.
2c) The feature voting system isn't even known to EXIST by most residents, and even when it is, it's often confused with the voting system in groups.
2d) There is no obvious link between the feature suggestions forum and the FVT.
2e) There are a lot of duplicate and out-of-date proposals in the system.
2f) The FVT is hard to search as the ACDX flags are not mutually exclusive. This means that when I search for proposals 'in development', I also get all the 'completed' proposals.
2g) There are hundreds of proposals which have nobody but their creator voting on them, and which clog up the system and contribute to the problem that the FVT is hard to search through and thus tends to encourage votes to split their votes on lots of similar proposals according to which one they see first.

Ok, so how do we tackle these problems? Let us consider each in turn.

To tackle the perception that Lindens do not listen to residents:

1) I suggest LL make a policy to respond to all proposals with over 500 votes within one month, even it is only to say "we heard you".
For example, this post in SL answers describes prop 422, which despite being a *very* old proposal, *and* having over 600 votes, *and* being brought up on SL Answers *and* being referred along by Torley over a month ago... still has no response. When residents do as they are told and post messages to SL Answers, yet still have their proposals seemingly ignored, it *does* sap their morale.

2) I suggest that LL put links to relevant FVT proposals in their version release notes.
Doing this would show residents that LL is putting features into SL that residents have requested via the FVT.
It would thus build resident trust in LL's ability to listen, *and* help advertise the FVT at the same time.

3) I suggest LL cull the cruft from the FVT.
The fact that so many unworkable and junk posts are allowed to build up on the FVT sends a clear message that LL do not care about it.
If LL went to more effort to keep it clean, then residents would be more inclined to believe they spent time reading it and acting upon it.

4) I suggest LL take more time over the way they respond to proposals on the FVT.
For example, the Linden response given to Prop. 1503 has left many residents with a clear impression that LL does not listen to resident feedback. This impression may not be accurate at all, but that does not matter - even if the impression is inaccurate it does remain with residents and damages relations between residents and LL.
The actual response given :

From: Linden Lab

We're currently tracking this situation closely and plan to continue to improve features for controlling griefing, including better mute tools that extend mute beyond the avatar to objects and IMs.
Read more here:
http://secondlife.blogs.com/change/2006/06/the_view_from_b.html

is a response which, to many, reads like an attempt to fob residents off, by switching the topic from "give us back identity verification" to "we're going to do something about griefing".

You probably don't see it because residents have given up talking to you all the time about it, but I see it daily. Every few days I get someone mention how either SL has gone very much downhill as a result of open registration, or something similar.

I realise that you guys are rushed for time, but when faced with the single most popular vote in the history of the SL feature voting tool, it might be a good idea to take more time over the reply.
Enough residents thought your reply was inadequate that they rejected your response and re-started essentially the same proposal again as prop 1523.

I suspect that your response to #1 and #2 was based on a very simple mistake : you assumed that residents would be satisfied with new anti-griefer tools, when in fact what they wanted was the ability to exclude non-verified accounts from their land.

Your response to their proposals was deemed unsatisfactory by many residents as it did not address their two basic worries : 1) that LL was not listening, 2) that SL would be overrun with unverified accounts.
This feeling of being ignored, again, creates feelings of distrust amongst residents.

The good news is that this problem is very much fixable.
You *can* avoid creating these feelings of distrust and being ignored amongst residents.

To do so, you must change the way you respond to proposals like these.
Firstly, you should address the problem directly, and avoid using 'something else' to placate residents with.
Secondly, you should get the residents' sympathy on your side and get them to put themselves in your shoes. You're dealing with adults here, and adults can do that if you give them the information to do so.
Thirdly, you should show that you are making real progress in response to resident demands. Instead of saying "can't do", say "won't do as this would go against the wishes of a very significant portion of the SL population".

If I were commenting on that proposal 1503, here is what I would say :
"Thank you for your suggestion. Unfortunately, we at Linden Lab are in a difficult position here. On the one hand, we have many people who want open registration, such as people in countries where credit/debit cards are difficult to obtain, and people who want SL to be a more open communications platform. On the other hand, we have people who want to keep SL restricted in some ways to give some degree of security, such as sim owners who want to protect their sims from griefing, and adult content providers who want to stop minors buying their products. No matter which policy of these two we pick, we get complaints from the other side. Therefore, we have decided to have a general policy of open registration, but also provide parcel owners, sim owners and scripters the ability to detect the payment status of residents and make blocking decisions based on this information. This policy means that areas which want to limit access to those who provide payment info can, whilst areas which want to be more open can do that too. We feel this choice gives residents maximum freedom and control over their space. It was a difficult choice, but ultimately we did this as we feel it is good for SL, and we have given residents the tools to retain the 'old', payment-info-required behaviour of SL if they wish. We debated this intensely within LL, and ultimately we think this is the best choice to move SL forward. If you disagree, you are welcome to build and remain in pay-info-required areas, but we ask you to wait a few years to see how it effects SL in the long term before judging the outcome."
What does this response do?
1) It thanks residents for making the effort to try to talk to you.
2) It explains that you are in a difficult position, and gets them to sympathise with you, thus neutralising a great deal of their hostility.
3) It explains why you are doing what you are doing.... in a way which DIRECTLY expresses their concern. Their concern is partly that you are not listening to them. By posting something like this, you show that you are not only listening to them, but listening to ALL of them and trying to get a compromise solution that is acceptable to everyone. That's the key - show residents that what you do is intended to be for the good of SL and is based on feedback from ALL residents about what they want/need, and you will get a much better response.
4) Explain your choice in terms that residents like, such as devolving the power of choice to them, and reminding them of their ability to exercise this to get what they want.
5) Assure them that you did THINK about this before doing it, and that you did debate it out and generally have a lively debate about it within the company. Make sure it is clear to residents that it wasn't just the fiat of an anonymous manager high up in LL who is trying to please his corporate investors.

I know you are capable of doing it. You did it with Prop 407, you defused the situation by making clear that you were considering the proposal, and that your issue was not with the idea, but with the place the idea was proposed. That move was enough to placate the residents. Residents don't really care about most of the issues they nag you about. What they really care about is that when they get frustrated with things that annoy the heck out of them, that LL seem to care and help them where possible. That is what they really care about - they really care that LL listens. That is why the perception that you don't which is alarmingly common in SL is a big danger sign. I've seen various meaningless statistics given in response to that charge - the one that the level of ARs has not increased, for example. What LL seem to fail to realise is that people are no longer reporting their problems as much as they used to, simply because they do not think LL care or will act on them. In the case of ARs, for example, I believe that they are holding roughly steady because the rise in griefing has been offset by many people ceasing to report abuse because they do not trust LL to act upon it.

You can reverse this trend. You can respond to FVT proposals and ARs in a way which reassures residents that you are actually listening (as opposed to pretending to listen) and that you are actually acting in response to their requests in a meaningful way.

Ok, now... moving on to other ways to help improve the FVT...

How to make the FVT easier (and thus more attractive) for residents to use.
I've covered some of these points before, but they are worth going over again :
a) Put a "Discuss This Proposal" link inside the detailed proposal page for each proposal, not just on the proposal index.
b) Increase the maximum character count for proposals so people have more space, and either require people to give a forum URL when posting a proposal, or allow them to add it later.
c) Advertise the FVT in-world using ideas like the voting awareness group and a VISIBLE link in the SL client.
d) Put a BIG link to the FVT on the feature suggestion forums.
e) Clean up the FVT and DELETE (not just close) pointless proposals.
f) Improve the search feature so that it is easy to pull up a list of JUST "acknowledged" proposals without also selecting "completed" proposals. Or, better yet, make "acknowledged", "completed" and "in development" mutually exclusive status flags, so only one of them can be set at once.
g) Automatically delete any proposal from the FVT which is older than 3 weeks and has less than 3 people voting for it. Realistically, anyone with 2 friends in SL can get 3 votes on their proposal. The barrier right now is that people think the Lindens do not care, and the system is hard to use. If you remove both of those obstacles, a lot of ideas will come up on the FVT. To avoid drowning in a flood, you will need to cull ones that have nobody but their creator supporting them, both to keep the requirements of time to read them sane, and also to encourage creators to work with others instead of just making 100s of throwaway single issue proposals in the system.
h) Stop the creation of duplicate proposals. As per my idea here, a simple word-search and confirmation screen could do this.
i) Link from secondlife.com/status to secondlife.com/vote when the grid is down (prop 1349), to stop Residents being all over Lindens when the grid is down, and give them something productive to do.
j) Encourage the merging of existing duplicates.
From Nekokami Dragonfly's post:

From: Nekokami Dragonfly

Allow someone who has submitted a proposal to recommend merging it with another proposal if they feel it is similar. This would send a message to the author of the other proposal asking if they approve the change. If both approve, the two props get merged, with both numbers referenced and links to any discussion areas are maintained. Those who have cast votes (for either of the merging proposals) should also get a notification at this point so they can check the new version and see if they want to keep their votes where they are.

k) Stop guests viewing the FVT pages! Most people who view the FVT pages whilst NOT logged into the SL site have no idea how to vote, and the drop-down box with only one option ("0"

displayed confuses the heck out of them. You should recode the FVT so that either you MUST be logged into the SL site to use it (thus, people get a 'login' prompt when they try to browse it as a guest, ensuring that when they DO see the FVT pages, they are able to vote)... or... boxes like the "set votes to" box do not appear at all for page guests. Logged out users should either be presented with a page demanding they log in before viewing proposals, or they should be clearly told they are not logged in and be given the form to log-in in place of the voting box. Guests cannot use the voting box, so why display it for them? Instead, display a log-in form, as a log-in form would be much more helpful!
l) Include an 'average votes per day' info line on each proposal... and make it searchable. This would be a great way to find up-and-coming proposals.

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Angel Fluffy

Very Helpful

Join date: 3 Mar 2006

Posts: 810

UPDATE : 21st August 2006, part 4 of 4

08-23-2006 09:22

==== Part 4 : My 'star list' of most needed features in SL.

In this section, I will give an overview of what I consider the 5 most important areas where SL needs more work. I will do 5 broad 'themes', each containing a very short (3-4 item) list of points in that area.
This list is intentionally *not* sorted by priority, both because it would be difficult and contentious to sort such a list, and also because I want the Lindens to read all of it, not just the top few paragraphs.

---1> Open Sourcing SL, Creative Commons Licencing, and Linux
* CC Licencing : 966: Creative Commons Licencing for items in SL. It would encourage the creation of free content that draws people to SL.
* Linux : Fix the bugswhich are a daily pain for linux users, such as the lack of copy/paste support in many places. Replace the 'tips and bugs' threads on the linux forumwith a bugzilla-type system which is both much more manageable and also lets users submit better bug reports for the linux client. Heck, you might want to use a modified version of bugzilla (which conceals exploit bugs from non-Lindens) to replace the "known issues" page.
* Open Sourcing SL : support the work of the libsecondlife project by making SL's client as open-source as possible. This would help bugs to be detected and fixed faster, as well as helping users in the long term to develop other clients for special needs.

---2> Security
= a list of all my security suggestions in one place
= Key ideas :
* 703 : objects in parcels an avatar cannot access should not render for that agent.
* 1597: objects owned by an avatar banned on a parcel should never be allowed on that parcel.
* 134 : land bans should affect alt accounts, to stop alt-griefing. Or, give us the ability to ban by hardware hash (a "ban this agent's computer" option).

---3> Finances
Key Ideas :
* 971: allow avatars to consensually bill other avatars on a reoccurring cycle. This could be used for things such as land rental agreements.
* 1433: fine people who break the ToS/CS - let rulebreakers provide a sink for the L$ economy
* Group bank accounts with permissions for who can add / withdraw money from the group account.

---4> Communications and UI
* IMs. Greatly increase the IM maximum length limit, and allow emotes ("/me ____s"

to work in IMs.
* Groups : "can start new group IM session","can reply to existing group IM session", and "can recieve group IMs" permissions in the group roles system.
* Website : SL's website should feature a clock showing SL time, and an "IM" interface to let you send IMs to residents inworld even when you can't log in.
* Profiles : Resident profiles should display their last logged in date.

---5> Land Controls
* Give land owners better controls for resource usage on their land. For example, let EMs/EOs set per-parcel agent limits to prevent a popular parcel using the whole sim's quota. Let parcels limit script time / attached prims per avatar. Essentially, give landowners tools to prevent agents doing very laggy things, and give estate owners tools to stop one parcel lagging out the whole sim. This would limit problems caused by lag-tastic avatars and neighbours-from-hell.
* Have a more flexible system to replace Estate Managers. It'd be great to have EMs with permission flags to manage the ban list, say, but not do anything else. It'd be even better to have a whole bunch of powers assignable to EMs, such as "can terraform anywhere on sim", "can split/merge all parcels", "can change parcel settings for all parcels", etc. This would make a huge difference to sim owners who want to make sure their sims are well managed but don't want to give their managers godlike power over their sims. It'd be more secure, more useful, and result in better-managed sims.
* Don't forget the Mainland residents. Give them some tools to help detect laggy scripts and colliders too. Maybe a version of 'get top scripts' and 'get colliders' with private info such as object name stripped out, and available to everyone on all sims?

Thanks for reading this

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Aspera Eponym

Registered User

Join date: 8 Jan 2006

Posts: 2

08-24-2006 10:38

Great job Jeska! Wow, 10 name change proposals... That's worse than I thought. Do you think Filters for flags will help you administrate the proposal database?

Angel Fluffy

Very Helpful

Join date: 3 Mar 2006

Posts: 810

08-30-2006 18:02

Update / responses :
1) I'm in favour of filters for flags.
2) Since posting, the following have happened :
* lots of updates for the Linux client.
* Kelly Linden has stated she would 'love' group bank accounts.
* Torley has commented about tools for the mainland and parcels
* Topic on sim limits that cut down on lag / ensure fair usage
4) Also, I found some things from the past that are interesting :
* Topic on estate tools
* A single post of mine on automated billing in SL
5) List of my known biases which are relavant to my work:
* I'm pro-security, due to having had to deal with griefing a fair bit in the past.
* I tend to be in favour of giving landowners more tools for things like security and finances, both due to being griefed in the past, and also because I own two islands which I sub-let. This also gives me a pro-landowner and pro-island bias.
* I'm an author, so I'm in favour of some forms of very limited, optional, copy protection for notecards as already exists for textures.

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