RC Questions
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Wynochee LeShelle
Polykontexturalist
Join date: 3 Feb 2007
Posts: 658
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05-05-2009 20:36
From: Katheryne Helendale Even that would be untrue. There *are* private Linden exchanges out there. I have not used one myself, but I know they exist. VirWox, Eldex, etc. - they are working well, extreme fast, serious, very small micro fees, I can exchange there L to $ or Euro or Pound in a second and vice versa in different ways. Especially for Europeans they are a good service. I can move Euro from my bank account in a second to them and in the next second I can transfer the Euros via their website into my ingame Linden$ account. Cash out works the same easy way. In a second I have real money on my RL bank account, if I use one of the many ways they're offering. Depends on where you live and the payment options per country how fast it is. In Germany and Austria we have many, many payment systems available. I use one wich works literally in a second. Click, click and ready.
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Lorelei Mission
Registered User
Join date: 25 Jan 2006
Posts: 32
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05-05-2009 20:47
From: Darien Caldwell Only businesses need to be on Adult Land, since they are the only ones who need to place Adult Ads. Those Most Affected will be given a Land Swap by LL. "Only businesses ... need to place Adult Ads" -- ?!?!?! SL is not just one big grid of stores! There are many wonderful free destinations that run ads on their own dime. How about The Forum? The BDSM Forum has been providing help and support to people of the BDSM subculture for a long time now. In the two years I handed out their landmark they were nonprofit the whole time. The Forum was not a "business". They understood that there are people out in the world who are living in small towns - or in countries with horrific oppression - or even living in a big city but are female and worried about the safety of driving somewhere to connect with the community for the first time... Heck, I have been listening and responding to these poor souls via my websites for 20 years now; I KNOW they need emotional support and a connection to other people. SL is well-suited to this need; I even got grief counseling here in SL after my dad died. So this is just ONE example of a place that is not a business, that needs to run an ad that people can find. Isolated or misinformed or newbie BDSMers, logging in to SL, who are unable to verify for some reason, ought to be able to type "BDSM" in search and find help. (There are many people unable to verify; many have explained why in these forums, and in their blogs, and in circulated notecards, and elsewhere. Examples: country where transmitting the info is illegal; country where paypal doesn't do verified accounts, country where international credit cards are difficult or impossible to get, heck even in the USA some servicemen are bound by their jobs not to transmit anything personal on the internet.) In my 3ish years in SL I have hosted, good lord, something like 30 free places, big and small. Some wound up next to commercial parcels because things were costing me so much (such as Bondage Ranch), but other locations remained free and noncommercial the whole time I hosted them. And I ran SL ads so that people could find those free places! It is totally not true that only Businesses need to run Ads! Additionally, there are reasons a free destination might need to use an "SL Adult Word" in an ad, for Unverified searchers to find them. Just my 2c, probably stretched out to about 8c.
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Phoenix Nohkan
Dangerous when annoyed
Join date: 10 Oct 2006
Posts: 45
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Maybe
05-05-2009 20:55
From: Argent Stonecutter Can I have this in OL?  Looking at that I see a furry surrounded by other digital lifeforms-not easily labeled by me. (super-sized snails!) The tentative answer, which is all I can give, is I don't see why not. OL is the same interface and relies on the same structure as SL except it's open source driven. People once used the SL viewer to access OL which should give you an idea how close they are. If you can build or find a builder then you can have "that" or whatever you want. Were you actually wanting an answer or were you trying to make a point? Sorry I couldn't tell.  .
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Waterstar Eilde
Registered User
Join date: 12 May 2007
Posts: 404
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Info on file and LL calling verification "age validation"
05-05-2009 20:56
Contrary to popular opinion, LL is not referring to verification as just "account verification", but as a validation of age.
Before the hopelessly defunct RC viewer came out, all my avatars (all PIU) could access Arapaima, with one setting it as home. After using the RC with all its problems of non-persistent preferences, etc., I returned to using the main viewer. Surprise, surprise - the alt that set Arapaima as home can no longer access it.
The only difference between her and the others is that, although she is PIU, she does not currently have PIOF. I don't know whether this is due to the adult rating dropping out after logoff (although it hasn't happened with other avatars), or whether it is indeed the need to have details currently on file. However, she can still access the hub using the RC viewer and changing the preferences, so there doesn't appear to be any logic to it. Has
I'd be interested to know whether anyone else has discovered this sort of anomaly. In the meantime, I might see what happens if I put her payment details back on the website.
Second point - the message she now gets on trying to access the infohub is "Could not teleport. You aren't allowed in that Region due to your maturity Rating. You may need to validate your age and/or install the latest Viewer. Please go to the Knowledge Base for details on accessing areas with this maturity Rating."
Note the reference to validating age - nothing whatsoever about it being merely account validation.
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Wynochee LeShelle
Polykontexturalist
Join date: 3 Feb 2007
Posts: 658
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05-05-2009 20:59
From: Shambolic Walkenberg Until a few months ago I bought L$ through the Anshe Chung (sp?) website till I got round to using what was slx. I'm NPIOF, own a small parcel on a private estate (which may or may not be effected by this ludicrous plan), and have put real money into the system through needing to upload textures for my build, buy furniture etc. And if LL hadn't bought slx then I'd still be unverfified in every way (and I'm yet to be convinced the slx/ xlstreet side of things will actually work when trying to reach "adult content"  . So yeah, there are ways of buying L$ that don't mean going through LL, and I'm less than impressed with the elitist attitude of certain posters on this thread when it comes to NPIOF being somehow second class and unworthy for consideration. I have a good friend here since years. She comes from a relative poor country and is NPIOF since 3 years and makes around 500 dollars a year by hosting events and by tips. She is, by the way, one of the best hosters I think. Anyway: she spends all that money for shopping and tips to others (musicians for example) renting etc. and there are much who are making a comfy living in game in this way, and so much content creators, scripters, builders and whatever services are provided by NPIOF players. Much, much of SL's cash flow is made by them. They are creators, sellers, customers, tenants, shop owners via xstreet, etc. and even if people are just there to explore and to visit locations and having fun without any money involved, they are very important for the ambience of SL. Every non-griefer is and makes SL just by login and being there! And not to forget: as persons and friends and for the great exoerience to have multi-cultural/cosmopolitan communication wich is interersting and the main aspect of SL, that the whole globe is connected here borderless and in peace. And logical: LL should not create any sort of "second class" residents. We are all equal. And we all feed LL and SL with values and social input in this or that way. A good tradesperson honors every cent. But u c: LL doesn't care if one feeds them with thousands of dollars a year or with 2 cents a year: the new policy kicks all of us direct into the face, economical and ethical seen.
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Angel Fluffy
Very Helpful
Join date: 3 Mar 2006
Posts: 810
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05-05-2009 21:09
===> My suggestion (re: a win-win solution for everyone)
Setting land ratings at the region level, instead of the parcel level, will mean I have to force a bunch of my customers (residents with land on my islands) to move.
As well as being highly inconvenient, it is likely cost me hundreds of dollars a month in lost business, as my residents, forced to move elsewhere, decide to look beyond my islands for land.
People have been asking for the ability to hide the contents of their parcels for years. I say... give us that. Let us stop people outside our parcel from seeing objects, or avatars, on it.
With this ability, the adult content providers on my islands can simply set their parcels to be adults-only, and not have to move. Sim owners like myself don't lose money, or have to put their residents through painful moves. Landowners get a feature they have been asking for for years - the ability to stop any passer-by from looking into their land. LL score points by giving us residents something we have been requesting for years. Everyone wins.
=== My concerns (re: data retention by Aristotle)
LL claims not to be storing anything beyond a success code. Aristotle, however, seems to suggest that it will store data for 'legal' reasons. This seems like another way of saying that all our personal information will go into Aristotle's database, to be sold to the highest bidder at some future point.
The same thing happened with credit reports. At first they were just for monitoring credit, but now your personal details are being sold to credit card companies, so they can send you 'pre-approved' credit offers.
Forcing SL users to link their SL identity to a RL identity, plus the future use of search bots, is going to allow companies like Aristotle to compile data on individual, real-life peoples' SL usage. One day, that data will be sold. People who bought clothes in SL will get junk mail for similar-looking RL clothes. People who bought beds in SL will end up in a database of people listed as being interested in sex toys. Imagine how inconvenient that will be when you get a catalog in the mail.
You may scoff, but if history teaches us anything, it is that: (1) Records retained for 'legal' reasons, in the absence of strict pro-privacy regulation, will include as much detail as possible, and will be retained for as long as possible, because companies love to data mining. (2) Personal records, once available for sale, will be bought and used for marketing purposes, thus, at minimum, subjecting individuals to unwanted advertising, and more likely, also severely damaging their privacy. Would you want to live in a world where companies buy and sell the personal details of your life, for their own gain, regardless of the inconvenience, cost, or even personal risk to you? I worry that the increasing retention of data about individuals by governments and corporations is pushing our society ever more strongly in this direction.
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Shambolic Walkenberg
Registered User
Join date: 24 May 2008
Posts: 152
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05-05-2009 21:19
From: Hanspeter Gelles I much sympathise. But for me at least i value some reassurance that the people i meet in SL really are 18+. Of course that said, the verification procedures in use don't seem to be particularly robust.
Hans. I have no more certainty someone with payment info on file/ used, or verified through Aristotle are genuinely over 18 than anyone else I may meet. I'm not so old as I can't remember living at home, surrounded by credit cards, debit cards, driving licenses etc of family. How hard would it be for someone under 18 with net access to quickly slip any one of the forms of ID accepted out of a parent or guardians wallet for five minutes so they can see pixel tits? It's not my duty to be responsible for others lack of parenting skills. I use SL as an adult, and expect to interact with adults. I cannot see how this false feeling of security by having adults, and alledgedly proven adults, is going to change anything in that respect. *If* under age users on the grid *are* a real concern then they should be a concern in PG and Mature areas as well as the steamrolling ahead pornoville. And if the only way LL see they can safeguard themselves (through using methods the providers themselves state are NOT suited to adult/ ID verification no less!) is to demand verification for users wishing to participate in certain activities, then I bvelieve they should make it mandatory for *all* users to verify. I want the pixels I'm chatting to or buying from to be controlled by an adult just as much as I do the pixels of a more explicit nature I may be having fun with in a more intmate setting. This two tier citizenship is only going to elevate the friction that can be found from time to time between paid up users and "freebie" ones. My post was a dig at that very attitude being displayed at times on this thread. By not having the tag of worthiness displayed on my profile I, and others like me, seem to be undeserving of a voice or even place in the commercial machine of SL. Even though we *do* add to the experience, in ways that range from simply being around to socialise with, to creating content, investing money, holding land... The fact I have refused to fund my SL experience (My World, Their Dictatorship) directly through LL should not automatically deny me freedoms of expression or opinion compared to someone that has. This isn't the only cause for my intense dislike of this adult continent catastrophe, but it is one that is very personal to me. It's also one that makes me thankful I never did pay up "properly" as I would now have a parcel on the mainland, and my sympathies lie with the poor buggers who've bought mature land on the grounds they can do what they want with it only to now (soon? Has *anyone buying mainland been forewarned they're going to be screwed in a not good way this summer?) find they can't, and they are most likely going to miss the opportunity to swap for land where they *can* still have those freedoms. I've only seen trolls, nutters (such as NK, who didn't seem to understand the irony of her many users through one account rule breaking in her rants about rule abiding perverts...), people who are unwilling to use their own discretion when viewing content ("Oh woe, I teleported/ dropped into a mature sim, and didn't like what I saw, how dare these people not be aware I will unwittingly descend upon them"  , and people who believe this will improve their slice of the commerce pie through strangling competitors, in favour of this change. If this is about people not wishing to see pixel perversions, then one has to wonder if they have a television, and whether they can comprehend the changing of channels (or even, shock horror, the off button). And even if we must somehow protect them from their fragile minds a simple pop up box to warn in advance of entering certain parcels would surely suffice? Or teh implentation of the Jira that would see walls being actual walls, preventing camming in and accidentally seeing something offensive that some loathesome individual had placed in their own build. If this is about underage users, then verfiy all, or better yet accept children will find their way here regardless and react in a timely and fair way to all abuse reports pertaining to this issue. Everyone here has agreed they are over 18 when signing up, so anyone who isn't is breaking the rules and should be booted. What else can this be about? The millions of not customers who may or may not have explicitly stated the adult side of SL as a reason for not being here? Treading on your existing custmoer base to try and reach a hypothetical one doesn't sound too clever to me. But then I wonder if this reason is more "millions" included the perv side of SL as *a* reason not to join, but not *the* reason. Merely one out of half a dozen that could equally include lag, compuer resource hogging, not wanting to fritter time away in a virtual world when there's a large spinning real one going on... Maybe it's a way of cramming the worst of the perv venues into one place, recording the pervs who wish to visit them, and making life easier when the time comes to pull the plug on all sexual behaviour. Whilst in the meantime making quick cash by flogging currently dormant server space and in the medium future forcing anyone who wishes to purchase unrestricted land to pay a premium (because if this works at all you can be sure Ursula will be expensive land when the swaps are finished) to get a slice of a very limited pie. The land barons may be the ones to sell the land, but the buyer will ahve had to get those L$ from somewhere. If you look at this whole fiasco kindly you can say LL are making a total hash and turning something potentially positive into a massive negative for many. The "discussion" which sounded to me like a tactic to get residents arguing and fighting among themselves rather than tackling LL head on (with a Linden along to throw some more oil on the fire when things got too calm) was a joke, we all know nothing is going to change yet LL claim to not even know what it is they're going to change that won't change! making an announcement on a blog that very few I've spoken to read is pathetic, when on the times I log in there's always an announcement on the screen but never about this. You can either take from that LL have no clue how to publish information, or (as in the case of the edited transcripts) they have no desire to be the open, understanding company they try to portray themselves as. Sorry, this has turned into a megarant! But I'm appalled by thge whole thing, and just glad I happened to be bored enough to flick through the forums a few weeks ago, or I'd still be pouring money into improving my residence in sweet ignorance of the despicable machinations coming our way.
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Valentine Young
Registered User
Join date: 15 Jan 2007
Posts: 37
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2998
05-05-2009 21:26
http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/MISC-2727approaching 3000, #2 issue needs another 1127 votes to be #1 issue in the JIRA get those IM's and posts and protest signs out there ---> PROTEST
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Valerius Constantine
*I* am adult content!
Join date: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 777
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05-05-2009 21:27
From: Hanspeter Gelles 3. Why doesn't LL put some effort into cleaning up the welcome areas for new players? For example what is the point of voice in these areas? They are a very poor introduction if LL is hoping for something that will be attractive to more sensitive members of society. There is bad language in welcome areas and worse things. And yet the new adult content rules seem not to address this. If i were an educator looking to build in SL this would be a really big concern for me. Also for many businesses again it would be a problem and will continue to be so. Who knows? One of the things that we've been trying to tell them all along is that the complaints that they're getting about "in your face porn" are coming from the welcome areas, not from adult businesses and consumers. Their plan does absolutely *nothing* to fix this. also It leaves probably 90% of adult content on mature parcels in place- simply because they're not advertised. Anything goes in a private home- which means that just as many "faint of heart" residents as before will be able to cam around and see things that'll make their toes curl. It does *nothing* for the problems, and too much for stuff that *wasn't* a problem to any but a small number of people. And I'm not real surprised that you're just finding out about this- you are not alone, and another thing that we've been trying to accomplish is to pressure LL to make an announcement about these changes via the log-in screen. ^V^
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Sindy Tsure
Will script for shoes
Join date: 18 Sep 2006
Posts: 4,103
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05-05-2009 21:31
At least some of the welcome areas are changing from PG to Mature. There will no longer be as many TOS violations there now.
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Felix Oxide
Registered User
Join date: 6 Oct 2006
Posts: 655
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05-05-2009 22:01
From: Sindy Tsure At least some of the welcome areas are changing from PG to Mature. There will no longer be as many TOS violations there now. On my last trip to the new Adult infohub I saw signs everywhere that said no nudity, no violence, no adult language, adult sounds or adult gestures. Sounds like a PG hub to me.
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Katheryne Helendale
(loading...)
Join date: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 2,187
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05-05-2009 22:09
From: Blondin Linden 4) Ilana made me an awesome Blondin Bondage Bear.  Let me know if you want one! Toss one my way please. 
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Valerius Constantine
*I* am adult content!
Join date: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 777
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05-05-2009 22:18
From: Darien Caldwell I love how everyone loves to generalize and say how *bad* all this will be, but can't offer a shred of proof to substantiate these claims. They go on about how *bad* the plan is, but can't produce a viable alternative (where's the wiki page for that?). I don't know if it's truly an inability to understand and see the big picture, or just that they can't even fathom when a favor is being done for them.
I can't even debate the issue with anyone here, you're too deep into your mindset that this is all bad and wrong. So I won't try. But the rest of us, the majority, understand that this is necessary and won't really affect most people. Most people don'' list their land in search, most people don't have offensive content on mainland, most people will go on with their lives and nothing will change for them.
But yes, some made all the wrong choices, and will suffer for them. That's life. Beggin' your pardon Darien, but not only have several people offered proof of how this *particular* plan won't do what LL says it wants to do, but several *have* offered alternatives. Some of us have even sent them directly to the "director" lindens who aren't reading this thread (or any of the previous ones, evidently.  ) My point is that if you're going to make sweeping generalities like that, use a smaller broom, okay? "Won't affect most people"? How many people *use* search anyway? And what's the ratio of verified to unverified accounts? something like just *under* one million verified(either PIOF, PIU or AVS, according to some numbers brought out in the previous thread) out of *fifteen million* accounts ( http://kotaku.com/5052067/so-how-many-people-actually-play-second-life)? I'd say that in raw numbers- the ones that LL quotes all the time to potential investors and advertisers- That would be 14/15ths of all SL users affected by these changes. Hardly anyone has offensive content on their land? How would you know? You don't know that the proscribed search words and activities are, because LL won't *tell* you! You don't know what any other resident will find offensive and AR you for, even though Blondin said that anything goes in private homes. Let me try to explain- you see, it is the party making the *changes* that has to make the case for them, and LL hasn't *done* that. We understand why they want changes- we are puzzled and upset that they are insisting on these *particular* changes that won't help anyone, and might hurt quite a few people. Being cavalier about it isn't going to help. people are being damaged by this, and talking trash about them like that (*untrue* trash at that) isn't the best way to win friends and influence people. "some made all the wrong choices?" I'd like to know what you mean by that- do you mean, taking LL at their word on the terms of the contract that I have with them that is based upon the TOS *at the time I signed up?* I suppose that I'd call that a foolish choice, not a wrong one. In any case, nobody is paying for their "bad choices". They are paying for LL's futile hunt for respectability and the big corporate money. Which they will rarely see, becuase SL is unsuitable for business meetings, and the like. No privacy, for one thing. Sorry, but the unsympathetic and rather gleeful tone of your message strikes a raw nerve- It says "troll". I'm responding on the off chance that you aren't attempting to be one. You've already said that your problem is solved and you don't care anymore. Well, most of us don't even *know* about this yet, so there's no telling how many problems there are to iron out, is there? ^V^
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Valerius Constantine
*I* am adult content!
Join date: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 777
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05-05-2009 22:23
From: Darien Caldwell You're right about the aymmetry. But I don't know that I agree that LL's purpose with the rules is to limit demand for Adult sims. The fact is there are many Mature sims which will have to flag adult for minor reasons, even though their content isn't extreme (mine for instance). It does certainly force a choice, because many (and I'm just as guilty) refused to make such choices on their own. I think a lot of the anger is misdirected. We all bear some responsibility for creating the conditions that led to this. Whether it was mis-keywording, Improperly using the land rating, constantly pushing the envelope of what is tasteful, or any other multitude of reasons, we have nobody to blame but ourselves. I dare some of the people in this thread to really think on that.  OKay, I've asked myself the question "What did I do to help create this situation?" I listened to crickets for a few minutes- A tumbleweed tumbled down the deserted street, and somewhere, off in the distance, a dog barked. Then i realized what the answer was- The same exact thing I did to get slapped with a price increase on my openspace sim! I operated within the TOS, was a good SL citizen, and I TRusted LL. So yeah, I guess you're right. I decided to be here in the first place, rather than doing something sensible with my money, so it *is* all my fault. ^V^
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Valerius Constantine
*I* am adult content!
Join date: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 777
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05-05-2009 22:36
From: Darien Caldwell This is a problem I agree, However the range of methods to verify is varied now, making a free paypal account to buy 1 dollar of Lindens isn't that far fetched for most people. But certainly it is an obstacle to getting into adult areas. But perhaps a carrot is all that some people need to coax them into doing so. Too early to say how much of a real affect this will have. Then why aren't LL *doing* that? Why all this crap with Aristotle- the non-functioning AVS? And why aren't they *getting rid of the freebie, unverified account? ^V^
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Snickers Snook
Odd Princess - Trout 7.3
Join date: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 746
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05-05-2009 22:44
This is so amazingly on-point. I tweeted it. @snickitty FWIW, I follow Mitch Kapor and he follows me. I wish he was in the trenches. 
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 Buh-bye forums, it's been good ta know ya.
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Katheryne Helendale
(loading...)
Join date: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 2,187
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05-05-2009 23:28
From: Sindy Tsure At least some of the welcome areas are changing from PG to Mature. There will no longer be as many TOS violations there now. *jawdrop* How does THIS fix anything??? All re-categorizing the Welcome areas as "mature" will accomplish is that it will now (at least by current standards) make it *permissible* to pelt newbies with penises!
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Valerius Constantine
*I* am adult content!
Join date: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 777
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05-05-2009 23:28
From: Darien Caldwell I see there's 20 more posts, so here's my general reply. Read the plan, read the facts. It's not hard to understand. There would be fewer replies if you weren't "a bit trollish". From: someone Stop taking it personal, it's not. LL knows you're mad, but That has never stopped them before. This isn't personal, this is *business*. From: someone For people who are taking about being treated with respect and being open minded, I see a lot of close-mindedness, and disrespect. Ursula is not a Ghetto, it's not a Concentration camp, all of that is in your head. In a world where we have no place, It's a place we can call our own. Its a home, and I do not shy away from it, I embrace it, as something precious. If it's so great, then why are they *forcing* us to go there in order to keep established businesses, and why won't the make a general announcement via the login screen about the Fabu new digs that all the pervs get * *Some restrictions may apply From: someone People talking about how there's 80% npiofs, yes those are all the millions of inactive accounts which will never return. Most of the active people have payment info on file, don't fall for the red herring. Those are LL's numbers, not mine, not anyone else's Which is why My suggestions included a shelf-life for inactive accounts 30-day warning, 90-day deletion. Clear that confusion right up. From: someone You can call me what you will, but I'm determined to make it through this, and make sure my customers and those I care about make it through too. I want everyone to. But I can't take you there, you have to do it yourself. Yelling in a forum never solved or accomplished anything. Decisive Action and understanding do. But it has to be the right action, for the right reasons. A lot of people are afraid to speak up about their agreement for fear of being labeled 'sellout' or what have you, just as I have been. But I'm more than willing to take up the mantle for their cause, and fight for them, as I have been. Someone has to. A. I'm not calling you anything. I'm calling your *behavior* trollish, which to be fair, is what *you* called it too. B. We're not *yelling (okay, maybe some of us are yelling, but most of us have been extremely businesslike, and tried to be friendly with Blondin and find out what is *actually* happening) C. "afraid to speak up"? Let me get this straight. you are suggesting that the reason why there aren't a million users on these forums all singing the virtues of linden labs and their plan is that they are *afraid* of the opinion of the *minority*? Uh-huh. Allow me to posit another scenario. a "viable alternative" if you will. The reason why there are hardly any comments about this *at all* is because Linden labs isn't *telling* anyone about it. Poeple have to find out from *residents* and then listen to LL's talk of "rumors", and LL apologists like yourself about how you are "the majority". Why was the JIRA ticket number *two* after less than 48 hours? Even *with* LL's blanket of silence, it was *still* #2 in *less* than 48 hours. I submit that it was because a *vast majority of the people who *have* heard about it, *Don't like it*. From: someone There is no shame in giving a little ground in the name of peace. Keep throwing artillery and there will be none. Those who are willing to trade a little freedom for a little safety, deserve neither. Ben Franklin- recognized throughout the world as the smartest man alive during his adult lifetime. This wasn't the smartest thing that he said- but it's *close*. ^V^
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Valerius Constantine
*I* am adult content!
Join date: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 777
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05-05-2009 23:31
From: Kalderi Tomsen Why do you feel that they are obliged to gives us all the reasons why and the supporting facts? This isn't something that we decide - THEY do. That's why there won't be votes - that's why the forums posts weren't asking our opinions on things, they were asking how best to get them done, within the framework they laid out. Because when a seller of a good or service doesn't give the purchaser of that good or service pertinent information *about* that good or service that the purchaser needs in order to make a wise decision about whether to purchase or not, That's usually called *fraud*. Especially if the purchaser has *asked* for said information. Repeatedly. ^V^
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DanielRavenNest Noe
Registered User
Join date: 26 Oct 2006
Posts: 1,076
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05-05-2009 23:57
From: Shambolic Walkenberg
Everyone here has agreed they are over 18 when signing up, so anyone who isn't is breaking the rules and should be booted.
If you mean consciously agreed, I don't think that is true. The current registration system allows clicking the checkbox without reading the Terms of Service, and the statement that you agree you are over 18 is buried on page 4 of 13 of fine print. I seriously doubt most people actually read all that when creating a new account. Now that Linden Labs explicitly admits to hosting adult material (by having search and land settings for it), they really should make it more explicit on registration, like most online adult sites do. Have a page pop up *before* you fill in registration info like this: "Some parts of this service contain adult material. If you tell us you are over 18 you may run into this sort of thing. Do you agree? Yes/No"
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Snickers Snook
Odd Princess - Trout 7.3
Join date: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 746
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Homeland Security Extremist Dictionary
05-06-2009 00:00
I wonder if they were working with LL on this one?? http://tr.im/kC1n
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 Buh-bye forums, it's been good ta know ya.
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Snickers Snook
Odd Princess - Trout 7.3
Join date: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 746
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05-06-2009 00:04
I'm thinking more like:
"Some parts of this service contain adult material including funny beds, detachable penises and other naughty bits. If you tell us you are over 18 (and you don't really have to be wink, wink) you may want to search for this stuff. Wanna? Yes?? OK, stick your credit card in the slot or visit our data mining partner."
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 Buh-bye forums, it's been good ta know ya.
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Valerius Constantine
*I* am adult content!
Join date: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 777
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05-06-2009 00:04
From: Valentine Young Wow, so many possibilities:
1) The pressure to implement is from Mark Kingdon's bosses, LL's board of directors.
2) Mark Kingdon, is conducting a live social experiment, to prove or disprove his theses above.
3) Mark Kingdon's staff are following orders to the letter, in an attempt to oust the CEO.
To bad, SL residents have been constrained within SL blogs, failed to use email and direct phone calls. The right to anonymity versus ability to voice a protest. The pivot point. You forgot "Mark Kingdon has been kidnapped by aliens from the planet Zepton, and a robot duplicate they placed so we wouldn't be suspicious has screwed things up so badly because aliens don't understand money or economics"  ^V^
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DanielRavenNest Noe
Registered User
Join date: 26 Oct 2006
Posts: 1,076
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05-06-2009 00:13
I only see 2900, so either you misread 2898 as 2998, or about 100 votes vanished. (I now wish I had tracked the vote count more closely) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Humorous sidenote: I guess Linden Labs does not care about getting business from the Ford Motor Company (makers of the Ford Escort auto)
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Lord Sullivan
DTC at all times :)
Join date: 15 Dec 2005
Posts: 2,870
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05-06-2009 00:55
From: Phoenix Nohkan I meant to reply to both you and the post you were quoting-I can't do multiple quotes it seems.
I've been in OL-talked to a business owner there who also has over a year in OL (Everyone I met there has been in SL btw)
There are lots of opinions but just like in SL the residents don't always know what's actually true.
According to the business owner I talked to there is an adult club on the mainland-I have the chat log and I asked for permission to give that out which she said yes to. Everything is possible there according to her and I felt reasonable comfortable that she was understanding my questions and knowledgeable about OL.
Having said that OL has it's problems (think SL a couple of years ago) and although there are regular updates and a very active forum I wouldn't want to pretend that OL is a utopia with no problems. What is though? Like I said, when I was there last Saskia was at pains at the weekly meetings to tell us that no sex/sex activities on the mainland due to their ratings (R15) IIRC, only on islands was it permissible as several of us adult providers were looking at creating an adult zone there on private islands at that time because of the rulings, so I was conveying what it was like and I am a foundation member as well and had a sim there on the mainland and that was the rules then, as i say maybe they have changed them or the games rating, i do not know for sure as i haven't logged in their for a while to due to RL commitments and the time I am spending here 
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Independent Shopping for Second Life residents from established and new merchants. http://slapt.me  slapt.me - In-World HQ http://slurl.com/secondlife/Bastet/123/118/26
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