Upcoming Changes for Adult Content: Answers to Questions

Of *course* it did.

^V^

What about a store on Adult land with "PG" level advertising?

Where does it show up?

Actually, that's not a bad question- Does SL allow the use of "meta-tags"? that could solve a lot of problems for merchants on mature land.

^V^

there is a WHOLE lot more sex in SL than there ever was gambling.

I think though that they are okay with Adult content being on Adult rated land.

But I think they will severely control how much adult land their is ..

Unless of you want to fork over for a private island .. cha ching.

Don't forget: half the tits out there are cocks.

http://icanhascheezburger.com/2009/04/28/funny-pictures-sigh-nudists/

Again, the fount of timely commentary.

Search word like LL are telling us wil be a isue, but i bet that some wil be inventing othher types of words like this:
-Goren = Garean
-Sex= sax
-Porn=Parn
-BDSM= BSDM
-Cock=Cack

And so on, i got no idea if its against the TOS or not but i bet there will be ways to get "round" all this,its just a matter of info from shop owners out to the users, if i got a Mature set mall and a shop rentor there that sells Gorean silk i wil like them to stay there and i will like advertise for them by setting Gorean silk in my classified ad for the mall.
A mall will soon die if ONLY users with pay info will be able to shop there, moust newbees that want to shop usly do not got pay info on file and any mall do depend on NEW costumers.So LL are excluding a lot of users to be able to shop items.

You can not denie a person to buye a adult rated item if thay dont got pay info in file, thats just wrong.
I know many that host and Djs and also do securety work in SL that never had payinfo in file, thay make there linden$ by working all week, this users got cash to spend but are not alloerd to get a adult rated item?

Blondin, could you kindly clarify that point? What is the purpose of moving "adult" places into "other"? And how does this make Search more "predictable"?

Reading the transcripts of the brown bag meetings, I notice some glaring fallacies in the Linden Assertions:

From the merchant meeting transcript:

Apparently no one told that Linden that keywords like "BDSM" will be verboten and banned!

BUZZZT! Dead wrong!

What about alts where they have one main account that buys or earns all their L$, and sends L$ to the alts. None of those alts needs any payment info on file, and all are valid consumers. Let's say I have a dozen alts, and only one credit card. I have payment info on my main, and spread the L$ to the alts as needed. I CAN NOT put more than 5 or so accounts on a single credit card, because LL will not allow me to do so! And don't tell me this isn't so. The ONLY reason all my accounts have payment info on file is that I was able to them spread across four different payment methods! YOU WON'T LET ME PUT THEM ALL ON ONE CARD!

What about people who earn 100% of their L$ by working in-world, and never need to buy L$? They do exist, and they do spend money in world.

What about couples where the boyfriend has payment info, and provides the L$ for his girlfriend's purchases in-world? She has no payment info, and can NOT use his to validate...

This is all well and good, but NOTHING in the posted maturity ratings guidelines SAYS THIS!

That "policy" is a complete about-face from what is done today with AR's, where most often the accused is immediately suspended while the G-Team "looks into the matter". "Hang the accused first and decide if they might have been innocent later" has been the guideline for the AR process to date.

And yet, most merchants surveying their stores and posting results in these forums indicated it was more like 40% to 50% of their customers who were NPOF!

That is enough for one post, and that was less than half of one brown-bag transcript...

/me points to sig

This is my reply to this whole nonsense going on - I found it better to write a blog post.

http://minervan.wordpress.com/2009/04/29/the-potential-corporate-customers-and-adult-ratings/

to copy here -

If anyone believes this whole nonsense about Second Life adult ratings is about all those corporations and businesses who turned down coming to Second Life, you are believing a spin-doctored half-truth.

How soon we forget the CNet disaster with Anshe Chung.

The problem there was not that there were adult strip clubs dotting the mainland, or Hard Alleys on private sims, although some of these certainly had other issues. Most serious adult businesses made the effort to leave the mainland years ago. When I first came to Second Life in 2006, I had interest, like many do, in the erotic potential of the platform. We are humans after all, and most humans find sex pleasurable in certain circumstances. When I went looking for those products for purchase - I invariably went to those sims which specialised in it. I never found the good products on the mainland.

I found them first in Eros - Stroker Serpentine’s sim, and I found them in Eventide - the home of Xcite, Javier Puff’s sim. And countless other private sims. They had been, for many years now, doing the right thing and self separating themselves out. Not out of any silly idea of protecting the children - but out of the very real need to have more control over the areas in which they sell merchandise. Same reason most merchants end up buying private sims, or renting on one.

Private rental estates generally have rules to keep the sex out of public view. Caledon for instance makes it clear in the covenant that obvious public activity be along PG ratings and in theme, while making no restriction to renters to do in privacy in their homes what they would like on their land. As a bonus, above the 512 meter level - the theme is relaxed, even security orbs are allowed over 512 meters. They were, like the sellers of sex animations and scripted items, doing due diligence to keep sexual conduct discreet.

None of them needed the Lab’s assistence for any of this. And they rightfully see the Lab’s current policy as destructive to their business. Oddly enough, that also means it’s destructive to the Lab’s business, but I digress.

No, what the real problem for the corporate users who turned down Second Life was that anyone could come to their sim, and rez a tubgirl shooting scat, or wear a hud shooting pictures of penises, in any event and nobody could do anything about it *before* the fact. The corporations had no control over your inventory. There are no ratings of inventory, no filtering of inventory BEFORE entering a sim.

The problem remains that anyone can rez anything they like in any area of Second Life. So this great experiment is nothing more than More Mainland Land Sales, with a happy helping of coercion to buy it on the side, aimed directly at their CURRENT customers. It’s not a solution to those potentials who turned Second Life down. I predict they will continue to turn Second Life down, until some fundamental problems are addressed. Which I shall illustrate further, now.

The corporations had another problem, dating from the days of Wells Fargo. Years ago, they wanted to set up shop in Second Life. They wanted to keep their data in, and they did not necessarily trust keeping sensitive information on LL’s servers. This has nothing to do with the adult content question and everything to do with security, just like the adult shopkeepers who moved to private sims. They didn’t have it. Linden Lab turned them down back then. And Wells Fargo voted with their feet. They didn’t stay, and who could blame them?

The real answer for these security-conscious corporations was making a standalone Second Life. Well, LL is doing that *now*. But it should have been thinking about it when Wells Fargo asked for it.

There is another problem, and answer I can supply. The problem is the question of content. Corporations are also attracted to Second Life because there is an abundance of content to purchase for small fees. These stand-alone Second Lifes don’t have access to that vast wealth of content or to a competitive market of content creators. And this is a problem.

There is an obvious solution, and I have been advocating for variations of this solution for quite a long time now. I will articulate it here.

Create an inventory system that can be ported across grids. That is, a Second Life member can still be attached to their Second Life inventory while in a stand alone Second Life sim.

ALLOW content creators to make PG, Mature and Adult rated content that can be rezzed across grids, while preserving the permissions system.

Allow standalones and private sim owners to decide which of this content can be rezzed in their systems.

Make this system OPT IN. Content creators need to *submit* their merchandise for ratings. I will be happy to pay a small fee for this. There is no doubt the Teen grid would love to buy PG rated content from the Adult grid too. I am certain many content creators would be FINE with a controlled content system that is cross grid portable, as long as they have the choice whether to participate in it or not.

UNSCREENED content should be allowed as usual, in Second Life proper (the Linden Lab main grid), in Mature sims and up, and also in private sims on the discretion of the sim owners. NOT on standalone grids.

Problem solved.

HAI LL, I HAZ IDEA 2 MONETIZED CONTENT 4 U. Don’t forget to thank me if you use the idea

I would be DELIGHTED if the Lab used it!

o NOTE: After a 60-day transition period, the Options tab will no longer display the 'Adult' dropdown choice on Show Place in Search under: [possible categories] <<< what exactly does this mean?! Does it mean after 60 days phase 2 is to even if you are verified shunt adult off the dropdown, Or does it mean after 60 days anyone none adult verified does not get rhe adult dropdown?!

Interesting Post Hypatia

I dont think its entirely correct. I am pretty sure LL wants to "clean up" the mainland and Gate off both the Adult continent and Adult sims from the new users.

Thus making SL a more "family" type place. Google with the filters on, etc.


Still you bring up some really good points. The one about Content being able to be rezzed/worn anywhere regardless of a rating (at least until AR'd for it)

It seems to me INVENTORY items need to have a Adult / Non-Adult tag

actually moreso than Parcels do.

especially since all content is rezzed inventory - after all.

[/mistress mode]Explain your self Blondin, what is this "60-day transition period"
& it's implications
[/mistress mode]

/me doesn't buy it.


Blondin, if I have a parcel on a mature mainland region that is not advertised in search or anywhere else and has nothing for sale and I spend all my prims building a 100m tall penis, will I have to move?

just a quick note:

Blondin's office hours are tomorrow at 3:30PM SLT
@
http://slurl.com/secondlife/Hanley/205/218/25/

Have a nice time

Just a personal note to my wonderful new ex-neighbours on my PG land. I really hope you like it there and you get your moneys worth. Dont know who from though. I moved. Again. It costs people a fortune when they chase after me. I have no sense of value when it comes to money, mine or yours, you wonderful ex-neighbours you =p =)

Not permanently gate .. just cover up to those without access.

But even those with access will have to choose to use it, so SL will seem much more "Safe for work" on the surface.

Yes, interesting post Hypatia, but I think off the mark. I'm not sure how it could ever be about inventory when nasty stuff can be made by anyone including a griefer who would label them PG.

Based on my time in corporate IT management and reading the recent press surrounding SL, it would seem to me that the core reason for them to clean up "public" SL to be much safer for the corporate desktops in the workplace. LL has a real opportunity to break into the corporate mainstream, but it won't last forever. There are many corporations though where the things that will be labeled as adult content are NSFW (not safe for work). Casting adult content off into it's own lands could make entry by employees at work much more acceptable.

I wouldn't be surprised if some time after this segregation of adult content occurs if LL makes available business avatars. Get your own business name (or variation of it) as a last name AND the avatars would not be able to switch or verify into adult mode.

I'll bring popcorn, who want's some?

If I can still build a 100m tall penis on mature mainland without being forced to move, nothing's getting covered up except search results.

Nothing except search results are being made safe for work/schools.

Heh, is that the word 'adult' won't be censored, or that it would not be ok to say 'adult poseballs' in an ad without it being censored?

Personally I am ready to abandon my virtual mainland and hit the delete key on any and all of my builds, items and avatars if the Lindens implement these insane & suicidal changes for Adult content. Second Life was a great experiment and I guess now its time to move on. Have fun Lindens with all the empty virtual space. At least you will have gotten the lag problem licked.

With the Open sims now available SL will become an internet footnote. Its sad to see it happen.

Language changes over time despite causalties, some of which are very lamentable. *And* in this particular case, anyone searching for a 'tit bird' who looked for 'songbirds' would find that vendor's shop and only two others. *In that case* there is likely no damage done.

*Also* I did suggest an alternative search engine that would operate just the same as the current one but leave the keywords hidden, thus allowing the more generic description of a place or business to come up as a response to what would otherwise might be considered by some in need of filtering.

For example, someone could search for 'tit birds' and still have that vendor's shop come up, likely as the only candidate without giving anyone an excuse to whine about seeing a bad word.

Try the San Fransico yellow pages search engine. It seems to find 'adult content' just fine without said shops needing to display any vulgar words in their descriptions.

Edit: I notice you did read and reply to my suggestion a little later. Even if SL does not allow such at the momment, how hard would it be to implement? Wouldn't it just involve adding an additional text field (for the display description) and changing the display to show only the contents of the new field while having leaving the rest of the search engine intact?

First of all, let me say that I am *not* questioning the right of anyone to have an opinion or express it.

that said, the post in question said that the only merchants that would be harmed by the decision would be the "crappy" ones. That doesn't sound arrogant to you? that doesn't sound like "fighting words"? They do to me, especially after having listened to a couple dozen people trying to figure out exactly how badly their businesses will be hurt over the last month and a half.
And as far as it goes, suggesting that we refrain from buying from people who are actively *seeking harm to our businesses* by supporting this policy isn't *bullying*. It is trying to bring a little economic leverage to our argument, because people don't seem to be listening to anything else. As long as they aren't affected by it/won't lose money from it, they could care less about it, or support it, seemingly without any sympathy to those who *will* be harmed by it. At least as far as that single post was concerned. again, it wasn't the opinion, it was the *delivery*.



Those in favor of the adult plan are only the minority in this forum. Actually, the * real minority* are the people who even *know* about the adult plan. that's one of the reasons why we are angry. Granted, most of us here believe that if the rest of SL knew what was happening, they wouldn't like it, but to neglect even the *possibility* of athe majority of residents expressing an opinion? Shameful!

And the post *was* offensive in part because of its characterization of anyone being hurt by the policy as being a "crappy" business. How many people here have said that the policy would hurt them? why shouldn't they be upset by that comment?
In what way is assuming that anyone who disagrees with you must peddle *crap* or else they wouldn't be worried *not* an arrogant act? The posted dashed off a flip opinion, phrased poorly, and got everyone stirred up.
You'll notice that the subsequent posts were mostly cordial and measured. questions and answers rather than hostility. That isn't the sort of widespread bullying that you seem to think is going on here. in fact, it is the *opposite*.