Serious Question!
Daniel,
I mean Blondin,
Why do people have to change their Adult descriptions to be Mature?
Why not just move them to Adult-Land for having Adult descriptions?
/352/11/314444/223.html#post2405417
Welcome to the Second Life Forums Archive
These forums are CLOSED. Please visit the new forums HERE
Blondin, you have some Esplanin to do. |
|
|
Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
|
07-16-2009 17:18
Serious Question! Daniel, I mean Blondin, Why do people have to change their Adult descriptions to be Mature? Why not just move them to Adult-Land for having Adult descriptions? /352/11/314444/223.html#post2405417 |
|
Katheryne Helendale
(loading...)
Join date: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 2,187
|
07-16-2009 18:44
I have seen all of this happen before in other worlds.. The company treats their customers like dirt because they can, the customers put up with it because their friends are here and it is the only world that offers something they need/want.. But as soon as something better comes along and their friends all move to that world, they go too, regardless of the investment. I have seen exactly this happen to another MMORPG/Virtual World known as EA-Land (née The Sims Online). In this case, Electronic Arts produced TSO hoping to cash in on the success of the Sims franchise. However, they rushed it to market half-baked despite protest from the beta testers screaming that the game wasn't ready for release yet. When TSO failed to live up to EA's impossibly-optimistic subscriber expectations, they essentially abandoned it and left us to fend for ourselves. Now, while the preceding doesn't necessarily describe the state of SL, this does: During TSO's almost-six-year life, its users loudly and repeatedly cried out to EA, trying to tell them what would make the game successful, but EA didn't listen. Finally, one person at EA *did* listen, and an intense restructuring of the game went underway. Unfortunately, EA bean counters began meddling, and EA stopped listening again. About six months later, EA-Land/TSO officially died. Unofficially, it had died long before this, as too many subscribers had jumped ship and bailed due to disgust from not being listened to and being mistreated by EA, that the game simply couldn't sustain itself anymore. This is the same road Second Life is presently on. The only difference here is that TSO refugees had somewhere to go -- they all fled to Second Life. Right now, there is nowhere for us to go that is even remotely similar to SL - and LL knows this. However, it would be extreme arrogance on LL's part to assume that this situation will remain that way forever. _____________________
Of course, its all just another conspiracy, and I'm a conspiracy nut. Need a high-quality custom or pre-fab home? Please check out my XStreetSL Marketplace at http://www.xstreetsl.com/modules.php?name=Marketplace&MerchantID=231434/ or IM me in-world. |
|
Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
|
07-16-2009 18:55
Imaginary meeting at Linden Labs Boss Linden: Wow, we have a lot of empty servers. People aren't buying opensims, and the homesteads don't seem to be drawing people in. But we are still making money since we increased prices on the opensims. Investor Linden: Well I got a good dividends check this year but I want more. Any ideas how we can put those servers to use. Boss Linden: Well lets see. If we merge the teen grid we will only have to maintain one grid. More families would get involved. Investor Linden: But the teens don't really make us much money. The adults are the ones with the purchasing power. We can't merge them yet. And besides theres too much adult content that would need to be cleaned up before we can merge the grids. Boss Linden: There you have it. The adults stuff. Some people don't support it, but it does seem to be everywhere. If we were to make them move to an isolated area we can benefit in several ways. We can make use of those empty servers by making a new land for the more adult stuff. Tech Linden: We only have so many empty servers. And a lot of the residents will be upset having to move all their stuff. Boss Linden: How many sims can we fit onto those servers. Tech Linden: About 250. 300, if we push resources. Boss Linden: Not bad. Okay, so now if we just move people there should be little resistance. Let them have the land for the land they currently use. We get them out of sight and that will help make it more family friendly. It will be good p.r. for us. Show that we care and don't want to isolate anyone. But at the same time cleaning up the grid. Investor Linden: Wait, you just want to give them the land? Boss Linden: Yes. Investor Linden: How are we going to make money on that? Boss Linden: Good point. (thinks for a few minutes) okay heres a thought. We only give away ¼ of the new land. Tell the residents its meant for extreme content, and that only if they advertise the stuff they will have to move. Then we auction off the rest and put that money into our pockets. Tech Linden: But what if more people want the move then we have the land for? Boss Linden: Well we will decide who gets to move. Then a few months down the road we can go in and tell those business's left behind that they need to change content or move to the adult land. They will be forced to buy the land from the speculators. Look at how much money those guys generated for us on Nautilus. Investor Linden: Nice we can make money from both sides. PR Linden: But sirs aren't we basically changing the whole nature of what we are selling. Wont this upset people. Investor Linden: Who cares. We have the only viable grid at the moment. They will stay. So what if we lose a few suckers, err users, err Residents. PR Linden: Okay, but I suggest we don't let everyone know our plans. If we do, there will be a mass revolt. I suggest since only a small percentage of users go to the forums and blogs we post it there. It will be less noticed and we can say we informed people about the changes. Lawyer Linden: I would add a press release, or two. That way if we get taken to court for possible criminal activities we can say we announced it in the press. PR Linden: Great idea, that will also show the world we are cleaning up the grid that way. This is only an imagined conversation. Repeat, IMAGINARY as in being able to fly, teleport, and most of the activities in SL. Quoting this again from that infamous thread since it was so cool the first time. __________________ |
|
Clarissa Lowell
Gone. G'bye.
Join date: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 3,020
|
07-16-2009 19:00
Don't kill the messenger, is my thought on this thread.
_____________________
|
|
Katheryne Helendale
(loading...)
Join date: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 2,187
|
07-16-2009 19:08
Anyone who owns mature land should be allowed a land swap. NO one should be denied for any reason. I had a thought: I won't say that *everybody* did, but I suspect a majority of the people who bought mature parcels/regions did so to have the greatest amount of freedom in what they could place on their land. Now Linden Labs has gone and changed what is and is not allowed on mature lands. They have, in effect, unilaterally rewritten the contract between them and their clients. The have essentially sold a product with specific terms, restrictions, and freedoms of use - then turned around and took away those freedoms and change the terms and restrictions... "But, if you pay us AGAIN, you can once again have the freedoms we promised you that you already paid for." In the real world, this is called "bait-and-switch" - an act of consumer fraud with real-world criminal ramifications. Since the horse has already left the barn, there is no point in evangelizing that concept any further. LL surely knows what they're doing, and so far, the law is on their side. However, at this point, the only way LL can keep things that way is to allow ANY land owner who gets successfully AR'd for adult content in mature-rated land - particularly those passed up for the current land swap - should be offered a free, one-for-one swap to Zindra as a means of resolving the AR. To do anything less - especially suggesting the accused "buy" a Zindra parcel to resolve the AR - would be criminal. I would strongly suggest that anyone who applies - and is subsequently turned down - for the Zindra land swap keep any and all documentation and correspondence related to the application and denial. _____________________
Of course, its all just another conspiracy, and I'm a conspiracy nut. Need a high-quality custom or pre-fab home? Please check out my XStreetSL Marketplace at http://www.xstreetsl.com/modules.php?name=Marketplace&MerchantID=231434/ or IM me in-world. |
|
Katheryne Helendale
(loading...)
Join date: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 2,187
|
07-16-2009 19:18
I suspect that if there were a significant number of adult businesses being denied land swaps, we'd have heard about more than one by now. Of all the people who filed tickets for the move, how many of them do you think are active in these forums? How many of them may have been denied a move and took the denial as LL's implicit statement that their content is perfectly fine on mature land? How many of them, upon being AR'd in the future, will be ordered by LL to move to Zindra - at their own expense? _____________________
Of course, its all just another conspiracy, and I'm a conspiracy nut. Need a high-quality custom or pre-fab home? Please check out my XStreetSL Marketplace at http://www.xstreetsl.com/modules.php?name=Marketplace&MerchantID=231434/ or IM me in-world. |
|
3Ring Binder
always smile
Join date: 8 Mar 2007
Posts: 15,028
|
07-16-2009 19:26
Blondin said "They can. That will be their choice if they want to move." all that means is that if they don't WANT (choose) to move, then they will need to remove the adult content from the mature/pg land. _____________________
it was fun while it lasted.
http://2lf.informe.com/ |
|
3Ring Binder
always smile
Join date: 8 Mar 2007
Posts: 15,028
|
07-16-2009 19:27
Absolutely, the goalposts have been moved, everyone should have been allowed the chance to migrate. everyone will have that chance... after the swapping phase is over the remaining land will be up for sale. _____________________
it was fun while it lasted.
http://2lf.informe.com/ |
|
3Ring Binder
always smile
Join date: 8 Mar 2007
Posts: 15,028
|
07-16-2009 19:28
I thought that may have been one possibility. However - THAT would have been an extremely deceptive way to answer my question. If that had been the actual answer Blondin were he an honorable person would have added a second sentence clarify that. ---------------------- AND - I considered that as a possibility at the time and offered him multiple chances to further explain and he didn't bother. YOU also didn't ask any further questions to get the details you were listening for. he's not a mind reader... _____________________
it was fun while it lasted.
http://2lf.informe.com/ |
|
Milla Janick
Empress Of The Universe
Join date: 2 Jan 2008
Posts: 3,075
|
07-16-2009 20:50
Of all the people who filed tickets for the move, how many of them do you think are active in these forums? How many of them may have been denied a move and took the denial as LL's implicit statement that their content is perfectly fine on mature land? How many of them, upon being AR'd in the future, will be ordered by LL to move to Zindra - at their own expense? Judging from the number of parcels allocated in Zindra, and the fact that two expansions have been added, I'd say very few of those who filed for moves were active in these forums. Despite LL's inadequate publicity, word did get out. MISC-2727 didn't become the most voted for JIRA issue ever by chance. As for large numbers of swap requests being denied, maybe that's happening, and none of the victims are telling anyone. However, there is no evidence that is the case. There is no evidence that a majority of swap requests are being denied as part of some anti-adult content conspiracy. The criteria to qualify for the land swap has also been made very clear for months. Johnnie Carling does appear to have a legitimate gripe with a breakdown in the system. Most of the rest of this thread is nonsense. _____________________
 http://www.avatarsunited.com/avatars/milla-janick All those moments will be lost in time... like tears in rain... |
|
Ian Nider
Seeds
Join date: 20 Mar 2009
Posts: 1,011
|
07-17-2009 00:00
I suspect most people out there still aren't even aware any of this is going on. Most of the people I've talked to still believe the latest server update to 1.27 was to fix the group chat issues that "conveniently" cropped up just before its deployment. LL's communication regarding the entirety of its new Adult Content policy has been horribly narrow and lacking - and I believe deliberately so! Of all the people who filed tickets for the move, how many of them do you think are active in these forums? How many of them may have been denied a move and took the denial as LL's implicit statement that their content is perfectly fine on mature land? How many of them, upon being AR'd in the future, will be ordered by LL to move to Zindra - at their own expense? Yeh, often I meet people who have no idea of all this and it could be hell when it all comes out and people can't tp anywhere adult all of a sudden and realize their land is censored. Even friends who don't read the forums didn't grasp what I was trying to tell them, which is understandable as it does take a bit of reading to get your head around, or more so actually believe to be true and not just rumor. I know the push on the forums to classify public bdsm as a sex crime and devalue the rights of a child av would have been stuff I'd have written off as bullsh*t if I hadn't seen it for myself. Practically speaking, if they can't /won't give adult land to all, which I doubt they can or will. The best thing LL could do now is review it's AR process to protect against ARs mature people could cop and let them know they are genuinely safe on their mature land. Another practical path would be for those who have been denied to keep that email as back up in the face or an AR. _____________________
Playin' Perky Pat
|
|
Tegg Bode
FrootLoop Roo Overlord
Join date: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 5,707
|
07-17-2009 00:51
It has recently come to my attention that the Lindens instead of just processing people's Zindra move requests are instead Judging people's land as worthy or unworthy of a swap ... WTF? Yeah we should give everyone who sticks a prim penis for sale on their land a right to buy up and profit selling Zindra parcels of course leaving less choice for others. Heck I may just put a Stokers affiliate vendor out and submit a ticket, give me my 1/2 sim for adult business in Zindra too so I can sell it next month for $100 per metre ............................... _____________________
Level 38 Builder [Roo Clan]
Free Waterside & Roadside Vehicle Rez Platform, Desire (88, 17, 107) Avatars & Roadside Seaview shops and vendorspace for rent, $2.00/prim/week, Desire (175,48,107) |
|
Cal Kondo
Low impact
Join date: 7 Oct 2006
Posts: 143
|
07-17-2009 01:10
Yeah we should give everyone who sticks a prim penis for sale on their land a right to buy up and profit selling Zindra parcels of course leaving less choice for others. Heck I may just put a Stokers affiliate vendor out and submit a ticket, give me my 1/2 sim for adult business in Zindra too so I can sell it next month for $100 per metre ............................... If they made it that easy to swap then everyone who wanted it would get it and there would be no resale market because every one who wanted it would already have it. The ability to profiteer on resale relies on not everyone who wants it getting it. |
|
Qie Niangao
Coin-operated
Join date: 24 May 2006
Posts: 7,138
|
07-17-2009 03:47
Judging from the number of parcels allocated in Zindra, and the fact that two expansions have been added, I'd say very few of those who filed for moves were active in these forums. Despite LL's inadequate publicity, word did get out. MISC-2727 didn't become the most voted for JIRA issue ever by chance. If LL actually ever enforces any of the Adult Content prohibitions in Mature regions, more people will be forced to move operations to Zindra (or re-tag their Estate sim--if the owner allows it) than have already done so. What's been done is the tip of the iceberg. That said, I very much doubt that LL has any plans of enforcing any of this, ever. It is simply window-dressing, exactly the same as the long-running farce of a beta test for "age verification" (nee "identity verification" or IDV). Some residents who are Not With The Program may try to AR adult content, and LL may be cornered into responding to a few of those ARs, but the generally half-assed way that this whole thing has been handled from the start suggests that there was never any intention to follow through on enforcement once there is Adult-flagged content adequate for consumption by media critics. |
|
Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
|
07-17-2009 06:10
Yeah we should give everyone who sticks a prim penis for sale on their land a right to buy up and profit selling Zindra parcels of course leaving less choice for others. Heck I may just put a Stokers affiliate vendor out and submit a ticket, give me my 1/2 sim for adult business in Zindra too so I can sell it next month for $100 per metre ............................... If everyone did that it would end up selling for about the same price as Mature.  _____________________
Argent Stonecutter - http://globalcausalityviolation.blogspot.com/
"And now I'm going to show you something really cool." Skyhook Station - http://xrl.us/skyhook23 Coonspiracy Store - http://xrl.us/coonstore |
|
Gummo Zaks
Registered User
Join date: 27 Oct 2008
Posts: 228
|
07-17-2009 07:02
If everyone did that it would end up selling for about the same price as Mature. And wouldn't that be great? we'd all have land again where we can do what we want when we want |
|
Ciaran Laval
Mostly Harmless
Join date: 11 Mar 2007
Posts: 7,951
|
07-17-2009 08:58
everyone will have that chance... after the swapping phase is over the remaining land will be up for sale. Which isn't the same thing, I had parcels whereby I could of, if I'd chosen, opened an adult business, now I don't have that choice. Everyone should have been offered free migration to land where they still had the same choice, LL could have set a cutoff date for applications and then moved their goalposts. |
|
Nika Talaj
now you see her ...
Join date: 2 Jan 2007
Posts: 5,449
|
07-17-2009 09:00
That said, I very much doubt that LL has any plans of enforcing any of this, ever. It is simply window-dressing, exactly the same as the long-running farce of a beta test for "age verification" (nee "identity verification" or IDV). Some residents who are Not With The Program may try to AR adult content, and LL may be cornered into responding to a few of those ARs, but the generally half-assed way that this whole thing has been handled from the start suggests that there was never any intention to follow through on enforcement once there is Adult-flagged content adequate for consumption by media critics. . |
|
Tegg Bode
FrootLoop Roo Overlord
Join date: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 5,707
|
07-17-2009 13:19
If everyone did that it would end up selling for about the same price as Mature. Has anyone who got their parcel there put it up for sale yet or are they currently blocked from doing so? _____________________
Level 38 Builder [Roo Clan]
Free Waterside & Roadside Vehicle Rez Platform, Desire (88, 17, 107) Avatars & Roadside Seaview shops and vendorspace for rent, $2.00/prim/week, Desire (175,48,107) |
|
Ciaran Laval
Mostly Harmless
Join date: 11 Mar 2007
Posts: 7,951
|
07-17-2009 13:24
Has anyone who got their parcel there put it up for sale yet or are they currently blocked from doing so? Parcels have changed hands, how much for I don't know. Those who tried to flip without putting down a prim have had their wrists slapped if LL noticed. |
|
Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
|
07-17-2009 16:42
Yeah we should give everyone who sticks a prim penis for sale on their land a right to buy up and profit selling Zindra parcels of course leaving less choice for others. Heck I may just put a Stokers affiliate vendor out and submit a ticket, give me my 1/2 sim for adult business in Zindra too so I can sell it next month for $100 per metre ............................... If it is selling next month for 100 per meter, then there OBVIOUSLY isn't enough of it. |
|
Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
|
07-17-2009 16:43
YOU also didn't ask any further questions to get the details you were listening for. he's not a mind reader... Sure I did. More than Once. Read the thread. |
|
Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
|
07-17-2009 16:45
everyone will have that chance... after the swapping phase is over the remaining land will be up for sale. You don't see the inherent contradiction in this? |
|
Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
|
07-17-2009 16:50
Blondin said "They can. That will be their choice if they want to move." all that means is that if they don't WANT (choose) to move, then they will need to remove the adult content from the mature/pg land. He did not say they will have to remove adult content. He said they could move if they wanted. Since my question was if they would BE moved, it would have been disingenuous if he actually meant they would need to purchase land to move, but didn't specify that. So EITHER he doesn't now stand by the statement he made then, OR he was disingenuous then. Has to be one or the Other. |
|
Tegg Bode
FrootLoop Roo Overlord
Join date: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 5,707
|
07-17-2009 16:53
If it is selling next month for 100 per meter, then there OBVIOUSLY isn't enough of it. Didin't stop it happening in Pay City or Naughtilus  _____________________
Level 38 Builder [Roo Clan]
Free Waterside & Roadside Vehicle Rez Platform, Desire (88, 17, 107) Avatars & Roadside Seaview shops and vendorspace for rent, $2.00/prim/week, Desire (175,48,107) |