Ban Child Avatars Being Used for Sexual Purposes

Emotion is understandable, Cristiano. However, I hope you can see how the statements you made could be latched onto by someone and used to attack me when I in no way condone, advocate or take part in the behaviour and have never played a child avatar. If someone wanted to start a witch hunt...you just sealed an innocent persons fate and further victimized a real child abuse victim whose only issue with these posts is that she feels they are offenseive to equate ageplay fantasy among adults to real child abuse.

I don't recall anything I said advocating this behaviour. Just because I disagree with the original poster and others that people should be banned for it does not mean I like it or take part in it.

People who read my posts clearly and objectively will hopefully see my only issue here is in how this feels like slap in the face personally to compare this to real child abuse when no children are being harmed here. And how exactly these people expect to implement the banning witch hunt process they seem so eager for.

Your association of me to this behaviours is every bit as invalid and off base as you thought my statemtn about some people harbouring latent sexual desires for children was if applied to you (which it never was....)

P.S. - I edited the statement you took offense at to be more clear as to who it referred to.

Now, I don't really have an opinion on this all yet, however the above suggestion seems like a bad idea for a two reasons.

1) “Hi Mr. Policeman, I want to report to you two adults playing as children having sex. Oh, yes, I have proof! I took a picture of it! Oh, well, yes I guess that does mean, by my own definition, I have child porn on my computer.”

2) “Hi Lindens, I stalked two people down people down to prove they where having sex while in child-like avatars. Oh, stalking is against the TOS? What?”

As for child avatars, the few I have seen have given me the creeps. Not because it is adults playing child but because of their actions. You stop for a moment to watch these strange creatures, like you would dragons or any other unique avatars, and they all stop and look at you. That is when you feel like you might just have landed yourself in “Children of the Corn.”

I think you should be careful levelling the accusation against the original poster. It was pretty clear in her original thread that she is reacting to her own victimization as a child, and that is fueling a lot of this. Kendra picked up on that before I did - her original thread was far less rational than the others. I think accusing anyone who is trying to stop this with a statement that they are doing so out of purient, repressed attraction themselves is a dangerous one to make that is every bit as damaging as the one you are pushing back against.

I don't recall leveling accusations. I recall expressing the opinion I had and how the posters came across to me. But for sake of removing this truly tangent issue from the picture, I will simply remove that statement entirely as people seem to want to focus on that rather than my real point...which is how offensive I find it to equate this to real abuse.

P.S. - This will be my last post on this issue. I find it to personally upsetting to continue with and people refuse to actually see what is being posted anyway. please continue the witchhunt all...but without me. I will be in SL awaiting the mass banning of all tinies, furries, Goreans, vampires, and short people.

I don't think it is being equated to real abuse per se, I think it is much more about it leading to RL abuse. In and of itself, age play is not abuse at all. It is just symptomatic of a much more serious issue.

PS - I removed my statement I made to you as well.

Against probably better judgement, I decided to put my thoughts on this matter into this thread.

I believe there are acts that are considered an abhorrent to the vass majority of humankind. I believe sex with children would be considered as such. I tend to believe with that depictation of such acts, even in a virtual sense, is indicative of the an imbalance in the brain chemistry of those participating in such acts. Likewise, I believe, as Cristiano stated, that such acts can be a reinforcement to such deplorable acts and can cause this seed of chemical imbalance to grow into a more dangerous and RL exhibition of such acts. It is the numbing aspect - the more the act is acted upon in the virtual world, the more acustomed the participants become to it, and slowly these chemical imbalances override the basic civilized morals/logic that prohibited the dasterly act in RL.

I would urge those whom participate in such acts to seriously reflect upon themselves and examine what is fueling this destire. While I am sure (or at least hope) the majority whom are could never see themselves acting upon these feelings in RL, perhaps they should examine what they are doing here and avoid the potential slippery sloap and let their civilized mind take control and put this hidden desire in check. I believe sexual deviancy in this manner is a mental illness, similar to that of alcholism and whatnot, and the last thing an alcholic needs is to embrace and tempt their illness by virtually giving in to it.

With that said, I am not sure if LL can do anything about it, nor if they did, if it wouldn't end up causing more harm than good. As pointed out by others in this thread, there is a fine line between perception and reality. If that AV a child or a short adult? I believe one could always say "Oh, no. My AV is just short with childlike features, but completely an adult" or just simply "My AV is young looking 18 year old". I can also see backlash from potential "witchhunts" - AV's busting into private residences trying to catch people in the act - most of which would most likely not be.

That's a slippery slope you're on yourself, Alondria , that you might want to examine.

Well mabey your rigth. But doing nothing is kinda silly too.
If Linden wont do anything at least you can file a complaint in RL against it... mabey there are agency;s like here in the Netherlands that do care about these things and they seem to get things done.

But its all up to you, mabey there is an agancy in your country that handles these kinda things too?

And what slope might you be referring to. Reitsuki?

How is it is a slippery slope? What she had to say was incredibly moderate, and I agree with it completely. There is not much LL can do about this problem, but it is a real issue, and the driving factors behind why someone is fantasizing about sex with children is definitely something for someone to self-examine.

Same question, so I'm adressing it at the same time.

Condeming based on correlation is a slippery slope.

Which brings up an important point: Putting aside for a moment the arguments about whether LL *should* ban sex with child avatars, how would such a ban work practically?

Since public sexual activity with a child avatar is already grounds for filing an AR, how would citizens discover, document and prove the instances where it is going on privately? And could they somehow implicate themselves in the process? Also, who exactly would be allowed to define what qualifies as a "child avatar" and what qualifies as "sexual behavior"?

I'm not asking this rhetorically, either. I'm hoping one of the people supporting this proposal can weigh in on the specifics of how they envision it working.

I'm still trying to figure out where I can get some menthal help.

Yeah and I see the grand army of the republic of the Netherlands invading California any day now to shut down Linden Labs for something that doesn't involve any real children, or break any US laws.

Good luck with that, I'll be watching the skies for that strike force to fly over any day now.

Bottom line:

No children in SL, hence no children being harmed.

No US laws are being broken by these distasteful activites.

It's legal in both the eyes of LL and the law of the land in which LL's servers are housed.

I'd suggest coming to terms with that.

I may be able to help with that...

Bottom line:

No children in SL, hence no children being harmed.

No US laws are being broken by these distasteful activites.

It's legal in both the eyes of LL and the law of the land in which LL's servers are housed.

I'd suggest coming to terms with that.

Right, so then GTA has to go... and, it's played by A lot of real kids, millions.

So let's do away all the online arena warfare style games.

Someone might get the idea that murder is OK. This is the slippery slope, and had some folks had their way, and been successful in outlawing video games with violent content, we'd have hardly any games to play today (that's a scary thought in and of itself isn't it? That violence in games is so accepted and so widespread because it "isn't real", that there'd hardly be anything left to play, if it were forbidden). Yes, Tipper got the labels on the boxes, but how much good does it really do? I can't even begin to tell you how many people I am acquainted with that don't pay attention to, or outright ignore those labels and give the kids what they want.

How is it that those who enjoy games with acts such as killing virtual prostitutes (violence against women -- another current hot-button issue), et al, can discard the notion that that sort of game content may lead to RL crime, yet can zero in on adults RPing children, and base their fears upon what might happen in RL as a result? I think we should worry more about parents who allow their kids to play games that depict victimization of prostitutes, than consenting adults RPing in an 18+ only game.

So, do you think that playing GTA might cause people to be violent in RL? Maybe your friend's BF was a violent video game user?

Question: how is it, that people are able to buy videos off ebay that have japanese (animated) schoolgirls being raped and the like? Doesn't that PROTECT act cover that?

I am not condeming anyone - infact I thought I made it clear that I doubt the majority of the people involved in such acts would act upon their feelings in RL. But the fact still remains the have these feelings. By the fact that they choose to act out these acts in a virtual world is indicative that they do have feelings of excitement regarding having sex with children, or else why would they be doing it? So thus, they do have this illness - and yes, I call it an illness. It is not necessarily their faults that they feel this attraction anymore than it is the fault of the alcholic feels the drive to drink. What is their fault is they decide to act upon these urgings. And yes, I believe there is evidence that prolonged fantasizing can lead to desensitization which in effect can (and I say again can, not will) lead to RL acts.

Further readings

I still wait for a Linden reply and still have hopes that they are against it for 100% and that they will add it to the TOS because now it seems to be an issue...

Time will tell

what was wrong with Robins answer she gave already? that it doesnt agree with yours?

In this context? Yes. I'm very much in favor of allowing consenting adults to roleplay whatever they want no matter how personally offensive or warped I find it. I'm very much in favor of people who can separate fantasy from reality being allowed to engage in fantasy and roleplay. People practicing ageplay in SL are no more engaging in child abuse than people shooting each other with seburos are engaging in murder, or furries are engaging in bestiality, or BDSM enthusiasts are engaging in torture and slavery. I'm very much against allowing knee-jerk holier than thou moralists to dictate what other consenting adults can and cannot do with other consenting adults.

...

did you miss the Linden response at the beginning of this thread then?

It is no more an issue now than it was a month ago.

I'd like to know if the people who are hopping through this thread guessing at what may be the motivating factors behind ageplay are credentialed in any way?

Disclaimer: I would never engage in this ageplay, but I'll be damned if I am going to try and go into the bedrooms of consenting adults and tell them what to do.

Damn you --you --you--sense maker.