RC Questions

Catherine Smith: I'm recording. We'll post the transcripts, and we'll also post text as well, afterwards. Hey, JP.

JP: Hey, good morning.

Catherine: Great. So, let me see if I can find Poid.

JP: I think I got her. So, Catherine, did you get everyone kicked off? Are we ready to get underway?

Catherine: Yes, I believe so.

JP: OK, great. Excellent, so yeah, thanks everyone for showing up. I'll be looking for your questions in IM. Thanks.

Marty: So, as we start - this is Marty. Thank you all for coming. Some of you were at the previous meeting we had to talk about definitions, or rather where we told you that we were going to publish them and then have another meeting to talk about them.

So, that's what this is. We want to have a conversation about the drafts that we published, take your input and then we'll be putting together a version that we'll start to live under.

JP: OK, question one from Katriana, "Have we determined yet a way to make sure that legitimate art galleries are not being censored or being asked to censor the artists that they host?"

Marty: Well, we think so. Here's what we're currently planning. The art will be able to be in a mature region. We're not going to get too deeply into trying to define what's art.

But what we will say is that if you've tagged the art with words that indicate an adult intent, then we will be filtering for those results. And if the intent with the art is to engage in an adult activity, then it will need to go in an adult area. But if it's art for art's sake, then it can be in the region. Does that make sense?

JP: OK, question from Lord Sullivan coming in, just a moment here.

Marty: Yes, it should. Not tagging the parcel that contains the art with the words that would indicate that the parcel has or the user intends to engage in adult activity.

JP: That's the first question. I'm just catching up for the record. The second question coming in is from Lord Sullivan. "Is a word list going to be released for us, or do we need to continue to make it available on our [email]wiki@slapped.me[/email]?"

Marty: The word list is not going to be published by us. The words that are on the list will evolve over time and will be tailored to the uses in Second Life. So it will not be a static list, and we will not publish it.

JP: Next question is coming in from Phoenix Wells. "Is the term 'photo-realistic' still going to be used to define adult? Or is photographic now going to be used when combined with nudity to define all adult? I'm asking because photo-realistic is still the term used to define art in skins."

Marty: I don't know where we used that word to define art in skins, but that is not the intent. The intent is pictures. So skins and art will... I mean nude skins and art can be in the mature region.

The term "photo-realistic" is the problem, is that what you're saying? Well, maybe we'll use a different word. Well, maybe photography would be a better way to say it, but we're trying to make clear our intent is that art and skins - nudity depicted as art, or art that depicts nudity and a skin - are not necessarily adult. Although, the word "photo-realistic" probably won't be on the list.

JP: I don't think I've ever seen it on a list.

Marty: I'm assuming that everyone has read, has a copy of, or can get access to the draft version of the definitions. That's why I didn't start by reading them.

JP: OK. A couple of folks are typing questions, right now, but they are not in yet. I'll post them as we get them. Next question from Marianne: "What methods will be used to revise the list? How often will it be reviewed?"

Marty: Well, we haven't set a period during which it will be reviewed, because probably it will be reviewed all the time. The methods will be a lot of what we do in the ordinary course of our day - looking at abuse reports, our exploring of Second Life, things that the governance team works on. We'll all be considering how search is being used and how keywords are being employed to tag content. I don't know earlier, a minute ago, somebody said, "The list is easy to infer." Well, that may be, but it is going to change a lot.

Having not done this before, we don't really know how often we're going to need to change words. I mean, you can guess that there are some words that will never go off the list. Then there are others that will come off or go on, because we didn't anticipate how they would be used or how the content that's being tagged with those words would exist in Second Life.

JP: The next question is from Stroker: "There is nothing on the map currently denoting adult parcels. Will that change as it pertains to teleporting?" That's the reason for the question.

Marty: So, I'm going to ask Cyn to tag that question, because I don't really know. I expect, when we fully launch it in June, it will turn up. But Cyn, do you know the answer to that question, about when it will turn up on the map?

Cyn: Yeah. It won't be on the map until the final release, it's just as part of the development process. You won't be able to play with that part until we get a little closer. Does that answer the question, Stroker? Is that what you were asking? OK, do you want to elaborate?

Well, yes, as of right now, but I'm hesitant to give a firm date, because as you know QA happens. So, we want to be a little bit flexible there, but it should be in the final release, yes.

JP: OK, next question from Nightshade. "How do you expect residents to realistically be able to make intelligent decisions about what terms they can and can't use in their classifieds or searches, if there is no published list? Will that not create a whole lot of duplicative work for you, having to on an individual basis keep addressing the same terms over and over?

Marty: Well, the words that we're going to put on the list for searches are words that indicate an intent to either engage in adult activity or are very sex-oriented. If you have a parcel or content, and you're trying to attract an audience to it for an adult reason, then I guess I really don't understand why you would need to see the list.

Because if you intend to engage in adult activity on your parcel, are you not going to use one of the words, so that it wouldn't be filtered? I guess I don't understand why the list is such a big issue.

At least the inference I draw is that if you saw the list of words, you wouldn't use one of them, so as not to be filtered. So that's not the purpose of the list. Essentially, it's a proxy for what we consider adult. The purpose of this entire initiative is to make the user experience more predictable for the highest number of people.

So, adult content will be in an area marked adult, where you have to have a verified account to get to it. If you decide not to use words that indicate an adult intent so as to avoid filtering, then we won't have accomplished our goal.

Ken: So, in other words if I could... A slightly different way to say it is that you shouldn't be matching your search tag terms to our list. You should be matching your search tag terms to the content that you're providing and the activities that you want those on the region to be engaging in.

If you're using - and if that match - creates several search tags, or even just a couple of search tags, that are words for sexual activity, then we think that it's a safe inference that that is an adult space.

JP: OK. Next question from Mr. Santa, "If content sellers are not being asked to move, then why are the keywords needed to reach customers being filtered, i.e., BD/SM, kinky, et cetera?"

Marty: I'm not sure I understand the question. Are you asking why are we using search? Why are we filtering search? Well, you can use BD/SM as a search tag, and that's how people would find it. Go ahead, Ken.

Ken: I'm sorry. This is Ken D. speaking, by the way. So, it's actually the opposite. It would actually provide a more targeted way of advertising. I mean you can think of many examples, but essentially people who are looking for an adult experience are now going to be able to do "adult" search.

So if you're looking for, for instance, a pair of stiletto heels or furniture or clothing that's going to relate to a BD/SM experience, you are now going to be able to search for shoes or whatever, just in "adult" search.

That's actually going to provide a more-targeted experience, because somebody looking for that is going to just be presented with what they're looking for instead of 200 different options of shoes, only a small portion of which are going to fit the BD/SM search. So I think it will actually provide a much more enhanced search experience and help merchants in that way. Does that make sense?

JP: Next question from Stroker. We're getting several questions about the list, and I think we've kind of covered as much of that in this first go-round as we can. So, let's catch up with some other questions. If we have time at the end of it, we'll come back around to another go-round with the list and whether it will be published.

Next question from Stroker, "It seems to me that most of the people do not understand or know that changes are coming." I'll add that. "We want to know if Linden Lab is going to do more about making people aware, i.e., message of the day, dedicated website, wiki, phased deployment with message of the day and drop-dead dates."

Cyn: I can take that one, if you guys want. Yes, absolutely, but what we've been doing up until now is all pre-work. We wanted to have conversations with people before we made firm choices and decisions about content, definitions, and all of the stuff that we've been talking about.

Now that we've had a chance to talk with the community in several different groups and in the forums, now we can - once we make our final decisions about exactly how this is going to work, not just content moves, but how search is going to work, the definitions and information that you guys have provided to us - now we can start talking about it in a much broader fashion.

As we get closer to launch, obviously we want as many people informed as possible. But, we didn't want to do that until we were sure about what we were talking about. And to do that, we need to be in conversation with you all, which is what we've been doing. So, yes, it will get pushed out much more broadly as we get closer to deploy on this.

JP: Next question from Alpha: "Will estate owners have an opportunity to buy land on the adult continent?"

Cyn: Everybody will have an opportunity to buy land on the adult continent, regardless of their status as a resident. So if you're premium and you want to buy, that's great. Anybody who wants to buy will be able to buy, once we have everyone moved over and settled.

JP: Danielle RavenNest has a bit of a question with the setup. "The 'CSI' television show, among one of the most popular in the US, often depicts representations of intensely violent acts, whether or not photo-realistic, for example, depicting death, torture, dismemberment, or severe bodily harm. It is rated for the 14 and up crowd. Linden Lab proposes restrict such content to only a small part of the mainland. The adult area is for a supposedly over-18 audience. Is this overly restrictive?"

Marty: Well, I'll take that one. If "CSI" were in Second Life, it would be in a mature region. So clearly, this is a good example of how difficult it is for us to craft regions that cover every fact pattern. So "CSI" would not have to be in an adult area. If it can be on network television, it can be in a mature region in Second Life. It can be network in the US; other countries have a more permissive view of what's appropriate for broadcast television.

JP: OK. Next question is... I'm sorry.

Marty: Yes, I know, and that's my point. Those are the words in the adult definition, but that's not our intent.

JP: A question from CheerGirl Allen, "Some of my group members, the Bimbo Cheerleaders, have what they call a fun-alt. For whatever reason, their main avatar has payment info or is age-verified, be it for business or whatever. But, they have also created their fun-alt to have use in adult sims or to engage in some sort of mature role play. Must these accounts be age verified, as well? Or will Linden Lab provide a way for users to link their fun-alt with their main account?"

Marty: I don't know if I can answer that question, because I don't understand it. So, it's an account that has...

Cyn: Yeah, I understand what she's asking, yeah. Yes, it won't be automatic to begin with. But there will be a way to do that, if you're asking if we'll be able to link alts for you. Yeah, you'll probably have to submit a ticket, initially, because we don't want to make mistakes, obviously. We want people to want to do that.

Yeah, well, I mean really, like in the big scheme of things, wouldn't it be great if you could manage all of your accounts and not have them be separate? I think everybody would like to see that, from the educators to the business people to me, personally. I would love to be able to do that. So, I think that's something that we'll definitely continue to talk about.

No, the tickets won't be ignored. There are lots of places where basics can file tickets, and we answer them very promptly, actually. So, that shouldn't be a problem; we'll make that a priority.

JP: Coming around to another list question, with a question of context. "Related to the list, an actual filtered example..." This was one that was actually discussed internally last week. "One resident, Mosley Sperper, I believe, sells songbirds. However, a majority of his birds happen to be the Great Tit, the Marsh Tit, et cetera. These are filtered terms on the list currently." I'm going to guess that the question is, what is our plan to contend with that sort of scenario?

Ken: Let me say a word about this, because I actually saw this on the Gyro, and it got me to thinking. I actually went to those parcels. I saw the signage, and I saw the birds. It's a great space, and he's basically selling birds and garden stuff. But in the keywords that he was using, or she, the word "tit" or "tits" was not in there.

So, if the search tags aren't in there, and I would guess - I mean if you're selling gardening stuff and birds - you're probably not going to draw a lot of people searching for "tits." It's not going to be classified as adult.

JP: Next question from CheerGirl Allen, "In sex-gen Vegas' private estate, we know that some will be flagged as adult. On this estate, we have one bot, and its purpose is to act as an anti-spam bot on the sim and in the group's IM chat, scanning and ejecting for child avatars, managing bans, notices and group invites, reading and modeling new clothing, or a new toy from many of our designers. When the estate is flagged as adult, how will the bot be age-verified? Or, can Linden Lab set up a specific bot-style account in order for it to continue it's duties in our region, once it's flagged as adult?"

I believe the account owner, because it does need to be owned by an owner, will just verify that account the same way they verify their other accounts. And it would therefore be a verified account. Is that correct?

Cyn: We would do the same thing that we just discussed for alts. You might initially have to file a ticket to get in it flagged, but that's what we would do.

JP: Next question, from Lord Sullivan: "Why will PG, mature, and adult sims be allowed to be mixed and side-by-side on private estates, so anyone can walk from PG to adult to mature if their verified status allows, yet adult becomes a dirty word and is separated on the mainland?"

Marty: Our intent in doing this is to make the mainland a more predictable experience. So we're separating the mature from the adult content on the mainland. In private areas, the owners get to make decisions about what goes on there and how it's rated.

A lot of the adult activity in Second Life is in private areas. And so it's just a decision that we've made that people who own private areas in Second Life get to make the choice about what goes on there and how it's marked.

Sure, a predictable experience, if you want to come into Second Life and not see adult content, that you can do that as long as you stay in mature and PG regions. That's what we mean by "predictable experience."

JP: If we could keep the questions coming via IM, we could kind of keep it organized and stay on track with getting these. But if you want to answer that one, Marty, you can.

Marty: Which one?

JP: Do you feel the average player understand the difference between mainland and private sims?

Marty: [laughs] I don't know if they do or not. I think you don't have to be a Second Life resident for very long before you figure it out.

JP: Next question, from Stroker: "We would like to know if it is necessary to mark a whole private sim as adult, or if it will be possible to mark only parcels?"

Marty: Right now it's not possible to mark only parcels, is that right, Cin?

Cyn: That's correct.

JP: Then it looks like a follow-up from Stroker. "It seems like there will be a definite impact on the mainland parcels being relocated to Ursula. One was the cutoff date for those being relocated. Many are buying parcels currently hoping to be moved. Also, since the land sales are already depressed, will there be any incentive for land buyers to purchase these deserted parcels? Do you foresee any detrimental impact on the land market?"

Cyn: Let's see. I guess I'm not sure if I mind if somebody buys a parcel on the mainland and then gets moved to Ursula. I don't foresee having a cutoff date right now. But I shouldn't probably speak to details on that because I know that the Harmony and the land team are working very hard on that plan, and when that gets public then you'll know exactly what they've decided. I don't have my finger on that right this second.

I think that people in the course of their business that buy parcels on the mainland and then sell adult content need to move to the new continent. And as far as land reclamation goes, that's actually a very strong market. We're seeing quite a bit of good movement there.

Reclaiming parcels and connecting them hopefully to other areas that also have been abandoned or left in other ways, we get a lot of good results offering those to neighbors sometimes, if they're interested in those areas. And then on the auction site. I actually don't think it's going to have a significant impact in that way.

So I know that Jack and the land team have done a very thorough analysis of how they expect that will probably work, and they're very comfortable. So I think we're probably fine.

JP: OK. Next question, from Melodie: "I've been doing an extensive experiment on one of my sims, and we turned on age verify only. The process for this is not a good one right now. Many, many people have been doing the process to no avail. I've run into people that the website says they have successfully verified, but when they come into the sim they are not. I have a lot of different things, we have learned that are not working."

Marty: We would be interested to hear....

JP: Go ahead. I'm sorry.

Marty: Cyn?

Cyn: Yeah, I was going to say, it's looks like we've got two questions in a row about age verification. This one and also one that something slightly opposite, which is that you can, if you want to try to deceive or game the system, submit information that you're in possession of that's not yours. And the opposite is of course true also.

The first part, I'd say two things. First, we'd really like to see this, because we're not aware of any sort of bug or mismatch between people getting verified but then not showing up in the system as verified. So we'd really like to - if you send that to us, we'll dig into that, because that should not be happening.

The second piece about some people being turned away, that does happen sometimes. The match rate is pretty good. It's better in the last couple of months than it's been every before. So when you're talking about nine out of 10 people who submit valid information are getting in, there's some people that don't.

There's reasons for that. They may have move recently or there may be just mismatches in information, and there's ways for them to manually verify. Or of course they could just submit payment information or have it on file. So, yes, some people are turned away that shouldn't be. We've gotten some success in getting that number down significantly.

The second question says they were verified and still can't - so we want to check that out. I don't think anybody here has heard about that happening, so, Melodie, would you be willing to send us the results of that so we can actually check into what's going on? Because that shouldn't be happening, and that's the first we've heard of that happening.

And then there's another question that as just posed also about age verification, and someone potentially submitting someone else's credentials. That obviously can happen. There's no bullet-proof way physically for any Internet site or virtual world - us or anyone else - to verify that the credentials being submitted match the person sitting at the screen. That's just a simple fact.

Unless you're getting into some biometric solution, that's a simple fact of life. So what we're doing is the best technology that's available. We're trying not to make it burdensome on people. We think we're doing a - if there's problems with it, we want to know about those problems. So, Melodie, again, if you'll send us that stuff, we'll look into it.

JP: OK. Next question, from Cheergirl Allen: "Part of my business is Hippos affiliate vendor packs. At this point I know for a fact that there are well over 250 of my affiliate vendors on the grid, mostly in the regions currently set to mature. The current vendors include such items as BD/SM toys and sexual pose balls. I have no control whatsoever regarding how and where affiliates choose to set up a vendor. How will the new adult region flag affect all affiliate vendors my business currently has on the grid?"

Marty: I'll try to take that one. The affiliates would - if it's content that's adult, then it would affected the same way content is all over Second Life. The vendor/seller, it won't matter who that is. If they're selling the same content, they're all going to be treated the same. But maybe I don't understand what affiliate vendors means. Are they re-sellers of content that you've created?

OK. So all of them will be treated the same, if that's the question that you're asking. Oh, that's correct. It's not about the account, it's about the content. An account won't be deemed adult, content will be deemed adult. That's correct. The affiliate will be responsible, not the content creator. Thank you for helping me put that in words.

JP: The next question, it's actually a follow-up from Lord Sullivan. "What are the long-term plans for Linden Lab since this phase one is causing so much trouble in the world? What is phase two, phase three? What is the long-term and five-year plan for Second Life?"

Marty: We hope this won't take five years, but I guess - Second Life will continue to evolve as long as there's a Second Life. For phase two, we'll be doing refinement on phase one to hopefully make the experience easier.

As I said, the list and the definitions are not static, they're going to change over time as we live with them. That's sort of the purpose of this meeting and having interactions with those are most likely to be affect. To make sure that we understand their viewpoints before we start trying to do this.

In phase two, we will probably change what we call PG and M to something that's more descriptive. We're happy to take any suggestions that you have. AO is pretty obvious, but M and PG, what we mean by it are unique to Second Life. And so we want to come up with new phrases to describe. So that will be part of phase two and that, believe it or not, involves a technical change that's not as easy as it might be.

We've said in the past, if we have a lot of demand for a PG area, then we will consider a PG continent. But we don't know. Right now, we're going to do the best we can to have this migration happen in the least impactful way possible. And then we're if there are technical changes needed to make it easier in the future, then that will be part of phase two or three as well.

JP: OK. We've got a pretty good backlog of questions set up at this point, so we're probably going to only be able to take one or two more fresh ones. But we've got a good backlog coming, just to give everyone a heads up.

Next question from Melodie: "Will you be allowing free moves to private estate owners that want to have an adult sim pulled away from the continent they own."

Marty: Cyn, can you help with this one? To have an adult sim pulled away from a continent that they own. Do you mean an island that they own? A private estate? To segregate adult content from non-adult on the private estate, is that the question?

Cyn: Yeah. Are we going to now allow people to rearrange their entire continent based on this? I think we have to do that a little bit on a case-by-case basis. I think Jack would probably strangle me if I committed to reorganizing all of Second Life in that way.

But if you want to have your AO moved away from your other regions, there would be a way of that. Does that answer your question, Melodie?

JP: The next question, from Stroker: "There seems to be a lot of confusion as to whether payment used is sufficient for age verified. Is there a current expectation of how this would be implemented? For example, PayPal on record with a SLX or XStreet."

Marty: Ken, do you want to take this question?

Ken: Sure. So, any payment will be accepted. I know that we were - and maybe JP, you even know the answer to this. But I know that we were working on getting payment on file with XStreet conformed as an acceptable payment method.

So, yes, any payment method. So PayPal would be accepted. A debit solution, a credit solution. Anything that we accept as a payment method. JP, do you know the answer to the XStreet question?

JP: Verified PayPal used on XStreet will be considered to verify the account.

The next question from Mary Ann. And we're all wrapped up with questions. We've got enough backup now to take us through the top of the hour.

So the next question from Mary Ann: "Related to the current - I noted that I can rearrange the hub location, but I cannot go into adult parcels. I have payment on file, payment in use with Aristotle. Is this deliberate or a known bug?"

It may be that we don't have Ursula turned on yet. While it may functionally permit you to do certain things, I don't think we have Ursula open. I might need to verify that, because I'm not absolutely sure. But that might be why you're experiencing what you're seeing.

Catherine: Let's table that and circle back on it, because it sounds like a technical problem that we may want to take a look at. So we may look at it and let you guys know.

JP: Next question from Boyd: "Will the terms of service need to be signed upon login for all residents due to these policy changes?"

Marty: Yes. There will be a new terms of services that you'll have to click through to come after we publish them. You'll have a period to accept of not.

JP: Next question, from Phoenix: "Because the keyword list that will be filtered, will contextual search come into play in time to let people use whatever words they need to, but in a proper context of adult versus non-adult?"

Marty: I think maybe I don't understand what you mean by "contextual" search. As I said, the list is going to change over time as we live with it and figure out how words are being used to describe what content.

So in that way, the context will inform us. But we don't have the technology to filter some content and not others that's using the same term. That's beyond our technical ability. But maybe I don't understand the question.

Cyn: I think, from Phoenix's clarification, I think if we found that in the review of things, things aren't working the way we expected, we'll revise it. That's what any business would do as they roll out a new product and they found the things that work and the things that don't.

That's why it'll be under continual review and revision as we go along. So if things aren't working, we'll adapt.

JP: Will you commit to supplying enough adult mainland to keep reasonable parity with the mature and PG land?

Cyn: I will commit that the land team is going to be responsible for making sure that our market is healthy and functional, and that's what they'll do, yes.

JP: I'm catching up here, I'm sorry. A question from Stroker: "More details on moving. the mainland would be nice. Are we guaranteed the same amount of land that we currently have on the mainland? Could there be a wiki on relocation specifically?"

There will be all of that. And those details will come out. The land component is significant, obviously. It's not going to be handled lightly, and it's going to be handled with a great deal of messaging and a great deal of support. All the support we're able to support, we certainly will. So, yeah, that's currently being worked on, and it'll roll out separately and it'll roll out with as much careful management as we can give it.

Cyn: So, yes, Stroker, to answer your first question, you're going to get the same amount of land that you gave up. We're not going to short you. But I think the team is hard at work on the details there. They'll be collecting some input and feedback on their own, and we'll get that out to you as soon as we possible can.

JP: Cool. Thank you so much, everybody, for coming out and taking the time. These have been a great series of meetings we've had. This is the last one, and it's been a great time. Thank you once again for all of your questions.

Marty: Before we leave, everybody, I have one more thing I want to say. We're going to take all of your input, and we're most likely going to make sure changed to the definitions. As Cin and I have said repeatedly, and I've said even during this hour, we're going to adapt and things will change from the time we launch this.

In the first month, I expect it will change, and in the first six months I think it will change. So please have patience with us as we do the best that we can. Our intent is to make this be an overall positive experience for you as much as we can. Thank you.

Cyn: Thanks, everybody. We really appreciate your time. See you soon.

Catherine: Thank you. And I'll post the audio as soon as I get it up and I'll let everybody know. So thanks.

Yes it is very counter-intuitive.

And I do believe that to many of them don't actually "USE" the service.
Though they may occasionally tour it in a sort of "Golly-Gee Look At that!" n00b mode.
It is pretty obvious to many of them Do NOT have a clue!


I actually find the NEW All tab and the other NEW searches less functional then the old system.

I keep wishing they had both still functional and you could choose which to use either in preferences or preferably right on each tab.

Now they are about to make search even less useful.



Oh look, Blondin is back! *waves*

Oh. I see what you're confused about.

I believe they're saying that Adult will be a "rating" but not a "category". So instead of having your stuff in the "adult" category, you can have it "adult rated" in the "hangout" category.

Ok! Tell me.
Where?
When?

I have tried with my Basic Alts.
I can't find it!

Does that part mean it will be added soon?
But is not in yet?

There is currently no corresponding ticket type.
And a notice that anything else will be discarded unread.


I am also unsure how the single support site to submit a ticket,
plus possibly talking to a mentor on help island constitutes,
"lots of places".

Thx for the transcripts Blondin

^L^

Fortunately I use the Cool Viewer so I get the old format searches (although there are both 'all' and 'all (web)' tabs).

Part of why I wanted to make sure I would not be forced to use 1.23 if I was not interested in adult content.

Although if they are going to insist on voice I will go on insisting on actual transcripts. The 'umms' and 'errs' included.

Anything less is, well, less.

This is service! Well done! (To say something positive in between)

What did you think of Zodiac?

It was ok... Not bad but nothing special.

The one issue which keeps popping up is the inconsistency in, "We'll not consider this adult, except, if people can find it, we will".
So it is, to paraphrase Ken, perfectly ok to run a business with adult items on Mature land, except if you get any actual customers.

...with the added confusion about just how invisible things have to be to be considered "not adult" (Advertising? Word-of-mouth? Parcel description? Object names on the parcel since they are used in search?).

And Marty's "Oh, yeah, it's not what we have written, but we obviously mean something else" doesn't exactly instill confidence, and is frankly unfair to *both* the owners, who have no idea which Linden will consider what offensive and thus can get hit out of the blue at any time, *and* to the people who want a "cleaner" experience, since they have no idea what they can actually expect; what is actionable and what is part of the supposed "SL experience".

Finally! Finally LL says yes, we have no way to know if the creds being submitted have anything to do with the person submitting them.

Apparently, it doesn't matter that the best tech available will accept dead people, as long as they were over 18 when they died I guess, as long as it's the best tech available.

Why will the art need to be in a mature region when the real life art that's depicted is frequently shown in public places that are absolutely "general audience" rated, such as museums, art galleries, public squares, lobbies of hotels and public buildings, and so on?

I guess Marty and JP haven't actually read KB6010?


Someone selling photo-realistic tits and other songbirds might have a problem, particularly if they have both hen and cock versions of the birds, and maybe farm animals like donkeys and asses, and household pets like pussy cats and puppy dogs.

Note that these are not all just made up examples. Some have already happened.

Can you PLEASE update KB6010 ASAP because that's what we have to guess your intent from.

http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/MISC-2222

I think that's either missing the point or evading the question. And I think you really need to think hard about it... this is a real world problem. Breast cancer support groups, lesbian and gay support groups, lots of organizations have been harmed by similar filters in the past and the public relations results for the filtering companies have not been really good.

For me that was one of his best books. It really feels to me like he ran out of some essential vitamins somewhere in the middle of The Diamond Age, and couldn't really finish it... and he's been going downhill since.

Also, they are still vulnerable to predators, perhps moreso in general access areas. Keeping kids out of certain parts of the MainGrid is not the answer..keeping them out altogether is.

Oh so, if this is true, then this congressman has something in common with me then. We both work out our fantasies: i use SL as a vehicle for mine and share the experience discreetly with a small number of consenting adults whereas he uses politics as a vehicle and waves his fantasy around more publicly. Oh so maybe we only have a little bit in common.

Hans

It's not actually necessary to do that. You can search unfiltered on Google using
<your search words > + site:world.secondlife.com

You can even do this *within the SL client using the internal media browser from an unverified account*. I tested this:

* Logged in with unverfied account, using 1.23RC0.
* Checked to make sure Adult is not available in Preferences>General and Search/All
* Typed http://www.goggle.com in local chat
* Open chat history, and click on link, media browser opens to google search page
* Enter "fuck site:world.secondlife.com" in google search
* Lots of adult SL pages returned

We just have to explain to unverified people how to use that feature

(it does not let them enter adult land, but it does let them find stuff)

Zodiac was also his first book, IIRC. I guess you just like what he was and I like what he's been becoming. Snow crash was.. well.. it was Snow Crash, which everybody in the world except Brenda and a few other heretics liked. Crypto wasn't the most exciting book ever but the writing was good and the story was interesting to me. Yeah, the Baroque Cycle was a bit slow in places but it was also ~3000 pages long.

Anathem I really liked. It's put Neal firmly on my Best Author Ever list.

Back on topic, maybe we can spam him into doing a sequel to Snow Crash (the book that coined the word Metaverse, for those that haven't read it) where the government starts back up and begins trying to impose its own rules on the metaverse. It would, IMO, be interesting to hear his take on what LL is currently up to.

There will be better directions to the Open letter page soon and I have now put instructions as to how to add your name for non wiki users Thanks for telling me even though I was in Town eating Fries and frikandels and enjoying the sunshine

/me grumbles at some of the phrasings in the letter (no offense to the author, I'm just OCD that way sometimes) but I agree with what it's trying to say.

Add me to the sig list please..

With all the references to Mark Kirk, I just want to remind people that his crusade is a year old. His statements about "Second Life not wanting to protect children from rape rooms" are from back then, and it is widely suspected that his all-out attack back then was what triggered the absolute hysteria around SL5B. (The "No child avatar can be depicted in the same image as an adult" and "No child avatar can be depicted in or near a bed" rules and subsequent spin control).

His first book was "The Big U" and it won't ever be reprinted.

Snow Crash was pretty good, but not so much for the Metaverse (that had been done so much better by Vinge in "True Names" a decade earlier) but for the metalinguistic hacking. And, yes, the Deliverator.

The Diamond Age would have been by far his best book, if he had been able to come up with an ending for it.

Cryptonomicon was "OMG open source is so cool but I'm too hip to actually use the word 'Linux'". Bruce Sterling did "open source is so cool" much better in "Heavy Weather".

The problem I had with the Baroque Cycle is not that it was long, but that every main character in it was a totally anachronistic "Mary Sue" with perfect 20-20 20th-century hindsight (except when it was necessary to advance the plot). It probably didn't help that I read them right after Rebecca Ore's "Time's Child" with its slightly more down-to-earth representation of competent people with pre-industrial backgrounds.

True and this new plan LL is beating us to death with is nine months old. Coincidence?

Its the word list at http://www.slapt.me/wiki/index.php/Adult_Content_Keywords

SLapt.me