RC Questions

Anyway, I think when it gets to the point that people are talking about you, instead of to you, that things have run their course. The window of dialog and understanding has passed; my work here is done.

I'll let you all in on the joke now. I admit I have been playing the part of the antagonist, because it became clear LL wasn't going to do so. By playing the part of LL, and saying what they appear to be thinking, I was able to draw a lot of good, healthy points and counter-arguments out of everyone here. Things that LL needs to hear and consider. Their passive role wasn't likely to get people to be aggressive enough, and that is one problem I have with how LL operates. They really need to engage the users. And sometimes that means challenging them. Something any good teacher knows.

I have a video I think people should watch, it may make you think.

http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/emily_levine_s_theory_of_everything.html

No, just a different opinion.

Yet another great idea that will no doubt go unheard or simply ignored because too many higher ups have already put their stamp on silliness.

This message is hidden because Darien Caldwell is on your ignore list.

Nah, it's "Can I have anything even vaguely comparable to this made by anyone". And the answer is "no", because there are no content creators in SL-clones making anything but the same whitebread human pimps and doxies you see in all these 3d hangouts. Why should there be? Anyone who wants anything from SL can just rip it off.

1. Their answer is "no".
2. Their reasons for answering "no" are completely valid and reasonable.
3. It would take a hell of a train wreck in SL to make OL look good.

I hope so. But it's not happening any time soon.
There are 3d environments. Very few of them are "worlds" in the sense that SL is a world, and all the ones that are are just clones of SL, with all its disadvantages and none of the advantages.

If I can't get content like that, I won't be drawn to it.

That's a difference in quality, not a difference in kind.

But is it doing that?

Dismissing people's concerns is not "just an opinion".

See, I think you have a point there - I think longer-term residents who care about changes keep a "weather eye" out on the blogs and the forums, because LL do tend to announce stuff here first, for whatever reason, and we know that.

What bothers me are the newer people, who are just as valid and valued residents, being friends, building content, spending money, etc - they should know too.

The question remains as to whether LL are going to make a larger announcement once they have their act together a bit more (which they quite obviously don't yet)....

Well, I'd gladly bash you when you're here, but we're evidently not on the same schedule

And I believe that we were referring to your comments in post #345



You admitted to being "a bit trollish" because you were annoyed with all the negative reactions to LL's plan.

Whether "a bit" or "a lot", trollish is trollish- after you say it about yourself, it's a little odd to complain about others agreeing with you

^V^

So, by your definition, if we *have* examined the plan and found it to be a steaming pile of Goat poop, we're fine to bash it all we like?

Thanks!

^V^

Right, so the contract doesn't hold water. That means it doesn't hold water on either side, doesn't it? Which means there IS no contract. So why are people tlaking here about LL breaching some legal contract with the residents? Either what we agreed to stands (and for both sides) or it doesn't (for both sides). You can't cherry-pick.

I have been through this one in other arenas. Once any threat of legal action is made, any lawyer will tell you not to make any statements in any recordable media unless they are involved, so that you don't say something dumb to ruin your case. Beleive me, if there is ever any legal action from any of the residents who have posted on these fora, LL's lawyers will be going through it with a fine-toothed comb, looking for ways to get the case dismissed.

Ah but they haven't actually DONE anything yet. They've TALKED about doing it on these forums and on the blog. Nobody with a current "official" client is restricted from anything in-world right now, based on what I have heard.


Don't get me wrong - I absolutely agree that this needs to be broadcast on the login screen - I have been campaigning for it in these forum threads and in IMs with Lindens since this whole thing started - at the very least to get some roadmap from them that says "once we have x, y, and z worked out, then we'll make an announcement". They haven't done that and I think this is a HUGE mistake.

I hope beyond all hope that they are going to do this, though. However, I don't think it's going to be the first significant change that they make that they don't announce on the login screen - was the Openspace/Homestead change published there? Or just in the blogs and the forum. Have there been any lawsuits about this? If there have been, I'd love to know, and to know what the outcome is.

well they've said that they will post it to the blog and have a forum thread going.. (/me looks decidedly underwhelmed by this)

what a change from when they bought xsl.. every av of mine that had an account there got spammed with their junk trying to get me to buy..

it would be easier for them to send out a bulk email to everyone pointing them to the blog post. Sometimes people go off an make a cuppa when the splash screen starts (reminds me of windows 95 startup lol) so they may miss it. however LL so rarely send emails that in theory people would pay attention...

but being LL that would be demonstrating a responsibility to their customers that I've not ever seen, so it's as unlikely as a snowflake surviving in the sahara.

I suppose it is- care to point out which is which?

^V^

Maybe we *like* SL, and want LL to *not* get their asses sued off over this. Maybe we're participating in a forum discussions because LL asked for out input, and part of that input is that we see glaring liability issues for LL if they continue on this course.

We *like* SL, and don't want the company that hosts it going bankrupt, see?

^V^

Some of you may be interested in this thread in RA:

/327/62/319635/1.html

Gee, and all I wanted to know was how "Blue" Linden got his name. Did he get it because when and swears, he curses like a sailor with tourettes?

This.

Oh I must've overlooked this adult content discussion between residents and active Linden Lab employees here under the title RC Questions.

It's the worst thing that ever happened, thanks for asking.

Giving users the CHOICE over what kind of content they find is one thing...

But instead the current plan is going to make it inevitable: one day I'm going to want to get together with someone, and DING, you or your friend is unable to come because they're not willing to identify.

Sometimes people want to share a pornographic-style image from the interbutts, or maybe build something with blood spilling out of it. Personally I will most likely be banned for unclean Language.

The rules say the adult grid is for adults... and I think big business can buy private land just as easily as we can, if concensus somehow says big business opposes certain themes.

But what I really want to say is, no matter what the reasoning, you guys are perfectly capable of pulling this off without requiring identification.

Why not LET THE PEOPLE CHOOSE?

If that's true, then LL can't keep swinging the TOS around and saying we'll do what they say or else. That sword cuts both ways.

In the end, someone is going to have to sue LL and stay the course, not simply quit like Bragg did. Someone has to stand up and put some money out for a lawyer, and say that taking thousands of dollars for a product and then changing the product with no negotiation or compensation is fraud, even on the internet. I could sell you a Ford Mustang, but deliver you a Yugo and tell you that you've already paid me, so take the car or abandon it makes no difference to me. You'd sue me, and you'd be right to do so. Someone is going to have to sue LL to get it through their skulls that they can change something they WILL sell at will, but not what they HAVE SOLD. And if they have to change up what they've sold for technical reasons, either a negotiated agreement or a refund are in order. Even on the internet, LL can't give us Rhinestones when we paid money for Rubies.

MK is getting SL ready for all the corporate billboards all over SL thats why they got/getting rid of all the other adfarms as they want to set them up instead and terrorize you Brenda with all that RL advertising lol

Perhaps he is a secret pornographer

Laugh while you can Monkey Boy, but that is exactly their ultimate plan. The ultimate adfarm. My dog told me so.

Dear Lindens,

I know this won't be heeded any more than the other ten thousand objections, but I can still try, right?

Why are you doing this? I understand that you're a company, and as such, you like making money, to keep SL going, to pay your employees, to work towards improving SL, and heck, just for the sake of money. So it makes sense that you wouldn't want to do anything that would obviously cause a fall in your profits, right? So, I ask again, why are you doing this? You're going to lose money because of this, partially from people leaving, because they don't agree with the changes, and partially because you're going to mess up. It's inevitable, this change is not going to go smoothly. The continent will be too small, you're going to force far more people to move than you anticipate, and you're not going to help most of them do it

Along with the move, your age verification won't work. It can't work, period. There is no technology out there that can prove someone is who they say they are without some physical interaction between the tech and the person, and even then it can be faked. SO, essentially, what you're doing is implementing new rules, new limits, and new steps to be taken for no legitimate reason. If your age verification doesn't work, it means that people can still get into the adult content easily, without really verifying anything, and perhaps people not being able to get in with real credentials, because the verification process decides they're not an adult, regardless of credentials.

You can't tell me that this will go smoothly, either, that you believe it's going to be implemented without any problems, because every time you introduce new features to SL, they have issues. There aren't any exceptions. Windlight had issues, age verification last time had issues, land security still has issues, sculpts had various issues, every single new feature has had issues that made them unusable to some, or to all. This Adult Content will be no different. Especially considering the information you've given us.

You've obviously had this in the works for some time. To be able to already have server code out there to start implementing the changes, and to have had that essentially when you told us means that you've been working on this for a while, and yet you can't even tell us what counts as adult. Your definitions change depending on the question and day, and there's nothing solid, and yet you're talking of implementing it very soon. If you can't even tell us the solid definitions after two months of discussions, then you've got some problems behind the scenes.

Whether you heed the advice of these forums, and the residents at the discussions or not, there are far more residents engaging in adult activity than you've stated. Out of everyone I have known in Second Life over the past two years of being a resident, I can honestly say that probably 5 people had engaged in no form of adult oriented activity. It's extremely rare to find someone who remains completely PG in Second Life, because part of adult life is, well, the adult side of things.

You are going to lose residents, and you are going to lose money, and in the end it won't do anything good. There will always be adult content in the open in non-adult sims, because people can put it there and you can't stop them until after they've done it. There will always be kids on the grid, because if they want to be here, they can get in. Period. There's no way to prevent that, and adding age verification for adult content is not going to help you in legal matters, because it's ineffective. If something doesn't work, it's not a defense. Your rules already state that the Main Grid is for people aged 18+, you require people to state their age upon sign-up, and you have resources out there for kids, things like the teen grid, a place where they can be safe. You're already going above and beyond what you need to do to be legally safe!

Again, why are you doing this? You're going to lose residents. You're going to lose money. You're going to make a lot of people unhappy, and you're going to alienate a large part of your customer base, and worst of all, in the end it's for a broken idea that isn't going to change anything, aside from causing more glitches and problems in SL.

Listen to your residents, and the people protesting. The sheer volume of people speaking up against this has to show you that you're very wrong in this idea, but you don't seem to care. Maybe you should come up with a new tagline, as it's obviously not our world any more. You're catering to the minority, not the majority.

I agree with you i do think that is the ultimate plan for the reasons it works for us and our RL site. I get a better return on the money I spend here in getting new members for the website than I do if i spend the same on banner advertising in fact i get less return on well placed banners than here

Exposures 31978
Average Exposures/Day 1433.37
Clicks To Your Site 29
Percentage 0.09 %
Ratio 1103:1

The above is from one of our campaigns i am having 1103 banners shown on adult sites for 1 click through to our site and SL gives us a far better take up because we are here and of course interact and give people value on the sim something banners never can.

Now on saying that SL is fun for us first and we are not a faceless company just using SL for advertising and I like you do not wish to have the big business shoving their latest RL goods in my face in SL, but i do believe what your dog told you

I found a transcript of the press conference for those who are interested:

http://harperganesvoort.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/transcript050109.pdf?

Thanks and added to the Slapt.me wiki along with the audio link