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Upcoming Changes for Adult Content: Answers to Questions

Thorn Witrial
Registered User
Join date: 28 Jun 2008
Posts: 237
04-24-2009 14:09
From: Couldbe Yue
absolutely. Tickling *is* torture ;)


There is tickle porn in the world. And tear porn. Don't ask me how I know, it's just too silly for words.
Vorren Voltaire
General Contractor
Join date: 4 Jul 2006
Posts: 78
04-24-2009 14:10
From: Ayla Holt
I am actually cracking up reading all of this. Do these people (by these people I mean Lindens ) know anything about what they are getting into here? Did they ever hear of KISS (keep it simple stupid)? I am so angry about this but I can't wait to sit back and watch them squirm when push comes to shove and they try to get this move made.

There hasn't been one response from Blondin that hasn't been changed to a different response later and then back again.

They start out with a idea and then put it out to the public when they don't even know what the hell they are doing and they don't have answers to so many questions.

They will "require" that you move your adult area to a Ursula Sim but..... some people might get turned down if they just have to delete a couple of keywords from their ads. So this means that they can't advertise like they want.

SL has been my rl business for the last few years. I have done everything by the book and paid rl taxes as I am sure many others have. I went into this with an agreement and a TOS which I have followed. NOW LL wants to change things and I am one of the lucky ones that won't have my business effected too much by the changes. But.... what about the other people who have made a rl investment into their adult themed business's here and spent good money on mainland and spent years setting up their place and building their business to now just be lumped into a region with all of their compition right next door.

BAD BUSINESS TACTICS LL!

I think the "Lindens" have been living inside of their computers for too long and have no idea what kind of hell they are in for once they try and put this adult content thing into full effect.

As it stands now they can't handle all of the abuse reports and people who are caught doing age play and other illegal things are still fully functioning residents of SL. And now they THINK they can handle the abuse reports they are going to get from "someone is having sex in the lot next to me in my mature region" ? I doubt they will do anything about it.

I miss the good ole days of sl.


I know! I'm constantly baffled as to how they think this can be good move for anyone.
Thorn Witrial
Registered User
Join date: 28 Jun 2008
Posts: 237
04-24-2009 14:12
From: Vorren Voltaire
I know! I'm constantly baffled as to how they think this can be good move for anyone.


Maybe LL is suicidal? o.O;; Is it possible for a whole company to be suicidal?
Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
04-24-2009 14:13
From: Blondin Linden
No, we don't want people to be less descriptive, but often times, if they remove a word or two, then the ad won't be flagged as Adult.
And if they can't get by with removing a word or two, do they get a free move?
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Brenda Connolly
Un United Avatar
Join date: 10 Jan 2007
Posts: 25,000
04-24-2009 14:13
From: Thorn Witrial
Maybe LL is suicidal? o.O;; Is it possible for a whole company to be suicidal?


Not since ValuJet
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Carl Metropolitan
Registered User
Join date: 7 Jul 2005
Posts: 1,031
04-24-2009 14:14
From: Argent Stonecutter
Speaking of which...

One of the longest running and best behaved PG communities in SL is worried about the change.

Blondin: Any comments on this?

http://forums.secondlife.com/showpo...0&postcount=113


From: Blondin Linden
We're on top of it.


Luskwood are not the only people worried. I'm concerned about NCI's two PG campuses in Kuula and Hamnida. The recently proposed PG rules*, give me cause to worry that NCI officers and helpers will be subject to retaliatory ARs from ejected griefers for speech, actions, or content that would be entirely appropriate for prime time network TV in the US.

Is it possible for PG sims to be rezoned Mature if we can get buy-in by the residents of those sims?

I'm not trying to be rude here--but assurances of the "oh--we would never enforce these rules in such a silly way" type are meaningless. Nothing you or any other Linden tells us on this thread is material to the application of the rules by the G-team. They will be working off of what is written in the ToS, the Community Standards, and Knowledge Base articles they reference.

*("A Region may be designated PG so long as it does not advertise or make available any content that is suggestive of any (even mildly) sexual or violent themes, or references to social drug or alcohol usage.";)
https://support.secondlife.com/ics/support/default.asp?deptID=4417&task=knowledge&questionID=6010
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Roxanne Hynes
Registered User
Join date: 3 Aug 2007
Posts: 15
04-24-2009 14:15
From: Blondin Linden
No, even with sexual content in your home, your region will still be mature.


And what if my home is as big as the entire sim and my friends are invited over to look at sexual content?
Would my sim be rated Adult or Mature?

I think the classification between Adult and Mature are too difficult..
Blondin Linden
Linden Lab Employee
Join date: 2 Jun 2008
Posts: 381
04-24-2009 14:18
From: Kira Welty
Blondin:
Will a non verified account ( not PIU, not PIOF, not Aristotle verified, no payment info on XstretSL) be able to purchase adult items (uncensored) from XStreetSL?


I'm not sure how Xstreet does it exactly but if you have lindens, you should be able to buy what you want. Content creators can stay on mature.
Shockwave Yareach
Registered User
Join date: 4 Oct 2006
Posts: 370
04-24-2009 14:22
From: Thorn Witrial
Maybe LL is suicidal? o.O;; Is it possible for a whole company to be suicidal?


Well, their efforts the past year have certainly seemed suicidal all right. They've also conveniently forgotten that the only thing they have to sell is a playground for adults to enjoy. If they strip the play out of it, all they have to sell is virtual ground. And nobody is going to pay for that.

And those who refuse to tow the line and have their sims taken away from them? If LL is trying to avoid lawsuits, this isn't the way to do it. Even on the internet you cannot deny a person access to their purchased merchandise just because you changed a TOS. There are still consumer laws in this country, no matter how badly M might wish there aren't. The fact that SL still to this day calls it "Buying Land" will bite them very deeply in the ass.

It's still not to late to put this entire clusterfuck on Hold, LL. Put it on hold until a simpler, fairer solution that won't bankrupt you can be found. Like say, any of the solutions we've submitted to you in this forum?
Hypatia Darkstone
*I* Am Adult Content
Join date: 22 Jul 2008
Posts: 19
Update
04-24-2009 14:24
From: Hypatia Darkstone
NPIOF Conversion Problem!
NPIOF Conversion Problem!

A New Ticket Type is needed for Basic accounts.
The ONLY Verification related ticket is to submit RL Documents and send hard copy.
We NEED one that is: ""I have Verified but it is NOT Working IN World""
Especially in light of [ Any other support ticket submitted by a Basic account or Guest login will be ignored ]

Automatic conversion of NPIOF to PIOF in world is spotty after adding payment info.
And NIPOF to PIU or PIOF appears broken when related to Xstreet use.

How can a resident get this fixed if they can't submit a ticket?


REPEAT:
NPIOF Conversion Problem!
New ticket type needed due to the new Verification Rules:
Somebody Please fix this! :mad:


From: someone
Hello!

Our system shows that you submitted this ticket from either a Basic account or with Guest Access. Basic account holders and guests may only submit tickets using the ticket type "Special Questions - Basic account or Guest Login". You did not select that ticket type, so the ticket will not be reviewed.
~~~
If your issue is one of the ones we offer support to, please submit another ticket with the information corrected.

Thanks!
No it is NOT a type you Support. Tho I did select a type.
From: someone
Ticket Type: Feedback (Knowledgebase, Support service)
And it was submitted as suggestion to fix the knowledge base but also with a suggestion that we NEED another ticket type. This appears like feed back form Basic account is not even read before it is discarded.

AGAIN:
How can a resident get this fixed if they can't submit a ticket?

From: someone
Hello!

You've submitted a Knowledge Base Suggestion ticket. Please be aware that this ticket type is strictly for evaluating suggestions for Knowledge Base articles, which means your ticket will not undergo specific technical review of any kind.

If your ticket is related to a specific problem you're encountering that you want some help with, please submit another ticket to a more appropriate center.

Thanks!
And where should we: "submit another ticket to a more appropriate center." Does this mean that all the NPIOFs should TP to "Help Island" and ask for help there When their NIPOF Accounts do NOT update?

LL better put up a bunch more In World Help Centers and staff them real quick if this is the case.

OR:

They could add a NEW Ticket Type: ""I have Verified but it is NOT Working IN World""!
Fix the Knowledgebase!
& Update the Verification Link to point to more then the Aristotle BETA!

Hello is anybody at LL listening? You have Another Major Snag here!
Meade Paravane
Hedgehog
Join date: 21 Nov 2006
Posts: 4,845
04-24-2009 14:25
From: Vorren Voltaire
I know! I'm constantly baffled as to how they think this can be good move for anyone.

As much as I loathe this entire deal, really and truely, one thing that's always been in the back of head is Marianne.

/me loves (in a totally chaste way) Marianne. She should have lots of room to run around and play and be a kid to her hearts content without having to deal with adult stuff. So should others who want to play too. I strongly believe that this group of residents absolutely has as much right to be here as anybody else does and I will jump up & down on and mash into pulp anybody who says otherwise.

I think she and others like her know that there's a "wrong side of the tracks" that will always be around, RL and SL, and that if they wander around blindly, they can run into these areas.

Anyway.. I guess I don't have much of a point here - just want to publically say that I'd hate to alienate that crowd or have them think that my objections to LLs plan is in any way a comment about them or their right to be here. They'll always be welcome in (the PG parts of) my virtual world.
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Ceejay Harvey
Very unhappy customer
Join date: 15 Feb 2007
Posts: 56
04-24-2009 14:28
From: Blondin Linden
If you have used Xstreet in the past, then you are good to go. I don't think you need to bring any money into Xstreet or SL for that matter. As long as there's a credit card or payment history on file, you'll be all set.



So what exactly is the difference between Account verification and Age verification..

After all the fact I typed this verifies my account as I have to have one to post...

Also why Xstreet and not simply purchases from stores in secondlife to verify accounts ?
Meade Paravane
Hedgehog
Join date: 21 Nov 2006
Posts: 4,845
04-24-2009 14:29
From: Ceejay Harvey
So what exactly is the difference between Account verification and Age verification..

Spelling?
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Lindal Kidd
Dances With Noobs
Join date: 26 Jun 2007
Posts: 8,371
04-24-2009 14:29
From: Blondin Linden
I'm not sure how Xstreet does it exactly but if you have lindens, you should be able to buy what you want. Content creators can stay on mature.


Get out much? Have you ever USED XStreet at all? If you had, you wouldn't say "I'm not sure how they do it".

You give them a credit card or a PayPal account. Neither of which, by the way, counts as AGE verification.

You check a box saying "Enable Mature Content"

You get a statment saying that you are over 18 and that you are agreeing to view mature content.

You click the "I agree" box.

And you know what? THEIR system works. They have even managed to sell adult content while flying under PayPal's radar, a rather remarkable feat considering how anal PayPal is about not letting their service be used to purchase adult content.

For gods' sake, LL just 8OUGHT these guys. You mean to tell me the company never looked as far as the guys in the office next door for solutions????
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Lindal Kidd
Hypatia Darkstone
*I* Am Adult Content
Join date: 22 Jul 2008
Posts: 19
04-24-2009 14:30
From: someone
Originally Posted by Hypatia Darkstone
I have via PayPal.
But I am still NPIOF in world and can NOT get to Arapaima!

Blondin, How do I fix this?
From: Blondin Linden
These changes will come with the new viewer
Did I hear that right? How does the viewer effect an account updating from NIPOF to PIOF or PIU?
""With the new viewer"" Do you mean at the same time?


This function seems to be an external from the viewer function.
The viewer just needs to read the accounts status, it does that now.
And currently allows confirmed PIOF & PIU in to Arapaima.

& if it is not working how do we submit a ticket with no appropriate category?
That is also external to the viewer!
:confused:
Aeneas Beaumont
*I* am adult content!
Join date: 11 Mar 2007
Posts: 64
04-24-2009 14:32
From: Coke Supply
Well I don't know about the rest of you but if this all goes ahead then I will probably just leave SL.
<snip>


You have to ^^ Your name is adult content :P
Milla Janick
Empress Of The Universe
Join date: 2 Jan 2008
Posts: 3,075
04-24-2009 14:32
From: Couldbe Yue
here's my current parcel description. which according to Blondin is adult.

Quote:
Satiated Desires & The Master's Pleasure. BDSM Sex & Kinky Toys

by Couldbe Yue. Main Store. Items for your kinky erotic fantasies. Sex beds, cuddle couches, sub & slave kneel cushions, rip silks, canes, spankers, CP, D/s, M/s, S&M, punishment, bondage, shibari, discipline & CARP (role play) lockguard furniture.

Kinky, erotic, sex, slave, BDSM and bondage all trip the search filter.

Oddly, D/s and S&M don't. Neither do two of George Carlin's seven words, and not the two you think.
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Toy LaFollette
I eat paintchips
Join date: 11 Feb 2004
Posts: 2,359
04-24-2009 14:34
From: Meade Paravane
As much as I loathe this entire deal, really and truely, one thing that's always been in the back of head is Marianne.

/me loves (in a totally chaste way) Marianne. She should have lots of room to run around and play and be a kid to her hearts content without having to deal with adult stuff. So should others who want to play too. I strongly believe that this group of residents absolutely has as much right to be here as anybody else does and I will jump up & down on and mash into pulp anybody who says otherwise.

I think she and others like her know that there's a "wrong side of the tracks" that will always be around, RL and SL, and that if they wander around blindly, they can run into these areas.

Anyway.. I guess I don't have much of a point here - just want to publically say that I'd hate to alienate that crowd or have them think that my objections to LLs plan is in any way a comment about them or their right to be here. They'll always be welcome in (the PG parts of) my virtual world.


TY Meade and we do know what goes on in SL and simply avoid it to the best of our ability.
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Milla Janick
Empress Of The Universe
Join date: 2 Jan 2008
Posts: 3,075
04-24-2009 14:34
From: Argent Stonecutter
And if they can't get by with removing a word or two, do they get a free move?

Kinda tough to describe a bondage post without using the word "bondage".

How will items with Adult terms as part of their names affect the shop's rating? They'd presumably show up in the list of items in the shop's search page.
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Wynochee LeShelle
Polykontexturalist
Join date: 3 Feb 2007
Posts: 658
04-24-2009 14:35
From: Blondin Linden
Yes, people will be turned down. The reason is that the majority of people will not need to move. Many others would simply need to remove a word or two from their land info or search tags and they would be fine on Mature.


Sorry, but they wouldn't be fine. Their spontaneity would be under pressure. They cannot longer buy, rezz, create, act spontaneous and they have to live and act with cutters in their heads on Mature. They have to think every second new: "is this or that right or wrong?". This is not being fine, this is a nightmare!
Vorren Voltaire
General Contractor
Join date: 4 Jul 2006
Posts: 78
Agreed (and then some!)
04-24-2009 14:35
From: Shockwave Yareach
Well, their efforts the past year have certainly seemed suicidal all right. They've also conveniently forgotten that the only thing they have to sell is a playground for adults to enjoy. If they strip the play out of it, all they have to sell is virtual ground. And nobody is going to pay for that.

And those who refuse to tow the line and have their sims taken away from them? If LL is trying to avoid lawsuits, this isn't the way to do it. Even on the internet you cannot deny a person access to their purchased merchandise just because you changed a TOS. There are still consumer laws in this country, no matter how badly M might wish there aren't. The fact that SL still to this day calls it "Buying Land" will bite them very deeply in the ass.

It's still not to late to put this entire clusterfuck on Hold, LL. Put it on hold until a simpler, fairer solution that won't bankrupt you can be found. Like say, any of the solutions we've submitted to you in this forum?



It should be pretty obvious to anyone that this is a really bad idea.

Right now, there isn't even clear definition on what is and what is not adult content. The definitions are sloppy, and open to so many interpretations that you could AR a church or gallery and be within rights to do so.

The execution of the transition is going to create hardship for those affected, if it doesnt drive them out of SL altogether.

Not to mention the long term issues and implications that Linden Labs just isn't equipped to take on.
and for what? A public relations exercise?

PLEASE Linden Labs, rethink this.
Thorn Witrial
Registered User
Join date: 28 Jun 2008
Posts: 237
04-24-2009 14:38
From: Vorren Voltaire
It should be pretty obvious to anyone that this is a really bad idea.

Right now, there isn't even clear definition on what is and what is not adult content. The definitions are sloppy, and open to so many interpretations that you could AR a church or gallery and be within rights to do so.

The execution of the transition is going to create hardship for those affected, if it doesnt drive them out of SL altogether.

Not to mention the long term issues and implications that Linden Labs just isn't equipped to take on.
and for what? A public relations exercise?

PLEASE Linden Labs, rethink this.


Yes please. LINDEN LABS, listen to this.


Vorren, please check your PMs too. Thanks.
Maleena Tiraxibar
Registered User
Join date: 26 Dec 2008
Posts: 32
Well odd indeed.
04-24-2009 14:50
Ok my mina account is AGE verified and PIOF and I still cant get passed the age verification scanner, it still says not verified when i have been for ages. Humm I can only assume this BETA idea still leaves much to be desired. This is still a bad idea LL there are many better ways this could be handled with far better resaults, but what do we count eh? It's all already been done I guess so we are stuck with it.
Lindal Kidd
Dances With Noobs
Join date: 26 Jun 2007
Posts: 8,371
04-24-2009 14:51
From: Hypatia Darkstone
No it is NOT a type you Support. Tho I did select a type. And it was submitted as suggestion to fix the knowledge base but also with a suggestion that we NEED another ticket type. This appears like feed back form Basic account is not even read before it is discarded....


That's correct, Hypatia. They won't even read your ticket, since you are a sleazy freeloading Basic account holder.

You CAN, however, submit a JIRA feature request. Never mind that the JIRA is cumbersome, and opaque in the extreme. It's even hard to FIND the link to the JIRA system. I bookmarked it directly, since it was so hard to navigate there.
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Deira Llanfair
Deira to rhyme with Myra
Join date: 16 Oct 2006
Posts: 2,315
04-24-2009 14:52
From: Argent Stonecutter
Epistemological death would have an elevated probability of immanentizing the eschaton through a process of iterated quantum suicide.


Iterated??? Ok - I'll loop it. (You still won't _really_ be dead though.)
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