Upcoming Changes for Adult Content: Main Forum Thread

If you rate your own creations, and for x y z reason there being passed on in a modifiable manner, you have no grantee that the next user is going to keep it in its same g-rated form, so placing the responsibility on the creator IMO is null n void, just the owner.

I know this message is probably lost among the thousands of other posts in here, but i felt like sharing them anyways. Let me start by saying i'm appalled that you're listening to the "moral minority" again, after the campaign against "broadly offensive content" failed so miserably back in 2007.

1) adult vs PG (no "mature" in between) - there isn't much difference between being "not PG" and having content that will offend someone - so why make a 3rd classification at all?

2) as for mainland - a separate adult content continent (or continents!) probably does make more sense than a PG continent given the amount of islands that are adult oriented

3) INFOHUBS! - why do you direct people from mature areas to PG infohubs? (and don't say "just telelport away", some of us mature people do run Restrained Life and can't TP ourselves)

4) forced relocation - If you actually do it, don't put all the load on the mature landowners - IF someone is forced to relocate, you basically need to offer the option for simply moving their entire sim to a new home AT NO CHARGE, as it's your policies changing - and let the PG adults do the relandscaping and re-setup of their places that were on the same sim, in the case of shared sims.

summary : keep just PG and mature categories, if adults don't want to see mature things, make it so they can flag themselves voluntarily as "pg only" or they can act in a MATURE manner, and just leave if they find something offensive.

I guess you can. I taught a sex education class, but it only made passing mention of BDSM as one of many alternatives...so I can't claim the title. Besides, I resigned from the Mentors.

I agree, too, Milos. And as much as I'd like to draw (some small) comfort in what Jack is saying--that this move is only about the "extreme" stuff--it appears (to me at least) very different than some of the distinctions Blondin has been suggesting.

For example:



(Not trying to pick on you, Blondin Just pointing out what seems to me a large discrepancy and understandable cause for concern.)

Ultimately I am very against the idea of any type of forced relocation, especially for a group of customers who have spent thousands of dollars investing in the platform, and who have collectively spent thousands of hours building, terraforming, and crafting a little bit of their world and their imagination.

Despite the recurring problems, SL is really a wondrous technical achievement, to my mind. Why LL has not first attempted innovative technical solutions to solve what they see as a problem leaves me somewhat sadly scratching my head. Some very elegant suggestions have been offered in this thread (warnings when entering an "adult" area, controls built into the viewer which allow people so see what the wish or do not wish to see, etc., etc.).

Will it take longer to to provide this "predictable" experience LL wants to offer some it's customers by looking into technical solutions rather than a one fell swoop approach? Yes, surely. However, I think the long-term payoff for LL would much greater than what is currently being proposed: it would show they value and respect the diversity and creativity of its current user base, even as they attempt to reach out to new populations to bring into the SL experience.


Forced relocation should really, really be a last resort.

How dare you be a voice of reason.

It's a no win for the Lab. Wait until they have all the answers, and people will accuse them of not asking for opinions, and not letting word get out early enough. Throw things out early, and people will accuse them of not having any answers.

Just for the record, if I was a Linden, I would do this much differently, for instance asking people to move voluntarily, and making is highly attractive to do so. That said, it is their company. They can do what they want.

The point with the MPAA rratings systems seems to have been too simple for many to grasp so allow me to make it clear.

What constitutes what has already been hashed out and stands from a legal viewpoint. Nobody said Klingdon gets to rewrite the book of American entertainment ratings.

This all moot. It seems quite clear to me the purpose Klingdon was brought in was to put SL to death. They could have saved themselves the trouble and just closed Linden Lab without warning.

Agreed everyone definition will be vastly different and all definitions will be open to interpretation, as you say some will find the C word to be broadly offensive, whereas others will think it a good nickname for their mate when he takes the p*ss.
But LL have asked for one and will put their own definition forward whether we like it or not IMHO.



I believe any one having any sort of sexual fantasy about kids whether acting on it or not needs keeping an eye on minimum, dreaming about it today may become acting out on it tommorow, sure it might not, but personally as a father I am not prepared to take the risk.

I am not sure what the point was in the instance of child porn or how it petains to adult content in SL, it is illegal content, people in that case need to know they are not accepted by the rest of society, I would advocate the removal of goolies which is maybe extreme, so at least arrest in whichever country they reside.

If this is an isolated instance, it's hardly surprising, given that even having the ID Verification from Aristotle/Integrity only marginally improves your chances of being able to access any particular age-restricted parcel in the current b0rked implementation.

But even if it's true across the board: were we to understand that *current* age-restricted parcels are subject to the same verification as what will be in place when all this comes into force? That was not my understanding at all, and in fact I understood that LL was still negotiating with other third-party partners (besides PayPal) as agents of verification.

Do keep in mind everyone. This move to Adult land, as much as I am against it, isn't about skins for sale. Merchandise for sale such as skins, beds with sex poses, BDSM furniture for sale..etc is not going to be classified as "Adult". Linden labs has already told us this didn't have to do with any of this.

Adult ..or the forcing to move to Adult land are clubs that offer sex for lindens. It's going to be public open sexual gratification. It's going to be bloody harsh body mutilations. The worst of violence.

I am not at all worried about my shops where I sell revealing clothing, tattoo's, sex beds or bondage crosses. I am worried about my brothel club that shares the same land as my big store. Will my brothel have to move to Adult sims even though sex is high in the sky in private rooms but no sex in the open on the ground? Will I be ok where I am at on Mature land that I own. I own half a sims on the mainland grid. Public garden, Clothing and furniture business, and a brothel all on that land.

My concern is if I am forced to leave will my clothing store be forced to go as well? Since its all part of my business plan that works. I can pay my tiers. But if I move it all..and even trade with LL's on adult land this is going to hurt my clothing store. I share traffic with the garden, store and brothel. I have customers that are newbies that buy clothing, those alts that want to play with the vamp world or gorean roleplay buy my clothing. I will lose this income of my store if I move to the Adult grid.

These are my concerns, how can we survive this move? Many of use have many business that share the same land, one business that helps the other..without one or the other it all fails. How will someone like me make a transition to an Adult only grid without complete failure to my business?..these are the things I wish we would be asking and finding solutions for. Or perhaps my brothel isn't and won't be considered "adult" since the sex is high in the sky anyway and not open for the public. Please help..

I've already placed all my spending on hold. I've even considered canceling all advertisement because I worry it's all coming to an end and I might as well start saving every linden I can make.. easement someone, anyone..solutions?

Speaking of the mature vs adult stuff..

I run a club that's open to _everybody_ (if they're an adult avatar) but is transgender-themed.. It's a naughty place, I admit it, but except for a few bits all the really naughty stuff is mostly in at least semi-discrete areas. The social aspect of this area is actually bigger than the sex aspect - you're as likely to find people hanging out, chatting about scripting & building as you are to find people hanging out doing sex-related stuff.

My neighbor (who founded this area before I even joined SL) has a giant golden statue, maybe 50m tall, of a naked female. She added.. er.. extra bits.. to it to fit the theme. Realistic? No - it's about 5 prims of extra bits. Obvious anyway? Yep. This statue has been there since about June 2006, when the region got added to the mainland.

About 6 months ago, we got a visit from the gteam which resulted in official warnings and the extra bits being returned. The ginormous statue of a nekkid woman was fine but somebody apparently didn't like the extra bits. My neighbor put up some megaprim walls around this area so the neighbors couldn't see us as easily and put the bits back on. End of story (I guess.. the gteam isn't exactly open about this stuff - maybe we're still getting AR'ed every day.. who knows?)

So.. Mature or adult:
- Giant nekkid woman?
- Giant nekkid man?
- Giant nekkid woman with extra bits?
- Giant 1000-prim copy of Michelangelo's David, done by Starax?

Because i'm not a resident/national of niehter USA nor Europe, i cannot verify my age, through your system
I live in the Middle east, if I send you copy of ID and utility bill, these would be all in arabic, would that be proper for age verification?
Why dont you use Credit Card to verify my age?

There has been no consistency from the Lindens on the above issues. Some have suggested such stores will be considered adult, others have said they won't.

And Jack, who owns the gteam and the mainland, apparently said that they're only talking about stuff like dismemberment, which is too extreme even for me..

Some rough guidelines would be really good here, LL. I'm also compelled to again ask for more details on how you got the 2-4% number without knowing if it includes places like skin stores or just snuff places..

I'd say send it in anyway, let them sort it, it's all legal, right? let them hire translators to decypher the pictures, if that's how they want to do it, then they should deal with the consequences of such.

Hi sweetie.....nothing that surprises me. Here as everywhere else. I'm not even going into an argument, it says enough for itself. Shame.

Boy

/pounce Boy Lane

Reading what's out there on the issue I came across some ideas... Maybe this idea was said already, the forum is way too long to find out.

In another blog post about parcel improvements (Sorry I don't remember which) someone suggested adding the ability to make the content of a given parcel not viewable from the exterior when privacy was desired. While I disagree with with this solution because it would make the landscape rather horrid... I had a flash...

Instead of carpet solutions... why not have said content flagged!

A simple check box. "Adult content".. Check. And voila. Object appears as invisible to all those not interested in such content. Even better... A user not interested in adult content would not even have to download it. Saving precious resources.

Even better! Locations with PG, Mature AND adult content (Think skins, some clubs) could be visited by everyone without offending anyone.

Locations specifically offering adult content could still be flagged at a parcel level and blimmey... if you don't want to be in contact with adult content enthusiasts and go there then you're asking for it.

Complicated to tag all objects? Not really. As far as locations go, adult related objects make a small fraction of a complete build. Said flag could even be "No Modify" on bought objects with "No Modify" checked, making it even easier. And if you're going to offer adult content, it's your responsibility after all.

Could even work for avatars (i.e. strippers) the same way it works when muting. Maybe said avatar could be red instead. It would even allow for someone to enter adult mode and leave it. lol... funny idea.

Doesn't change the landscape. The "adult" location's "walls" would still be there and therefore the landscape would not be affected.

No costly moves to a new Sim.

Much like RL regulations, the advertising on the outside wall (provided it is not adult itself) could still explain what's inside and therefore not affect the finances of adult content owners.

If those not interested in adult content are offended by the simple possibility of it near them, it's simply bigotry, not wanting to accept part of the world does like and indulge in adult content.

As for the search... you don't need keyword searches. Just a clear definition and you can be certain those responsible will flag to stay out of trouble. Those against adult content will report any offenders presto. For those who don't flag... good riddance, they asked for it.

How complicated does it have to be?

~Cy

HERE HERE, definitely worth more than $2. I hope I have been to your SIM.

BT

I'm not "worried" about my store(s) either - I am pretty certain they WILL have to be on adult land.. not because of the market I sell to but because of the appearance of the items themselves. If the vendor texture or a rezzed demo item has an anatomically sculpted insertable visible its just asking for an AR to put the shop anywhere else, even if the AR is unreasonable the hassle of appealing it is not worth it.

My post and what I stated as being considered "adult" and not was from the audio of a linden labs gave us publicly to listen too. With questions that were answered. They defined what was and would not be considered "adult"..vague yes. But my take was clear from what I heard, it would not include merchandise for sale. So don't start covering up those skins with shorts just yet.

For what its worth, I'm glad to have adult stuff moved elsewhere. I personally don't want to be walking around a sim to run across some of this stuff. The x-rated content is part of what gives sl a bad name to those who don't understand it.

Moving that content will give avatars more choices.

Thanks LL

if you don't want to be around in it, why be on mature sims at all? it's people as narrowminded as you that cause the rest of us to suffer.

it provides us with less options, not more.

If I want to walk around as a wolf that should be my option for one, I roleplay as anthro, that's MY reality on SL, I keep myself "approprate" in areas that are populated, especially in clubs, but that's how I want to be, my choice, who is someone like you to say to remove that option from me?

After my neighborhood got visited by the gteam, I wrote up some scripts (but haven't really finished them) that would IM people as they entered our land that they were entering an adult area - "you're welcome to stay but pleaes leave if you're gonna be offended" type deal.

As one of the few rational people I've heard really in favor of LLs plan, I'd like to know if you actually want all the adult stuff GONE from your SL or if you'd be satisfied if you were giving a bit more warning as you approached it?

According to what LL has said, Credit Card verification will be acceptable.

My granny always said "A squeaky wheel gets the most oil."

While I won't mention the poster by NAMY NAMO this does seem to be the case here.
What most of us here tend to forget is we EMBRACE differences in people and RESPECT their right to BE different even if they don't happen to agree with us. This entire WORLD has grown organically (orgasmically?) based on this concept. ALWAYS remember that! There will be times where those of us who live by this concept need to stand up and squeak LOUDLY. Simple concepts that we take for granted e.g. "Live and Let Live" that we honestly don't even NOTICE that we are living by are TOTALLY foreign to the closed mind. SO squeak when you think that people who try to force their TINY world view over your HUGE world view. SQEEK LOUD and SQUEEK LONG!! Remembering always while I don't agree with those views, I respect the right of ANYONE to hold them.

The most offensive, violent and morally reprehensible thing I have found on SL has been the idea that someone could actually THINK that they KNOW what "adult content" IS. That these someones could flippantly say “of course EVERYONE knows that" further compounds that issue. I propose that THIS in itself is fitting of the moniker "Adult Content".

Lindens... WAAAAY back at the beginning of this post I brought up the possibility that the reports from 'many' might have been griefers. Sometimes the simplest explanation IS the reason. When someone states "I had to step over two couples dragging naked slaves in a texture store at 9am today”; motivations need to be SERIOUSLY questioned. While it COULD have happened I find it RIDICULOUSLY unlikely to have happened. (especially when textures HAVE to be the most COMMON item stored in the servers of LL) ((but hey lightning CAN strike or that winning lottery ticket CAN be bought))

OH and if it an expansion kinda thing... adding and expanding a "PG" contienent seems to be more cost effective... but I'm sure there are things that I'm missing because the reason for this has NOT been STATED! (predictible = pablum)

One more thing....


Many people think alike! lol I did the same thing... not once... but TWICE... and between those two checks there (and I MAY be mis remembering (there has been ALOT of 'stuff' added to memory lately)) that there was a POINTED difference in her groups... groups that seemed to NOTHING to do with rhetoric being spouted. So I IM'd in world to ask if the forum posts were backhanded to make a point... the response was "I was being quite plain" <paraphrase>. Maybe STILL a 'joke' but a simple join date check would confirm or deny that.....