Ok, can someone just tell me what is wrong with me?

That is certainly one way of looking at it. The child avies that I encounter are with their "mom" my sister, and I know if she knew anything about that they certainly would not be in her family nor friends list. My sl sister does not have children, well hardly any family irl. The family in sl IS her family.

Now as for sexual ageplay in sl, I don't condone it nor am I am against it either. My initial inclination would be to be against. But then I remind myself these are consenting adults and if they are confining their activites their private sim then I suppose it's their business. Honestly, that is a tough one for me. Just like smut and other activities of extreme nature in sl. I honestly just don't know.....

If this is true, help and persuasion are one and the same.

Agreed. I think the hardest thing in the world to change is a mind... I'm undecided if it's harder to change one's own than that of another.

At any rate though I think if someone has already decided that they cannot do something, it becomes much more difficult to convince them that they can. Not impossible though - in my experience, the deciding factor is if they actualy want to do it / want to learn.

I've been at times exasperated trying to teach people because they have decided that they cannot, and at that stage they lose all hope/desire/interest... it is I suppose easier after all to decide a thing is impossible then stop trying, than it is to work hard to try to 'achieve the imposssible'.

And I have also been ecstatic when teaching people, because they don't give up and they sincerely want to learn and even if they said they couldn't, they obviously didn't believe that because they kept trying and finally they got it and you can see how happy and proud they are at having done it.

Unfortunately I've dealt with too much of the former and not enough of the latter, so I've developed enough apathy that when someone say they can't, I'm content to leave it at that.

-Atashi

(nod) In this particular case, though, it should have been bovious that I wanted to do it - after all, otherwise, why would I even have mentioned it?



Again agreed. Real teaching has techniques to avoid this - they're called exams, and the associated fear of failure. (After all, if you fail your school exams it'll be a disaster, right? Well.. actually.. it isn't.. but they make sure you don't know that, for exactly this reason.) As I've mentioned, SL could benefit from similar things - I've already suggested the threat to format the hard disk.



I understand, but that does hurt the other person a lot. Now I acknowledge that isn't your responsibility but it remains the case.

Believing that someone other than yourself SHOULD do anything is pretty much always going to make you unhappy.


There is nothing inherently hostile or malicious in believing you can't do something. If they aren't getting the feeling that you are capable of something they aren't getting the feeling. That's all. And yes they COULD take the time to teach you whatever they know that they think you don't but there is no reason to assume they have an interest in teaching you or that they owe it to you to do so.


Or they believe they can do it and they want to do it and they aren't interested in working with you and they don't feel responsible for what you do or don't do. You are being unreasonable if you think that they somehow owe it to you to change how they feel.


You just need to learn to accept the choices other people make for themselves, even when they are not the decisions you hoped for.


No one changes themselves over night, especially when their ego is in fight-for-survival mode. But as time goes on perhaps you'll think more about what everyone here has said and start to change your thinking so that your expectations of other people will be more realistic and you won't be so vulnerable to hurt feelings when people follow their own agendas and not yours.

Assuming that what is obvious to you is obvious to others is a good way to guaranty miscommunication. In this case almost everyone here has told you that they don't think it was obvious at all.

I apologise, what I meant was, "in order to demonstrate that this option has been chosen by them, this is what I'd expect them to do".



I think there is something a bit hostile in believing that they are superior to others without evidence. I mean obviously if I was talking to a famous builder type, it wouldn't be hostile for them to believe they were a better builder than me, since they are. But to believe it about something philosophical along those lines, that "I can do anything if I think it through (but you can't)", is just a sort of assertion of intrinsic superiority which seems hostile to me. Thinking that you have the right to a positive outlook and others do not is not a friendly thing.



No, I don't. But saying that I shouldn't be _unhappy_ as a result is just a "battery hen on drugs" thing. This is why I find this type of advice so disturbing - what it seems to say is, yes, I am actually useless at everything, and so I should just sit in the corner but be happy about it.



I am vulnerable to hurt feelings not because people follow their own agendas and not mine, but because people persistently do this to me and apparantly not to others, as I showed with the examples that I posted earlier. I can't deny that they have the right to do it, but it does make me feel there is something wrong with me that they made that choice.

Yikes! Is this still going on? Making any progress?

Nope.

Actually, it is, and I'm very grateful for what people are writing.

Obviously.

I'm afraid I might have to retract some of my statements. Hate that.

Oh good....because for a minute there, I was about to suggest that perhaps coddling doesn't work for you....and that buckling up and getting a grip and moving on might be more effective....and that perhaps hanging around people who continue to coddle you, aren't necessarily influencing you toward a more positive direction.....and then I would have to appear a hypocrite and apologize to a dozen people that I scolded for playing armchair shrink at your expense.....thank goodness you have progressed past that point....and that the time everyone took with you, was not in vain.....and that you have solved your problem.

I haven't solved the problem - not yet. But I do appreciate the time and effort people are putting in, both in this thread and in-world - I've met (or remet) some great people as a result.

As for your comment I don't think you can divide it starkly like that. In other words, I don't see why getting a grip and moving on have to be different (ie, I don't see why I can't get a grip and then succeed at this thing, instead of having to either 'move on' and do something else, or 'be coddled' and fail but be happy about it)

OK - glad it's all working out for you. Good Luck.

Yumi did you try stepping outside the box and taking a chance like I mentioned earlier and present your idea to the person I mentioned?

I really believe they would either be interested and help guide you to a way to make it work, or they would be interested and give you tips on what to do next (I have a feeling their life is too busy to actually help, but.. if you really believe in your idea, do you really need help?

and if so... what would you need help with?

(I rarely ask for help in SL, and the only time I seek assistance is after I have pulled my hair out trying to script something)

So... did you go to that person? Or did you let the defeatist within yourself win, with thinking that the person would not be interested before even asking them?


I know you are not me, but...

If I were in your shoes I would not have gone to someone and told them my idea, especially with the attitude of "it won't work".
Why in the hell would you expect the other person to offer to help if you already told them it won't work??
(and stop saying they should have known you wanted them to argue that it would work, because trying to convince someone that their own idea is good, even when they say it won't work, is down right confusing and gosh I can not even think of a word to describe it)

(remember my earlier post about the idea of mine, that I went to someone about... I did not tell them it would not work, if I did they would have said oh, ok well... and left it at that, I believe in my idea, that is what makes the other person excited about it too)

I know if someone came to me and told me about an idea and then said it probably won't work and told me that even after I said I think it would... well I would be done with the conversation.
It is not up to me to convince someone that their own idea is good.

Don't you even see the flawed logic in that???

It is up to you to believe in your idea and present it to others with that belief, it is not up to others to present and sell you on your own idea.

Here is another example to mull over.

If I came to you and said hey Yumi, I have an idea for "something" but I do not think it would work...

how long would you argue with me, trying to convince me it would work, how many times of me saying no it won't work, would it take for you to say oh, ok well

and drop the subject?

(and remember, everyone is different, so the time frame for another is not going to be the same for you)

but at some point, you would give up trying to convince me... the person you spoke with...well they had a short time frame (granted longer than mine, because I would not even try to convince someone of the merits of their own idea.)

Rha, the reason why I didn't think it would work, is because I didn't think anyone would show up. The person who I was talking to was someone who, reasonably, would want to come to such a build. So I wasn't hoping for her to "sell me my own idea" in that sense, I was hoping for something to say something along the lines of, "Well, I'd come." When she didn't say that, I figured that she didn't care whether it existed or not. My logic was, if even she (who in her profile expressed a clear interest in the activity the build was about) didn't really care about it, then who would?

I mean.. personally.. if someone came to me wanting to build something that I had always wanted to be available in SL, I'd probably encourage them. But maybe that's just me.



Probably texturing, or the link between it and prim structure - that always makes my head spin.

short timeframe? they were totally dismissive. they made no attempt at all to even suggest that yummi reconsider the product.

they told her they thought it would work, she said no, they said yes again, she said no

she got more from them than she would me. If someone came to me and told me that they did not think their idea would work, well I would not argue with them about it.

they are telling me it won't work, so... it is their idea... I guess they know best


Yumi, I really do not know what else to say to you.

I do want to make this one suggestion though, if you want to avoid this kind of situation again, do not tell someone your idea probably won't work.

IF you tell someone about an idea, tell them it will work, and then ask them for help if needed, or if they ALSO think it is a good idea, and let the conversation flow, don't wait for them to sell you on your own idea.


hell that would be like a vacuum salesman going door to door and telling the person at the door, I have a vacuum here but I don't think it will work... and then waiting for the person at the door to convince the salesman that yes it will work and I will take one.

Or a car salesman to have the consumer do the pitch for them, and convince him as to why they would want to buy the car.

Do you see how backwards that thinking is?

We have all had expectations of other people and we've all had the experience of the expectations turning out to be valid. But we've also all had our expectations turn out to be wrong. Part of growing up is learning to accept and get over this kind of disappointment more quickly and more easily.



We all have a tendency to form opinions of other people and and I agree that some people do form negative opinions about others as a way of being hostile and defensive. I'm keeping in mind that I may be wrong, but in this case from what you've said I have formed the opinion that your friend was not being hostile or defensive when she said, "Oh. Well, ok." You on the other hand seem to have taken it in a pretty negative way which does come across to me as a bit hostile and defensive.




Some people will be hostile and unfair to you. I wish I knew what to say to you to help you just accept that and learn to move on with less pain when it happens to you.






From your point of view, it is kind of adding insult to injury for us to imply that you have no right to feel the way you do. But actually I think most of us really are hoping that by pointing out that there is no need to feel this way we can help you to get over it and feel better.



I feel that if this happens to you over and over and not to other people then you should really study those other people and try to be more like them.

You seem to be saying over and over that it was her responsibility to say the magic words that would give you the confidence to go ahead with the project. I, for one, wouldn't blame her if she just wanted to work with people who didn't need that.

Right, but I don't really know how to "study those other people" because those other people tend to be defined by how they've succeeded at those things. As I said, it's like with Marianne, I admire her a lot but I can't really use her as an example because her situation is so different to mine precisely because of her success in that regard. I've asked her about things, and she's been very helpful, but on the social things her answers just don't apply to my situation. (Since they were in private IM discussions I'm not going to give examples here.)

I don't know what she did or was like prior to getting noticed by anyone. Likewise, with the first person about whom I felt this, Ginge, I don't know what she did differently either. Or why the person I spoke to in this case was able to attract people to her location while I wasn't, and wasn't able to say why.

Also, on the latter message - why can't I be unhappy about something someone else does without "making it their responsibility?" I know that in our own heads, we can comfort ourselves by thinking that we are not responsible for everyone, but the reality is that any pain we cause is still pain.

Or just come out and ask for their honest opinion on the feasibility of the idea.

You do not enjoy the popularity that some other people have. You want this popularity so badly that you are unable to enjoy life without it. Is that right?

You can be as unhappy as you want to be. And there are definitely many unhappy things, like abused children and animals, that very few of us can ignore or be happy about. But if you are unable to enjoy anything or get over what seem to most people as minor disappointments then honestly I think it would be worth it to you to really think logically about what is making you unhappy and figure out a way to be less bothered by the less serious things.