Another relationship thread

I like what you said Yosef.
I would add if you don't have a family or significant other in real life, there is always yourself.
It is important to love and care for yourself, do the things you need to keep yourself grounded in what is truly important to your life.
People come and go, be in rl or sl, but you will always be always have to deal with the human that is you behind the avatar no matter where you go.
It is most important to care for the human that is you behind your avatar and your life in whatever form that is because your live is precious and short.

Well said, Yosef.

No, no no ... god who could do this to you?
I hardly know you, but you are one of the kindest and most gentle people I know.

But I do know what you mean about having your husband there for support. I have been through this with my wife and I. Both ways. And this is not a SL only club either .. it happens everywhere.

Ah dear- people who "do" this sort of thing- don't give a crap about how kind or not the other person is. But you have to hold on to who you are and don't let the rough stuff kill you.

It's too easy to develop a callus and forget that people are not all evil- people are not out to get you- people really do genuinely care. NO, not all of them- but because some hurt you, you cannot just decide screw 'em all and just give up and wallow in self-righteous hurt. You see that kind of stuff all the time- in and out of SL - bitter, self-consumed people that are so afraid of pain they never again can see when someone means them well. But you take your lumps and cry when you need to and smile and laugh and love when you can.

Thank you, Yosef.

I can't fault him, entirely. I've had such tough year that it was hard on all of my friends, but he bore the brunt of it. He's a good guy, one of the best, or I wouldn't have spent nine months of my life with him. He did, at least, wait until my life settled down again to leave.

People change. I know the last few months of tragedies have left a mark on me - I'm not nearly as outgoing as I used to be, which makes all of this doubly hard. I don't want to be alone, but I'm not sure how to go out and make friends again. But I'm trying.

I think it could be argued that there are some people who feel so dead inside they will risk a broken heart just because it proves they still have a heart.

Interesting Amara.
It is easy to get stuck into certain of thought especially around romantic or personal situations at least for me.
We have discussed this few times privately. I am not the type to let a whole lot
people truly in my life be it SL or RL, it's a self protective thing.
For some people like myself it's very difficult thing to truly let someone in because
it often hurts.
I have set ideas of what things should be like in order to be loved and often it fails
because of differing expectations.
One person wants things causal is just playing role but can't say that out loud yet
the other may be coming from place real human need, passionate intensity,etc.
I realize personally it is form of imbalance, i.e expecting things in my world, my life to be different then they are and lack of acceptance.
It is easier to expect the worse then the best in others.
For some it's really hard to change the cycle is hard to change, often drama of unpleasant form ensues over and over again.
And it's often rooted in many things.
Recently my real life boyfriend and I were discussing or I was discussing my personal experience with alt scene or the whole poly-amorous relationship scene and why it hasn't worked for me.
He said something very insightful that some People have very simplistic needs around "love"
and usually just around sex.
People define love in their own unique way, often it involves around their own needs or expectations.
It isn't wrong or right, but what ends up making it wrong is when we allow our expectations for love or closeness to follow a certain demanded course, when it fails, we convince ourselves that something is wrong with us or we use to it hurt ourselves.

Pretty amazing responses, ty.
I think I am afraid I will hurt him, I do love him so and want to keep him by my side.

Honestly, if you're married, unless you're preparing to leave your spouse for your SL love...You're going to hurt him worse, and you, and your husband. If your marriage has any hope of being repaired, or if you have any desire to repair whatever is wrong - you owe it to all of you to get out now. And it will hurt. No matter what you do, someone is going to hurt.

I wanted to clarify a couple things 'cause it seems I stepped on someone's toes with my earlier post- I had a lover here eons ago- there were no problems. We spent hours and hours and hours together. I would sit and watch him build, sometimes we woudl go dancing. One day out of the blue he said to me SL was making him crazy and he was leaving- we could still communicate in YM, etc... Well I was new, didn't realize no one actually leaves unless they do- and if that's the case it's a lot earlier than nine ten months into it. Well - long story short- he came back as an alt and attempted to seduce my neighbor who spilled the beans. And as if all of that wasn't a great tale- (that was over a year ago) some time last month he pops into the builders forum, talks to me- tells me who he is (alt) and says we should get together sometime - Hmm - sure - did I miss the memo on Hell freezing over?

But there are beautiful people here too- friends and lovers- just like in RL it takes all kinds to make a world.

this is kind of amazing all this would happen to someone with the SL name the OP has

LOL... this is cute.. made me smile.

FWIW, I'm with Colette on this one. (/me waves to Colette.)

Such a gloomy outlook, this depresses me to think the end may be nearer in my sl relationship than I had thought... I dont want it to end!!!!

None of us ever do Deb

I've heard some real horror stories lately...the worst being about the gal who sold her house and was getting ready to move to where ever her slove lived so they could be married in RL, when she was told by her slove's "friend" that he had been killed in a racing accident. Well, guess what....no accident. But until she was able to find that out, she was utterly and totally destroyed.

So, no more SL relationships for me, thanks. I wasn't looking when I was found, and I definitely won't be now.

Being afraid of hurting someone you love is completely normal, but just realize that the intensity of what you feel in SL is amplified a lot by this place. "Afraid to hurt him"in SL) makes me think that it might have moved past what you were expecting, and into uncharted, possibly uncomfortable waters. Having been in exactly this same spot with the most perfect (and married RL) guy for me, I can honestly say that you need to fix the "afraid to hurt him" part.. and pretty soon. Because, just like the emotional rewards in SL, feelings like fear, paranoia, guilt, etc.. are also amplified by this place. Left unchecked it's very possible that it could change you, and how you interact with him.. whether you want it to or not (happened to me). Make whatever kind of change you need to so that YOU are comfortable with this.
It's good that you two have set RL boundaries, like not taking it into RL, but there's another side to it as well. The whole "how deep into our hearts can we go with this before it causes problems" angle is very important to sit down and discuss with him. If you limit yourselves, it's totally possible that you two can enjoy what you have now, and cherish being together for years to come. If you choose to ride the untamed, unbridled heart to wherever it may lead, there's a good chance it can lead to a very painful place. I'm not saying it will for sure, but with both of you having RL partners, it takes special considerations at this point to prevent the big meltdown.
Only you know the real details of your RL situation, and I can only hope you make the wise, informed decisions relating to that. You CAN have both (*waves hand as living proof*), but you have to factor in to your SL choices the fact that ANYthing in life with such powerful rewards requires self discipline, or you fail.

Dana that was excellent!

And yet, there are also more and more stories like mine...where I sold my house, and everything I owned to be with my SL love on the opposite side of the planet BEFORE we RL met (from PA in USA to Sydney in AU).

I bought a one way ticket, arrived, got pregnant within three days of meeting him first time RL (such a tart, yus), and have been happily struggling with getting my visa worked out to stay here with him and get married. We're doing great, been together well over a year including SL time (almost nine months RL time, and the baby is due almost any day, see pic: http://sl2rllove.blogspot.com/)

There is one simple, basic rule that seems to be circled around but not actually said.

Logic and logical rules have never, can never, and will never contain, stop, revoke, or otherwise diminish emotions and the emo responses brought on by love in any form. They even knew that back in Shakespeare's time, no?

And again, basically every study and professional opinion I've found (and I've looked and posted many here: http://sl2rllove.blogspot.com/) continuously states that SL/online and RL love contain pretty much all the same key psychological indicators and relationship milestones (even if faster or by different means).

But just because you HAVE a million choices doesn't mean that you should or can properly choose all of them. It seems to be romantic consumerism to do so.

Check this thread recently brought back up:
SL can effect relationships in RL very dramatically
/327/e7/272800/1.html

Originally Posted by Zerock Parx

Yes but she is not free, or potentially so - and neither is he. So unless there's some changes here, Rondoym, your situation and that of many others (self included) does NOT apply here and in the nicest possible way you are not really helping Her here. Sorry to say it - the rose tinted spectacles are not what she needs right now. She needs coffee.

Her, my first SL boyfriend and I are still in touch. We write infrequently and it's not really much different than it was then - more innocent times - we enjoyed SL together when he was able to get on but since he was behind his wife's back he would disappear at the drop of a hat (he wasn't even really doing anything wrong). When we talk now it's two friends sharing their lives - if you are married and he is, and want to stay that way, you have to understand what you both want and set boundaries.

And it might split you up.

If it does then SL has a lot to offer regardless, including (I suspect) some shoulders to cry on. I know this much - if my relationship here goes wrong (and I was not looking for anything with this guy when we met) then that's it. Finito. No more. It tends to be guys who want relationships in my personal experience, I'd be better off friends only if it's not going to work this time (coming up to almost a year together now).

You're misunderstanding what I'm saying completely. Did you read my entire post? Sure doesn't seem that way.

My reply was to the person posting the horror story about SL2RL love, because that kind of horrible story tends to be the only story told in the media. My intent in posting it is specific. The reason SL love can go RL and DOES go RL more and more often is because...it is REAL...it is no less real emotionally than someone you meet in a bar, at school, at work, etc. Odds are that you'll encounter jerks, and liars, and fabulous people, too, just like RL.

And the post goes on to say repeatedly that Love is Love is Love, and there is no way to contain it just because your brain logically slices and dices it up. Boundaries are bullshit; logic has no control over love (see my post). Logical boundaries over love not working out are literally the reason people have written millions of sad love stories, of unrequited love...or love gone wrong...and 'cheating'...etc...it's what the media lives for! It's what movies are made of!

My story, like so many others, is proof that it can certainly BE real, and she sure probably does need a shoulder to cry on or at least a coffee or a walk. What I find most interesting about this thread is that she never really says what is bothering her (until a hint or two later on in the thread, but nothing specific). It's very vague, but we're still talking about it. Heh.

Don't you get it? LOVE IS LOVE IS LOVE (isn't sex)...doesn't matter where you find it. Sheesh. I am living proof that what you are saying is true! Yes YES, It's a problem when it happens this way--I mean people aren't single. Why in the world do you think I have spent so much time posting stuff about "cheating" (not my word choice) to the blog when both me and my partner were single? It's because it's still about LOVE. Period.

p.s. I would hardly call the link to the cautionary tale at the end "rose colored"--what I'm proposing here is quite the exact opposite...

ty
everyone really

Yes, but you have to admit that your relationship clearly falls in the minority.

Maybe not... me and mine met on the net... maybe not in SL but in Yahoo chat..
vaste distances were crossed and now we have been together for 4 years...

be it SL or some other virtual medium.. its real.. sure there are ppl out there playing mind games and catching a quick thrill (sometimes even running scams) but i can bet you that in each and every virtual relationship.. its real for at least one of the parties involved...

more and more ppl are meeting online and then hooking up in rl..

You yourself wrote the effective means for emotional boundaries only 1 paragraph below where you said it can't be done:

That's right.. it doesn't mean that you should or can properly choose all choices that lead deeper into love.. if that love (or the extent of it) is proving to be a problem.
When the outcome of a particular choice is known from experience, it becomes predictable. If it's predictable, it can be averted. If someone knows from experience that snuggling, for example, leads them to feelings of intense emotional bonding and that's a danger area for them... logically choosing not to engage in that little bit of snuggling averts the problem end result before it can affect them. A logical choice has just put into play an emotional boundary and avoided a situation where one knows they'll lose control. It's not rocket science.. alcoholics have been using this same method and choosing NOT to have that first drink for ages. In the same way Logic CAN temper love and be a powerful asset, one just has to be willing to let it.

I've been reading this thread off and on, and have to say I've never read such a pile of steaming, self justification in all my life.

To be honest, have whatever sort of relationship you want, as long as everyone knows what sort of relationship it is.

Mono whatever, Poly whatever, it's all fine and to be frank is only of interest to you and yours.

However declaring yourself Poly* in SL, despite the fact that someone in your little menage thinks they're in a Mono* relationship, simply proves you to be a deceitful, and dishonourable human being.

All this stuff about "I don't believe anyone owns anyone else"; "why should I give up on the opportunity to fulfill myself?"is, in the british vernacular, complete bollocks.

The only person that is being so unfair as to cage the special human being that is you, is you. All it takes is the guts to stand up and say what you want and live with the consequences, instead of snivelling around in here.

Ok, so there are occasions and instances when "standing up" is hard or maybe even impossible for some. In that case at least have the good grace to accept the situation, and your part in it, for what it is.

I'm assuming we're all adults here and to an extent all have a modicum of self control.

Even as a pretty repellant 42 year old, I have met several people over the years that in any other circumstance could have turned into much more than friends. My wife isn't repellant at all, so I'm pretty sure temptation has come her way many times in our 12 year marriage.

At every point you make a decision, stay or leave. You stand up and live with that decision and are honest with the people involved. You don't try and justify deceit and infidelity or turn it into some sort of special and romantic imperative.. although obviously you do.

I'm aware that it's real, to most people, myself included. However, those of you who who meet your SL loves and take it to RL (and make it work) are *still* in the minority.