Mainland Sim Full: Who Is To Blame?
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Marianne McCann
Feted Inner Child
Join date: 23 Feb 2006
Posts: 7,145
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05-11-2008 09:53
From: Lias Leandros I re-designed the parcel across from the infohub two weeks ago to reflect my complete disgust with the infohub abuse situation. The dancepads and signage are a result of my complete disgust with this situation. I am now at the point that if I cannot comfortably use the resources I pay for then I will not make the loiterers comfortable. The new players are welcome to the freebies. And hopefully soon they will have their infohub back. Oh, so that's yours. Now this all makes sense. From: Beezle Warburton My "New User Experience" was Ahern. o.O Mine too. yet somehow I managed to stay. It probably helped that I found one of those smaller outlying infohubs and used it as my home location for a while. Mari
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  "There's nothing objectionable nor illegal in having a child-like avatar in itself and we must assume innocence until proof of the contrary." - Lewis PR Linden "If you find children offensive, you're gonna have trouble in this world  " - Prospero Linden
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Beezle Warburton
=o.O=
Join date: 10 Nov 2006
Posts: 1,169
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05-11-2008 09:58
From: Marianne McCann Oh, so that's yours. Now this all makes sense. It does? From: Marianne McCann Mine too. yet somehow I managed to stay. It probably helped that I found one of those smaller outlying infohubs and used it as my home location for a while.
Mari I was lucky and found one where some cool old-timers were hanging out at. Learned a lot about SL. 
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Though this be madness, yet there is method in't. -- William Shakespeare Warburton's Whimsies: In SLApez.biz
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Lias Leandros
mainlander
Join date: 20 Jul 2005
Posts: 3,458
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05-11-2008 10:38
From: Marianne McCann Huh. Stopped by the infamous Bear Infohub today. A whopping four people in the hub. Beautiful place, too. A lot nicer looking than some of the other nearby storefronts (The guns and free camping place), IMO. Am I missing something? Yes, your missing the on-going nonsense that comes out of that infoHub from players over 30 days old. Luckily there was a mentor there this morning helping new players. He advised them, passed them information and freebies and off the went. At no time did he tell them that the infohub wa sa chat zone for their entertainment (as these loiterers do quite often). It is as it was before the loiterers took it over. But that will not last long, I assure you. The guns and free camping is my protest to keeping a sim beautiful for three years just to have its resources abused by loiterers. I am not going to maintain a beautiful environment for people that have no regard for the people paying to keep a server online.
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Lias Leandros
mainlander
Join date: 20 Jul 2005
Posts: 3,458
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05-11-2008 10:40
From: Mordos Yering #6. Disturbing the Peace Every Resident has a right to live their Second Life. Disrupting scheduled events, repeated transmission of undesired advertising content, the use of repetitive sounds, following or self-spawning items, or other objects that intentionally slow server performance or *inhibit another Resident's ability to enjoy Second Life* are examples of Disturbing the Peace. http://secondlife.com/corporate/cs.php  Disturbing the peace will need to include gathering en masse on a infohub and abusing the sim resources. This rule can be added or the Lindens can just limit the infohubs to access for peopel under 30 days only and Mentors. Problem solved.
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Chris Norse
Loud Arrogant Redneck
Join date: 1 Oct 2006
Posts: 5,735
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05-11-2008 10:50
Funny I never found large warehouses built on the plot border to be beautiful. Visual griefing is more like it.
Face it Lias, they are on public land, they have just as much right to be there as anyone else. Are you kept from visiting your land? Have you ever been denied access to the sim? Or is it that you can't run your scams on newbies if the older folks are there to tell them to watch out for you?
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Beezle Warburton
=o.O=
Join date: 10 Nov 2006
Posts: 1,169
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05-11-2008 10:51
From: Lias Leandros Disturbing the peace will need to include gathering en masse on a infohub and abusing the sim resources. This rule can be added or the Lindens can just limit the infohubs to access for peopel under 30 days only and Mentors. Problem solved. But it doesn't. Visual griefing seems to be covered, though. 
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Though this be madness, yet there is method in't. -- William Shakespeare Warburton's Whimsies: In SLApez.biz
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Sarah Nerd
I BUY LAND
Join date: 22 Aug 2005
Posts: 796
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05-11-2008 10:52
Weird I thought people paid the higher prices at Bear specifically for the traffic. I'm not sure why people would by there otherwise, or be angry when the traffic there is better than they wanted. If your lots in view of that Info-hub, be sure to look me up if you decide to dump the land and move on. I'd love that type of traffic and advertising.
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Victoria Kelly
Registered User
Join date: 2 Jul 2006
Posts: 31
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05-11-2008 10:53
From: Lias Leandros The guns and free camping is my protest to keeping a sim beautiful for three years just to have its resources abused by loiterers. I am not going to maintain a beautiful environment for people that have no regard for the people paying to keep a server online.
You consider a few people who like to hang around a public area and chat obnoxious? And your solution to make the sim beautiful and peaceful again is to give guns to newbies and camping pads? I just so totatly see the logic in that..........rolls eyes
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Sarah Nerd
I BUY LAND
Join date: 22 Aug 2005
Posts: 796
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05-11-2008 11:08
I just went to visit bear for the 2nd time this week, both times I had no issues getting in. This time when traveling to the hub from sim center I passed the huge FREE GUNS place and was spammed with note cards and objects from Lias. You obviously use this land for advertising, marketing and publicity so theres no reason you should be complaining about the traffic that you obviously use. If Ryan Radio and you decide to let this land go, again look me up, I'd love to have it and I'd make excellent use of that much desired traffic.
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2k Suisei
Registered User
Join date: 9 Nov 2006
Posts: 2,150
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05-11-2008 11:15
I sympathize with you, Lias.
But you have to accept that sims are a shared resource and anybody can come along and use more than their fair share. Whether it be a mad scientist that likes to play with the physics engine or a club owner that likes to bring people together. This is a design flaw of Second Life and there isn't really much LL can do about it now.
Some would argue that it's not in LL's best interest to fix the problem. The majority of people that buy an island do so becuase they're tired of the crap on the mainland.
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Marianne McCann
Feted Inner Child
Join date: 23 Feb 2006
Posts: 7,145
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05-11-2008 11:33
From: Beezle Warburton It does? I was lucky and found one where some cool old-timers were hanging out at. Learned a lot about SL.  I wasn't so lucky, but I had friends an acquaintances here who served the mentor role for me. Jes stopped by again. About 9 people in general area of the infohub, including Misses Leandros.
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  "There's nothing objectionable nor illegal in having a child-like avatar in itself and we must assume innocence until proof of the contrary." - Lewis PR Linden "If you find children offensive, you're gonna have trouble in this world  " - Prospero Linden
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Lias Leandros
mainlander
Join date: 20 Jul 2005
Posts: 3,458
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05-11-2008 13:43
From: Chris Norse Face it Lias, they are on public land, they have just as much right to be there as anyone else. Are you kept from visiting your land? Have you ever been denied access to the sim? Or is it that you can't run your scams on newbies if the older folks are there to tell them to watch out for you? Chris, I usually ignore your posts because you resort to personal attacks. But I will respond to you one more time. After this if you keep up the attacks I will just ignore you once again. I have mentioned for a year in these forums that I have on numerous occassions been denied access to the sim because all of the little green dots capable of rezzing into the sim were in the Infohub. I do not know of anyone telling anyone to watch out for me and could not care less if they did.
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Annabelle Babii
Unholier than thou
Join date: 2 Jun 2007
Posts: 1,797
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05-11-2008 13:52
From: 2k Suisei I sympathize with you, Lias.
... Whether it be a mad scientist that likes to play with the physics engine ..... I see my reputation precedes me.
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Deep inside we're all the same - we're an amorphous fog clouod.
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Lias Leandros
mainlander
Join date: 20 Jul 2005
Posts: 3,458
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05-11-2008 14:00
From: Sarah Nerd I just went to visit bear for the 2nd time this week, both times I had no issues getting in. This time when traveling to the hub from sim center I passed the huge FREE GUNS place and was spammed with note cards and objects from Lias. You obviously use this land for advertising, marketing and publicity so theres no reason you should be complaining about the traffic that you obviously use. If Ryan Radio and you decide to let this land go, again look me up, I'd love to have it and I'd make excellent use of that much desired traffic. Sarah I saw you fly by. As I stated before - since 2005 we have always kept a quiet and relatively adfarmer-free sim. But now I have no desire to keep a sim lovely for people that will be using more resources than I pay for. Torley Linden in 2006 came to me and asked did we want a inofhub for new players to rez on the mainland - he did not ask me did I want a unsupervised chat and greifer zone that would take precedence over my activities in the sim. Since the Lindens have decided to allow their parcel to become just that - I see no reason to provide a lovely environment for this to occur.
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Chris Norse
Loud Arrogant Redneck
Join date: 1 Oct 2006
Posts: 5,735
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05-11-2008 16:50
From: Lias Leandros Chris, I usually ignore your posts because you resort to personal attacks. But I will respond to you one more time. After this if you keep up the attacks I will just ignore you once again.
I have mentioned for a year in these forums that I have on numerous occassions been denied access to the sim because all of the little green dots capable of rezzing into the sim were in the Infohub.
I do not know of anyone telling anyone to watch out for me and could not care less if they did. And you resort to lies and half truths. Of course your constant attacks and insults against the people visiting the infohub are OK, one standard for Lias, another for everyone else.
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Lias Leandros
mainlander
Join date: 20 Jul 2005
Posts: 3,458
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05-11-2008 18:25
And this is my last response to this character. Too bad Chris you were almost holding a civilized conversation.
The first post is about who can fill the sim: Loiterers in a infohub or the person paying tier to use the sim resources. I witnessed a double standard when LL allowed 20 to 30 loiterers in the infohub for hours on end BUT returned several of my dancepads when I had 30 people on my parcel. Just because ten infohub loiterers could not teleport any more of their group into the sim. when I abuse report a near-full infohub I usually do not get a response. When people over 30 days old abusing the resources in the infohub report a full sim the Kindens respond immediately. This is a double standard and cannot be tolerated. Removing the infohub is one answer - but only the new players suffer when that happens - and the hub was put there for them. aking the hub accessible to new players 30 days old or younger is a good solution also. In any case something will need to be done
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Jezebella Desmoulins
Registered User
Join date: 4 Nov 2005
Posts: 561
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05-11-2008 18:33
Perhaps the reason the dance pads were returned is that live people wanting access to the sim are given greater priority by the Lindens than AFK dancing campers. When it's live people versus live people, however, it probably becomes a case of first come, first serve.
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Phil Deakins
Prim Savers = low prims
Join date: 17 Jan 2007
Posts: 9,537
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05-11-2008 18:37
From: Chris Norse And you resort to lies and half truths.
Of course your constant attacks and insults against the people visiting the infohub are OK, one standard for Lias, another for everyone else. Why do you resort to insulting people? Are you incapable of continuing a reasoned discussion?
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Carl Metropolitan
Registered User
Join date: 7 Jul 2005
Posts: 1,031
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05-11-2008 18:40
Lias--would you be interested in selling your land in Bear to NCI? We have a NCI "InfoNode" in Chief just over the border from the Bear InfoHub, but we are very prim-limited at that location. You seem fed up and disgusted with the Bear area--on the other hand, it would serve NCI's mission quite well.
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Lias Leandros
mainlander
Join date: 20 Jul 2005
Posts: 3,458
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05-11-2008 19:21
From: Carl Metropolitan Lias--would you be interested in selling your land in Bear to NCI? We have a NCI "InfoNode" in Chief just over the border from the Bear InfoHub, but we are very prim-limited at that location. You seem fed up and disgusted with the Bear area--on the other hand, it would serve NCI's mission quite well. Hey Carl. I am only fed up to the point that I am no longer maintaining a atmosphere in the sim that will add to the comfort level of people abusing the resources in the sim.I actually still believe that there is someone at the service provider's office that values people paying for the use of a server for three years over loiterers who have no regard for sim resources.
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Johan Laurasia
Fully Rezzed
Join date: 31 Oct 2006
Posts: 1,394
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05-11-2008 20:13
Hey, I've got an idea, how about don't buy land in a sim with an info hub!
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Macphisto Angelus
JAFO
Join date: 21 Oct 2004
Posts: 5,831
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05-11-2008 20:15
From: Johan Laurasia Hey, I've got an idea, how about don't buy land in a sim with an info hub! If you read through the thread the infohub was not there when she bought the land.
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Sarah Nerd
I BUY LAND
Join date: 22 Aug 2005
Posts: 796
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05-11-2008 21:09
I guess this is a no win for you then. You don't want the info hub traffic, but you obviously use it for the benefit of advertising multiple land marks. You don't want to sell the land, but you will make the effort to make it look like shit and arm newbies with guns to prove your point even though nothing will ever become of it except bad. Someone in a different forum suggested that this seemed just like a huge hoax for publicity and I kinda tend to believe that since your not interested in any of the solutions you can actually work with like moving along. WIth the large sum you could get for that land from someone who would be extremely happy to get such a unique traffic ready plot you could buy the best of the best mainland anywhere else you'd want. The Lindens aren't going to remove there own infohub because someone happens to bitch a lot. I'm sure the welcome areas get way more complaints, and I'm sure they wouldn't just pack those up to avoid a little drama. You raise a fuss in the forums, people visit the hub to see causing even more traffic which I thought was what you were battling in the first place. I can totally understand standing up for something you believe in, but given that the land is being used as a big advertisement that benefits from the traffic, I kinda think pride isn't the case here and it's more a publicity stunt.
I also lost a lot of respect for this "mission" when I realized the "FREE GUN, spam me with Lias's advertisements" lot was owned by a notorious ad lot dealer. This looks like ad lot dealer behavior for sure. Don't give me what I want, and I'll make the whole area look like shit.
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Lias Leandros
mainlander
Join date: 20 Jul 2005
Posts: 3,458
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05-11-2008 22:13
From: Sarah Nerd I guess this is a no win for you then. You don't want the info hub traffic, but you obviously use it for the benefit of advertising multiple land marks. You don't want to sell the land, but you will make the effort to make it look like shit and arm newbies with guns to prove your point even though nothing will ever become of it except bad. Someone in a different forum suggested that this seemed just like a huge hoax for publicity and I kinda tend to believe that since your not interested in any of the solutions you can actually work with like moving along. WIth the large sum you could get for that land from someone who would be extremely happy to get such a unique traffic ready plot you could buy the best of the best mainland anywhere else you'd want. The Lindens aren't going to remove there own infohub because someone happens to bitch a lot. I'm sure the welcome areas get way more complaints, and I'm sure they wouldn't just pack those up to avoid a little drama. You raise a fuss in the forums, people visit the hub to see causing even more traffic which I thought was what you were battling in the first place. I can totally understand standing up for something you believe in, but given that the land is being used as a big advertisement that benefits from the traffic, I kinda think pride isn't the case here and it's more a publicity stunt. I also lost a lot of respect for this "mission" when I realized the "FREE GUN, spam me with Lias's advertisements" lot was owned by a notorious ad lot dealer. This looks like ad lot dealer behavior for sure. Don't give me what I want, and I'll make the whole area look like shit. Believe what you will Sarah. I and the notorious adfarmer have owned a majority of Bear Sim since it came online. No adfarms or any other nonsense had blemished the sim until this group took over the infohub last summer. Ryan sold his products and I held my classes and all was well. We never had any need or desire to advertise to the infohub- we ignored it and stayed on our parcels (I had actually only seen Ryan once when I sold him the land in 2006). What I have made of Ryan's plot is in direct protest to what the infohub has become. Your not suppose to like it. I do not like paying tier to support a Linden-owned loitering parcel. But this is where we are right now. I make no apologizes for my response to a year of nonsense and I in no way need your support. There is a definite Breach of Contract here when I pay to use resources and the company collecting those fees blocks me from using the resources. This all can be easily solved by making infohubs for peope 30 days and younger.
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Beezle Warburton
=o.O=
Join date: 10 Nov 2006
Posts: 1,169
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05-12-2008 00:50
From: Lias Leandros Believe what you will Sarah. I and the notorious adfarmer have owned a majority of Bear Sim since it came online. No adfarms or any other nonsense had blemished the sim until this group took over the infohub last summer. Ryan sold his products and I held my classes and all was well. We never had any need or desire to advertise to the infohub- we ignored it and stayed on our parcels (I had actually only seen Ryan once when I sold him the land in 2006).
What I have made of Ryan's plot is in direct protest to what the infohub has become. Your not suppose to like it. I do not like paying tier to support a Linden-owned loitering parcel. But this is where we are right now.
I make no apologizes for my response to a year of nonsense and I in no way need your support. There is a definite Breach of Contract here when I pay to use resources and the company collecting those fees blocks me from using the resources. This all can be easily solved by making infohubs for peope 30 days and younger. Excellent idea. We'll just send those pesky non-mentor oldbies off to the corn field when their sims go down. This will keep them from infecting the under-thirties with their non-mentor ickyness. The infohub isn't yours to tell who to come and go at, and the bizarre sense of self-entiltlement you show when doing so (i.e."Don't you people have somewhere better to be," "I'm a mentor, so I can do what I want," "I pay tier"  speaks of a less than pleasant personality. You're not a Linden. Stiop telling people to get off of Linden land.
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Though this be madness, yet there is method in't. -- William Shakespeare Warburton's Whimsies: In SLApez.biz
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