An Observation and a Suggestion for the Mods

You're still not getting my Bud Light!

I'll form a new group if I ever do the SL thing again

" As a matter of fact, you just make it worse, every time you harp on the same thing, day in, day out."

You may be right about that, Nolan. But please, could you speak to me a little bit nicer? I am not disingenuous. I'm probably the most honest person you will probably ever meet, or ever have met.

Chip, if you don't like it, don't read it.

Pandastrong, if your pictures make this thread get closed - even though I have already had my say in it - I'm going to be pretty mad about it, and at you, for it. Personally, I don't think pictures hurt anything, anytime, and are often cute and defuse tension. But I don't want them being a reason to close threads.

coco

P.S. Raudf, I've ignored dozens. I've ignored dozens for MONTHS. I've ignored them in this very thread. Ignoring doesn't work all as well as you'd think. And besides, other players come on here, say something, get insulted and LEAVE. That's more to the point.

Ok, just one more before you get mad at me:

Seriously, for your own sanity...follow your own advice.

Ay-yi-yi! You should see Sophia Weary's new AV, if you haven't!

It's a refrigerator! She's in the refrigerator! It's totally adorable! Even has her name spelled out in those refrigerator letter magnets!

coco

P.S. Nolan, I left General only once. Scared, of course. I tried making my comments in other forums, but that didn't work out any better. So might as well come back here. As I said, I think every day of what it could cost me.

If you took your own advice, most of the blithering here would not exist.

Maybe you SHOULD take your own advice.

But you can't, can you? Your advice is for everyone but yourself.

The question is... why? I think I've found the answer, you're Prok's tool.

Ah well. Mystery solved and you may now be ignored without compunction.

Wow. I know you were just friends with Prokofy and that he's not your alt but I swear I thought this was his writing when I first read it. Isn't that a crazy coincidence that two folks who seem to have such similar writing styles would find each other in a virtual world and become friends.

It's a small world.

~Ulrika~

I have yet to find anyone on the forums that thinks otherwise Cat.

I have removed the offensive personal attack from this thread; I also wanted to remind everyone to stay on topic. Please do not personally attack those who believe something different than you do, instead concentrate on discussing the issue at hand.

I think you are. Whether it's conscious or not. I think you have no real fear of that rule you so loudly protest. I think you are over-dramatizing it, and wielding it as a literary cudgel, trying to stir up fear. I also think you (perhaps unconciously) have some very blatant double standards.

On the policy where you can be banned in world for forum behavior: I am not going to go into whether or not I believe the policy is good or bad, and this is why: I think it is 100% a scare tactic.

When I was in grade school, one day my Mom told my Dad, that us kids were getting a little too much for her to handle, discipline wise. Dad went down to his workshop and made a paddle out of a 1' X 4'. It was a work of art. It was beveled and sanded smooth along the edges, had a diagonal pattern of holes drilled in it, which were counter sunk neatly - built to generate as little friction as possible. You know what? They told us if we ever laughed at Mom again when she was disciplining us, we would get 10 whacks with that paddle. Did I mention? The paddle was like 2 feet long. Wicked scary.

"Moral of the story": We never did get hit with that paddle, and it made us think twice before sassing back.

This really has no bearing here. Mostly because you are an anonymous person at the other end of 1000s of miles of coax. Being honest is not the end all, be all anyway. History shows many examples of people who were honest, yet misguided.

Irony.


As far as being nice goes - when you start being nice, I will. Indicting multiple people over what one person says, is not nice.

Speaking for the masses constantly, is not nice.

Banging certain people over the head with a constant barrage of parental admonitions, whilst being an apologist, and indeed an advocate for certain other player's right to do just what you claim to dislike so much, is not nice. We call this "speaking out of both sides of your mouth", where I come from.

Do you see why, with the double-standards and the fear-mongering, I might think you are being a bit duplicitous?

Cienna,

I disagree with you here. God knows that Cocoanut's posts have frustated me to no end sometimes, but I have also found that even having polar opposite opinions, we can be friendly to each other (and dare I say even friends, even though I still don't know her all that well). I do see the spectre of Prokofy all over the place in her posts sometimes, and wonder how much influence he is having on what she says, but I don't think she is doing any of this with an agenda. However misguided any of us may consider what she's doing, I don't think she is simply fair weather kind of friend or pursuing a hidden agenda.

Other people in this thread definitely are beyond hope in terms of coming to any kind of coexistence or understanding with. I don't think Cocoanut is one of them. I think she may be a bit too fixated on some things to the point of familiarity breeding contempt, but I don't think she is doing so maliciously.

I'm fine with you disagreeing. I happen to see all too many signs that this is precisely the case. If you spend some time talking with some of our mutual friends who know her from TSO, it becomes rather obvious.

I think she is very deliberately doing this maliciously. She has set upon every thread that in any way, shape, or form could be turned into a discussion of Prok, 'the rule', or anything associated with it (up to and including her insistance that she's some kind of victim, when in reality, she can't produce a single quote of any of the attacks she swears has taken place).

Every single instance wherein she has done this has been specifically geared toward lobbying for one of three things:

1) Let Prok back on these forums
2) Get rid of the new rule on banning being global
3) Put an end to the "FIC" and their network

If that isn't an agenda, I don't know what is.... and I'm sick of people like her, like Prok being able to turn the entire place on its head. You don't think she's heading right to where those footprints left off to carry them forward? Mark my words. Six months from now, you'll be kicking yourself the same way you kicked yourself over giving Prok the benefit of the doubt.

I suppose time will tell. I do tend to give people the benefit of the doubt and try to find some common ground with them, even when I have a tumultuous relationship with them. Sometimes, it is impossible, and sometimes it bites me in the ass in the end. If I don't kick myself, you can feel free to kick me

Bravo Jeska!!

Hugz

Cat

Just what is the issue at hand?

I think we've hit bottom. Everybody just stop.

Indeed. It has been re-worded to be less offensive while still maintaining its truth. Now if only they'd do something about people picking the scabs here...

I won't kick ya, but I will reserve an 'I told you so.'

"Indeed. It has been re-worded to be less offensive while still maintaining its truth. Now if only they'd do something about people picking the scabs here..." Cienna



nods agreed

Now if you will excuse me I must go make a 20lb lasagna from scratch

Cat

if i edit its do to not having a built in spell check good damn thing im good at numbers lol.

Hah. I'm going out with two friends tonight and we're paying someone else to make it all from scratch. But Lasagne.... yum. Enjoy.

i think a few pages ago the topic changed from "mods please don't close the thread because people disagree" to "mods please don't close the thread because of monkey photos."


i'll pay 100 L$ to anyone who posts animal pictures to this thread before page 10.

Pay up!

Nolan, you can think what you want. Obviously, I can't do anything about it. However, I am not a liar, and I do have real fear of this rule, and not for myself alone. Do you think I would lie to my husband about it? I don't wield literary cudgels, or try to stir up any damn thing. Just TALK on these forums, and you're accused of "trying to stir up" things.

That's exactly what I mean, come to think of it. Think about "trying to stir up things." What does that mean? Maybe it means, having a different opinion, thus stirring up things. Stirring up the status quo. Daring to think something else. INSISTING on thinking something else, even.

And then to be called a liar for it - no. I have tried to be friends with you, Nolan, and I thought we WERE friends, but I can't deal with anyone whose translation of everything I have ever said on these forums comes down to me being a liar. I just SIMPLY AM NOT.

Misguided, that is another thing. If you think I'm misguided, then that is a reasonable thing for you to think in your opinion. It doesn't completely offend my honor.

Being nice - if you define being nice as "not indicting multiple people over what one person says" or "speaking for the masses constantly" - well that's your option, too. I tell you I can't stand seeing people ganged up on and treated cruelly, and I tell you I'm GLAD I can't stand it.


No. Because you have defined the terms and then gone on to draw conclusions from that. I don't have any friggin double-standards. If Catherine decided to join in on some group flogging of Pandafair, I would speak up against her as well. Fear-mongering? I don't fear monger. The things I speak of are all upon us now.

Duplicitous - I am not duplicitious. Sometimes, Nolan, I think you, and quite a few others here, get so involved in wordplay, logical play, semantics, and argumentation, that you really just can't see the forest for the trees. It's almost a game.

That you would throw me over for this wobbly logical edifice is unfortunate. Or - never mind the logical edifice, maybe you really and truely believe I'm a liar and all that other bad stuff.

In either case, you are wrong and I have had enough of it.
If you insist on saying I am a liar and not a nice person, well then, I just won't be having anything further to say to you really.

Nowhere that I can recall have I ever said bad things about you. In fact, I have defended you to other people and said good things about you, because there are plenty of good things to say. However, you will not quit maligning my character. I would not dream of saying those things to you. Even if I THOUGHT them.

I guess it is just impossible for people here to talk. Maligning character, that's all anybody knows.

And thank you, Cristiano, I appreciate that, and I'm proud to call you a friend, if I may, even though, as you say, we don't know each other all that well and it is frustrating to disagree so much on these matters. Your approach to people is much the same as my own.

coco

P.S. And one more thing, Nolan, now that I have looked back over the thread. If you really think everything I do and say and stand for is some kind of manipulative tool to accomplish the goal of getting Prok back on the forums (though he should be allowed back) then you are imagining monsters, and I no longer have anything to say to you.

Quote from Coco way way back at the beginning of the thread.

My suggestion for the mods would be to consider that perhaps all such threads in which people are asking for or discussing freedom of speech and freedom from oppression NOT be closed at the first hint of disagreement.

In practice, this might mean taking care not to close all the threads of particular individuals just because others jump in to disagree voluably.

Allow everyone equal access to speech on these forums.

I don't see that this problem exists. We have at present 9 pages of disagreement, some of a very personal nature, and yet the thread remains open. I've been here over a year and seen plenty of threads stay open with tons and tons of disagreement. You yourself have posted successfully over 1200 times in a few months, many posts are extremely long. I think you paint things with a very broad brush indeed.

I agree, Fiona, this is a good one. It has gone on despite personal attacks, and despite funny pictures posted.

That is what I like to see. Contention, debate, even a degree of unpleasantness - that all preferable over closing a thread, especially if one person could cause it by posting a personal attack, or a picture or something. I figure closing a thread should be a last resort, basically for those that have become a hopeless total fistfight of all involved.

To finish off here, here is what I have decided to do. I have a friend coming for the weekend, so I won't be doing anything till later next week sometime. But at that time, I think I will post a thread about forum reform. Of course, anyone who would like to post about it earlier can.

But anyway, somewhere around that time, I will take what I have learned from this discussion and others, make a platform of suggestions for forum reform - not many, really, and probably none people haven't heard me speak of already - and put that up for debate and discussion, and for Linden eyes to see.

coco