Land Sale Mistake !!!!!

cant relate..... there's faq's, a wiki page and Live Help and Lindens to ask the proper way to do this.

I don't disagree, of course, that an improvement in the interface will be helpful, particularly to the inexperienced, though they don't usually own plots this big, so the stakes aren't so high.

I just think that the rush by the majority of the posters in this thread to convict someone who has no opportunity to defend himself is a very, very bad precedent, and that some apologies might be in order. Might. We can't really know.

I do not think we convicted anyone... or at least I have never said anyone should be suspended or banned over this. I will say no matter how this works out that the buyer had to know without a doubt that purchasing ~30k of land for only ~$L9k was clearly beyond a doubt a mistake and should of at that time given the land back.

I know I would of without hesitation... regardless of attitude of the person I just bought it from.

Personally I always tier up at once, maybe he did the same. I agree it was "probably" a mistake, but not "clearly". There are circumstances when such things happen. I'm sure we have all heard of the lucky resident who is in the right place at the right time. Let alone the land baron with his alleged new scanner system who can arrive within seconds.

If you don't capitalise on an opportunity which may be perfectly fine, you can be damn sure your chance will be gone very quickly. For me the probable commitment to $125 tier is one big complicating factor. Remember, the land is not his, until he tiers up. If he hasn't done it, he can't sell it back to her even if he wants to. Why did the Lindens not think this a suitable case for compulsion, if they have indeed done it before? Did he present a counter-argument? What was it ?

Surely we must all agree, this huge rush to judgement was totally unjustified on the one-sided information presented ? Don't we ? On reflection ?

And I have read all those, I have talked to personal friends that are in Live Help... and guess what.. unless I totaly missed it (which I do not leave out that possiblity) I never once read anywhere that the land tool will update all input before you close the box or hit an "apply" button.

It goes in great detail how to set land for sell, great help on how user groups are done... everything other then the fact that it updates the land imediately as you type... not just when you get done typing but the land price changes as you type the price in.

That is and acknowledged by Lindens, as being confusing and needs to be fixed.... for 3 years now.

How would you have handled your $125 tier commitment, Jesse ? I hope I would have done the same, but I couldn't pay US$125 for someone elses mistake. LL said they had to sort it out themselves.

With your new statement I must concur that more information would be needed, I just hope theLindens have thought of this and have not dropped the issue but are digging deep enough to tell for sure what tookplace.

But this is exactly what i would expect. Editing a prim, everything happens instantly. Setting the other things in "about land" and "edit land" ditto. It is the default behaviour. There is clearly no "apply" button in existence. Isn't that a clue?

I thought, I could be wrong it was my first week in game, that I was able to transfer a 4k plot to a friend that I had not teired up for. At the time I recall asking a Linden if I had to teir up right away and they told me that is why they had the grace period.

I believe I still ahve the emails I sent back and forth, I will go back and reread them again.

I am sorry this happened and all I have been pointing out is if we all quickly jump hearing one side of story are we just as guilty of being a$$holes as the other party has been made out to be?

Well, I would have to say no As I have myself been caught by that confusing interface.

It makes zero sense to have the land update in-realtime when you clearly have to type in a price and set a specific user if you wish WHICH is below the "sell land" check box. I was very lucky on my sale that finn Jensen was there to save me.

We have been conditioned to expect that events will not be set until we confirm it one way or another. All major os's have had this in their systems since Win3.1... it is considered standard practice for input boxes to work that way.

While on prims it is essential to have the prim update imediately, you can not say the same for the land tool box.

You must see what I am getting at here.

Ellie...Perhaps you were in on this land scheme or work for LL ?? So far pretty much everything you have said in all of your posts are untrue. You first said I did not have waterfront property....well I do on 2 sides of the land ( not one ) as you mentioned in your other post. I realize the land is not worth what I paid for it now...I had bought the land in sections over the past few months and I know I paid too much for it but I wanted my land all together...not scattered about the sim. And noooooooo I did not know this person who took my land and if you read the post under yours from earlier you will see why we put the 'big erect penis and copulating animal statues on the small plot of land that I had left. That was yesterday Ellie or whoever the hell you are. I wish I had the chatlog of the whole conversation that took place when this happened because it all happened so fast I don't even know what all was said!!! Me and my friend were standing on the 1120 piece of land when this happened and the one that bought it swarmed in with her bud like they had just won the lottery. My friend im her no more than a minute after the sell and said it was a mistake...I freaked out and so did my friend. Loki you were there also...and I THINK Toy was too but I am not sure. Like I said...I wish I had the chatlog, I was hysterical and wasnt even watching most of all that was said...was busy trying to get a Linden or someone over there to help. I know both me and my friend called her a few select names because she was being unreasonable and insisting she was doing the fair thing...playing the victim!!!!!!!!!!!! She said she did not want to talk things over with me because of the abuse she received..HA!!!! so is using that against me to make herself look good.
The following day is when I received the im saying shekept part of the land (waterfront) and set 20,224sqm for me to buy back at 20,000. How nice of her...why in the helllllllll would I do that? As far as her landtier is concerned.... in my opionion TUFF!!! If you are going to steal land from people like this using alts or scanners then you should pay the price. There has to be a way of stopping this from happening in SL...it is not fair. The thiefs in SL are being protected and it has to stop. What will it take to end this? It really seems to me like there are a few 'inside people' that are profiting from this. I'm bitter...I'm hurt but most of all disappointed in a chatprogram that I loved so very much. So...Ellie and the rest of the heartless people in here...I say this....KISS MY ASS!!! Thanks heaps for the people that have posted in here to support me....nice to know SL isnt totally corrupted.
And most of all Thanks to my friend..Nathan!!! One of the most fair and honest person I know. We need more people like him to defend the true victims instead of the thiefs and liars. Perhaps there used to be help when this type of situation occured...but there isnt anymore. Okay...I have had my say....now I am sure Ellie and her gang will jump on this.
Get your facts straight first.

Just curious for the people screaming about the 125 tier up for the buyer...

If the lindens wouldn't roll that back as well in the process of cancelling the sale then I, for one, am glad I have never bought land and NEVER WILL untill there is some guarantee that through a simple misclick or typo in a crappy incerface, that I would not lose months of work in just a few seconds and have no recourse but to hear 'Hello, 911. Sorry, there's nothing we can do for you... Please hang up and call someone who gives a damn...' when I called for help from the Lindens.

If any of this is even remotely true (and I'm totaly inclined to believe the person making the complaint as the 'buyer' has made NO EFFORT to defend their actions or present their side of the story as far as I know...) and the Lindens don't do anything to rectify the situation, then they will have lost a considerable amount of trust and good will of at least one player (me).

For a company to throw away their reputation for the sake of double dipping an extra $125 from two players for the same parcel in a given month has got to be one of the worst buisness decisions I've ever heard of.

Over and over, we hear that just this type of player who is willing to tier up and spend those dollars every month is the MOST WANTED player that LL can get.

Letting SL aquire the reputation that those 'big money' players can get screwed for no good reason and there's nothing they can do about it? Dumb, Dumb, DUMB. Did I say Dumb enough times yet?

Personaly, I'd keep at it over the weekend Sasi. If nothing is resolved by next Monday afternoon, well, then it looks like you were screwed and that's that.

If this doesn't get resolved, I'll join in the group of people donating to help soften the blow you took.

Racer P.

Yea and for once im glad the system works the way it does, it doesnt matter how fast they ditch the land their monthly land tier is based on the peak amount and not average or daily, so they gonna have to pay 125$

Looks like they trying to start slingo, i might have to start parties at the same time and fill the sim up.

Sas i hope this gets sorted outpretty quickly for you, i know you are still new to SL and this is your first attempt at dividing land, i for one had a problem with my land also when the land i had deeded under a group suddenly expired i asked live help for assitance but they couldnt do anything at the time, so as my last resort about a week later i mailed Phillip as my last resort and frustration and thankfully all was set right, I have hope this will get rectified Sasi, and i know how frustrating this particular issue is also, the guy helping you divide the land feels very sad this happened, and is truly devastated himself with this ...
Nathan your a great source of help thanks for your input also and beign there for Sasi and all those who replied you're all great, as for those that are just here to reply as bitter people i bet you would stir up a fuss higher then this is this happened to you .. get agrip, its not how much you spent, how much you stand to gain profit, it's also morals and principal too, preying on innocent people like that is morally wrong ..whether your a newbie or an oldie to the game
Sas biggest hugs to you and know i am on your side

Dear Ellie,

SL toolbars, windows, editing windows, menu bars -- there is so much crammed into those that it takes individuals awhile to get used to them.

There have been times (and I know suggestions) of an immediate UNDO on any changes made to a window, whether it be prim or property changes.

People make honest mistakes. People sometimes take advantage of those mistakes for profit, meanness, spitefulness -- you get my drift.

But to have absolutely no sympathy for this individual, no compassion, no caring, no understanding -- all I can say is simply this... "What goes around, will come around. Wear steal panties, because it will surely kick you square in the ass, and it's really going to hurt."

I'm not convicting the person who purchased this land. I'm not examining and calling the person who set this land for sale "less than intelligent."

What I have said is that there has been a history of this exact problem before -- by experienced users and newbies alike; it's a problem that needs to be changed to benefit any/all landowners in SL.

So please don't insult my intelligence or any other land owners of this community.

A simple mistake was made. A confirmation does need to be placed into that window.

Let's just hope that it never happens to you. Let's just hope that these kinds of costly mistakes don't drive away more individuals who are willing to invest their hard-earned USD into virtual property simply for the joy of creating.

And let's just pray that it never happens to you and I find out about it. If it does, I will sincerely quote your comments made today.

I have a clue. Do you?

awesome post Lynn...You are the kind of person that makes me want to stay in SL

So this person made a mistake with the Linden software, and expected someone else to pay US$125 because of it :
"As far as her landtier is concerned.... in my opionion TUFF!!! If you are going to steal....".

Well, I think we now have our answer, even without hearing from the other side. Pretty clear why the buyer did not co-operate. Pretty clear why the Lindens decided not to intervene on her behalf.

This is still only the description from her point of view. Imagine it through the buyers eyes. I hope those of you who took sides so readily now feel sheepish.

It would be best if people did not risk an amount of money large enough for its loss to make them hysterical and to lose control of themselves.

What is your problem ellie, why do you seem to be arguing so forcefully for the otherside when lindens have already said the software is confusing and needs fixed. Nothing is clear as to what the buyer did or did not do unless you are party to their dealings, and its not clear why the lindens dont want to intervene either, it would be nice if they talked to her, and she's begged for them to speak to her, see the recent hotline forum post, she's still waiting to hear back from philip after this many days.

And where on earth did you get it that she was hysterical and she lost control of herself?? please do tell, or have you been in on the deal or talking with the people who bought this land for next to nothing at a value around 1/4 of first land?

O dear, Nathan. Are you sure you should be posting here, if you don't read others posts? I'm very happy to tell. Sasi just posted :

"I was hysterical and wasnt even watching most of all that was said..."

You are just blinded by your loyalty to your friend, I fear.

Maybe if she had kept calm, apologised for her mistake, asked nicely without the accusations and abuse, and offered to refund the lost US$125 tier, everything would have been different. That's how I would have handled it. Hysteria and accusations of "thief" were not helpful or appropriate, and probably antagonised the Lindens too.

Just because I have enough experience of life to exercise caution when I see someone absent being reviled on the basis of a one-sided account, don't assume I am some sort of callous monster. What happened is very unfortunate, but the victim clearly reacted very aggressively and unwisely to what was after all her own error.

Why do so many people seek to avoid responsibility for the results of their own actions, expect others to rectify their mistakes, and in this case even to pay handsomely for the privilege ?

"TUFF!!!" indeed. "KISS MY ASS!!!" indeed.
(those are quotes from Sasi, by the way, in case you fail to realise)

And the comment about loosing control of herself? Its quite ovcious your just going to reply in anyway possibly negative against me or sasi, no matter what we say.

Ok sasi pressed buttons on a piece of software that is confusing and needs fixing, it provides no hover help for that section, it was her first land sale. The software doesnt follow normal windows standards in that section how software usually works, yet you still feel the need to have a go at her for making the error, linden labs have ackowledeged the problem. The mistake on her part is that she expected the software to protect her assets and work like the other ways the software works, a tick box on the left gives you access to the option on the right, and when there is a crucial money loosing decision there is usually i dialogue box.

I'm sorry if you feel that newbies need to know all the ins and outs of how the software works from their first sale, and not to expect a consistant piece of software then im sorry that i said anything.

If however you like software that confuses the hell out of newbies, makes then think that releasing land is releasing land for sale, ticking the box on the left is not like a standard window operating function or like the rest of the sl layout then looks like you got what you wanted. Software confustion and a whole lot of upset newbies.

And im sorry but i just cant keep trying to reason with you anymore. You've seen what the lindens have said, you've seen that it was at the request of the linden who arrived on scene that abuse reports be filed. I know there are a hell of a lot more people angry about this, due to im's and visits, than the extreme minority who seems to be arguing about it.

Isn't self-confessed hysteria losing control of yourself?

Now you supply a simple lie (above). You want chapter and verse? Try Star !

Let's just drop it, shall we? I guess LL knows all the facts, and made their decision. Worth no more effort. The only axe I have to grind is a concern for justice and a dislike of seeing a mob maligning someone in forum without proper impartial evidence. I think I've done enough. Blatant factual lies just compound my reluctance to accept a one-sided version of events. I personally saw Sasi own then sell substantial property in Star. I didn't talk to her, but I heard nothing against her. There were no penises. I have no interest in any more of your posts, Nathan, if thats the level of integrity we can expect.

I dont appreciate being called a liar, Perhaps its about time i asked you whats your involvement with this, how come you know so much about where she has lived, do you work for linden labs? trying to get out of a mess or just spying on people getting vindictive.

As far as making her first sale, i dont suppose you know anybody that hasnt logged onto someone elses account and done a job for them before, just as easy as switching alts, you should know about that.

Now i'll drop it.

Nope. She owned it over a significant period. Her name on the plot. She built on it. She sold it. I saw it. So your statement was pure invention, at the most charitable description. Ask her. The word "lie" seems fairly applied if it ever is. Pathetic.

Spying on it all hey?, some sort of grievance maybe? Makes sence seems you've been arguing so hard against her, all falls into the light now.

As i said have you never seen anybody log into someones account and do something for them, its like logging into an alt, you appear as thier av, you must know about alts as your never inworld on this name, so would know about different appearances, under different usernames, especially being such an expert with the software and all.

Maybe you should retract you calling me a liar and now pathetic.