Rant: About respect of other people's effort and people that can't mind own business.

God! This is just too much. Your just going on and on here about nothign and everyone is telling you different, but you just repeat your "feelings" again and again about what the world "should be like" in your opinion.

To call someone a griefer for making a valid abuse report (suggested as a soultion by the Lindens themselves), over an issue that the Lindens themselves would AR if they saw it first is disrespectful at best.

Your arguments are just wrong, and your attitude probably has a *lot* to do with why you wre AR'ed. I would be willing to bet that some poor soul probably told you the signs were a violation and you spewed one of these rants at them. Perhaps *that* is why you were AR'ed. If you had just a smidge of respect for anyone but yourself and your "creations" you might get a lot more sympathy.

There are lots of creative *original* people in SL. It does not seem to me that replicating Toyotas qualifies you for being in that group. So your "creative artist being squashed" routine is hollow to me.

.

I might be stupid, but not most stupider!

Ha! I love that.

Hmmmm.. what does this say about Panda?

Uh oh! I sure hope nobody goes after these guys!

I have acquaintances designing RL cars. At Nissan. Hyundai. Chrysler. GM. Ford. etc. If they feel as I do (and I have good reason to believe they do), then they would not consider someone setting up a business and selling replicas a form of flattery. They would call it opportunistic.

imo, either do it for free and have a partially-worthwhile position from which to plead your case, or design your own branded product for sale. And btw, many vehicle shapes are trademarked (besides being patented), so the Linden let you off when they probably should not have. Consider yourself lucky.

And for those wondering, car companies have taken an interest in game companies using their designs, so before you speak too quickly about what they would or would not do, remember... you're not them. Companies jealously guard their brand and for good reason. It's not our place to conjecture how they control it or what advantages they might gain or whatever. We didn't create it. We shouldn't use it.

For the record, I've replicated one product I designed in RL and still won't sell it because I couldn't get permission to do so. That's life.

Mmmmh.. An interesting example of talking without proper informations and without knowing me at all.



Disrespectful of who? Of the ones that go out of their way to try and screw someone else's work? Ok, i'm proud of being disrespectful in this case.



I'd be curious to know how much you would have bet on it, because you would have lost. In fact NO ONE has ever come to me to tell me their view on trademark infringment or the like. Actually my cars are one of the few things i can really say i got nothing else than compliments on, at least openly in my face.
Looks like the only criticism is coming from people that can only cowardly fill an anonimous abuse report instead of coming and telling me those things in my face.
Conscious citizens? Sorry, but i doubt it.



Sorry but i don't remember ever having a conversation with you, so maybe (just maybe uh) you lack the proper information to tell how respectful i am to people and customers (of course people that don't try to plainly and blatamtly do damage).



Not to be too proud, but have you ever set foot in my shops, or does this (as it seems) just come out of an educated guess?



This set aside, about creating my own cars, i cerate cars trying to stick to realism exactly because i like that. I express my own creativity in my clothes, while i like to create cars as real as they can be, given the limitations of SL. Sure i could create original ones, but they wouldn't have _TO ME_ the same charm and interest as the real ones (and do you really thing than making a decent looking replica is easier or takes less skill than make an original car?), in other words i wouldn't have fun doing them. Like a scale model kit hobbyst, i like to work on them exactly because they are exact (or exact as i can get them) replicas of cars i love in real life, and making them different simply wouldn't give me any fun, so why bothering?


Csven: I have acquaintances working at designs for Ferrari and Alfa Romeo, and as some may know, Ferrari is for good reasons the most protective at all about their brands and designs (in fact the official games that include their cars can be counted on an hand's fingers). I once shown them Deesse et Ange shop in Shiner, and they were sure not outraged about someone "stealing" their creativity, they were actually amazed some fans made some really great replicas of their cars counting the terrible limitations SL poses to the building of complex items.

This is more of a temper tantrum than a rant, first off. You were not wronged in any way. I mean, how dare SL residents comply with the ToS! Gasp! So far as replicas, I've never seen LL have a problem with this. They do however have a problem when you slap on a copywritten logo that could potentially put them in harms way. How dare LL take care of themselves! Gasp! Your cars could look as close as you can make them to any real model by any real company, please do. But! Come up with your own logo. Heck, your logo only has to be 33% different than that of the real company. How hard is that? If you truely want to be proud, please make it your own...

Dude,

You are being a tool.

You are blatantly using a trademarked logo.
Is it a big deal IMO? Hell no.
But then again, I do not own the rights to those logos.

If I were you, I would remove the bunched panties, and not draw attention to my copyright infringement. I too have been AR'd for this, my Dominoes delivery service , I know how you feel. Ultimately, w/o the permission of the logo owner, you are in the wrong.

If LL were to neglect such an AR, I suspect that would be further ammunition if this were to come to litigation. If LL wants to *try* and remain litigation free, they did what they must IMHO.

Again (and for the Nth time), this post is only marginally about LL, even if i do believe they have much bigger matters that are left unadressed and should begin by adressing them instead (for instance the shameful conditions of roads, or the TP issues).
In fact i agreed with the linden that i CAN keep my cars the way they are, i just have to remove the big display signs with just the logo on them. If they wanted me to remove my cars they would have to strip a big percentage of SL's content, and i REALLY doubt they would even think doing it, thankfully.

This post is about people that, in the name of the "i can't do it, so no one else should be allowed to" philosophy, go out of their way to try and damage others' work.
Is there anyone here that can honestly state they believe the abuse report was an act of a mature citizen trying to save SL from the evil car maker instead of a simple (and quite cowardly, being anonimous) attempt to safely damage someone else?

On the other hnd, i have to thank Pandastrong for hitting the nail straight in the head and being able to understand exactly what i do and why.

Perhaps I'm a little slow...you respect their work, so you openly copy their valuable trademarks and logos, usurping them for your own purposes? I dunno, but someone using my copyrighted material without at least asking first doesn't seem all that respectful to me.



Your reasons for using them are plain irrelevant. They're not your logos to use, they're the rightful property of the car manufacturer. You have neither the right nor the privilege to make the decision for them on how they are used. What you've done is associated their name now with copyright theft and blatant copying. I'm sure they'll be mighty proud to support that.




The worst thing here is, I agree - people really should respect the work of others. My only question is...why should you be any exception?


- Newfie

Yes actually. I believe that someone who says "I wish I could build like that" would not waste their time submitting such a report. I do believe however, as has been proven time and time again in these forums, that there are many people watching out for LL. Why? Because not everyone is so self-important that they fail to realize that if everyone doesn't contribute, SL can never amount to anything. It's like a community watch, and I assure you, there are people who get -very- serious about their community watch.

Take a word of advice from yourself, "Mind your own business." Meaning, go take care of your business. All you're doing is hurting yourself, I'm sure there's a number of people now, of whom, have lost a great amount of respect for your products simply by the way in which you deal with this bump in the road. You broke ToS, you got called on it, get over it. It doesn't matter if someone was jealous of you or not, the fact of the matter is -YOU- and only -YOU- gave them the amunition with which to shoot you.

You have no one to blame but yourself.

Yesterday i just finished painting my beautiful 1/48 brand new model of a Focke Wulf FW.190, tomorrow i'll make sure to make a field trip on Kurt Tank's tomb to ask for his forgiveness for "openly copying his valuable trademarks and logos, usurping them for my own purposes"... LOL

What kills me here is knowing that if you caught someone replicating your work, you'd call for thier heads on a platter.

Yes, and providing quality (i hope) content is my way of contributing. And honestly i do believe it's a better way of contributing than going around sneakily purposedly trying to find faults to punish, expecially when they don't harm anyone, but make a lot of people satisfied (at least judging from the comments i get daily, for whom i'm grateful and that help a great deal making me carry on working).
If people self elect themselves as a community watch, maybe they have a lot more time in their hands than what they should if they begun to behave constructively, instead of destructively (and they would help SL to develop a lot more as well).
They did me no harm (other than removing a couple sign), since thankfully the lindens said that i can keep my cars as they are, but they WANTED to, and that's what upsets me.

You keep throwing out complaints about getting abuse reported, yet you continually avoid facing the fact that you used copyrighted material without proper permission of that material's rightful owner. Until you have that piece of paper in your hand from the manufacturer giving you permission to use their logos, your opinions on 'contributions', 'tributes', or any other phrase you wish to call it doesn't matter. Not. One. Whit. It is not up for you to decide how those logos are used or not used.

You might even have an idea to end world hunger with the logos, but you know what? It doesn't matter. You're infringinging on someone else's work, so you deserve every inch of the TOS report. If you're not suspended yet, you got off lucky.

Maybe next time, eh?


- Newfie

Nice attitude we have here, had a bad day or you just relish on other people's problems? Just out of curiosity uh?
Again, there was an agreement with the lindens about keeping my cars the way they are, because probably (and differently then you) they know and respect the effort that goes into them.
They don't suspend people that go around repeatedly shooting at others, and they should suspend me for creating constructive content? Interesting concept we have here.

Whether it's a Toyota, or the Mustang you made (which, btw, is almost certainly a trademarked shape), or the Nikon brand camera you sell, those items pose a threat to all of SL because they disrespect the rightful owners and violate RW laws. They also disrespect those SL original content creators who might be trying to sell original vehicles but who lose business to people doing what you're doing. This is exactly the wrong kind of thing to support SL imo and my thanks to whoever reported the infraction.

You know what you're talking about so much that you even talk about me making a Mustang, wich i wouldn't even think to make, since i strongly dislike muscle cars, like everyone that has actually taken a second to talk with me about cars knows very well.

Really? Suppose I verify that the Mustang is a trademarked shape and informed LL of this little fact. Since you think they "respect the effort" so much, you won't mind my doing this, yes? And if it's not yours, I apologize for seeing your Race Girl discuss it and seeing it on your blog.

And btw, what's with the Nikon? Is that another form of "respect"?

We are having a conversation right now
You are having multiple conversations with multiple people right now
It seems to me that you are being disrespectful to all concerned right now

Also if you want a good discussion, you shouldn't just repeat everything over and over again in every post. You have called this person a coward and a griefer in almost every post on this thread, and they are not here to defend themselves.

I know who I would call the coward in that situation.

Also a good argument is not just the automatic gain-saying of everything the other person says...

Not the ten dollar argument anyway.

To revisit a snippet from your original post:




So which is it, did they support you, or did you have to make changes in regards to this? It sounds suspiciously to me that they made sure you changed your designs (sign/car/whatever) such that there was no confusion about who owned the copyrighted material. And I'd be very willing to bet that the amount of effort put into them had very little factor in why they decided to not suspend you.

Otherwise...the person that spent untold hours performing the recent hack would've been practically idolized by the Lindens.


And like was said before - if you dont like people posting abuse reports on you, dont provide them the ammo to do so yourself. They just happened to notice the copied material, you put it there all on your own volition.


- Newfie

Okay.... All I can do is laugh now. Come now guys, he's doing a well enough job of making himself look bad, he no longer needs our help. Watching him dig his hole deeper and deeper is amusing, but oh so sad at the same time. While I was never interested in spending my lindens on any of 'his creations' to begin with, I will most certainly make a point to never do so in the future. We have here someone with a different view of themselves and their activities, trying to drill our corrected views is obviously not working. All that is happening is he's looking more and more like a fool, to the point that this isn't even fun to watch anymore, it's just pittiful...

Okay, Okay...

/laughing, tummy hurts.

Maybe it is still amusing. haha

I think this is a *bit* extreme.

Shiryu is clearly an enthusiast. He doesn't have a website where he charges people RL currency to download Toyota's logo (not that I know of at least - I don't really know him too well).

This isn't the metaverse yet. We don't buy and sell products or services within SL using RL currency. Neither Shiryu or LL assigned a RL value to Linden dollars. It is monopoly money that a couple of independents allow people to trade for RL dollars.

Until someone pays Shiryu in RL currency for his creations, I cannot assume that he is making RL money off of it (even though he probably does).

If Ricky Zamboni decided that my neg-rates were worth RL money, would I automatically be obligated to pay taxes on them?

Unless you have peeked at Shiryu's GOM account or income tax filings, let him be an enthusiast. I would draw a bunch of RL analogies concerning representational art and hobbies, but I am feeling like a real lazy hippie right now.