Drama around Views program - Maybe just a big misunderstanding?

umm are you saying this is wrong?


OMG i think i am in trouble

Cocoa, you say you object to the process but it looks like you object to anyone being selected at all. You can disagree but that's sure how it looks. As far as I can tell, the only time you didn't object to something like this was when your house was selected for the suburban experiment. Why must everything bow down to the high god of Fairness to the point that nothing can be done? Life is too short...

LL should have asked for volunteers and then picked from that batch? Sounds like a wasted step in the process to me. They made the assumption that all 250,000 registered users were potential volunteers -- is that so shocking?

There are lots of different ways to be heard by the lindens if that's what you really want. The Lindens have lots of inputs ... this gathering is just one.

You should really consider taking your own advice sometime.

It may look that way, but I don't mean it that way.

As for my case, it didn't quite go like that. The first house was actually one that won a contest for content for new premium accounts - which had other winners including, was it your truck of clothes? Anyway, a trunk of clothes, a vehicle, and I forget what all else. It gave new premium accounts a choice of these six bonuses they could choose from for free content.

After that promotion was over, Lauren Linden contacted me with a business proposition. She was about to start Blumfield, and wanted to know if I'd be interested in doing the houses for the entire sim for LL. I would make several houses of the 50's variety for them to use in the sim. I don't know what it would have paid, because I stopped her before she got to that part.

I pointed out that it was very flattering, and wonderful, and I loved the idea, and would love the work, but I had not yet put in for the Developer's Directory. I explained my other house had won in a contest, for the other promotion, and the contest was open to all, and an equal opportunity for all. And since I wasn't in the Developer's Directory, I didn't see how I could accept this assignment. If it had been a contest, or if I had been in the DD, I told her, it would have been different.

So she said, well, hold on, let me ask about this. (We were in an IM in the game.) She got back to me a bit later and said there was no reason they couldn't run a contest. So they did! They announced the contest for the houses, and said they would choose three winners.

It had a very quick deadline, and, as in the first contest, I wanted to turn in a brand new house, so I had to work quick. I remember there was an update during those 2-3 days we had, too, and I asked for an extension of a day for us, due to the problems that cause, and so we got that.

Then I sat around on pins and needles, thinking how humiliating it would be if my house was not chosen! But, I told myself, them's the breaks. You wanna compete? OK, you're competing. I know I could have done that sim myself, no problem, and done a good job, and loved doing it (and WOULD have, if I'd gotten on the DD in time), but this contest definitely did put an edge to it!

It turned out that she was thrilled with the entries, so much so that she chose six houses, not just three. Five other people were also thrilled, to have been chosen. I was thrilled to have been chosen, and thrilled for the other five people as well. I just loved the whole Blumfield idea, and enjoyed following the progress of the people who later moved in there.

I firmly believe that when you open things up to application for all, you might be wonderfully surprised with what you get, as opposed to what you would have gotten if you'd gone with only what you knew. In addition, it provides an opportunity for new talent, and for every resident to participate in exciting Second Life things. The Lindens still get to choose, but at least everyone gets to try.

As for the "Second Life Views" project, if they want to do this, then yes - they should take the extra step and make the opportunity to apply for it available to everyone, even if it is extra work. It's worth it, and they might be pleasantly surprised with the results.

coco

P.S. Don't think from the above that I expect anyone else to turn down something like that at all. I do very much know how hard that is to do, even when you believe in doing it! What I do expect is for the Lindens to make opportunities open to everyone to participate. As I said, they can still do the choosing, as is their right.

I think a lot of the problem here is that Prokofy and others espouse that anyone involved with the supposed FIC is just downright evil, part of the problem, wrong, and it is a big conspiracy. In fact, it is not, it is a natural thing. Consider:

- Linden Lab wants to promote their product through the residents, so of course they're going to pick positive people who have been successful to market alongside themselves

- The SL views has a wide breadth of experienced residents with many different talents and background, and some are actually quite angry with the way Second Life has evolved over time

- Any company is going to be loyal to their early adopters; the early believers are the ones who allow the company to flourish

- In 2003, there were 1/100th the people here; much easier to know everyone who was a regular

- Its natural, just because of the nature of time, that those of us who have been here longer are more likely to have more friends, and closer friends due to the length of friendship and the trust level built up

- 1/3 of the Lindens were residents first

- The most likely candidates to be hired as resident-to-Linden are older, due to the experience level necessary with the platform to be employed by Linden Lab

These are just a few reasons. Prokofy and others take these simple truths and make it sound like its an evil conspiracy, when, in fact, its a very natural thing. Have we taken the "Feted Inner Core" label, mocked it, and turned it into a joke? Very much so, as I pointed out before; we took the label and removed its negative power much like the gay community has absconded with terms like "queer" and "fag" from the bigots that created them. That doesn't mean that those bigots stop being schmucks, however. Some of the paranoia from the ranterati anti-FIC types borders on prejudice by Second Life birth date or prejudice by association, in my opinion.

You can now thank me for debunking the interesting myth that was the Feted Inner Core and call it what it is: smart business decisions and loyalty to your most loyal customers.

Regards,

-Flip

There's a guy that hangs out outside the Golden Nugget down town, preaching and alerting passers-by about a Jewish conspiracy to take over the government.

When you're all done here, how about going and having a go at him? You'll have better luck.

hehehehe, got sofa crash space for Jennyfur and I? We'll make a weekend out of it!

Regards,

-Flip

No matter what some of us say or do it will inevitably end up with the same people saying the same exact things over and over and over again. Its redundant and the dead horse has been beaten into a gelatinous pulp. I fail to see the point of it anymore, not that I ever really saw it in the first place.

No matter what I say to the "unchosen ones" it translates through the assumption tunel as Jennyfur - the bitch - the head up the butt girl - the smug arrogrant one who thinks she is more popular than us - that FIC bitch - she is so full of herself - she sits on her elitist throne with the rest of the FIC finding ways to be kewl - Linden ass kisser - she only does thinks for the self-congratulatory pat on the back from her peers and so on and so forth.

People don't like Elitism... Thats why there is so much negative feedback.

People don't like ignorance.... Thats why there is so much negative feedback

You have made it clear that this is what you believe since it is more inclusive and allows an additional avenue of exposure for those not previously noted for their contributions to SL. Others have made it clear that they don't necessarily agree with this due to the godawful red tape that is involved, the fact that the benefit of a large scale application process doesn't always outweigh the costs of such a process, and that there are already ways to "apply" just be being in the world and doing good things.

Both views have their place. LL has chosen, for this exercise, the once that suits them best. I don't necessarily agree that it is the best for this particular endeavour, but I don't have to.

I don't understand the idea that this is some kind of unreal, utopian plat-game where LL must not engage in real life relationship building in order to better their product. It is not the city government abusing its position for the monetary gain of cronies. It is a small company looking to get bigger and better, which means a very real need for efficiencies and certainty, as well as decisions that are definitely not utopian.

I have my current RL job by way of relationships built in other dealings with the corporation. There wasn't an interview process of every capable person within a ten county radius. There was nothing wrong with this way of hiring and it had very real advantages for myself and the corporation. Did they miss the next great genius? Perhaps. Was the process successful? Definitely. Did other people lose out on a job that they didn't even get to apply for in a tough market? Yes. Was it wrong? No.

This is not a game for LL.

I wouldn't count on this if I were you. If it becomes advantageous from a business point of view for LL to (metaphorically) slit your throat, you can bet dollars to doughnuts they will do just that.

Just sayin'.

i wouldnt get too bothered about it, its just some lindens busy work

and personally i really beleive them, since ya know those feature request and voting widgets really get results =/

I really have to ask this, I really do.

Are you not the same person that posted a few months back about making a public announcement that you were going into hiding and using an alt because you thought you were 'considered too FIC'?

It's one thing to be called FIC by individuals among the public (personally, I just think you're a tag-along hoping for reflected glory, but not an FIC), but what kind of self-inflated ego does one have to have to call themselves FIC?

Maybe it really is time you went to your alt, and took a reality check. LL has shown repeatedly - and this 'chosen ones' crap only reinforces it - that they only deal with those that are within their social circles. You on the other hand have the choice of setting a better example.


- Newfie
(Who doesn't care who is FIC or not, because the problem is LL, not FIC)

Is this a reasonable summation of the opposing points of 'view' on the FIC, er, 'SecondLife Views' advisory group?:

(red vs. blue, just for point/counter-point clarity, my apologies to any colorblind readers out there)



Citizens that have more influence over the staff at Linden Lab will use that advantage, resulting in an already unfair system rewarding them even more!

Some citizens may have earned more of Linden Lab's attention than others. It's just basic human nature to favor people if they've earned your respect. Sure someone may abuse that position of trust, but it'll balance out in the long run.

All citizens must have an equal ability to be heard and heeded by Linden Lab or unfairness will result and corruption will follow.

Some are more articulate than others, some indecypherable, some have more to say, others less. We are all different and have our own desires and concerns. If only the majority wish is heeded then the minority is marginalized despite any validity to their concerns. The only way LL can heed all our voices equally is to ignore all of us completely and that would be worse than unfairness.

Even the presense of Linden Lab staff in world results in an unfair system as we must trust them not to abuse the additional powers given to them in their employment.

But Linden staff are held to a higher code of conduct as a result of those powers and aren't permitted to participate in SecondLife the way 'normal' citizens do.

But abuses occur anyway, and the FIC aren't held to the same code of conduct that Linden Lab staff are... staff can turn a blind eye when FIC'rs misbehave. LL staff may even be able to extend certain favors to FIC'ers not available to everyone.

Linden Lab staff are human and thus prone to mistakes. And while power corrupts, anyone that abuses the system sufficiently will get caught and disciplined eventually... particularly if the abuse is considered a serious violation that jeapordizes the viability of either SecondLife and/or Linden Lab. What LL senior staff feel is an abuse vs. what citizens call abuse is likely to differ, but that can't be helped.

Hoping that everything turns out all right like that is a recipe for failure.

Appointing yourself chief of ethics is an act of vigilanteism.

Well, someone has to do it, and you certainly won't!

Your quixotic tilting and windmills is quaint. Idealistic... but completely impractical, ineffective and annoying!

and you, sir, have the morals of a goat!

(thread locked)

Yes, it is noble and admirable to strive for equality and fair treatment and to discourage corruption and nepotism... I do respect the effort, but I see that as one end of a spectrum. At the other end are people that have earned the right to be heard, not because other people nominated them, or because they filled out an application but because their thoughts and deeds have merit that has been recognized.

It is unfair if the voices of a few elite people cause the wishes of the many to go unheard.

But it is also unfair if the majority of 'common' citizens can drown out the deserving few who are investing their lives and talents into making our world a better place.

It can't be all one or the other.

To be 'fair' some middle ground must be found.

"Who decides who is deserving?", is of course, is the root of the problem.

--
Welcome to the Plutocracy of SecondLife.
He (or she) who has the gold makes the rules.

(did I miss any significant points?)

I believe the reason wasn't the FIC, it was that she was too often referred to as "Mrs. FlipperPA Peregrine." People would IM her asking my whereabouts if I wasn't online, and things of that nature, and it really would irk her. It is funny, in RL, she kept her RL last name (which is a pretty cool one, heh) though we share on in SL. She did create that alt and uses it often.

However, since that time several opportunities have come about for Jennyfur due to her hard work and immense talent I can only dream of having: CNBC got in touch with us through SLBoutique to do the interview, which led to more interest specifically in the Jennyfur avatar (since she was listed as a co-founder of SLBoutique), including the opportunity to speak at an upcoming conference in the Philadelphia area about the future of fashion design (being held at QVC Headquarters in West Chester, PA). This has led to a slight change of heart.

I'm sure she'll have more to say on the topic herself, but that's the gist.

Regards,

-Flip

Good question and the long and short of it comes down to me being a fickle gemini and i do what I want when I want and it really doesn't have to make sense. I'm prone to changing my mind from time to time. It wasn't that I was lamenting because *I* was considered too FIC. I did go on about all that FIC silliness and thought it was stupid at how serious some people take it on both sides. To be honest, I'd have to dig up the post to reference the other reasons. I did take a bit of a hiatus from Jennyfur.

You personally may think I am a "tag along hoping for reflected glory, but not an FIC" and you are well aware that I don't give two shits about what you think and see you as nothing more than just another one of the bellyaching "unchosen ones" taking every chance they can to attack the rest of people like me no matter what I say or do. So put that in your pipe and smoke it.

Yah that is some of it. Its like it became impossible for me to make good on my promise and retire Jennyfur with some of the opportunities that came into being. How stupid would it have been for the CNBC interview for me and Flipper to be on it and me claim to be some alt. We've met far too many SLers in real life to pull that one off and my picture is easy to find because its in my profile etc.

What we need is a real villain that we can all bash together. A nice family togetherness beat down.

Sign me up. Nothing like a little 'Mutual Adversity Bonding'

how many people would agree that pixel sex is immoral and should be banned or otherwise not in SL? that puts *you know who* out of step with a large pecentage of the SL community.. so him saying he should be picked is laughable! anyways.. I couldnt make it so I wont be there

/logs out of shitty alt >.<

How fascinating!

Please, elaborate who 'people like you' are...since 'people like me' clearly aren't 'people like you'.

- Newfie

Bored now. You are going back on ignore because I refuse to waste anymore of my precious valuable time responding to a wastoid like you.

Hrm, I would have to disagree based on my own personal experience.

I run a subscription based service in RL and I am very thankful for and loyal to my charter members. If it were not for them trying our product, providing us feedback on how we could improve the service and sticking with us the company would not be where it is today. I cannot fathom any business situation to arise where the viewpoint on these folks would change.

Do they get any special perks, benefits or "platters" other than a charter member subscription rate? No. But you can bet these are the people whose opinion we value tremendously. They have been with us for 3 years now, they have seen the service grow and change. They have a unique perspective and can offer a type of feedback that newer folks cannot.

That said...we value our newer customers very much as well. They are fresh "eyes"; they may see things we can improve that the older customers may not. Their opinions/needs/feedback is also very, very important to us.

Depending on what new feature or direction we may be thinking to take with our service we may solicit feedback from the older customers, other times from the newer customers and a lot of the time from all customers.

The need is completely situational. It is not that one groups opinion bears more weight or value than the others. It is the type of perspective we need at the time that dictates whom we actively solicit feedback from.