SLCC 2006: August 18-20th, San Francisco, Fort Mason Center!

There was one attempt to collect to input. There may've been more; this just happens to be one I know about.

Comment:

I notice that one you referenced, Khamon, was moved to meet-up forum for further discussion.

coco

You are absolutely correct, except one thing - the poll you've referenced was created after the decision for the location was made, and done because of the number of people who objected over the lack of community involvement.

If anything, the existence of the poll only underscores the accuracy of my statement.


- Newfie

Newfie,

I've worked in various aspects of event coordination and management for over six years now from corporate to non-profit and you know what? The location decision is usually made by a smaller group of people. WHo wants to waste the time polling 50,000 global co-workers 98% of which won't attend no matter where it is. The only event I know of that polls the community is Convergence and does a seemingly decent job doing so is Convergence. Conventions and conferences in general are usually hosted in any variery of major cities from NYC to LA to Philadelphia to Chicago etc. There is no central location for a global community. The ideal equidistant location for everyone is probably in the middle of the ocean somewhere.

Why is this so hard to understand? The SLCC organizers aren't trying to steamroll the community at large by picking a location at random without input. You may think that they just threw the dart at the map and said "wooo hoo" San Fran wins. There is no way to please everyone in SL no matter where the SLCC would have chosen. WOuld you still be pissed if we posted a poll and the end result was still San Francisco? Its easy to criticize the jobs of others when you don't have to lift a finger to do so yourself and are free to complain about the problems you have with the decisions made.

I didn't decide on San Francisco. I only recently hopped back on board the SLCC organizing train because a couple of things had to fall into place before I could committ to being an organizer- mainly when it was going to be because of my work schedule and a huge fundraising gala that I am working on. I live on the east coast so its not like San Fran is in my back yard. Its a six hour flight. I have to take time off from work. I have to pay money for a hotel. All that said, San Francisco is a prime location for the convention. Why? well the bay area hosts one of the largest demographics of Second Life users, Linden Lab is there, its a beautiful town with a temperate climate, there is tons of stuff to do. I'm sorry that all that is so unappealing and incomprehensible to you.

If you want to have a community voice and participate in the decision making, then volunteer for something and quit complaining. You are getting hung up on the semantics of the use of the word "community". Just because it is a community convention doesn't mean that all 200,000+ community members can and will have a voice in every decision that is made. It would be completely undoable. We are a community no matter how many numbers you include in the equation. Every single organizer has numerous real-life obligations, jobs, families and responsibilites. We are doing the best that we can do. Mind you, for FREE.

Regards,
Jennyfur

Come on, do we REALLY need to do this whole song and dance again? Its getting redundant. I'm not going to go into the reasons for the location choice again; I stick by our logical decision making process as detailed in the last SLCC thread announcing the location. Quite a bit of research was done before choosing a location. Nevermind that San Fran got more than double any other city in the posthumous poll linked above; that does make the argument a bit moot.

Anyway, there was also an announcement about our kick-off meeting here:
/234/5b/89594/1.html

Everyone who attended that meeting or has IM'd one of the organizers about helping out has been contacted and involved in the decisions making processes. We have a much larger team helping this year than last, which is wonderful! I will note that none of the people who have complained came to the meeting announced at the link above, or the one linked below. In fact, I got quite a nasty IM about not posting that link above to General because someone didn't see it; now I'm getting comments that this doesn't belong in General. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

There have also been plenty of open-to-the-public SLCC events as well, such as this:
/108/db/74616/1.html

I've also received no IMs (can't speak for the other organizers, but I doubt they have either) from the people complaining regarding wanting to volunteer to help either this year, or in future years.

Regards,

-Flip

Personally I have no interest in refrying these same beans, there's hundreds of postings that go through all this in extruciating detail. However, I have decided to make sure to keep *both* sides of this issue represented when possible. I make no claim to represent the entire community, only to represent myself as a member of that community.

Take it as a notice. For each post that tries to advertise this event as a community convention and give it an upbeat flair, I'll be making a response to ensure that both sides of the issue is presented. A number of people and locations have been left out of this process, and the very name of a community convention that left out the community in the process is a misnomer at best. It's called giving a balanced review of things.

It may not be an opinion that you agree with or even think is fair, but then again that's what makes the real world such an interesting place. If you cannot handle criticism, then you're in the wrong line of activity. I wish you luck with your SL Community Convention that doesn't factor in the community.




If this is what you give to the community for free, then I would suggest it might be time to either charge a fee or look for something else to do. If it bothers you that your 'free' 'community' service is getting a negative response, then it's clearly not free. Instead, what you are looking for is an ego stroking as a reward.

Sorry, I'm not feeling that generous.

Good luck with your SLC.


- Newfie

Regardless of whether the poll was created after the fact we didn't sign the contract with the Fort Mason Center until last week so if public outcry was that severe and people demanded we changed the location we ***could*** have done it at anytime. However, since its only a handfull of people complaining and we didn't receive any death threats we kept it in San Francisco. Could is the keyword here.

If you have no interest in refrying the same beans as you put it yet you pretty much post the exact same thing to any SLCC related thread. As soon as I saw your post I knew exactly what you were going to say because of the redudant nature of your responses. So until you put your money where you mouth is and contribute more to the "community" aspect of the SLCC other than criticism your opinions are completely and utterly irrelevant to me. I'm glad that you have nothing better to do than to rain on everyone elses parade by posting the same darned thing to each SLCC related thread.

I guess having a convention for the SL community organized by many of the SL community members doesn't involve the community enough in your opinion.

Thank for hijacking the thread and making it all about how miserable ol' Newfie thinks the SLCC lacks any community involvement. Boo hoo.

Regards,
Jennyfur

Oh really?

That's funny, ever since from practically post #1 in the original threads, the response from the SLC organizers was 'it is in San Fran, so there, deal with it.' Even up to the point of your own 'get over it' in this very thread.

It's too late now to play the 'coulda/shoulda/woulda' game. What has happened belies that whole nonsense claim about being open to changing the destination. I'll stick to the facts of the case, rather than suppositions and hypotheticals.

In the meantime, I would recommend you re-read all the prior threads, rather than further trying to rehash a debate that has already been picked over like a rotten corpse. It'll save us all boatloads of wasted effort.




Hrmmm, let's apply a little logic. Opinion is the same, facts are the same, causes are the same. Were you honestly expecting me to say something different?




I have plenty of other volunteer and community oriented items I am already involved in, thank you very much. Wanna know why you dont know about them? Because I'm not in your little social circle, and I dont go about trying to get attention and ego stroking with them.



Sure, it's plenty for me. Except the SLC isn't organized by the community, nor is it even considered by the organizers. See my prior paragraph about your little social circle. That's who is running this event. I hate to burst your bubble, but your little social circle does not constitute 'the community'.



Gotta love those logical, well-thought-out adult responses. Do you also use that same tactic in these other events you deal with, or it's just that special touch you reserve for the SL community?


Now, care to try to respond in a manner befitting an adult trying to carry on a meaningful discourse?


- Newfie

I'd like to go since I have family there and it's a quick flight up. I dunno though. I'm skeered. But I'll see. Have fun everyones!

Aww Lash, don't be afraid. Those going sound like a good group of people. Wouldn't you like to meet them? Find out if your online impression of them is what they really are in real time? You will have a good time.....!

Not particularly, as I have wasted enough time responding to you and have MUCH better things to do like eat dinner, take a piss, and find new ways to screw the community over 'cause I'm such an elitist FIC bitch. Have a nice day

Regards,
Jennyfur

I have to take exception to this one even. Once the decision was made by your group, there was no way it was going to be reversed. Don't insult any of our intelligence to believe that this decision would have been changed for any reason.

The point is, make a community decision based on the offering of community input. In this case, a small group of people thought it would be nice to have it in SF. Instead of saying this is a community decision, call it what it is. A gathering organized by your group and if anyone would like to attend, come on down!

All I am saying is that it could have been changed not that it was going to be, but it could have been. Yes. San Francisco was the first choice of many, but if it was obvious that a majority of the people were so insensed that they didnt get to nominate their hometown, it *could* have been taken into consideration.

Its just very frustrating to spend a lot of time working on something that gets nickpicked apart in semantics and by people who want everything, but won't lift a finger to help.

so much for this year being on the east coast.

I second that.

You're not alone there. It's also frustrating to have to try to give feedback to person(s) who think that because it's their pet project that it means they are infallible in their decisions and would rather put their fingers in their ears than instead try to listen to constructive criticism from those who honestly do want the *community* convention to be a good one.

Then again, you're probably too busy patting yourself on the back in self-righteous indignation to even consider that thought.

All the more reason why people like me need to reply in these kinds of threads.


- Newfie

Ladies and gentlemen, avies, furries and such I hate to say it but I think the point is being missed about what the SLCC really is. It is a combination of Real World and SL into festivities that is suppoesed to foster though, community participation, and togetherness of this virtual world that we all share. Much in the same way that the location of Linden Labs was predetermined by a group that started SecondLife, we all continue to log into their servers and participate in this digital world of thought, creativity, ideas, and art that we all have welcomed into our lives.

The SLCC being in San Fran, oddly enough the location of where Linden Labs, and the servers are, should be more symbolic than argumentative and rather having the argumentative point of what location it should reside in, the arguments should be over who would like to participate in what resident run availabilities, who would like to see what addressed at the SLCC, and what impact or food for thought items should happen in the world that we all have created.

The SLCC is a wonderful opportunity to expand our horizons, interact with other people in both a real and digital format and foster new and old connections, ideas, art, thought to this creative world that we all have contributed and live in on a daily basis.

I myself and very excited to be there and I hope to see those who can make it in person, and those who can't make it in person in world. Let us not spoil this opportunity!

hai guyz whats going on in this rained parade

Last year: New York City, 501 miles from my location. Not ideal. Also? Expensive. Also? can't drive there. Also? New Jersey. Also? It's not in Detroit.

This year: San Francisco, 2070 miles from my location. Not ideal. Also? Not expensive. Also? Too far to drive. Also? Linden Lab is there. Also? Not in detroit.

I think I shall take this time to stamp my foot around and demand that it be held anywhere but San Francisco.

But! Mark my words, no matter where we pick next year, I'll still complain. Even if it's in Detroit.

*stamps foot*
*cries over spilled milk*
*pouts in the corner during recess*

Seriously. It's a convention for a game world hosted in, get this, SAN FRANCISCO. The company that designed, built, and is running this world is, get this, SAN FRANCISCO.

I know, I know, totally wild coincidences. I mean, seriously. Who'd have thunk that a con devoted to a world hosted in SAN FRANCISCO and ran by a company in SAN FRANCISCO would be hosted in SAN FRANCISCO? I mean, that's just totally bonkers. I would have guessed Topeka, Kansas. Maybe Deluth, Minnesota.

Lincoln, Nebraska?

Seriously. It's a global community. Absolutely nowhere on this planet will be ideal for all 200,000 accounts. Air travel being what it is nowadays, even the most remote place on earth is scarcely a day away. Get over it.

I sure did. a 2000 mile trip to San Fran can be done, non-stop, from Detroit.

Steps to fly to San Fran and still make it feel local:
1) Get on plane in Detroit.
2) Drink Whiskey.
3) Pass out.
4) Wake up in San Francisco.

The people complaining in this thread have pretty much zero basis for complaining. Saying "omfg assholes u picked it before you asked ME1111!!!" didn't bother to care until you heard it wasn't in your hometown. Nevermind the fact that Miami, Florida probably isn't the best spot for a SL con. Because, you know, the world is hosted in SAN FRANCISCO.

Sheesh.

Issue 1 for consideration at a roundtable....Is SLCC community based? If so, how can it best serve the community?

Issue 2 for consideration at a roundtable....What form can a community based poll take for future placement of an SLCC gathering such as this one in SF?

Issue 3 for consideration at a roundtable....Once the next location is decided, how can we outside of the "group" offer our help for the next community convention?

Re: Miami, yes that and all of them hurricanes. I don't know about the rest of you but trying to outdrive Hurricane Andrew on our way home from vacation the last time I was in Florida in the summer was *not* fun. I repeat *not* fun.

Conversely, the weather in SF is great in the summer certainly better than the humid sweaty armpit that is pretty much the rest of the continental US.

Rather than go into the specifics of this debate all over again (my opinion hasn't changed, so restating it in more encyclopaedic detail is not really needed), I'd suggest read the original posts.


Long story short, to use Nexus' words, there was an opportunity to bring the SL community together in a great way, and because of the self-interests of a limited set of people, that opportunity was thrown away.

For those of the community that were given the shaft by such a decision, it's a parade that was rained on before the floats even left the warehouse.

Hopefully next year the SLC organizers will learn from this whole effort and earn the honor to put that extra 'C' in SLCC.

But it aint this year, by a long shot.


- Newfie

Eh, LL is in San Francisco, thus it makes sense that the SLCC should be there, since on key objective, I would think is to maximize linden-resident communications. Any way you cut it it costs money to travel, and obviously more people are going to have to travel than not.

Thus SF is a the logical location. More Logical than NYC, for example.

But really If I am in detroit, for example, I am getting on a plane and paying hotel fare whereever the convention is.

All this ranting bunk about the community not being involved is just silly adolescent grandstanding to work up a controversy. And trust me I know a lot about silly, adolescent grandstanting.

really if you want the SLCC to be representative of the community, just show up..in person or online. Sitting in your corner and pouting because you were left out of one decision is not really productive, or participating in the community.

If you don't like things, do it yourself next year. But participate....

Well, for what it's worth, I'm totally stoked that it's in SF.

Nevermind all that mess, bruh (and if you're not a bruh, i'll still call you BRUH!). All any of you cats need to know is that BushidoBrown will be in the building. Flip, JennyFur (girl, you are FIC? When did that happen!@#$@ Nether, Astrin, Spin, Bo..all you cats out there who will be in the precinct, recognize, it's about to be ON & CRACKIN'!

When can I get down with registration for this rendezvous? I thought Hiro mentioned 450 slots? What's the science on that? If I missed when ya'll slid the mathematics to us, MY BAD Be easy and I'll see "ya'll" in August.

/BushidoBrown/ (brought to you by the makers of Funk & Wagnalls. GUARD YO GRILL!)