Stagecoach Island defects to ActiveWorlds

Is this movie of SL or AW?


http://www.swivelmedia.com/fun_money.htm

Since you appear to be reading this thread and responding, Reuben, what I'd really like to know is why none of us involved in this project (Bedazzled folk and the content creators) were informed of this outcome in a timely manner. Were you under some contract constraints with Wells Fargo not to reveal the details of this until a certain time? Or were you ever intending to make a statement to us at all? The answers to these questions will greatly affect how I feel about working with LL on projects of this type in the future and whether or not I would recommend this to others.

That entire thing is almost completely SL. They even show SL shops.

It's of Second Life.

I have not been to the AW version of SI, but that certainly looks like SL... right down to the "Mischief" and "Celestial Studios" logos.

Also, in the initial shot, you can see the SL logo in the lower right corner, with the phrase, "Powered By Second Life."

IMHO, this whole debacle stinks to high heaven. If I were one of the cntent creators involved, i would be screaming bloody murder.

P2

The only thing I've seen wrong, from WF view, is them using Cubeys skydiving stuff by mistake, and supposedly they are working that out.

That video is clearly SL. I'd appreciate any updates around on this basis, because this continues to look immensely dodgy to me, and I need to know when to launch the internet campaign.

The real question is when was that webpage/video created? Also WF and Swivel did PAY for this. Another question is where was this page found? Is it linked from somewhere else?

This is why we need updates.

My position is that if Wells Fargo go ahead with their promotion while using SL material and, particularly, content from people they had no agreement with, that's something that needs publicising.

The mere fact that they moved from SL to AW doesn't bother me, but misrepresentation and ripping people off does. I hope that that's not the case and that it's all a misunderstanding - and they've not launched this on their basic site, so that's still believable. I hope that this is all worked out and everybody is happy about their role. But I'm a cynic and thus am paying close attention, as far as I am able.

Beryl:

We found out about this on Friday when we received a mass email that went out to all registered SI users.

Reuben, I think Beryl is really asking why those involved with S.I. were not notified back in November (i.e. when you guys found out) that the project would be discontinued after its beta.

Reuben, I was referring to WF ending the Stagecoach Island beta and that we probably weren't going to have the agreements honored which we entered into for US$ payment for use of our content. Let me quote you from an earlier post in this thread in regard to this:
So, if you knew about this back in November, why did it take the resident content contributors a month and a half to hear about this, and then not even from Linden Lab?

To be quite honest, I'm still sort of waiting for some OFFICIAL email from you or Linden Lab or Swivel or somebody in authority telling all content creators exactly what the status is on our agreements in regard to the content we agreed to let you use for Stagecoach Island. I think that would be the courteous and professional thing to do.

Edit: Yeah, what Ricky said.

Correction: My system always paid all content creators for all sales the moment they took place. By creator, I mean the key returned by llGetCreator(), so if you setup your own store, and I believe everyone did, you should have got all the money already.

Correction to the correction:
Halfway through the project, I was told LL was "looking into" the fact that money/items could be transferred to the main grid, so I don't know if you stopped being paid after some time. It's all logged, regardless.
On top of that, I don't know if you arranged some extra compensation with LL due to the fact they took over your items and forced you to charge lower prices.

"Swivel is THE creative, full service experience marketing shop.
We provide the highest level of creative and strategic vision to meet challenging marketing objectives. Think of The Wolf in 'Pulp Fiction'. We solve problems."

Yikes.

Reuben, I'm confused. Did you know in November that WF was leaving, or did you just find out on Friday? Or am I mixing up answers to two different questions? I'm not accusing anyone of anything, just asking for clarification.

And Swivel media REALLY needs to remove that video. Wow.

Swivel Media is a San Francisco based company that specializes in marketing to college kids. Swivel Media is located 3.6 miles from Linden Lab in San Franciso, according to MAPQUEST:
http://www.mapquest.com/directions/main.adp?go=1&do=nw&rmm=1&un=m&cl=EN&ct=NA&rsres=1&1y=US&1ffi=&1l=&1g=&1pl=&1v=&1n=&1pn=&1a=380+alabama+st&1c=san+francisco&1s=ca&1z=94110&2y=US&2ffi=&2l=&2g=&2pl=&2v=&2n=&2pn=&2a=1100+Sansome+Street&2c=san+francisco&2s=ca&2z=94111

A press release on Swivel:
http://www.prnewswire.com/cgi-bin/micro_stories.pl?ACCT=146101&TICK=DIGW&STORY=/www/story/09-20-2000/0001317545&EDATE=Sep+20,+2000

Perhaps someone should contact Swivel's Founder: [email]erik@swivelmedia.com[/email] with relevant questions.

Here's a profile of Erik, with picture and bio:
http://www.soflow.com/Profile.jsp?MemberId=4451&t=1137036118505

PLEASE read the "Academic Qualifications" section of this bio.

Swivel Media's founder, Erik Hauser, an "Experiental Marketing Evangelist", says:

"Swivel Media is Brandshake Marketing® and more. We are people people. We have a bright and engaging staff, always ready for new challenges. Our principals blend a mixture of creative passion and industry experience, and are most proud of our Company’s ability to communicate messages to all types of individuals. We focus on personal relationships at all levels with both our clients and their customers. That’s Brandshake Marketing® in practice.”

Yep, they really communicated with us, didn't they? What an "experience" that was! Did you feel the warm BrandShake?

Here's Erik's cute column for chiefmarketer.com:
http://chiefmarketer.com/brandanimation_experiential_01092006/

He briefly mentions Swivel's work for Wells Fargo, calling it: "an indicator for the future."

They likely knew in November as he initially posted. Contracts like that don't end without prior notification. That they didn't tell the Bedazzled team is a matter of pure rudeness. That someone other than the Philip is both answering and not answering these questions is weasely.

Not that I think this is an issue of concern for anyone but WF, Swivel, LL, Bedazzled, Cubey and a few others, but by their dishonorable conduct, Linden Lab made it one. Can't say I'm surprised given their history.

According to the intial Wells Fargo press release:
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m4PRN/is_2005_Sept_14/ai_n15390656

The pilot program was slated to end in mid November anyway. That was never mentioned in the original Linden announcement of the island:
/3/13/61521/1.html

or anywhere else on the forums (that I could find). Was the scheduled end of the pilot program mentioned to Bedazzled, or to the content providers? It seems not.

Surely, LL wasn't surprised by the scheduled ending of the pilot program. Though I imagine LL was dismayed that the program was unsuccessful. So, I suppose that what Reuben was trying to say was that LL knew in November that the program had ended, unsuccessfully. LL just never told us that the program was a trial. Or that the trial had ended, unsuccessfully. I'm not sure why this information was withheld. According to Reuben, "Shortly before launch, we all realized that a single group would need to take ownership of the vendor items in order make the process of maintaining/modifying the build possible." If all vendor items were in a single group, wouldn't it have been trivial to announce to the vendor group the particulars of the program?

From Reuben's statement that LL "only found out on Friday," I assume that Reuben meant that LL had only just then found out that content had been copied to another platform. LL may not have been informed by Swivel and WF that the content had been copied. LL may have been as surprised as the community was by the news. How about it, LL? How was the copying discovered?

Summing up, it appears that LL did not inform anyone that a) the program was only a trial, scheduled to be re-evaluated in November or b) that the trial had ended, unsuccessfully or c) that content had been copied.

In fairness on the copying issue, LL may have been "in corporate shock", still strategizing and meeting with counsel to determine how to break the news to the community. Corporations have to be careful with that kind of news release.

Not being up-front about the nature of the program to start with, or about the program's unsuccessful ending, however, doesn't sit right with me.

Am I anywhere near the mark with my assumptions?

I was never told when the beta would end; I wasn't told much of anything, I guess that should have been my first clue that this deal wasn't exactly a great thing. I do know that I was promised, in an August 29 email from Reuben, a specific amount of US$ "upfront" for use of my content which was to be paid by Swivel Media. That check has yet to show up in my mailbox over four months later.

Some interesting info, paulie. Thanks.

Thanks Csven and Surina you cleared up my questions

Swivel Media seems to have their eye on the ball with their business in general. There client list is impressive. From what I have read I can say they have a very strong customer base. They (Eric Hauser) didn't get there by chance. Checks not being sent as promised and their web site (swivel media.com )currently down for revamping made me raise an eye brow. With that said I'm still leaning towards it not being entirely Swivel Media’s responsibility this happened.

There was a substantial amount of money that changed hands. I am a bit perplexed over how LL found out about this only on Friday.

If LL knew that the Beta of WF SI would not continue in November. Then I feel they had an obligation to the content creators and contributors to tell them it would not. In November. I also think they should of stayed on top of the situation, it appears the ball was dropped somewhere along the way.

It is imperative that the bond of trust between LL and its content creators not be broken. Future endeavors, contracts, and projects deserve more. What ever needs to be done to rectify this situation should be actively pursued by LL, WF, and Swivel Media immediately.


MarCat

Wrong. The content that we put out was taken over by a Linden to supposedly help ease the copying process when creating the copies of the islands and in case things needed to be moved. Much of the content didn't actually use your payment system, I believe. I was certainly never asked to set it up to use your payment method. I haven't recieved any L$ from sales on SI yet. So payments went to the owner of the object, which was a Linden. I can only presume that they also took over the creator tag, maybe, so that permissions didn't give a problem when reselling.

*shrug* Either way, no L$ from sales has been seen by me yet.

Luuuuuuuuucy! You got some 'splainin to do.

But, as I noted way up there ^^^ if you had been forthright with the interested parties upfront (forgetting us uninvolved gossipmongers like me) you would have had a lot less.

Obviously, the system only paid people who used it.
The only purchasable content that didn't use it was in the gaming area, so basically... you and Cubey?
You presume wrong, though, the creator tags weren't changed. All I needed was mod perms so llRemoteLoadScriptPin calls wouldn't fail.

You originally said "everybody did" - so I explained that that's not the case.

I have no idea if the creator tags were changed. But so much gets left to presumption because, to be quite honest, nobody really explained an awful lot and Reuben wasn't specific. You said "everbody did" in which case if your system was going on the creator, maybe that explained why I didn't get the L$ directly, if the creator tag had been changed to a Linden. As you've now agreed no, not "everybody did", and so payments didn't go to me, they went to whichever Linden owned the object.

Just wondering if this point has been addressed yet...

Surely, you jest.