Upcoming Changes for Adult Content: Geographical Separation of Adult Content

lol I like to explore and love amusement parks, been to a few on SL frankly was thinking next time I will need to bring my cricket soundbox. Some noise, considering it was a weekend evening and only 3 other people in the sim, and one of them was with me. Was really a great park too, kind of depressing really.

Sadly I think I will need the cricket box for a lot more locations after this move by LL.

The problem you will have is if you re-locate the 4% most hardcore content. The owners of the next 10% of more moderate content are probably going to want to move also, just to make themselves feel safe from interpretation or future rule changes. Then you have others that have mixed content that may want to move to keep it all together, and others that just want to be near that stuff. So before you know it, to remove 4% of content you actually lose say, 20% of content. That's a lot of disruption and not good for land prices.

If you are reffering to adult content in general I would say the 2-4% is nothing close to the real numbers. Anyone who has been active on second life for a while knows, a big percentage of the second life™ economy is driven by the adult scene.

Add to that, responsible "adult" content creators on mainland usually manage their stores appropriately in the case that adult products are a division of their business. Take for example my main store, from the landing point and all over the ground floor there is nothing "sexual", explicite or not, if a visitor has no problem being exposed to "adult" content they can do so only if they choose to, even by doing so, the content they get exposed to is nothing extreme, so i dont see that me or anyone who creates quality "adult" content responsibly being 'forced' to move to a continent that everyone is already reffering to as the "Getto" an appropriate step for business.

While you say you will make the transition to the new continent smooth and swift, for most it will not be, take into consideration creators that include their landmarks in the product package, how much work will that be to alter the landmarks inside 100+ products, or regular visitors that already have the landmarks and pass it on to their friends, when they arrive and find out that their favorite store is nowhere to be found.

What about the new search ranking, to my knowledge the land "age" does have a relevance on how high a business appears in the search results. Seems to me like movers are going to start over from scratch, unless they are willing to invest a big chunk of their profits on advertisments and/ or placing bots and camping places in hopes to retain the position they once had in the new search.

To sum this all up, I only support this decision if it will only effect the minority that come up with really extreme sexual or voilent content, specially if it does not hold any artistic or intellectual value, I won't be suprised if such content is in most cases created by minors.

Well lots of possible reasons. They are not 'out' about their RL preferences. They are housebound or ill. They are elderly. They are shy. They would be discriminated against in their RL town. They are afraid of RL physical dangers attendant to this RL activity. In other words this is not always an option.



Okay but it was designed to be shared with the populace, and the people voted with their virtual feet - and minds, they created and went where they personally wanted to go.



One could argue it already is, but depends on one's personal definition.



Seems the reverse - that this virtual world comes from what already IS in people's minds. But these changes are not only about the SL "sex industry" and there would be other ways to address anything found 'objectionable' there, anyway. (Actually SL already has rules which do.)



Could again be solved with sim by sim zoning, "this sim is for residences, this sim is for businesses, this sim is for educational purposes of the university sort" like in real cities, (i.e. one sim equals one RL city block) rather than the (IMO) drastic measures being taken with this. (I have a serious question - can universities not create their own virtual world/server for their students and teach there, instead of in a borrowed world like SL?)

Also, though, it's a virtual world, is segregation really the answer there any more than in the 'real' one?

Umm it's just a wild stab in the dark but I suspect there may be the slightest possiblity of a second continent when the first is full, selling land is good money afterall and this land would actually have value without needing any moles to landscape it.

Tegg what about land already being vacated. It all costs money for LL to upkeep on their servers, right? Wouldn't building more land on top of that further drain their resources?

I sell prefab houses(PG) and run a house rental business (Adult - Mature).

In principle I'm all for people who don't want to be exposed to adult concepts like sex, bdsm, sex, violence, sex, furries, sex, vampires, sex, gorians, sex, etc.... having a place away from all of the 'minorities'.

Unfortunately when u put all these 'minorities' together I think you will discover that they far outweigh the vocal "Disneyland" folk. If you forcefully move what u consider adult, even if its 15% u will alienate over 60% of your user base. U will loose revenue, major revenue, both short and long term - and create further problems with policing content on large land masses, as well as dealing what others start to think of 'offensive'......

As a business owner, it i was forced to move, i may consider closing shop and LL loosing $200 USD in teir per month from me......... what if that was 2,000 business owners that decided the same?

Not to mention how u would actually relocate the ones that didn't close their doors.........

As suggested previously the best way is to:

1) Create a "G" area - where anyone can go - this is where u police for infringing adult content. (Perhaps the new continent u r creating for the 'adult' category)

2) Anyone wanting off the G island must go through adult verification (Premium accounts/payment details/Credit Card Details)

3) The rest of SL is by default M, ((all forms of sex) in homes, u can say FUCK in public, - just no sex in open public - allowed in secluded places however)

4) BDSM/Gore/Carnivore/Sex Clubs/Escort Areas - to be marked as Adult (New Category) - and a Blue warning to pop up when entering the area's - this popup can be disabled in the viewer settings.

(Actually the blue popup showing G, M, and Adult should be a warning, which can be turned on/off in the viewer)

I would seriously not be merging the teen grid with the main grid - the potential for abuse of children, and also children pretending to be adults would bring a legal and litigious hammer down on LL's head - DONT DO IT for everyones sake.

The above is an overview, smaller details to be worked out, but I think the above will work out the best for everyone assuming LL pursues their goal.

Cheers' Photon

“I believe that man’s natural enemy is the mega-organization
because it robs him of the vital necessity to feel responsible for his fellow-man,
restricting his possibilities to show solidarity and love
and instead turns him into an agent of power,
that for the moment may be directed against others,
but ultimately is directed against himself.”
Stig Dagerman October 5, 1923 - November 4, 1954) Swedish author

The `(double)moral disgusts me in this new "idea" from LL
Its Orwell and all others put together


"Your world "-bah!

If you are not mature enough to decide for yourself were to tp , then you really have a problem.And in the case such persons really exists-Well build vanillatown for them.

I dont agree or like a lot of things inworld- I just avoid to go there
Adult? arnt we all that in here??

Will there be some mechanism to exchange existing land for equivalent land on the new continent?

Or will adult businesses have to sell their land (probably at a loss) and buy what will likely be more expensive land on this new continent.

My reading of the blog post is that this is what LL really want us to discuss. Having come up with their new scheme, they've realised that there is a gaping black hole (namely how to do the relocations), and are hoping that we will come up with some magic solution (at the very least LL can then blame us if it doesn't work).

However, it doesn't seem to be going very well - at the moment everyone has just pointed out all the obvious problems and asked how LL is going to resolve them!

Matthew

Try as I might I remain somewhat confused as to what precisely the proposed changes are aimed at or why they are necessary. The aim appears to be to prevent fragile and sensitive souls being caused offence.

However, whether something is offensive depends entirely upon the context and the environment in which it is displayed or takes place. Nobody entering a clearly marked lap dancing bar or naturist beach can be offended by nudity there because in such an environment nudity is expected. In contrast, the sale of small quantitities of genitalia at what is ostensibly an "innocent" clothing store may well cause offence because it is unexpected and likely to shock. In other words, the fact that the predominant use of or activity at the location is innocent directly causes the offence.

As it seems to me, the problem arises because mixed use continents and locations have been permitted to grow and develop. In particular, M sims have been permitted grow and develop adjoining PG sims. Surely, so far as those locations are concerned, it is now far too late to try and impose development control. It would seem much easier to encourage the growth and development of a new exclusively PG continent upon which educators and their students and other apparently sensitive souls could wander around freely and safely admiring the architectural granduer of the competing educational establishments and the religious buildings which would no doubt soon appear. It may be a place as dull as dishwater, but that is what those folks appear to want, and so why not give it to them?

When the residents of the new continent become adventurous, they might choose to explore elsewhere in SL. That ought to present no problem as surely they could be provided with PG only viewers which prevent them from entering or seeing into a non-PG sim and prevent any non-PG results from appearing in any search they might conduct.

I regularly marvel at the creativity displayed in SL. I love the animals, the birds, the scenery, the environmental sounds, the AOs, the realistic skins and clothing and, yes, on occasions, the sex animations. I think of myself as a relatively normal adult fortunate enough to live in RL in a liberal and tolerant western democracy. I take responsibility for my actions and would never intentionally set out to offend. As matters stand, I think that those with particular sensibilities ought to take responsibility for their own actions too and in the absence of viewer restrictions should take care only to enter PG sims. By reducing their draw distance, they could go some way to ensuring they could not be offended by any adjoining M sim.

The proposals seem to me to infringe on the freedoms of the liberal majority of SL residents to "protect" what is very much a conservative and (perhaps overly) sensitive minority.

No, Jago, you are wrong. I have private land, that I rent from my friend, who owns it. It is mainland. I have a dock. Under the current "Adult Content" guidelines, I cannot lay on my dock, naked. So, if anyone thinks what they do on their own parcel will not be affected, they are dead wrong, and in for a rude awakening.

I agree with the ghetto statement. This is more like the Lindens creating SL's version of the "March of Tears" and sending all the undesirables to reservations.

What is it with the furries? Did you know that the oldest furry area in SL is PG? I didn't know that vampires are now adult stuff too.

OMG! Tijn!!! You kill me! that's a great laugh for the first thing in the morning, thank you VERY much for that.
::wipes a tear::

Look at it from a LL perpesctive. I have a big feeling that they are just going to auction off new "adult" mainland but not enough to meet the demand so prices are high and then our existing mainland which is worthless now anyways will be even more worthless because of the exodus out of the new purified Disneyland continent. Its capitalism at its finest and another way for LL to start auctioning off mainland at a premium while having plenty of cheap land for the "Universities and Businesses" they hope to attract.

Adult content always has money behind it not the other way around. Unfortunately that is IMHO why LL isnt making a new G rated area.

I like the sound of this, it will be nice to have an area for specifically adult themed stuff, seperate from other mature and PG sims.

It will allow people to continue exploring their fantasies, without putting them in the faces of other users

Yeah, this could ruin SL for me. I love being able to do whatever I want on my land. I have marked it mature, and I like to swim naked in my ocean if I want to. Will SL force me to move, and where, I picked my land because I liked it. Is there going to be an Adult police force? My first reaction is Bummer.
BT

so in our Sim we discuss books. one week it might be Mary Poppins the next Leathersex, we separate not geographically but temporally. how will you accomodate this?

We can *hope* this is what will happen. Given LL's apperant attitude towards adult oriented entertainment, my fear is, they won't. I also have to question if the new adult areas will be run on older servers. My fear is they are simply creating a way to get the adult stuff out (I know I know they certainly claim otherwise), but without actually kicking them out. Only making it such a horrible experience, they'll leave of their own accrod.

Meagan makes a great point... Many builds are tailored to the land form, surroundings, and exact parcel shape and dimensions. Unless you can reproduce those features *exactly* the owner will lose out.

Also, many people have friendships they have built up, or working relationships with neighbors in the sim and don't necessarily want to lose those.

My proposal then is to make TWO NEW REGIONS, one landmass marked adult, and one marked G/PG, and *LET US CHOOSE* whether to move or not, don't force us to move.

One question I had, that I did not see mentioned yet...

Once the migration has started, and the adult places are on the new continent, how will the policing of the new maturity standards be enforced???

Will they be based solely of abuse reports??

Will it rely on mainland residents voluntarily flagging their content??

There really seems like there is so much more to iron out with this.

LL will no doubt make a great deal selling off the new adult themed land, which no doubt will fetch a premium.
But I don't see the mass exodus you suggest from the existing mainland, most clothes, skin, hair and furniture shops etc. will most likely remain on the existing land, nudity homes with sex beds etc. will remain as they are mostly unchanged.

The difference should be a few more explicit fantasy environments moving over to the new adult themed land.
Which should allow those places to be more open and thrilling for their users.

Some practical questions for Jp Lindon

Situation:

We run a women-only meeting and sex club. It's been in operation for a little over a year and has grown to it's present size of 4960 sq meters of mature mainland over the last year by word of mouth. Traffic at the moment is between 13K and 20K. depending on time, day etc. All is genuine, no campers, and my meter says 55,000 tps in over the last 6 months - it comes out as #6 on a search for 'lesbian' and is in 125 peoples picks.

We're popular. Very popular.

We're popular because it's a good, highly tuned and tasteful build (unlike most). About 40% the surface area is social with dance balls and couches, 20% is a mall, and the remainder is a sex area. We have a large number of pose-balls and sex furniture, and they are explicit, but nothing extreme and the light bdsm items could be removed (St Andrews cross, a spanking animation and so forth). There is a select of vintage, black and white, erotica/pornography on the walls all at least 50 years old and some 19th century. Interestingly at any one time about 80% of avies are in the social area.

The build is at 600 metres, with a 100 meter diameter giant spherical prim around it. It's flagged mature. No-one finds us unless they are looking for us - it clearly says sex on the search terms.

4960 is a lot of tier, but because of the mall - L570 a week for 18 prims on account of the traffic, and donations - we cover that. We don't wish to take a full sim or some such - 4960 would be as large as we'd want to go because any bigger would spoil the ambience. We're viable, we're discreet, we're popular and we provide a service and facility that people want.

And I just checked. Out of 20 people visiting over 10 minutes or so only 1 was age verified or had payment information on file.

So questions:

Are we defined as 'adult content'? If so would removing the few light bdsm items change that?

If we're adult will we have to move? Why can't you just designate any area above, say, 2000 metres as adult? Many such places are run in skyboxes and this would be an easy, non-disruptive solution. Moving upwards would be far easier than moving location.

If we do have to move are you going to swap the land for us or do we have to sell/repurchase? 4960 is a lot of land to buy, growth to date has been out of profits, and we couldn't afford to finance an outright purchase. Selling/repurchase would loose us traffic in the transition.

Will you be offering the land tier-free for a period whilst people get validated. 95% of our visitors are not validated so traffic will not support 4960 for a good while

If we do have to move, and it is viable to do so, will you be moving the build for us? There's a lot of prims, many of the items are no copy, and rebuilding manually would take days (and mess up traffic even more). And of course we don't even have perms on the prims in the mall.

Finally: should moving the club not be viable, and on the basis of what I see so far, especially in view of the age verification ratio, it does not look likely it will be, this premium account will be cancelled as it was set up explicitly for this venture. So you'll loose tier and a premium in addition to whatever other activity we generate. How does this fit with the Lindon's policy of increasing the number of premiums? Or rather does it fit extremely well with a Lindon policy or removing adult content?

LL should state clearly what is classed as adult themed or not, so users know exactly what is allowed or not.

To let users know exactly what constitutes as explicit material.

I just highlighting the question of what exactly is 'adult'? Furies could be seen as adult (nakies & 'and abomination to god -warewolves etc') - same reason vampires could get the axe ..... its a question of what is 'adult' and what offends. I personally have no problem with either group, have friends in both groups..... but this is where censorship could take us..... and if we get taken there I will be leaving SL and LL will be the poorer (both monetarily and content wise) for it.

Cheers

Photon