Upcoming Changes for Adult Content: Answers to Questions

yep.

Where is Ursala on the map? is it on the SLURL map ? what area or by what land mass?

PER BLONDIN,
6) My question is what will determine who goes first (land swap)? How much land we hold currently or by join date?
ANSWER: The process will be first come, first served.

THIS IS TOTALLY UNBELIEVABLE AND UNACCEPTABLE!!!!!

So in other words.....If you don't have a SOLID 55,000+ sq meter lot for me ....that I am exempt and and can continue with my adult sim on mainland....until the time you have BUILT my 55,000 sq meter parcel so i can move to ursula...(THAT IS EQUAL TO IN QUALITY AND TERRAIN TO WHAT I OWN NOW).or you buy back my land????????
thats the same as my buying a Cadillac and you decide you want me to own a Ford for the same amount of money!

You had better take a real close look at what you just said...I agreed to your TOS but you have to also respect and furnish what was advertised at that date WHEN I came to SL...and what you are proposing IS NOT WHAT I PAID FOR...key word is PAID with real money that you say is meaningless...wrong!!!

Sleep well tonight Blondin because this thread just got a lot larger when sim owners see that response.

Way off to the East, far away from anything else.

The closest place to it you can go is the Arapaima Infohub.

http://slurl.com/secondlife/Arapaima/131/170/22

Hard to see how a company could show greater contempt for their long-standing and loyal customers than this.

I agree. 100%. This is BLATANT SLAP for your long term PAYING members. Yes, everyone deserves to be treated fairly, but SENIORITY AND LAND SIZE should factor in FIRST. Full Sim owners, by rights, should have first pick. Then 1/2 sim, 1/4 sim, everyone else. Otherwise you can't give everyone what they currently pay for. That one statement right there, will be, the cause of a mass exodus of paying customers.
5 years of paying for land, a full sim for the last 3 years... and you FORCE me to move... and can't guarantee i will get a full single sim.. and i want one, that preferably, has water on at least ONE side...and is NOT intersected by all the..*protected land and roads*. I pay for a FULL SIM.
This needs SERIOUS consideration.

As per the petition that will be online this weekend:

We, the undersigned, as residents of SL, would like to submit this petition as a suggestion for the moving/swapping of mainland parcels to the new Ursula continent.
We ask LL to thoughtfully consider the following:

1. It has been stated that 9 days will be allowed move. It is entirely unfeasible. There are many full sim owners that simply can not pack up and move a full or even ½ sim in that allotted time. We propose a changed time limit of 30 days minimum, for anyone owning more than 2048 land. The original 9 days could be applied to anyone owning less than this amount. This allows existing businesses to still remain in business while the new location is being built and set up.

2. It has also been stated that LL will not charge a *duel* land tier while the swap is underway. While this is acceptable, there is also the time that we, current paying residents of SL, have to invest to rebuild/move. In compensation for this time lost, we respectfully request one months land tier credit, to compensate for our time, and loss of business this move will incur.

3. In consideration of the land swap, all group owned land choice should be given to the current group owner, or top contributor of donated land in the group.

We are currently looking for acceptable compromises in this issue, and believe that the above listed would go a long way towards improving customer/LL relations, and make this move as painless easy as possible, with minimal impact to LL and the residents that have contributed real time, and real money, into making SL “Our World, Our Imagination”.

How about considering what your customers want.. and paying attention for a change?

~Brie

May I ask how could anyone ever know if the identity info had been compromised?

If it is credit card info, then you would know someone used it for a purchase from you account's monthly statement.

But if it is identity info, and sold it in the black market and use it for age-verification by the underage kids, how would you ever know?

If the same identity info is used by the criminals to create fake passport and fake ID using your name, would you ever know?

I'm afraid by the time you found out that identity is misused is when someone committed a crime, and you were implicated in the crime, and be thrown into prison because of that. That is exactly what happened when the US Government detained a US citizen not too long ago and put the guy in jail, treated him as a terrorist due to mistaken stolen identity because they traced the terrorist activity by a stolen credit card under the poor guy's name.

Thanks Milla I got a good look at it copying the slurl from the safe info hub LOL.

I was worried for nothing.. that I would want the try and get in on the swap (as My main holds land that I bought in Mature for the reasons most say so I could do what I wanted weather it be sex or nothing at all. and I do sell some BDSM stuff, and other sexual related prims.. that can all go away I don't make enough to worry about it)

As I look at the 240 sims in this new mass I see roads separating each sim on all sides (on about 1/2 the mass. (nice river dam and lake though) as well as these LL builds that just scream Bay City/Nautilus at me. \\

My Question is, is all this going to remain? is there really a need or want to this look? I don't care much for it. I like roads my land has a Linden Road running along one side of it. this almost looks like its going to be set up just like Bay City. and that sucks!

I think this is going to all go to land flippers and its going to be a mess. I guess I will wait and see at the open house and watch. but if this is it how will a sim owner own a full sim? in the tree area? out on open water?

I think the resoning behind this is the same as it was for Nautilus.. LL made a pretty penny off of Bay City and they think thats what we all want. I tend to disagree and think they just hope they will make tons of money as those that don't get a swap want land there and it gets added and sold at auction for insane prices.

Waiting and watching. may just close up and go basic with my and the partners Premium accounts . Cant do what we want on our Mature land and wont get the swap (I am sure we are not "smutty" enough or prominent enough to be allowed (and heck I would rather the people who really need the land to survive get it (but I don't think they will either)

very sad .. very very sad. not anything like it was in early 06 in SL is it

I am Adult and so is my $40USD tier a month for the past 3.5 years

So I see. And an issue as to why a non-Linden group on a non-Linden sponsored website would have to try to manage what can really be known about this thing so people can ask the intelligent hard questions, and keep asking and asking until Linden comes clean, as it were. Or such a website could make a clear, reasonable approach to having Open Source Grid and/ or Open Life Grid as the only reasonable alternative.



What you are saying may be quite true enough. It would be very useful to have source quotations on a website that is not under Linden control both to archive the mess Linden appears to be making as well as source quote where possible. I'm not so concerned over who's dropping the ball. I'm quite happy to see all ball-droppers exposed and submitted for well published and fair ridicule, whatever position on the issue they may take.



It is true land speculation is not against the rules. This is also why in such a mess as this, Open Source Grid and Open Life Grid solutions make much more sense in the long haul than the Linden Grid does. What I put on my web site is dictated by the Acceptable Use Policy (AUP) of the server, and if I really wish to push the issue (and I had the money) I could simply pay for a business line and write my own damned AUP. So long as Linden is the only 'game' under consideration, Linden is the obvious attack point for whomever has an axe to grind. If I publish something on my web page, people can attack me. But it's going to be a real bear to attack me and several thousand, ten thousand or more people each on their own server... the reason 'Peer-to-Peer' networks are so vilified. How do you attack a cloud? What good is it to swat at fog?



I wouldn't disagree with the assessment. I simply would wish to see as much third party documentation on the specifics as possible in hopes that people could discuss and assess facts.



Would it not make sense to then hold the discussion independent of the Lindens? The whole discussion really boils down to money. I'm spending $31 USD/ month. Can I get the same or better entertainment value sinking my $31/ month into a non-Linden project? Would it make sense to show how the concerns that people have about the adult content issue are better served by non-Linden alternatives? Or if the alternatives are so unsuitable and we are forced to work with Linden, how can we as a group call them to task on specifics as well as voice specific concerns on source referenced and documented statements?

Hell, if it's suitable for us to 'get some mad on', let's bring it. But let's do this in a way meets the 'no baloney' standard.

Wait a sec. Are you saying that even though I have been paying Linden Lab about $300 per month in tier for almost three years, I can be blocked out of a sim because I don't (in my case, can't because I'm a Canadian/US citizen living in the UK) verify my age via Aristotle? Tell me that I misread things. Be very, very, very careful and clear with your answer.

I'm sure Linden just wants the money, and the big money is to be found in convincing businesses to 'set up shop' on the Main Grid. It is rather annoying to me Linden took the path they did for creating the Second Life server as opposed to the route Apache took: "Here is our software, all the source, everything. Do as you will to no harm." Some businesses compete against Apache, but it's really freakin' hard to compete against 'free to play with'. It's also really freakin' hard to manage and maintain a high volume web server, which is how some places make a good bit of money. Second Life *could* have been the 'Apache Server' of 3D worlds, but they didn't take that route.

How do you resolve all this adult content stuff when you view the web? When you let your kids do stuff on the web? You sure as hell don't sue Apache for their server software over it, whatever you do.

Meh... Linden is going to follow where they think the money is. I do not believe that 'following the money' is a bad plan, though I might disagree with where they think the money is. But if people on this message thread want a club to beat Linden over the head, that club is going to have to be made out of gold bars. You don't strike gold bars out of hysteria, unless you are an MLM for homeopathy or write books on how to get rich.

Real knowledge is an expensive investment. How can we set up a savings account in this situation?

I'm still worried about this only people in the usa and canada can be age variefied, will people from europe be able to get into adult areas on PIOF alone or is there another way we will have to verify. Or are we being forgotten about and will suddenly find we can't go where we want because LL says we can't be verified?

I am old enough to make my own decisions thank you if given the opportunity to do so, so please LL don't forget the europeans.

I mean they keep saying PIOF is enough to allow access to adult land, I only hope this is the case and I know I keep repeating this but it is a worry as I really do enjoy my time on SL and yes I do spend some time in adult areas and would like to continue to do so and ahve the freedom to do what I like in SL. If not then theres no real point in staying in a nanny state.

As to why it would make good sense for a third party to archive and source document where possible these things. As to why I hoped someone else was already doing it so I could contribute instead of offering myself as a target. I'm still hoping against hope someone else will come forward to serve as a reasonable target for the general malice this stuff dredges up.

I've been around a long time and what I see is....SL and us both have a contract...I pay $195usd faithfully per month for less than a whole sim...I have kept my side of the bargain...but what I see is a breach of contract by LL and SL...they provide a service we pay dearly for and now they have changed all the rules midstream....everyone says we only have two recourses...go along with what they do and say or quit....I dont think so.

I believe we should have another place to discuss this outside of SL....if anyone knows of any other threads I would be glad to have it...out of earshot and eyesight.

I can be IMed inworld with the info...thanks

Who controls the servers, controls the service. The US Government would have no problem at all simply walking in and seizing the hardware as criminal evidence. Just takes someone in government with an axe to grind and a well-fit corncob.

What exactly does that mean?

"Has spend real $$$ AND Aristotle"

or

"Has spend real $$$ OR Aristotle"

?

That's the way I read it too, but... people can be blocked out of a sim for any reason at all right now, up to and including because the sim owner doesn't like the color of our socks. Heck, right now a sim owner can ban all people who *did* submit payment info, for the truly rebellious stick-it-to-the-man hippie types

But this doesn't have anything to do with sims marked as Adult; those will apparently accept pretty much any kind of payment as proof enough. (Whether that makes sense is another question entirely.)

Europeans will be allowed in some adult places but not in others, the ones that only want PIOF proof will let us in, the ones that want age and PIOF proof wont let europeans in, I really hope this is not the case though and they either allow europeans to get age verified properly or this for now until they get a solution wont apply to us, the age part that is not the rest.

I guess one easy way around this would be to ahve a tickbox saying allow verified people from outside of the US.

It's late. I'm tired. Thank you for clearing this up for me. All I can say is that if someone blocks me for being female or not using Aristotle, I will will gladly take my business elsewhere.

Almost no one uses the age verification system now, I doubt that will change.

So not only are LL isolating and annoying the adult and mature communities, they are willing to pretty much ban their none american customers from certain areas simply because they choose to use an age verification system that excludes anyone else. I mean what about the japanese or chinese players not just the europeans bah, yes im getting annoyed, I hope some good answers come from this.

Sorry to go on so much people, now I shall lie in a dark place and have a little lie down and a glass or ten of wine.

Edit: Oops didnt see your answer Milla sorry, well that is a little reassuring, it seems everyone is right though LL are really not thinking things through. Unless they are but at the moment its all up in the air.

...if I say nothing now.

I took a look at opensim / realXtend. I think LL's golden goose may be cooked. Interesting that they would be trying to implement major changes to current land ownership and inworld activities at precisely the time that alternatives are arriving. I see that the opensim folks are implementing currency systems as well. So, if I can run my own equipment, connection, sim(s), and cash out thru paypal just like I do now without having to pay tier fees to anyone, why would any of us need LL or SL? This is a very interesting business move on LL's part and will be fun to watch over the next few months.

It isn't hard to do ..I have my own standalone sim up and running now...soon I will probably connect to Opensim..there are video tutorials from Liferain.com makes it very easy

This isn't what I was asking Blondin...

I said...




I'm not talking about images - with my example, let's just say the entire 'Pick' (as in Profile Pick) is described in accordance with the ToS - i.e. PG imagery AND language - BUT the destination is a PRIVATE (as much as anywhere can be) Mature Mainland residence (unadvertised in Search, Classifieds, Events OR Land Description) - BUT the destination has sex beds and hardcore pornography on the walls - WILL THE DESTINATION BE CONSIDERED ADULT CONTENT?

For example, my friends may add my home to their Picks - even if worded PG etc., will the fact that more than two Residents have sex there make this an adult content location?


(As a related aside, whilst digging deeper into the thread, I did find this answer to a similar question - which isn't what I was meaning either, but raises an interesting issue - that even when relocated to Ursula, Land Descriptions will still need to be PG worded? I may be missing something, but won't this mean having an 'adult' Pick - determined by the Land Description of a location - be restricted? I'm confused)


Won't this result in a less 'predictable experience' for some Residents - if they can't tell what a location is likely to contain? And doesn't it make a mockery of the changes to Search, if one one hand you can include 'adult' wording after the policy change (for Ursula locations), BUT that same text appearing in a Profile Pick (which is what happens when you add a New Pick) will result in a breach of the ToS?

Ah, maybe you're planning on disabling the ability to add Picks from Ursula locations in Profiles (unless I've missed somewhere that the People tab in Search is also going to be updated to allow filtering?)

(P.S. where did the old first wave of threads on this subject in the forum disappear to? I was still reading those - the ones which were separated into different subjects re. the policy change?)

Speaking as a newbie to SL who does not like mucking up community standards, I think sandboxes are definately needed on Ursula. Even if I am opening something not labelled as adult, I am shy about opening things or trying some things even on a mature rated sim, 'just in case', especially in the case of freebies. As offensive as things might get to some on an adult sandbox, at least they would be more likely be considered 'ok' to try there, and people would not have to worry as much about sandbox decency rules.

This is nowhere as important a thing as making sure everything else about all this happens as smoothly and amicably as possible, but still should be done.