Upcoming Changes for Adult Content: Main Forum Thread

No I don't get you because you change your tune Comprehendi, to**er

REally?

Well I suspect you have not been checking the online stats and checking where all these people are. Let me help you:

On a average sl day, about 5% of the users are in gor at any given time
another about 10% are in BDSM/Fetish/Etc
25% aprox. are in sex related areas. Free sex rooms, sex clubs, stripper etc.

Well we just accounted for about 40% of the users.

Add in the rest of the adult areas and your talking about well over 50% of the average online daily traffic.

Lets not even start talking LIndens because then your up to over 60% of the lindens trading hands.

QFT

Can you tell me where and how you arrived at these percentages of what SL people are doing. and what about the BOTs I would love to see the official stats that you are quoting as that would help with our marketing here

This!

Right now, we are a fairly homogeneous "society" who present somewhat of a moving target to direct marketers. Once you start categorizing people and their activities - make no mistake about it, that's what this whole adult continent idea really is - then you present hard, static targets to marketers. Once this adult continent is set up and populated, there will be a whole bevy of real-world porn studios setting up shop there, since the continent will be viewed as the officially-sanctioned place for such activity. And they will aggressively direct-market their "products" to everyone who works or has the misfortune of living on this continent.

Further, since practically everyone living on this continent will have credit card information on file, LL's payment database will suddenly become *extremely* valuable - even to the point of making it a direct target for data miners and hackers.

I can in ims hun, and have.

The last sentence is telling!

What is next?

What if they ban Gorean RP?
What if they ban child like avatars?

Where does it end ? how far does LL want to dilute their own product?


Again like is i stated in another post....this effects more SL players than any of the previous policy changes.

Show me real figures not what you guessed, I have stated already I guess about 80% of the users have some sort of interaction with what could loosely be termed adult related stuff, thats why I think LL are only considering moving the sex clubs and porno video or pictures by their estimate of 2-4%, their estimate not mine.

Lindens anyone buys for SL, sure LL take a small cut, as they do now in SLX purchases etc. but even Rene agreed the lions share of profit comes from tier payed by residents.

You think they are all going to get up and leave because of this move? sure some will, but the vast majority will take it on the chin, whether they like it or not and get verified if they want to visit adult clubs, or carry on in their own virtual homes as they do now, because as someone else said, right here right now there is no better alternative to SL.

Thank you, allow one book in the library to be taken out and burned may as well burn down the library.

I totally agree with you where will it end but at the end of the day its LL company and i assume they can do what they want with it including running it into the ground if that is there wish. However i do not think as Toy has said they "want to harm SL" but in the grand scheme of things maybe eventually they want things for SL that we do not even know about. But if ever it gets to the stage it becomes not viable for us to be here then we will just retain our avies here to meet friends as this the best chat program available to day and i love the cute avatars

Got your IMs thx and fair enough

Maybe they will open up a Farenheit 451 sim.

I never said LL will be impacted by a loss of 2-4% of adult business related land tiers......you brought that up!. This is getting boring...let me post to whom i was replying and why....then you might understand this time around!!




to which i replied




Where the "2-4%" came from ....god knows, because i can't see it in either of those 2 posts, but presumely you felt you needed to butt in without following the paper trail!

I would have thought the part saying "25-30k" SIMs would imply the "Whole Grid". I mean most people here would know it represents the size of the whole Grid and not the 2-4% you were referring to!

They are not talking of burning the books as you put it they just want to move them to a new section.

There is far to much hysteria being whiped up by this.

Did any of the other policies the lindens carried out actually kill SL?

No

Did people get hurt?

Yes, some were put out of business completely.

But people still remain here even in times of rl instability, because there is nothing available yet to match, let alone beat SL, in desirability for its users.

The average joe logging into SL couldn't give a gnat's chuff, where the adult stuff is they will seek it out and use it as they wish, or leave it alone.
In much the same way they do now.

In the end the after seperation the mainland will look better, so it is time to do it now, before opensim catches up.

Neptune, I am struggling to understand how you manage to keep missing the point that several people have made to you. These changes do not just involve adult businesses.

Adult business brings RL money into SL. Significant numbers of residents make money through that business which they then spend inworld in non-adult businesses. If adult industry in SL contracts, as LL intend it to by introducing these changes which have the effect of separating the adult industry from a large part (ie. the non age verified and no PIOF) userbase, the amount of money spent in other SL businesses will contract. A significant number of businesses (both adult and non-adult) will not survive these changes. The choice of products available to all of us will reduce.

It really is no answer to say "I'm alright Jack. I can still have a jump on my sexbed whenever the fancy takes". The consequences of this for SL commerce are very significant and we should all be concerned.

Sorry if you want to pay me for them, as i did for them, sure.



lol your kidding right. Lindens get a fee on all lindens bought. Lindens get a percent on all lindens sold. Lindens get about 4 percent on all slx sales. Lindens get even more when Avatars leave with lindens in the acocunt which is many.

lol OpenSim catch up!. None of those micky mouse operations will ever catch up....they could never scale to SL.

Anyone that wants to match LL & SL, will need to have the technology, the resources and the funds to do it....none of the existing Open "Garage" operations stack up!

It wont kill SL, I agree with you there. I further agree that this will put several folks out of business, where we dont agree is that I am certain it will not just be adult ones.

One of the business that might not survive (although I'm doing my best to make sure it does) is mine. Just as your NIMBY attitude decides where your views are slanted on this issue, so my business concerns decide where mine lean. Its obvious why you dont agree with a lot of the posters here.

Since we cannot agree, lets just agree to disagree. LL will do what they want anyway.

Spot on!
Its like when the Gambling ban kicked in and my sales for the preceding months dropped 25% month on month......at first i couldn't understand it..initially I was "I'm alright Jack" and this couldn't possibly hurt me!
I rarely gambled, i didn't create & sell any Gambling related products......."I'm alright Jack"...or so I thought! I was very wrong indeed!

Then i began to learn the way SL economies worked and how they are very much intertwined with another.

Eg..a downturn in the land market or lack of movement.....also hurts the Prefab companies and furniture companies, the landscaping companies and so on

Oh undoubtedly, although I believe a lot of the gambling money stayed in gambling circles, it obviously had other areas where the flow would be effected.

This is bigger, this is mainland rentals, estate rentals, fashion, building, scripting, this is the whole kit and kaboodle.

Well the casinos sold land, sold sims, deleted inventory....more importantly cashed out all their money......the money supply that would have been there for gamblers. So the 2 way cashflow traffic of casino and gambler stopped....not only casino packed up and went, but also those that came specifically for the gambling. Of course this would not have the same sort of following as those logging in for Pixel sex......but its still made a dent at the time.


I agree this is potentially far bigger!

Your opinion is it doesn't only affect adult business, till it happens you don't know, I know adult business brings money into SL, I know they are likely to spend their money on non adult business.

The adult business is unlikely to contract in the long term because of any move, this is where we disagree, sure a few will go under, or just give up for one reason or another but any highly profitable business will remain, why would they throw away their cash cow?
non verified users who visit SL purely for its adult areas currently will just register a credit card so they can continue to use them.

Example. I log into SL when I am feeling horny to cyber with a woman go to my favorite free sex area say, then one time I log into SL and the free sex place has moved now I need to prove my age to enter, did I become less horny?
No
So I have a look to see how I register my age and find I just need to put my credit card details on my account nothing more, ok I am not very happy about this but I am still horny.
So I think about it for a minute maybe decide to go to a porn site instead, but its not the same, I can't talk to the girl and get her to use specific animations only watch a pre recorded video.
So I think about a porn video link but this is going to cost me and my wife might get to find out I payed for this service.
So I look at SL again yes I could put my card details on the account and have my fun again.
What do you think I am going to do?

Card out mate thats my guess.

Will the services on offer shrink, choices be diluted I doubt it, if anything I reckon in a adult area where competition is fierce businesses are more likely to raise their game.

So in the long term I see a rosie future, but I may be wrong.

And I have nothing to loose either, with my current SL usage, because as the saying goes "I am alright Jack"

You get my point now

No not that interested.
I only care how many actually will be affected and quite frankly I don't believe anyone has a clue.



Yes and they get 100% of all their tier payments, it might cost them a little bit but people are unlikely to stop buying lindens, selling lindens etc.

New users age varifying with credit cards might actually start spending a liitle extra in the long term, once they have gone to the trouble of registering a credit card.

Who knows?

Well then even less to be worried about then, so stop whining.

I am amazed at how so many are arguing over economic impact, social impact, environmental impact and the future of this world when the large issue in my eyes is ethics. Cheating a population who paid real money, time, heart and soul into an effort under the (apparently) mistaken assumption of an open expression 'Mature' world, only to find that term being redefined under their feet, is wrong.

It is morally wrong. Beyond business...beyond finance...beyond statistics.

People are not statistics, despite what so many out there seem to say.
They have hearts and souls, they work and they love and they cry.
They invest their beings into this.

If I hear one more person write 'yes, some will get hurt or leave....but things will get back to normal...', then I hope that person realizes they are dismissing the importance of people, their time and their hopes and dreams.

Forget about the money, the land, the inconveniences and the eyesores of things some may not agree with, or what is sex and what is not sex....Remember what is right...and what is wrong

And that can be summed up as the difference in the way you treat others.
- GINA

Hi Kalderi,

I doubt that it's possible to satisfy your first concern. In some cultures adult means showing a woman's face uncovered outside of her home. In New Guinea full nudity is perfectly acceptable as long as men wear a 2 foot long sheath on their privates. There is no workable or unambiguous definition for "adult" even within in a single country or culture, so how is it possible that SL will find it for a global community like SL. In the end it will come down to someone or some small group making an arbitrary and personal judement and imposing their beliefs on all others.

Your second concern is equally difficult to satisfy equitably. I have three business on one piece of land which I have subdivided into three plots. One is a strictly G-rated photo gallery, the other is a G-Rated gadget store, and the last sells skins and fashions. All are together on a mature sim. I am just starting out and my business is tiny, and I rely on the fact that traffic from each business feeds the others.

But XStreet thinks my skins are "mature", and my ads do depict the skins and shapes that I sell unclothed. What happens now? Does the same standard apply in SL? If ads are Ok that's great! What about shops that use skin models? Tattoo models? Is topless Ok? Topless is permitted on many famous beaches in RL, in "civilized" countries. Oh, but there are real nude beaches in those countries too, aren't there? People are even allowed to bicycle nude in Seattle WA. (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,452086,00.html) Is Seattle an "Adult" city? How do you draw a line when there is no line?

And what happens to my little compound? I lose my photo gallery clients because they can no longer visit mature sims without some sort of certification? I move my other stores away from my fashion store and lose the traffic synergies? I move my whole compound to a PG sim and stop selling skins? My skins are my best sellers! Do I dress the skins in my ads so buyers can't see what they are getting? Then how do I compete with skin sellers in mature sims???

And why would I do any of this? I have never had a vistor complain that they were offended by skin sales. But it's somebody's idea of "mature" so I may have to?

Of course, my situation is just an example, and I doubt that it is the best one. My point is that I don't think SL will benefit in any meaningful way from the planned changes around "adult" content. If LL has time on their hands to spend on disruptive and meaningless change, I'd suggest they spend it trying to keep my hang glider from disappearing (and my viewer from locking up) when I cross sim boundaries and my hair from disintegrating when I teleport. That would make a material and positive difference in this users experience.

Sandi