Jack - Why allow child avatars on Zindra?

Zindra: An Update
Publié par Jack Linden en marche 26 juin 2009 10:29:27
Last Monday the new adult continent known as Zindra was officially opened to the public. After a week of comments and feedback, we'd like to take this opportunity to update the community to some small changes we hope will make the transition from the mainland and the migration to Zindra a bit easier. An updated map of Zindra to showcase the addition of double primed areas has been attached.

1) How do I claim a plot if nothing is parceled? The original idea behind keeping a majority of Zindra unparceled was to allow more freedom for the Residents in their ability to request land. We realize now though that a lack of parcel boundaries has made this task incredibly difficult. In an effort to provide a bit more guidance, the Department of Public Works will be hard at work the next few days carving Zindra into smaller, more recognizable plots. Please, take some time and re-visit the landmarks you've identified for the migration as they may have changed slightly due to the new parceling. You can view property lines by selecting View > Property Lines. After a brief pause you should see land boundaries shown in red.


2) Why is all the waterfront protected land? The DPW have been actively patrolling the coast line and creating more parcels which will include beach and water.


3) What's the status of X parcel, or Y piece of land? IM Michael Linden, he can adjust parcel tags for clarity. The parcels labelled Special Ocean, Special Water, etc. are just late additions to the land available for Residents.


4) Why can't we terraform the land? In order to protect some of the builds and Linden land, terraforming and join/subdivide will not be allowed in the city areas. However, the rural regions will have the usual +/- 4m allowance as well as the ability to join and subdivide land.

5) Is there enough Zindra to go around? Yes! There is plenty of land that is still offline. If we need to bring it up then it will not be a problem.


6) When will the tickets be available? The ticketing process will open on Monday, the 29th at 10am. They will remain open for 3 weeks, closing July 20th at 10am.


7) When will I hear back from Linden about my ticket to move? We ask that Residents be patient as we are expecting a flood of requests. Submitting a ticket to ask when the first ticket will be addressed will only prolong the process as it increases the support load.


I own a large parcel and/or have a bunch of stuff on my parcel that I don't own but need to have with me in my new location. We have an answer for you! If you are willing to move to a Private Region (not part of the Mainland) we can essentially peel your parcel (terraforming and all) off of the current mainland region it calls home and put it on a brand new Private Region (note that this won't work for moves to Zindra, as those regions exist and are terraformed as a whole). If your parcel is larger than 16,384 m^2, you can request movement to a Private Region instead. We will discount the Private Region setup fee (normally US$1,000) based on the amount of land you own. For example, if you have 32,768 m^2, you would pay $500 for the setup fee. If you have 49,152 m^2, you would pay $250 for the set-up fee. The regular monthly land fees of $295 will be charged 30 days after the move. There will be a separate ticket type specifically to request this sort of move.


9) Are child avatars allowed on Adult land? Child avatars are allowed on adult land as long as they are account verified like any other Resident. Those choosing to represent themselves with a child avatar do not represent a minor as the account holder. Not all adult land is going to be hosting adult content either. There is plenty of protected land on Zindra that will technically be adult but safe in terms of content. This however does not change any prior policies regarding child avatars. Sexual ageplay is not allowed anywhere on the grid, regardless of rating.

This last bit is shocking Jack. What is wrong with Linden Lab allowing depictions of children in adult areas? We all assumed that Zindra was supposed to be the one last place that adults who RP as adults could go without fear or worry or concern of a child avatar. There is now only one place on mainland that adult content is allowed and that is Zindra, yet Linden Lab is allowing child avatars there?!

What about nudity and sexual acts in open public areas of Zindra? Allowed or not?

Can you please just explain to us why or why is Linden Lab giving child avatars so many rights over common sense? I also still do not understand why any adult would ever want to RP as a child in an adult environment. I hate to keep repeating myself but why allow them that? Am I the only one that finds this sick? Please help us to understand this madness, Jack.

What kind of message is Linden Lab trying to send to us? Why is it now that child avatars have free reign over the entire grid? What about the ageplay rules? What about RL laws concerning depicting children in an adult type environment? What about what the majority of your own residents want?

Why would parts of Zindra have non adult ratings when there is the entire mainland?

What about these rules?

Participation by Residents in lewd or sexual acts in which one or more of the avatars appears to represent minors (or the depiction of such acts in images, video, textures, or text) is a violation of the Community Standards.
Promoting or catering to such behavior or representations violates our Community Standards. For instance, the placement of avatars appearing to represent minors in proximity to "sex beds" or other sexualized graphics, objects, or scripts would violate our Community Standards, as would the placement of sexualized "pose balls" or other content in areas depicting playgrounds or children's spaces.
The graphic depiction of children in a sexual or lewd manner violates our Community Standards.

Does Linden Lab have a clue how this is not only a slap in the face to the adult community but how it makes them look to the rest of the world? I wonder if they have recently read what's going on in Australia concerning filters, etc.

http://www.inquisitr.com/27288/confirmed-second-life-online-adult-games-to-banned-outright-in-australia/


Thanks Jack..

"Not all adult land is going to be hosting adult content either. There is plenty of protected land on Zindra that will technically be adult but safe in terms of content." << That's why. (^_^)

here we go again...

Child avatars on Zindra or adult verified only flagged parcels are obviously adults.

Jack says the ban on age play stands. Which is rather dumb if child av's can go into an adult environment because LL knows they are 'adult verified'.

No i do not support age play (as i have said in prior posts on the issue). I just dislike this weird dance around the issue that LL does.

A child avatar can be in a porn hall because they are adult verified and assumed to be adult.

However, a child avatar can not have sex in the above mentioned porn hall because they are in a child avatar even though they are a verified adult.

That is just dumb. I would rather not see child avatars having sex or dancing nude and raucously with nude adults. But i would rather see a logical execution of the rules even if it is offensive to my personal tastes and beliefs than see this illogical application of rules against child avatars who are verified adults and what they can or cannot do on the grid.

It does not make sense and it does not fit, and when it does not fit? You must acquit! (Poor dead Johny Cochran!).

Sorry, but I guess you overread all the stuff about the already existing rules on sexual ageplay. They will stay in tact, so there won't be kid avatars having sex or dancing nude and raucously with nude adults. LL acknowledges what many said already: Zindra or other adult flagged regions won't be a giant fuckfest, there will be lots of non-adult content, and LL acknowledges that there is no reason to ban kid avatars from making use of *this*.

What?

Did you read what was posted in this thread?

I spoke of specifically items posted in this thread.

What are you referring to?

My post is a direct reply to this from the blog:



So what did i 'over read' when i said that child avatars can be seen on zindra in a porn hall but not sexxing in the porn hall?

And the comment i made about child avatars dancing nude with adult avatars is a reference to a topic in this forum a few weeks ago where such activity was mentioned.

What are you referring to?

I see it as this:

Kid AVs can see teh pr0nz because no RL kids are involved. (^_^)

Kid AVs can’t be seen in teh pr0nz because the depictions impact the economic potential of SL when presented to the public at large and may affect the ability for SL to be accessed in some foreign countries. (^_^)y

Maybe I misunderstood you, but as I understand what you wrote, you think the newest clarification that kid avatars are allowed on Zindra and other adult flagged regions is dumb. In my eyes, it isn't. It clearly is stated that the only forbidden thing is participation in adult activities.

A good clarification, and - also very interesting - this time the correct term for the forbidden stuff was used: "sexual ageplay" instead of the up to now usually used much too broad and therefore wrong term "ageplay".

Good for you OP. This is an important issue.




This thread will get locked like the others. LL wants this issue to go away.

Not at all...I think it is fine that child avatars are allowed on Zindra, and around adult activities.

I just find it rather illogical that they say child avatars are allowed there because they are 'verified adults', thus acknowledging that adults are in control of the avatar, but still not allowed to engage in sexual activities because they are child avatars, even though LL recognizes them as being adults. This is incongruent. But if i recall, i suppose it is an external legal issue beyond LL's control that says virtual depictions of children in sexual acts is illegal? Or is that currently being challenged?

Anyways...The entire matter is a circus affair.

In Before The Lock

Don't forget to add to your campaign the banning of underage weasel, robot, potplant and kitchen appliance avatars from adult land.
And please JIRA an automatic detect/eject system for such avartars while you're at it.

If only some people would check their intolerance at the door, we wouldn't have threads like this.

Oh... IBTL!

To the OP:

It's nice to see you are still reactionary and incapable of seeing the truth staring you in the face.

Child avatars are not allowed in any situations that are sexually explicit. Please allow me to say that again. Child avatars are not allowed in any situations that are sexually explicit. None. Nunca. Nein. Verboten.

Child avatars are, however, allowed in non-sexual situations on Zindra, if the actual people behind the keyboards are adults. Same as your avatar is allowed there if you are in fact adult yourself.

There are many areas where sexual situations on Zindra are forbidden today, will be forbidden tomorrow, and will remain forbidden when all the tickets have been processed and those who are moving to Zindra have done so. Therefore the real danger is not the child avatars at all. It's the avatars that are not child avatars. Should some idiot bring a child avatar onto a property where they are forbidden to be, of course they'll be harshly dealt with. I don't see a single responsible adult with a child avatar who actually believes they will be allowed to bring their avatars onto those properties, though.

However, there are plenty of irresponsible adults with avatars that are not child avatars, who are already advocating engaging in behavior which is quite unwarranted for the locations where they propose doing so, in a deliberate effort to entrap child avatars. These people are the real danger. You as the thinking adult you claim to be, should be speaking out against these people. Why aren't you? Perhaps you support their plans to put all of SL in danger through their attempts to entrap child avatars?

Yep, that's about the length and breadth of it. Sexual ageplayers aren't a even legal issue in Uncle Sam's jurisdiction, as far as I can tell from other posts, but they are in Europe and possibly other parts of the world. I guess it's fair to say they are bad PR for Linden Labs wherever you happen to log on from.

And I agree that the rules against ageplayers are illogical given that we are all adults in the first place but it's my opinion that if the Lindens want to go down that road then they ought to be a little more consistent and keep all forms of ageplay away from 'Adult'.

Another couple of years and they'll have to make a 'XXX' continent because 'Adult' will just be the new 'Mature' and what will be next if they still don't straighten their ideas out? A 'Hardcore' continent after that?

Kid toons are still not allowed in a "porn hall" whether it's in Zindra or not.

hush, you. how else is all the disinformation going to spread?!?!

Needle sharing and unsafe sex.

It will if I have anything to do with it

LMAO

Oh! O.k. Well that shows how much i follow this issue.

I personally do not get the child a.v. thing and wanting to be around anything even remotely sexual, or even dressing sexually appealing as a child a.v. (*shudders*).

Being adult verified should really put an end to all this nonsense.

Instead it seems to have created more confusion for some of us.

Not all (or even most) people who have kid toons play them around "anything even remotely sexual" or "dress sexually appealing". Most of them have the same reaction as you to that kind of thing.

That's a completely separate issue from whether they're allowed to visit non-sexual areas that happen to be in an adult-rated sim, or even play out Grimm or Dickensian storylines in a violent Fantasy, Victorian or Cyberpunk sim.

I think a lot of it stems from the people who see the following text:

"Child avatars are allowed on adult land as long as they are account verified like any other Resident."

And read:

"Child avatars are allowed *to leash themselves to slaves while ARing people with sex beds in order to gain access to the beds themselves because we all know that's what they want to do in order to make pornography that would get all of Second Life shut down simply to explore their perverted wants* on adult land *because we all know that adult land will be a 100% F**k fest down to the last pixel and even the pixels will have pornography on them so it's undeniable that Adult means sex 100% of the time so if you teleport to Zindra without being prepared for instant sex you should anticipate an immediate ban since you're violating the Adult parcel rules* as long as they are account verified like any other Resident."

Wasn't that fun, boys and girls? (^_^)

In fact... A few people have given examples of addendum text in quotes in addition to refusing to state their references when they attempt to "drop bombs" on the discussion. (=_=)

Much ado about nothing. (^_^)y

Linden Lab will continue to post ambiguous, conflicting nonsense and wait to see what happens - then scramble the words up and re-post it again. CYA.

Exactly. You all know that is the knee-jerk reaction to hearing Adult Content and Child Avatar in the same sentence. Explaining why you all can and want to go to Zindra does not seem to be putting these folks at ease. Yet you soldier on mocking the concern that surfaced after the publicized visit of a child avatar to Zindra. Maybe there could emerge someone from the child avatar community that can speak on this issue with some sensitivity toward the put-upon Adult Community. Since you would rather make mocking remarks and fan the flame -obviously this person is not you.