As You Like It - Men Becoming Women

Well, it happened once, to me, and I'm not even in a female avatar.

Girls pretending to be girls are probably better off without that, too.

Avawyn... I don't even have an avatar that's the same *species* as me. Some aren't even part of the same taxonomical *kingdom*, and don't *have* gender. If you think playing a character of the opposite sex is a little odd... you're coming from a position I can't even visualize.

Whoa, whoa, whoa... are you claiming that guys playing females are doing it *because* they want to date guys who think they're females? What if they're celibate in SL? What if they haven't even got an "explicit" skin, because they're not interested in bumping pixels? You'd still demand that they prove they're female before you'd even associate with them?

don't you want to be happy?.

I don't understand why you need to talk about such dark, depressing and provacative subjects all the time. and when people inevitably argue over your controversial subject you show up at the end of the thread wagging your finger in disapproval.

It wouldn't be so bad, but this is a virtual world forum. Ya know, a place where people come to have fun and get away from real world issues. But oh no, here's Jig to remind everybody about bullying, domestic violence and self loathing.

"YAY! Jig's here!. Happy happy! Joy joy!"



like wtf are you on?

..cos it sure aint prozac!

I can understand where poeple are coming from who have a hard time with guys going around as the opposite gender on SL, where I come from this would be the general line of thinking too. I would have thought the whole SL thing was king of wierd myself if I hadn't tried it, but I don't want to go around as myself on here it would be too boring. I've already done that, tried to make my av look like myself, got some clothes like the ones I would normally wear, try to build some stuff, ok I'm done and have scarcely found a single person to talk to this way. Maybe for some people they consider their real life selves so interesting and marvelous that it makes sense to bring it here with an avatar version, and I can dig that. Maybe when I was like 17 I was a wild and fun guy but these days I'm just trying to survive in real life. If i made an avatar version of the real me it would be a working man whos too busy worrying about my family and people I care about to even spend the time and money on myself to make myself look cool. One thing I have noticed, I'll talk to women on here with a male avatar, just being myself, and it generally goes over like a led zeppelin. I talk to anybody with my female avatar, using my normal personality, and people think I'm a total gas.

This is really a different topic - a virtual world forum where"people come to have fun" but if you read teh threads and teh comments many peopel are not disallowing their real identities and issues to have a significant role. For many people (even myself) sl offers a distraction from a busy life and may even pose some answers to queries I may have.

I am NOT an unhappy person in real. I am a "serious" person with a "serious" career. I dont sell "fluff" - I "sell" issues and comments that are topical. SL is surprisingly restricting (and, therefore, beneficial to me) in the dissemination of information and in what is allowed to be said. I can learn from it. Some people make money here; I gain a different perspective - its a kinda currency just the same.

You dont have to comment on what I ask. You dont have to like me (you clearly dont) but dont for one minute think I am unhappy. And certainly with the lifestyle I lead in the real world you could hardly call me "disapproving". I simply dont like it when reactionaries slam women or gays or anyone who sound more intelligent than they think women should.

The other day I was in a club and a girl said "I bet you are a guy". I let it ride at first not really caring what she thought of me, but then I though - hang on, I can provenance who I am. So I gave her a web site with me details, and the same photo I have on my SL profile although on the site it is a cut out - proving that I had the original photo in SL... therefor it must be me, then I gave her my work phone number and said call me tomorrow if you dont believe me.

She said, ok, maybe you are a girl.

And I got to thinking afterwards I really should just have let it slide, what difference did it make to me?

The thing is, for whatever reason i've not yet figured out, it did make a difference. I'm not totally sure why it mattered, but am wondering if it was because my honesty and integrity was being challenged.

well whatever...

I have no problem with you personally, Jig. I find your posts pleasant enough and your 'teh' very cute. But those threads you start - grrr. They drive me nuts!

But here, have some more of this:

<3

You know something, "I kissed a girl and I liked it!"

Does it really matter in a world where virtualities are the parameters we abide by? In real I have kissed girls and I REALLY liked it. So if a women pretends to be a man I dont care. Why should a man be so upset when he is intimate with an avatar who is actually another man? What is this hang-up that men have???? They'll never know teh truth about teh sex of the person they are pleasuring. And in teh big scheme of things does it really matter?

And if they did, then you will never know.

Pep (Ignorance is bliss eh?)

well I've kissed a guy and I didn't like it.

maybe it was the lack of lipstick?

Seriously though - guys are just gross!!

Since you are a woman, you will never know or understand, even if you got told.

Pep (So stop asking)

QFT

Pep (Hi me!)

Hi, Sweets!

Pep (I touch myself every night)

I'll take that as an apology of sorts. Its snowing. I've been people-watching all morning. There are frustrated parents and squabbling teenagers. Businessmen are noisily getting sloshed on over-expensive beer. Some poor bugger's waiting for his plane to Sydney. My plane is delayed. My luggage is prolly in Calgary. My friend emailed me from Jakarta with "wish you were here " SL sounds positively normal.

I'll go for a walk around this airport and think of another thread to annoy you. Prolly about social class systems in sl. Or if slavery is banned in reality, why is it socially acceptable here?

I'll kill you

Tell her "No, I'm actually a freak mutant German Shepherd who thinks she's doing pretty well typing with paws..."

I've tried it long enough to know that the other kind is pandemic.

Delusions of omniscience eh?

Pep (Generalisations are usually worthless)

No, just the ability to use a dictionary.

I was talking about the "knowing" part, not the "pandemic" part.

Pep (Doesn't need a dictionary)

Hmmm.... Maybe, just for fun, I think I'll actually respond to the OP of the thread... Yes, after all these bloody pages and stuff. (=_=)

Start with the dominant sex:: Really, I don't like black&white thinking like that. If you try to determine which sex is dominant over the other on a family-by-family basis, or, in a workplace-by-workplace basis... You'll probably find that each situation shows different forms of dominance, glass ceilings, broken barriers, segregation, integration, and so on... In fundamentalist religious/rightie fields, there's a continuous drive to "put the woman back in the kitchen"... Where in fundamentalist modernist/leftie fields, there's a drive to "eradicate the world of the tyranny of a male dominated society". Then, there's an infinitely huge gray area in between. (^_^)

As for the boy-girl, girl-boy SL thing... It's an only-in-SL thing as any other. We have ferrets and bi-ped cheetahs responding to this thread. What people do with their SL is their business as it really is just pixels. Pixels we identify with, but, pixels just the same. What people choose to make their pixels look like is surely based on a TON of personal matters that would probably be no fun to require everyone to express. There are people that could be dealing with self-loathing, or simply being exploratory. (^_^)

I find myself a bit more concerned with people that match themselves exactly, where I take a look at their 1st life tab and the photo is practically a spot-on match to their avatar. I mean... With all the options available, why not live a little? It's my own prejudice, but, I usually wind up with the thought of "what is driving this narcissistic dufus?" but... That's just me in my own head, I still have no problem being friends with them and appreciate them just the same. (^_^)

Myself, as an example. ((You don't know my name. You don't know my address, phone number, length or color of my hair, shoe preference, and so on... and so on... OH!! And my gender too... Assume all you want, I don't care, you just don't know... As my 1st life tab says: "If we get along and I see that you care; you will know about me... Probably more than you want to know. But if you just want to know for the sake of knowing; don't expect much." Immy is Immy and in many ways my ideal, including all sizes and whatever state of undeadness or roboticness she takes on.)) So... I'm nothing more than what I want to be here. Nothing more, nothing less. I have my own home under a cookie jar. I have my own Email address. I have my own little online existence. All that silly meatsack does is tap away at the keyboard. =^-^=

Add to that... No, I will not pixelpound you. I already have partners RL and SL to satisfy my wants and needs, and, frankly... Anyone else won't really be 'up to snuff' for me... Particularly gullible noobies. Anyway... Who would want to get together with a gullible noobie anyway? That sounds like such a waste of time. I mean... You're gonna have to teach them all the mechanics of RP and whatever poseball function you're going to use... I'm sure it would be a disappointing experience for the both of you... Unless that's your kink. (=_=)

And, yes, deception is a bad thing. Dishonesty is a bad thing. But, I guess, some people need the veil. They have their place and I think they survive just fine. I can kinda understand the need to hide behind an avatar. But, someone being secretive about their RL is not a showstopper for a friendship from me anyway. I have no problem being a friend with someone I know nothing about. (^_^)

Finally... On the other end... Why is the distrust, distaste, whatever of trannys getting mistaken with homophobia? You can't always assume that a tranny is homosexual, so, where do the 'homophobia' assumptions come in? At best, it's simply intolerance... I wonder if there is a 'phobia specific to trannys? (O.o)

No, you weren't, you thought I meant "universal" or something like that. Now you're making up something else to try and weasel out of it.

When I turned on voice, I did not hear a Second Life full of voice, radio, and movie actors. Sorry.

/sarcasm on

Why limit it to gender?

I think everyone's avatar should look exactly like their RL selves. If you are overweight, you must look overweight. If you're only a 32A, you can't turn your sliders up past 20. If you are in a wheelchair, you must use a wheelchair in SL. If you are a brunette, you can't wear pink hair. If you are 5-6", 140lbs in RL, you are not allowed to look like a football star. If you are black in RL, you must be black in SL. If you suffer from depression or something, you must also behave that way in SL.

If you choose not to follow these rules, you must pass out a notecard on meeting people telling them exactly how your SL ava differs from your RL person. Otherwise you are lying at the expense of the RL person you are communicating with.

/sarcasm off

Yeesh. SL was designed by LL to be a fantasy world. It's not First Life, it's Second Life. Expecting others to play or interact with SL according to your personal rules is just not reasonable. They may choose to or not. They may choose to share all or part of their RL to you or they may not.

I'm female in RL and I use voice now and then but only where it's convenient for ME. If someone asks me to go on voice as a gender test, I decline and assume they are really only interested in my ass-ets. (Note that this has only happened to me twice and both were rude newbie males looking for pixel sex so I don't think most of SL shares the voice verification requirement.)