So why are kids on Zindra?

I can't parse that paragraph.

And that's just as true in Mature. In fact it's MORE true in Mature because in Mature they can complain that the person was spamming them to come visit in voice group chat and isn't that advertising?

It is upsetting that so many people wish to limit the freedom of a child av well beyond the necessary restrictions that are already in place.


A collegue of mine IS against drinking, has never had a single drop in her *entire* life. Yet she does go out with the rest of us. Is she doing something that is against her beliefs by doing so? No, she drinks lemonade all night, and if someone starts to get at the point where he or she shouldn't be drinking another, SHE is the one asking "should you really drink another?" in a very kind way. Which is something all those involved (other collegues including me, bartenders and waitresses) should be doing as well. But gimme a break, nobody does that untill someone starts throwing up. She does it when it's actually already the right time to say something like that. You can fight something head on, or you can try to sway the other side towards you.

It doesnt matter that im allowed to go in the bar. It doesnt matter if im


No, in real life, that's the responsibility of the parents or the owner of the venue. In SL, it's the responsibility of the child av as well.


And in case you do get propositioned for sex, you'll actually have a good reason to AR the hell out of someone. Yes, this is a hint for the AR police.


Which is exactly why I see no problem with child av's on Zindra. Simply because the sex will NOT be everywhere. Public sex won't even be allowed in many areas. And yes, I DO believe the major part of zindra is going to be as boring as mature or PG mainland.

As for the OMG, I can make pictures of child av's standing next to naked adults or adults copulating. You can make those pictures *anywhere* in SL. You can even make pictures of naked adults with children in real life, in about any naturist resort. You're not allowed to photograph in most of those areas though. And they generally have rules that children have to stay clothed. Sex with children in RL naturist resorts is a pretty sure way to get arrested, if you haven't been lynched by the mob of naturists present before that already.

And sexbeds work in PG areas too, you know? They're not allowed there, but they work. The very same scripts are used in PG furniture as well, by the way. Both child avies and sex beds are allowed in mature land. Would that classify mature land as *anything goes land as long as it's behind closed doors"? Hell, no it doesn't.

No more than I'd worry about any one else. Anyone can set up a fraudulent AR.

It's the fraudulent AR's that I see as the problem, I'd like to know more about LL's AR review process and actually tried to start a thread on it recently. Also I'd like better ban and mute controls, say by account or isp/ip (which ever it is).

This way people could feel safe from which ever is their nightmare, vigilantes or certain preferences of others.





You may be well be right here.

So you want to exclude me from my own estate because I want my tenants to be able to do in their homes as they like? And no I will not change my avatar to go to my sims, I live there myself afterall.

The current rules are already more restrictive then RL.

So many worst case scenario's..So many victims and it's not even started lol

Kids could get onto zindra!! Ya most children will make a child avatar to walk around Zindra because a kid just wants to be a kid and not someone else

Kids could get on Zindra it's not 100%!!
Well nothing is 100% and prevention is only to help..The parents have to at least try with the percent that is left over..If they can't then they need to be held responsible as well as the adult and child taking part if there was a case with an actual pedophile..
No more internets for you!!

A pedophile could just as easily be playing with someone in an adult shape..If they think there is a chance they are gonna get caught would they risk it with a child avatar upping their odds?? a stupid one maybe..

No more NPIOF hide and seek there so they are putting themselves out there more than before..

People want 100% sure thing i can walk blindly through without a single fear..It's the internet..You need to be on your toes.. You are not gonna get 100%..
Put a few media reports of parents also being held responsible for their kids getting in places they shouldn't be on the net is gonna have a bigger impact on the percent LL can't watch..

If someone is wanting to play in that way with someone..Just make sure timestamp and log is on ..ask their age..If they lie then it's recorded..every little bit is gonna help..
If the person continues with someone under age then they all need to answer for it..Not us and not other people playiing child avatars...because they may not have been using child avatars..

Someone wants to trap me then they better have one good lawyer is all i will say on that..because i have some myself... I will be drawing big attention as to why someones child is standing next to me in what is considered adult..SL

If people feel there is a big chance of being setup..Don't go stomping through the mine field because you feel you have the right too..
Sure you do ..but let a mine go off..you also have the right to be blown up lol
Walk careful for awhile till things calm down..

I'm not tying someones legs off that already has their hands tied so i can walk my selfish sel fthrough sl without common sense or a tinge of fear because there is a slim chance..
There is a slim chance of a lot of things.. It doesn't mean we go cutting everyone off..Because before you know it..You are sitting their bored and all alone..

True but the issue of introducing this new classification gives the impression that there are now three tiers of appropriate content in SL while, in practice, there is no such standard at all - just a lot of potential for drama and, still worse, litigation.

I was shocked recently to learn that not only was non-PG content to be found on PG sims but that residents were quite prepared to argue that's ok on the grounds we're all adults anyway. In my opinion, the inherent lack of respect and consideration for others evidenced by that attitude is the epitome of childishness itself and I question whether or not we are ready for the virtual freedoms afforded by media like SL and to regulate our own behaviour in a responsible manner.

The situation works both ways: while I am entirely in accord with the need to respect the PG classification and keep my heavier content away from those sims out of respect for residents who made the PG choice, I certainly don't want to see a child av going hoppity-skippity through a battlefield or an orgy room. The 'Mature' classification should have been enough to keep these two very distinct types of content separate but that has not proven to be the case.

Now we are condemned to wrangle over nice points about whether or not a skin advert is 'Adult' content or that a scene of the crucifixion is adult content or if that child av hanging around an orgy sim is or is not adult content - and, yes, it will happen.

Our avatars are content. As such they contribute semantic weight to the total content of their location merely by their presence and the region they are in will in the same way affect the meaning of the av itself. When a child av enters a 'Mature' or 'Adult' region, he or she is walking on eggshells - as is everyone else around them - because the state of being a minor (albeit a virtual minor) will immediately raise questions about other content in the vicinity.

So you want to go shopping in a 'Mature' and now 'Adult' sim? Feel free, but don't be a jerk: put on an adult avatar for the duration. What does it cost you?

Mark my words it'll end in tears or I am not spraying my monitor with spit as I sit here foaming at the mouth in apoplectic rage at the complete f@cking stupidity and selfishness of people.

There ARE three tiers of appropriate content. The confusion is from treating region ratings as content ratings.

PG regions can contain PG content.

Mature regions can contain Mature and PG content. They are not "nudie sims", they are sims that are allowed to contain public nudity.

Adult regions can contain Adult and Mature and PG content. They are not "orgy sims", they are sims that are allowed to contain public orgies.

PG and Mature avatars are therefore allowed in Adult regions, because an "adult region" is not "a region of adult content", it's "a region that's allowed to contain adult, mature, or PG content".

I own or manage almost half a sim of mature (and therefore formerly adult) land, altogether, and have yet to put any mature (let alone adult) content on it. If I believed I could qualify for a swap I'd put in for one, and STILL not put any "adult content" on it.

I see the problem somewhere else: Just because the majority of users apparantly uses their avatar to show off their sexual preferences (probably because in RL they can't do that) it doesn't mean that EVERY avatar was created for this purpose. Not EVERY furry was created for the sole purpose of yiffing nor do ALL child avatars serve some sexual purpose. Actually I guess, most do not. Sometimes an avatar is just an avatar, a representation of ourselves, our favorite fashion style, our fantasies, in a completely non-sexual manner.

OMG... Run... the puritans have landed, the puritans have landed.

So long as they aren't violating the TOS, what's the problem?

As far as the rules go, Adult is the same as Mature has been until now. Some places are appropriate for child avatars, some aren't. The content if individual parcels should dictate that.

If it turns out Zindra is 100% Adult Content, child avatars wouldn't be appropriate there. Chances are it won't be. We'll see when people start moving in.

Yes ... it has, time and time again.

Say an RP family decides that their 'kids' are old enough to watch Friday the 13th and they go off to find a theater build that might just have said movie ...

They'd have to go to Zindra or some other private estate to do so.

With all due respect, I do appreciate the difference but setting up region ratings is confusing in itself.

The problem is that we are not discussing RL here, in which case most reasonable people would understand the boundaries on situations where it is ok for adults and children to mix socially - or even for adults to act like children if that is what they want to do, which question is much more appropriate to the SL experience.

SL is an entirely different kettle of fish because more or less any activity is acceptable between consenting adults with the single exception of sexual ageplay. Personally, I have no problem with other residents who wish to practice ageplay, whether it be the purely regressive or slightly more sinister sexual form (yep, the regressive type of ageplay is *very* sinister as far as I am concerned) and, despite my own visceral distaste for it, my inclination is to live and let live. Lamb sakes avs can get away with 'murdering' one another without any comment beyond the idle question of why sensible individuals would want to do such a thing. So what is it with the pixel poppets popping their cherries?

Well, questions of the involvement of RL minors aside, the sexual form of ageplay in virtual worlds is a perversely actionable offence in many jurisdictions. I say 'perversely' because there is no question that the police in those very same jurisdictions will come knocking on the door of consenting adults who like to get off wearing diapers or a saucy schoolkid outfit.

It seems that in the virtual context the toon is the transgression in itself.

So we have a black and white situation of 'PG' and 'Adult' here with a muddy grey area called 'Mature' in between. As far as I am concerned, if it is not right to go cockwalking through a PG sim because some residents may not unreasonably find that offensive and even threatening, by the very same token it is not ok for child avs to be anywhere near content of an overtly adult nature.

For ageplayers to argue that it is ok is inconsiderate, unbalanced and downright dangerous.

The other reason is prevent lag. I know at least one escort club will be using a full sim, of which most will be rented skyboxes, cause *two* clubs in the same sim will lag each other to death.

So simply to prevent death by lag, Zindra will not be wall to wall clubs

/me points an accusing finger.... LOOK!!!! PG parcel guidelines in an (Adult) sim...


http://www.sluniverse.com/pics/pic.aspx?ID=379140

So, to all reaches of the definitions of things, this place is PG according to the Lindens. If kid AVs can't go here, where can they go? (^_^)y

I do not believe that Zindra is intended for any other purpose than to play home for the SL sex industry. I don't care how LL is currently selling it or how some would like to spin it for their own purposes.

So you are saying that LL is lying to us again?

This thread is silly. You do know these are not real children right?

That's the way it should be, but thanks to the way the rules are written, it probably won't be that way.

Shhh, it is only the appearance that matters, not actual facts.

It doesn't matter what you believe Angel: What matters is what the POLICY states ...

And the POLICY is worded to support what I and others have been telling you.

My bad,feel free to lock me up in one of my cages.

Lets see, first we are told all the evil "Adult" things are to evilf or the mainland and must move to a new place. Next we are reassured it is not a Adult Getto" but just a logical sensable place. Not to worry, we will not be harrassing you, etc. Don't worry, it will be just like the old sl.

Now, open less thana week, we have people already, ready to call the cops because someone didn't bother to change out of a child avatar to go look at an empty contienent. Not to mention that we ahve a few ehre who clearly will harrass anyone that brings a child avi to the contenient to god for bid, Shop, Vist a friends house, watch a movie with a friend, go for a drive!!!

The clear intent is already there. While we were all promised this would be a simple thign, we already have the ones who shoved this forward to get every piece of adult content off their pg mainland, now already making threats about the new adult mainland.

Well folks, I hope you enjoy your PG SL, because given the attitudes here i can see someone simple offering a alternative to sl soon and the Adults flocking to it.

Then you will soon discover who build and paid for sl as it closes down slowly.

Watch this space and see how silly it's going to get.

How do you suppose those soon-to-be redundant Mainland sims will be occupied if they don't merge the Teens with the Main Grid?

The depiction of children in sexual situations is offensive and illegal. It has no bearing on the argument who the RL players behind these toons are.




Today the policy supports this weird voodoo, but it won't for long.