sincere question about tipping in clubs

Any good dancer will earn whatever he/she gets... but I despise working with other dancers who never say a word and then poormouth/bitch in the dressing room. I had a girl who proposed to me that I should split my tips with her, since we both worked the stage that night and she'd never said a word while I kept up a good conversation with our patrons! I just told her "you get what you work for, sweetie" and made a point not to dance with her again.

While I appreciate all the tips I get and work hard to be creative in my appreciation, I realize that it's all up to me and you never know what drives some people to tip and others to not tip - at the end of the day, it's just fun....... well, that and money for new hair.

I never go to strip clubs, just dance ones sometimes. I guess for the strippers it's more work as they tend put emotes along with their animations, to give a better show. That's understandable.

But if the dancer is really just running a chimera that's cycling dance animations for them, I mean that's really not a whole lot of motivation to tip.

I will tip any staff that does something that makes me laugh though, or DJs that play my request etc. Just wearing your chimera aint gonna do it though

It sounds like your place is a great place to work David.

I think that it would be very nice if other club owners would make sure their employees were well compensated as you do. I know that there are other clubs out there that take care of their folks, but it seems more of the opposite sometimes.

Care to do a shameless plug for your club? Or maybe PM me - I'd like to come have a look-see.

Hi Serendipity

You're right in your assumption that tipping here in the States is part of our culture. It's a huge part; God we tip everybody! I draw the line though at the tip jars that have sprouted up at coffee counters and sandwich shops. Please.

Here we pay an cover charge at most clubs and we still tip while inside the club. Most people will tip the bartenders/drink waiter, and dancers. (not that I know this from experience - ) It's just something we do. *shrugs* I have traveled overseas quite a bit in my life and had to re-learn my tipping behavior so I understand that it's different from place to place.

In SL, I would still tip the employees of a club venue, even if I had to pay a cover charge. It's just what I'm used to. I don't ever really feel pressured.

Make me laugh or blush for a couple of hours...that's worth a few sheckles (Lindens) to me.

To those who asked .........

Didn't really want to take advantage of the forum to plug our club, but out of deference to those who asked, run a search for either "Carnivale Royale" (our half-sim, all free, theme park) or "Double 0s", which is the formal club situated within the park.

Looking forward to seeing some of you there, and also to reading about your experiences if you have any comments.

Take care all - and thanks for the opportunity.

David & Theodora Bournemouth

Trouble is as soon as you put the buy pass option up, people just won't pay even $5L to come in.

Why would they when other places are paying out $5L every 20 minutes to get people to come and camp?!!

As a dancer I can honestly say that any tip is appreciated, large or small. Any dancer worth their salt EARNS their tips by interacting with their audience. If you are watching a dancer and he/she totally ignores you, tip them nothing, they haven't earned it. When I am not working and I go clubbing if I like a dancer and they are being interactive I tip very well. If they are silent I tip nothing, take my business elsewhere and probably won't be back to that club unless I know that that club is a good one and this one dancer happens to be a bad egg.

Agreed, I bust my tail (no pun intended) to earn my tips. And because of that I make very good money dancing.

Coming from someone who began as a dancer, then moved to hostess, then to DJ and now as a live performer...i can honestly tell you that today my idea has changed tremendously. I would much rather people be at my shows enjoying my music. If people didn't come because they felt they couldn't afford to tip, i would be devastated! So, my answer is tip what you can or what you feel like. I've been tipped 5L all the way to 5K. I dont think there's a standard. Tip what you feel, if you're feelin it. It should be all about the fun!

QFT!

Just returned from a dance venue (that we only go to when our fave DJ is there). In addition to the DJ, there were the clubs two co-owners, one manager and two hostesses. And 12 people there (including all the above, so really 5 people when you deduct the DJ and his partner and the owners/manager/hostesses).

When I worked in a jazz club about the same size as the above physically but much more populated, the owners were there most nights but REFUSED to take tips or any tips to the house. There was one manager and either a "cigar girl" or "barman" on duty. The music stream was run by the club owner. I don't think the managers were ever tipped (nor was their spam or requests to do so). And these managers were GOOD - in addition to making sure the events were posted and sending out group notices, they offered to dance with unaccompanied patrons and helped keep a lively banter going in the club. Maybe once an hour the manager would mention to "remember your cigar girl or barman" but that was it.

Since I go to clubs so rarely now, I tip the DJ anywhere from 250-500L - the 500L if I make a request. Sometimes I add more as the night goes on. I always feel badly if I'm "cash poor" on a certain night. But I always give mega-compliments to the DJ and hope it encourages tipping in others.

I know more than a few club owners and they talk to me a fair bit. They tell me that there is little money in dancers, tipping or even escorting anymore from the club owners perspective and clubs that try to get by on that are not likely to do well for long.

A lot of the clubs I know run some sort of contest, one where someone has to pay usually but gets everyone involved.
This is where a lot of the recent revenue is coming from. How do I know this? Because I sell a voting picture contest system to a lot of clubs and I have to tell you, you can never underestimate the need to be the most popular "whatever" and win a cash prize.
Every single customer has made their money back on their initial purchase price in the first few hours of opening the contest - without fail and there is a new phenomonen called voting frenzy that has started especially around the times contests finish.

Most of my few customers tell me in shock and awe that their revenue has turned from looking quite grim to turning a good profit. Sure the management have to work for it in looking after the contestants and voters questions and issues etc...but at least there is a way for them to make the money.
Of course then contestants and their friends stick around to socialise at the venue, partly to check out who else is voting, gaining votes etc... Places stay packed for long periods.

Most people that I sell to do a contest every week or month with a different theme and for the average club goer, that is enough to keep them interested on top of seeing their friends etc.

Word of mouth tends to keep me in tier and shoes so I don't usually make a big thing about it and advertise like others on the forums. However whilst not strictly on topic the conversation had at one point turned to club revenues it seems and so I thought I would share what is certainly the case for my customers who are running their own clubs and this type of contest.

Oh and as it is a contest and free to enter, involves no chance whatsoever (is completely deterministic) and does not pay out any L$ - does not violates and LL gambling laws.

I know this goes counter to what many venues are trying to promote, but I'll *not* split my tips between the venue, the performer, the pet gold fish and the stage hands. I go to a place for the show which is put on there. Whatever economic deals go on behind the scene to make it profitable for the involved parties are not of my concern.
I don't know who actually provides what; say, whether the performer or the venue supplies the streaming servers, or whether the performers are paid by the venue or purely by tips, so I don't feel neither in a position to, nor honestly care for, working out the "correct" percentages in each individual situation.

It may be a cultural difference; in my country, tips aren't as prevalent as I gather they are in the US, and if you do tip, it's almost always simply throwing additional money on top of the final bill; not tipping individual persons/services specifically.
It may be worth taking into account that the "remember to tip everybody and their dog" shouts at events may come across as *very* pushy to people who are used to another system.

I think all Zombie and Vampire club workers should be tipped in the spirit of this back from the dead thread.

I usually tip what I can and I spread the tips around evenly to each of the male dancers. But I don't tip the female dancers because they are not my cup of tea unless they are my friend. No offense to the female dances, just my preference. I tip the host because I have been an host and it was alot of work. If I request a certain song or if I am really enjoying myself I tip the DJ. However, I don't go to clubs much anymore. I am more into attending live concerts. After reading these posts I now know I need to tip the performer more. I usually tip 100L. I have a dance floor on my openspace sim and my boyfriend and I dance there usually listening to the radio. Or if we attend a live concert and its too laggy, my boyfriend will grab a copy of the stream and we dance at home.

One time I was at club and female dancers were talking in open chat about their sick rl children, what they cooking for dinner and what not. I thought to myself how unprofessional. If the male dancer isnt doing much he won't get a tip. Swirling around just shaking your package is not hardly work. LOL I recall they use to have stripper classes for those that is interested in entering to that profession. Perhaps the ones in this thread that is real good at it combine your talents and open up a school similar to DJ school.

So tip what you can is what I say.

This 'other system' you refer to is known as 'cheap people'. Any adult knows that the venue didn't spring out of the ground from magic beans. The hostess and the DJ are not volunteering their time and bandwidth to entertain the masses. Neither is the venue owner or the performer.

I do not know what this 'additional money' is you speak of since you enter the venue for free. This is why I do endorse one flat fee cover charge at the door so everyone working ina venue can get a fair amount of Lindens while the venue owner makes just enough to keep the venue open for the masses.


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Gee, thanks.
Actually, this other system is known as having a business model. It's fairly common.
I don't pay the drummer, the lead singer and the staff separately when going to a concert, and I'm fairly sure that doesn't make me "cheap".
This "additional money" I speak of was specifically referring to RL, as an example of how we customarily do not split up payment here, but lump it into one, for the people who receive it to split up as they see fit, based on whatever arrangement and expenses they have.

hehe

Second Life Club Business Plan.

1. Buy Tons of land or even an Island - to make sure you can get enough people into your club and that the competition cant open up in the same sim.
(large upfront cost, accompanying large overhead for tier)

2. Build/Get someone to build your most likely over sized club
(probable large upfront cost for any sort of quality)

3. Hire workers trying to get quality ones in a world where there are 101234123124 competing clubs.
(Commission equals a high high turnover *OR* salary equals high operating costs)

4. Try to convince people to come to your club when there are 101234123124 clubs out there.
(Involves high operating costs and even ethical quandaries in terms of campers / Classifed ads / etc. OR opportunity costs - like Trafficbots limiting how many people can attend your events)

5. Lose money hand over fist.
(operating costs far exceed any possible revenue in a world where the 101234123124 other clubs are too busy trying to compete for customers to charge money)

6. Deal with constant drama.
(much of which is related to you not being able to get tipping customers in the door.)

7. Close, several hundreds of dollars poorer.

8 The End.

I don't go to clubs much - most of my tips go to great builds and well-managed sandboxes and stuff.

For these as well as clubs, how much I tip depends much more on how much I can afford at the time than on how much a venue, DJ, greeter, dancer, whatever deserves for their efforts.

Sometimes I tip as much as $L500, sometimes as little as $L2. I would never avoid going somewhere because I didn't have enough to tip, so there have been occasions when I have not tipped at all. I was sort of under the impression that being there, as a real live not-a-bot, not AFK, willing to chat person had a certain value in itself.



Well, in that case, I think they are a little bit daft. I understand that everybody would love to cover their tier and ideally make a bit on top, but they would make far more money if they employed their skills in RL. This kind of goes against the advice given in just about every business related thread to "do what you enjoy in SL and if you make money treat it as a bonus".



Nice idea, but unless the majority of clubs adopted the same policy it wouldn't work. There are loads of people in SL who do what they do primarily for the love of it. Those are the ones who get my tips (when I can afford it).

Concerts in RL charge you a hefty COVER CHARGE to enter the venue. Then they split the money up. If you do not pay a cover charge you should willingly take the same amount of funds and tip the people bringing you this bit of entertainment.

And the SL venue business model is WRONG. Venues are the sole supporters of the Live Music Scene. We get the land, buy the equipment, advertise the events and pay the Live musicians top dollar while they collect the lion's share of the tips. It is past time that the Live Musicians start supporting the venues also. We need to have Top Shelf LIVE MUSIC COVER CHARGE DAYS across the grid. Have the musicians endorse ticket days. Clubs can all use the same ticket system(TICKETRON). When the patron gives their ticket to a venue in the network - that venue and perfomer get the lion's share of the money from that particular ticket price.

I hope to be part of this happening in the near future.


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When I tip it's usually only 20-30L$ because I tip all the dancers / hosts, not just one of them.

I am a club dancer, and quite honestly, although it's nice to get tips, I do the job more for fun than anything else. I work at a club I've already been attending for a while, where I know the manager and the regulars. And for those that think being a dancer means just sitting in a dance animation and occasionally sticking up some pre-loaded gestures, there's a lot more to it than that. It's all about interaction with the audience, personalising the experience to customers individually.

And, I do it because I like doing it, not because of the tips. Maybe I'm a bit of an exhibitionist at heart. Most, if not all, of the tips I earn I end up paying back to the club in some way or another anyway. Usually I tip the other staff as well, and add a bit extra to the contest board prize money.

If I'm at a club and not working, I tip the DJ between 100 and 250 depending on how good they are. Sometimes the host and dancers as well if they're good and interacting with the audience; what I tend to do there is watch how much each one has been tipped, and I tend to give tips to the one with the least, to even it up a bit. No-one likes to be the staff-member that earned the least.

the thing is, a lot of dancers do just hop on the pole or chair or whatever prop, and do nothing else but let the animation run, and do a few canned gestures

those are the ones who don't get the tips

I tip about 50L to 300L to a musician/DJ/performer/host at least once throughout the night. If the DJ plays a requested song, I tip more. If there's a good vibe and lots of fun, more to the host/organizer etc.

I try to tip as well as I can but sometimes I'm a poor kitty and then I usually don't go to events or give my last few Lindens with an apology and explain I've not got more. Although I've given monies after the fact to someone before because they did such a good job and I just didn't have the Lindens on me at the time.

What a great idea! OMG. Next time I run out of tip money I'll give a gift certificate for my store plus something I made that I think the person would like. Wow!

The rose is very touching! So nice that someone thought of that.