Gettiing Collared

Well, to intrude on the thread with a request, I'm seeking a Gorean slave who would be willing to discuss Gorean sims, d/s, slavery and that sort of thing OOC for a women's group monday at 4pm SL time. The sort of things we'd be interested in is how this pertains to RL views, what is attractive about it emotionally, what needs you think it fulfills in you. The group is feminist oriented so there might be some critical views, but it's not an "ambush for the evil gorean" type of thing. If anyone's interested IM me in game please?

I'd just like to point out something to some of the people posting here:

http://home.comcast.net/~garbl/stylemanual/c.htm#capitalization

Gravity - not just a good idea, it's the law.

I completely agree with this, personally. It is not uncommon to have a D/s relationship where the sub will occasionally misbehave in order to be chastised. Don't anyone say this is wrong, or that D/s shouldn't be like that. If you want a doormat sub, fine. But not everyone wants to play it that way, and no-one is entitled to lay down the law as to what is right or wrong.

I was thinking (avoiding the discussion of rights and wrongs- I made up my mind about it all a while ago) about the original question, and how the answer (nobody can force you) is only true as of right now.

Nobody needs propositions. With the open source thing, all it takes is "SL: Sub Edition", and you get a client where any attachment with "FORCE" in the description or whatever, just will not detatch unless something is sent with the right credentials from the "owner". You could probably make the client force accept objects with a certain code in the name/description, and make the client attach/wear them automatically without even asking "so and so has offered you Collar of Doom accept/decline".

Likewise, your "stand up" button, map, teleport etc would be grayed out if you were sat on something tagged a certain way. (ie locked in a cage or something).

Such a client could be made compulsory for roleplay sims- some kind of internet comms would ping you to see what client you had, expecting a proper response or ejecting you from the sim.

Of course that would limit it's effectiveness still to the roleplay sims or parcels with the appropriate internet-enabled security orbs, much like social pressure does already.

But with new alternative versions of the SL client, there are all kinds of things that could be "forced" on someone who chooses to run it.

oh and why not go the whole hog and wire up some USB fingerprint sensor into the client to constantly check you're not AFK

Still looking for someone to chat with us about their experiences. Please?

I have thought rather hard about how this could be done, and I have posted a discussion paper at another forum, which goes into the practicalities of making an extension to LSL that would interact with a modified client. Now all I need is a C++ programmer to edit the client. It wouldn't actually be a lot of work. I call the system BDSL ...

I'm not sure I should post the link here, but if you check my profile inworld you will find it.

As to constantly checking you are not AFK, that doesn't need a fingerprint sensor. Evil Kitten at Myeolchi has a Wicked Cage that forces the prisoner to stay at the keyboard to enjoy their imprisonment, all done without any modified client. A very evil device, and worth every linden, if I might say (shameless plug).

Well as for the collars and stuffs i would say that even in RL it can't be forced on you, most collars, even lockable ones won't stand very long again a good pair of bolt cutters. and even if they do there is a wide array of power tools that will easily get rid of any piece of steel.

I believe that the guidelines for developing the SL open-source client specifically ban the use of "magic numbers" - ie, regular SL messages that have special significance when retrieved by an appropriate client.

There may well be a way of making a collar or other object irremovable without needing to modify the client. I've done some tests on it and have come close to a non-removable attachment, but it does make use of what may be a bug in SL.

However I do basically agree with what others have said - having them choose not to remove the collar, even if they could, shows more power than having it locked onto them. It's hard to do, and far too many SL folks who wear those collars seem to have a "I'm bored of poseball sex, let's try this" attitude which makes it practically impossible.

I don't see why that should be, and in any case, if it were done as a private project I don't see how anyone could object.



I've discovered the truth of this. There are a lot of good players who will respect this absolutely. If something is said to be locked, it is locked, and one simply doesn't even consider the fact that you "could" (in terms of SL mechanics) remove it.

You're still licensing the source code from LL, remember.

The page in question is http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Coding_standard#Obvious_Things_That_We_All_Know with a specific link to a Wikipedia page which identifies a "magic number" as a signal in a regular data stream, indicating that a particular format of data is being sent. (Looking at it I'm not absolutely sure that was what was intended, now..)

Why ban it? Most probably a) to prevent server functionality being added through the back door, and b) to prevent people being pushed into using third-party clients by the fact that the original client will be recieving all of the 'magic values' for those third-party client features as spam.

Good point. In the system as I see it, though, this would not be excessive, because messages would be sent only when using certain items that were known to be coded to work with the special client.

But in the end, the best coercive force is social pressure.

Well I only posted it as an exercise in "what if".

Still, I don't see a difference between a client that interprets a certain object description code and then alters its behaviour (to grey out unattach etc) to one that interprets the results of land for sale data and alters its behaviour to buy automatically. LL didn't say that wasn't allowed, they made some mention of changing things to stop it being effective as a moral statement.

It could be something as simple as removing detach option from anything attached to the chest (where most collars attach) and only allowing login at a specified home location, with no teleport function (business and education organisations would likely want this exact same function to keep their clients/students *out* of BDSM Life)

Just saying.

I had to read up on magic numbers (not a fan of the band really) on wikipedia. It seems to be, in programming, more to do with obfuscated and unreadable number malarky than anything to do with checking for something like object descriptions. That said, I'm more than happy to leave it to the eggheads

Well, that's sort of the thing I had doubts about. It says "no magic numbers", but the Wikipedia linked page has two seperate definitions of magic numbers on it, either of which LL might reasonably not want included in the client.

Gummi, What i said was Not in "Groucho Terms" as you describe it, what i said, and i Paraphrase here, Is if you believe the Only way you can Maintain Dominance is by Bullying and Violence, you are the wrong sort of person to be Attempting Domination At All. Such a person is Not a Dom/me, they are an abuser.
People, Mostly from outside the lifestyle, see, or want to see only the Violent aspects of the Life. They don't know, or even care that there is a mental, and emotional aspect that is Far more important that the Physical. The problem is, the mental, and emotional aspects is where all the REAL work is and that is the Primary reason it holds no attraction for the Uninitiated, who's only concern seems to be a cheap, pliant, and plentiful source of Sex.

As for the work being Done once the Collar is in Place, God, Nothing Farther from the Truth. Yes, a Good slave will stay where Put, But it takes a Long time and a Lot of work to create a Good slave. There Is endless trying of the Boundries. In the Early days a slave WILL stray, that's natural, but straying is worlds different from Running. If they stray, they return, and accept Correction. If they Run, then the Dominant has failed. Sometimes, it's recoverable, but something that causes a slave to Run is usually a perceived Violation of Trust sometimes it's recoverable, Many times it is Not.
Being a Domme is a Huge amount of work, There is education, and correction (And no, Not all Correction takes the form of the Whip). It's a REAL commitment. None of my Girls are "Droopy Drawers" as you put it. Try to take Liberties, and you will have proof of my words. The aim of a Good Dominant is to Harness, and Control, Not to Break, Not to extinguish the Girls Fire.
Like a Tiger Trainer, I can Tell you, Just because it's safe for Me to pet them, doesn't mean it's safe for Everyone. You should expect this though, I'm thier Mistress, You are Not. I've done the work in Dominating them, You haven't.
If i give my Girls an Order, or Instruction, It will be Obeyed. If You order them about the Best you could hope for is an Derisive Laugh.

A Good, Well trained and Properly Dominated slave will have no desire to leave. Once, Long ago, a Woman who didn't understand our lifestyle at all Offered to Purchase one of my Girls from me (A practice i NEVER engage in) for the Purpose of Freeing her from Slavery. I told her to go and speak privately with my slave and see how she felt about it. Without missing a step, My girl told her if she was Given her freedom, the first thing she would do is seek me out, and Beg my Collar again (I could have made a lot of Money on that deal, but i'm more honest than that. Lol). Each of my Girls has learned they can be Freer Kneeling at my Feet than they ever were being on thier own, they have no desire to be anywhere else.

I have no Need of a Forcably Locked Collar. I have something stronger.

Angel.

A magic number originally refers to an identifiable sequence of numbers in the header portion of a file or data record which uniquely identifies it to the program examining the file(record), and its purpose "back in the day" in UNIX was for editors and other software responsible for managing data to be able to identify the type of file it was handling. These numbers were usually derived by accident - files in one format invariably had C0FE45 as the first thee bytes, for example, and so editors and other software would check for those and know it was a specific format. With time, magic numbers would be specifically encoded just for the purpose of identification of that file or record. That is the usage Second Life is referring to here.

In this case, Linden Labs is trying to prevent obfsucation of the data stream (which it still owns), and for very good reasons! If clientSlave available at SLSlaves.com used the magic number 183afe to tell the viewer to "hide the stand button", then clientGrief at SL-Slaves.com could use the same magic number to hide the "Pay" button by maskng it as a "Sit". LL has a hard enough time trying to understand its own code and data protocols, it certainly doesn't want to play net-cop over someone else's protocol.

Another use of magic numbers is to put literal values used by computer programs into easily identifiable sections near the beginning of the code so they could be easily changed if needed. For example, the HTTP port 80 would be "magic numbered" as

#define HTTP_PORT 80

just in case a future release of the program needed to change that port number to something else. the alternative to using this form of magic numbers is to scatter these values throughout the code, making it harder to change (since you'd have to find and change every use of the literal). So instead of writing

if (connect(url, HTTP_PORT) == SUCCESS)

it would be written as

if (connect(url, 80) == SUCCESS)

Its much easier to change one magic number at the top, instead of dozens thorughout the code.

Now, put like that, I agree with you entirely.

Then keep right-clicking the cage until 'rate owner' comes up. Post a message in chat saying 'I've just been caged by an idiot griefer called XXXXX' in capitals.

The license for the source code is just the GPL V2 with a FLOSS exception. There's nothing in that about magic numbers, or any other coding convention.

If you wish Linden Labs to incorporate some of your code back into their client, then it seems likely that they will enforce their coding standard. But as far as the license is concerned, there's nothing stopping you from releasing a version of the client that uses magic numbers, or violates every other guideline on that page.

> rl Gorean ?? by definition Gorean = Fiction. There is nothing real about it what-so-ever.
> You might as well say rl stargate, or rl robocop, or rl martian. Novels are NOT real.

Wait! You mean the stargate ISN'T real? I just saw one in a SIM I visited! But what about the Gould???

I have been told that John Norman's books were really badly written. Apart from that, I had the third gorean slave land on my plot a couple of days ago, running away from gor and her 'master'.

Someone took me to a gor island recently, thinking I might be interested in the architecture. After donning the free woman attire (including a veil) and stepping onto land, all the males were playing bows and arrows while the slaves sat silently alongside them.

I think some of these 'masters' have no expertise in how to treat a slave at all and don't really want to learn. They damage people who then run away so they just move on to the next one.

In addition, I was sitting on a beach in SL and there was a domme/mistress with her sub/slave kneeling beside her with the titler 'I am just a piece of shit' or words similar. Could anyone who knows, tell me if that is a common thing to do? Several people on the beach commented on it and domme/sub tp'd away.

There are people who practice BDSM in real life

There are people who live out a version of the gorean lifestyle in real life.

There are people who dress up like Mr Spock in Real life.

They read like a lot of other pulp science fiction from the 60's. I dont think they are particually badly written when you consider that they started there.

Most people who have read them of course, have never read any science fiction from that Era.

A lot of people involved in Gor or who are looking to criticize Gor use the writing style to avoid reading more of the books, lol. Its kind of like the "but my history teacher doesnt describe things well excuse to not doing homework back when you were in High School.




Most people in D/S and Gor online are just "winging it" leading to things like this. Trying to learn something for real takes effort. They just want to have fun.

Who cares. It's probably bannable now anyway. Gor is broadly offensive, as it's a means for consentin people to have fun. No more fun, unless it's on the level oftiddlywinks or tic-tac-toe. Just look an adult when you do it, or else. And no pinatas, either, cuz that's too violent.

*cries*

"========================================
What happens in Second Life, stays in Second Life."

Interesting signature, hehe. After the ID verification, you'll have to change it, of course.

It's the later novels that are bad. Not so much badly written as unedited. John Norman is one of the most self-indulgent readers I have ever read. He writes really well in small spurts, and then gets off on a boring 20 page tangent. The early books, say the first 12, were edited by professionals who took out most of the tangents and repetitions, left the good parts, and published pretty decent books of around 200 pages. But then Norman got successful and obtained editorial control and the series went out behind the outhouse to live in 500 page books with 1/5 the plot points found in the earlier books.

Gor is huge place. There must be 50 Gor sims on SL. Every sim is different and the people in every sim are different. Please don't lump all Goreans into the same bag. It's true that there are a whale-load of rt-Geeks playing BigManonGor because it combines the two things they like best, computer-gaming and jerking off to porn - but there are also alot of people who take their roleplay very seriously because there is a certain kind of emotional reality to it.