SL Forums: Whose Culture is it Anyway?

Not if the comment is not based on your gender. Equality is being able to call anyone a dickhead when they're being a dickhead.

Usaig, there are "sad people"' all over the world, not just online. I'm sure you know that. From a couple of the responses it's pretty obvious what is going on and it doesn't bother me. I'm not the one who has to live with it.

Yes, SL has grown, with many coming from all walks of life. You are right in thinking that not everyone is going to get along. Certainly not when there is so much wrong with the way humans treat each other. We are not in this world to live up to each other's expectations, however, we still have to live up to our own. If we expect less of ourselves than we do of others, then it is a sad state of things. The fact still remains that if people were to seek some common ground and then expand on it, we'd all find we are not so different. We are each unique in our own ways, but, we are still human and we still need the company and comfort of other humans. If we can't all at least make the effort to get along in a place like SL, it leaves little hope that humans will ever grow beyond (evolve?) the point where we are now. If the human race cannot grow as a whole, then they might as well go ahead and hit that red button and end it all now because there is no point in continuing as things are. Mankind has made a mess of his world and only mankind can clean it up.

Well thats the point i was trying to make sl is like rl with the amount of unhappy people here on sl. They just bring it over in to the game.

The difference to me is... I'd respect the person who came right out with it more, even if they'd just called me a fuckhead.

You know what really irks me?

When people critique others for being insulting, all the while being insulting themselves, in a "wise aunt Trudy" manner. Affecting pity towards others, so as to make themselves feel better about themselves.

meh.

LOL, so sorry, Fade, for completely missing your mention of the ad... see how flustered it has me? I'm in San Francisco and it airs here -- I can imagine it isn't being shown in other markets tho.

Ok then put it out of its sadness this thread.....WOW i love happy endling

*smiles and nods politelly*

Hah hah so would I have in that case. Woulda squashed him like a bug. This leads me to something I wanted to bring up. The only time Ive been told that using profanity some weakened my argument, was by the said Lewis Nerd, after about six posts of mine he seemed unable to find anything in he was able to counter. If my argument was so weak, why was he unable to address a single point other than my use of profanity? From my observations, not just in this case, but others, people pull the language card as a last resort. It's just piss weak.

I've only ever AR'd a single person, and there was no profanity involved. That person was simply being a bully, repeatedly. It was hard to even to it in that case, in Australia, no-one likes a 'dobber'. Siggy I don't see as being the bully Coco claims. He picks on a weak argument, not the weak.

The really funny thing about that ad vivi, is that apparently it didn't even occur to anyone that it might be a problem in other countries until after the campaign was launched. Only then did someone say, whoops, was that a good idea? Maybe they won't get it.

Apologies for multiple sequential posting, but I was sleeping while all this was going down.

Coco you make women sound like weak, pathetic things that can't defend themselves. That's gotta be offensive to any woman who respects herself and knows her worth as a person. I can assure you, the women in my country aren't delicate little petals who feel intimated my a harsh word, they can give as good as they get. What's more, I don't believe that's exclusive to here. My girl's American, and she can hold her own against any man, there's more than once when I've stood back laughing while she takes some dickhead out. Damn I love a strong woman who can hold her own.

please please before its too late

Dear Usagi.... ever since Coco posted... well, just read her posts

too far gone time to bring in the people to remove

Going to condense replies.

You can't say courtesy is just being polite and considerate because what is polite depends on what culture you belong to.

When I lived in Germany a man would enter a restaurant first .. the explanation I heard was that it was a hold-over custom based on the man seeing if it was a "fit" place for a woman to enter. In the U.S. a polite man would hold the door open so the woman could enter first. Which is polite? Bingo - they both are within their cultural context.

So... A German man and American woman go out on a date. (both old-school). He tries to be polite and go in first, she thinks he's opening the door for her - bam!! collision in the doorway. They have just violated each others cultural expectations of right behavior, which they may not even be aware of. They can seeth quietly and assume the other person is a mannerless pig, or they can ask why the other person did that.

I used Siggy because he made a good example and because he has been targeted heavily in this thread by one person. If you see c*nt as a neutral word, then you don't secretly feel bad if someone calls you one, or you use it yourself.

I have to say if someone started armchair analysing me based on my forum presence, I would tell them to bugger off. Your statements seemed very condescending. I've had the pleasure of Siggy spending 10 days as my houseguest and he is as advertised -- what you see is what you get (only he does swear more). IMO it's as rude to attempt to dig through someone's psyche unasked as it is to rifle through their underwear drawer - and about as informative.

On the contrary, I think this thread has been very productive despite the personal stuff and I hope it continues to provoke new trains of thought.

Some good points so far...

The majority of the posters care more about personal attacks than cussing.
Some folks don't like cussing and thinks it makes you appear declasse or ignorant.
We haven't agreed on what the TOS says about this subject
Some folks believe that there is a universal polite standard of behavior, others don't.

Which brings me to the subject of my next post - which I will post from work (after I get off the forums, get dressed and get there!!)

Is there a relationship between monotheism and the belief that there is a universal polite standard of behavior? To paraphrase - One Right Way?

Looking forward to the posts.

To illustrate how polite behavior varys from culture to culture, start a list of things which you know are fine in one culture and rude in another.

Eating with your left hand.
In many Arab and Muslim countries, eating with your left hand is profoundly offensive. This is based on the custom of using your left hand in lieu of toliet paperk, and having a common dish of food. You wash it of course, but the stigma remains. Makes life hard on the lefties.

As you posted this I was thinking about the 'universal' polite standard of behaviour, because a few posters in this and the thread that preceded it were suggesting there was a simple code that was understood by all. I don't believe such a universal code exists at all.

I recall someone citing some extreme universal morals, such as murder and torture are wrong. Not even these are universal. There are countries were it's morally right to stone a woman to death because SHE was raped. In many US states capital punishment is legal. To me, it's still murder. Generally Australians are against the death penalty, and I don't imagine for a second that everyone in the US agrees with it either.

To some of the people posting here, "you're a fucking retard" comes off as a personal attack. At some point tonight when I go to work to someone I like will probably tell me I'm a fuckhead. I don't view it as personal at all, or an attack. A while back I was at a friend's house, and got into a heated but good-natured debate with her mother. Profanity was frequently traded between us, and I wasn't considered rude or disrespectful. I'm sure in many places, it certainly would have been. I'm sure some people would be mortified if I spoke like that to one of their family members, but here, it can be ok if you are well enough acquainted, and depending on the family's culture of origin. It's not even a constant here, we're far too much of a product of immigration.

"Treat others as you would wish to be treated" was suggested, which I'd say is a Christian ethos at it's roots, and maybe that touches on what you're asking Surreal. How we would wish to be treated varies greatly from culture to culture. It's ok with me if you call me a fuckhead, so if I call you a fuckhead I'm just treating you as I would be expected to be treated. Wait, hang on, you don't like to be called a fuckhead? You're offended? Well then I guess it's not ok to treat others as you would expect to be treated.

Nothing is as universal as it may appear to us in our own parts of the world. I'm constantly using expressions that I think are just standard, only to find Ylusive has no idea what I'm talking about, and I have to translate.

These absolutes just don't seem to exist.

You're either special or your not. If you want to get special treatment on any level - be it how men speak around you, how men act, etc, in other words if you want men to change their behavior around you - then you don't get to complain when you aren't treated fairly. It's an all or nothing proposition.

THATS what I refuse to do.

I think it sucks that women get shafted in pay at work. But some of these women complaining about that (not saying you are) are the same women who will sue for sexual harrassment when their co-worker makes a joke about his sexual escapades in a conversation she can overhear.

I'm all for "treat others nicely". I hold the door for anyone if I'm in no hurry, and nobody if I am. But I've also had feminists who have been brainwashed by the ultra-feminists at college here deliberatly change course when I hold a door open and use the one next to it, avoiding looking at me the entire time. And other such things. That pisses me the fuck off.

Agreed. Although I could stand with less farting.


Agreed too. Sadly when one woman overreacts she hurts other women who ARE being harrassed. All genders have fucktards.

This'll sound stupid and corny but, good grief....just be yourself.

I'm not going to waist CPU cycles censoring or filtering anything my human host does....that just causes more lagg. ;-P

So this is about *size*? Is Siggy's forum icon bigger than yours in pixels, or in bits? Or do you mean he's going to show up inworld and tromp you with a giant mecha? It can't be a reference to RL sizes, as Siggy's a mere 6' 4" human . . . puny compared to, say, a great big troll.

It gets old through redundancy and isn't even snicker-worthy anymore, watching some broad continually pick fights so she can wrestle around and get all sweaty with the charismatic badboys of the SL forums (hey, wouldn't that make one hell of a calendar?).

Oh no, YOU BRUTE, no no, you wouldn't dare SEXUALLY HARASS ME oh no and don't KEEP SAYING THOSE NAUGHTY NAUGHTY WORDS and you wouldn't dare no don't you dare PUT YOUR HAND THERE *pant pant pant*



Seriously, now, Coco could just mute these guys and forget them. But no, she posted right in this thread that she likes to fight. She invited Siggy off to SC so she could mudwrestle him under the bridge. She likes -- no, LOVES this stuff. She'd be bored out of her head if they wouldn't play with her, and would have to resort to the played-out "someone once said I was Prok's alt" gambit or the OCD Fairness Rant (player A got 457 jelly beans, but player B got 459 and a higher percentage of red ones, and in order to distribute them more fairly we must have an A. 6-week international talent search; B. 1253-post forum thread with no pictures of bunnies with pancakes on their heads or references to pie; C. a winner-take-all game of Russian Roulette. Because, it's funkin' important, that extra two jelly beans, so important I nearly SWORE).

It's all nonsense for entertainment purposes. And the mods know this, too. And that, my friends, is why this thread is still open.

Or maybe it's cause they're asleep.

Anyway, 10 L$ says Coco follows up by accusing me of "blaming the victim." But I'll give her 500 L$ if she just laughs and moves on.

*Jeopardy theme*

You people are messed up. "You people" - you know who you are.

The OP comments on how how various regional and international cultures might affect behavior on these forums, and whether an ecumenical standard might be applicable, and "you people" turn it into

(1) a flamefest against those you don't like
(2) a fuckfest for those whose backside flesh you regularly like to taste
(3) a shallow essay on curse words, when there's so much more
(4) a contest to see who can be the most cleverly offensive.
(5) an overarching international drama - the kind, in my short experience, I see here every time I check in.

Ask yourselves what sort of virtual culture might produce these reactions every single time someone asks an interesting question.

On the basis of that quote, I guess you fit into category 1!

Well, I'm awake. I started this thread reading the OP, which I intended to respond to with some of my own experiences--needless to say, there's been some really unpleasant disruption and unproductive back-and-forth personal bickering here. We can keep that out of here while discussing our views, I'm sure! Please do. (Yes, I detest the negative redundancy.)

Okay, I come from a Thai background. It's considered extraordinarily rude in my heritage to stick two chopsticks upright in a bowl of rice--it's like, offering it to the spirits or something. Sometimes alleged to bring demons to the dinner table as well. To me, it was just a convenient way of holding my chopsticks (as they are long and finangly things), but I eventually switched to eating with a spoon after being scolded too many times.

Also, being patted on the head. Very common in American sitcoms with affection, EXTREMELY EXTREMELY RUDE TO THE THAI PEOPLE. The head is a holy entity and should not be touched. I had my haircuts done there near temples, with miniature shrines around for blessings. Google for something like disrespectful touch head thai--not a joke.

Saying "fuck" in Thai, phonetically, sounds about the same as the Thai word for "squash"--the vegetable. "Fuck thong" = pumpkin. "Key" in Thai is close to a certain English word for excrement, altho not as rude.

It's very polite in Thai culture to clasp your hands together as if you're praying to someone else, and then bow graciously. Leonardo DiCaprio has done it too. (Incidentally, I went to the same beach that The Beach was filmed at--very pretty.) This is called a "wai". But when I did this to peers in Sunday school, I got a stern talking-to because of how it ressembled "human worship" (?). :\