Upcoming Changes for Adult Content: Main Forum Thread

I agree. It is about attracting a different sort of resident to the mainland however. One that the corps feel will be a better marketing target. The early adoptors flat out told the corps they weren't welcome among the resident businesses, but their ad budgets are too big for LL to ignore. Once the sims are full of the "right people", let the new adfarming begin.

Edit: I see Rayana has pretty much said the same thing, that's what I get for reading from the bottom up

Interesting that since we started pointing out the way the Lindens here have tried to control and guide the discussion with their pr answers, they all seem to have disappeared!!!

So long as there's plenty of freebies for newbies, corporations trying to sell virtual property for real-world prices aren't going to get anywhere.

I went to CompUSA's store in SL and they wanted me to spend more than L$0 on a prim Alienware computer that wasn't even scripted.

I can't see ANY collection of new residents that's going to do anything but laugh at that kind of shenanigans.

Ahnse Chung has been buying and selling Lindens for years on her Dreamland website....and i have seen a few others too.

As someone whose alt avie works directly with said corporate entities, I agree. There are just a couple of basic approaches that work for coporate interests in terms of marketing, and they all involve having exclusive, controlable space. Someone earlier in the list asked about corporate noob landings - in most cases they land on a corporate sim or on a third party orientation island that the corporation has a relationship with so that whole experience can be managed.

PR trained!

The less they say, the less they can be held to.

You'll only see him answer to things that are set in stone and understood already by the majority here.....or directly reciting sections what are already contained on the original blog or from the opening comments in those other 5 threads.

If you're expecting any new information............forget it!

Exactly!! I've been asking for a signup sheet from day 1 of this, nearly a week ago now. And those of us who are just accepting that we'll be at least partially relocated aren't getting any better responses that the angry comments.

Hey LL, where's the signup sheet?

Even at SL prices , or free , I don't want their crap in SL. I would never set foot in a shop tied to one of them.

ok SL is 18+ which IS adult in the USA, sounds more like LL are either republician right wingers or right wing christians...telling someone to move because it's to sexual or too violent is cencorship...and saying you wanna be more family oriented sounds like you fucking sold out to walt fucking disney

Why move the adult content anywhere? SL has been founded on the creativity of the adult community. If there are those offended by adult content then provide a place for them to go rather than inconvenience those who helped put SL where it is today. If one faction doesn't care for Adult content let them not go there. Evidently these are new users or a minority of the users so why put the burden on the paying subscribers, land owners and business community???
It seems since LL got fat on the increased tier fees he is pushing the limits to see how much crap members will take until we have had enough!! SL need remember, they may be good, and we made them good but they are not the only game in town and their numbers will fall faster than they have ever grown. CHANGE FOR THOSE WHO OBJECT NOT FOR THOSE WHO LIVE HERE!!!
What's next? Isolating gays, lesbians, blacks, Chinese, Jews and anyone else who's presence offends the minority??? Get Real Lindens and leave well enough alone. In todays economy you're not going to lure big business into SL with your lame attempts at a puritanical SL to draw them in.

That's not YET correct. LL state that no address information related to the age-verification is stored anywhere. All they keep is a positive/negative-tag.

The moment where I find my RL address, email address or any other data exposed to anyone, I am out of SL. But that's another topic.


Back to adult content:

We already have the tools to mark adult content: SIMs, parcels, and even classifieds can be marked as mature/adult. As can groups.
The problem is that nobody cares. Many people don't flag their content appropriately.

So in theory, all we need is people who control and enforce ToS breaches or wrongfully flagged content, if people are not willing to flag their offers correctly.

I am running adult services myself (although I am not considering this a business -- SL is rather a hobby for me).
But I always wonder why nobody cares that you can easily find XXX content with "mature" UN-ticked in the search.

So once again, the majority of residents have to take the consequences from ignorant behaviour of a few. Deja-vue like the Homestead price increase?

I would happily volunteer to help the Lindens spotting wrongly flagged content and classifieds. But as the most severe "punishment" I've ever heard about was warning people, I doubt that any reports regarding "mis-flagged" content would be read or any further actions taken.

So, probably the Lindens fancy the easier way of punishing thousands of people who run adult content, but stick to the right flags, don't annoy their neighbours (if any, as many of these establishments run their own SIMs), don't wear "explicit" clothes in non-mature areas etc.

Actually I think that re-grouping or re-locating X-rated content into certain areas is the most reasonable approach (please leave isolated private islands untouched, as nobody can walk in by mistake), unless the Lindens get the age-verification system sorted some day. It has been beta for how long? 1.5 years?

But play fair, please, Linden Labs: SIMs which are currently already populated with more than 50% X-rated content AND marked mature shall be moved as-is, and the non-X-rated people/businesses should move out then. Seriously, it's their own fault to put non-mature content on SIMs marked mature.


I don't know why we have this discussion now and not before the age-verification system was introduced. Is it because of plans to merge both grids? Or do some educational institutions pay shitloads of money to be more equal than others (aka Lobbies)?


I'm curious about the outcome, and whether our voices are actually being heard -- would be the first time, as far as I remember. So please, Linden Labs, think twice.

Glad you touched on that.....this part has been missed by many!

For successful Adult businesses located on Mainland or don't own a whole estate sim , the potential financial loss in sales could be huge.
If you had a high ranking position on various keywords in All search which depended on IBL's (e.g Picks)....these will now be broken and you'll have to virtually start from scratch in the new Adult Continent.
It can take months to get those high ALL search positions back....in that time you'll experience a drop in sales, ....thats not to also factor that you're potential audience in future would have shrunk because of non-verification.

Then there are the existing landmark issues which are sitting in 100's maybe 1000's of people's inventories of a wrong location for you Main shop.

Really like in rl......LL should compensate for loss of earnings

Well seems all the angles and questions that can be of the adult content change and suggested variations have been. Barring the fact that none of these will most likely be implemented and Linden will go through with the original change.

How much of a discount do those that have land designated as adult get from the tier payments? I mean obviously adult designated lands should not have the same tier payments if access to these lands is harder to come by. The reason for the tier payment after all is server maintenance and upkeep correct? If this is the case then sims with stricter guidelines for access would obviously have a lower target population then others. That statement at the very least is true, since a new person would not have verified all the info or jumped through the required hoops. So what are we talking for a percentage discount? Since I for one, plan to dump my adult land and revert back to a basic account if there is no balancing factor to this restriction.

Well - having not had the courtesy of an "official" answer to any of my questions posted over the last few days, I guess I'm just goimg to accept and accommodate the planned changes. The wicked side of my character is rather excited about the grief and chaos that will be caused when the proposals are imposed on the largely unsuspecting and unprepared residents of SL. Things will grim.

I have an image of dozens of naked Johnny Noobs complete with traditional noob male appendages forlornly wandering the mainland looking for lap dancing bars and finding only billboards inviting them to enrol at one SL educational institution after another.

I'm afraid contemplating the boundaries of the non-existant distinction between mature and adult is rather too peculiar a concept for my small mind. So I'll be flagging adult and saving myself the agitation.

I realised this is the only way to go after having spent 15 minutes pondering whether toe-sucking poseballs were mature or adult, and whether it would make a difference if the balls were hidden or showing or if the balls had captions above them or not.

Na tempest they are merdging the teen grid with us thats why they are doing all the clean up. We wont be a adult grid much longer maybe 5 months at most.

In reading all the comments here..someone needs to address somthing..and being a business owner who is going to suffer and probably close down due to these changes I will..
I own a store that sells good quality clothing,skins and accesories to new people,dancers,older avi's and many others......My store thrives on the fact that people can just pop in and look around from ALL areas.
If I have to move to an 'Adult Content' sim...I loose all my new customers who are just new people trying to not look horrible...for less money...most of them won't be 'age-verified' and the 'adult content' flag is going to become a stigma of thats where the 'freaks go'.....
If I stay in a 'mature' sim and don't move...I loose all my dancers and strippers who come and shop for inexpensive clothes they can change in and out of daily....
And I loose the lookie-loos who are people stopping by becasue they just were hopping around.
Can someone tell me the benefit to a store owner like me....why it would be good to shuffle us all off??
Why can Linden not give the mainland clubs the power to flag just their clubs as 'adult content' allowing other parts of that sim to be mature??
If its the camming in on activity...how are they going to stop people from camming into private residences??People do that now already....
I benefit from being in a sim where EVERYONE can come and shop.....

I just took a look at "The TAO of Linden" at http://lindenlab.com/about/tao

"It's our mission to connect us all to an online world that advances the human condition."

Segregating adult content to a different continent is in IMO *not* an advancement, but a *huge* step backwards.

"You must not only respect but actively seek out differing views [...]"

Well... again: Segregating adult content is definitely *not* seeking out different views. But it can be considered as trying to suppress them.

"We are blessed by some of the most informed, passionate, committed customers imaginable. They are our reason for being, they are our world, and we call them Residents. They are an insuperable source of advantage and an awesome responsibility."

I wholeheartedly agree with that, but...

"In every choice you make, consider how your choice will impact their experience."

Well... here LL clearly failed.

"We're here because we're open to all the wonders of the world"

Again LL's actions here contradict their words.

"This is a place where you can be you"

*ahem* Not for long if LL continues to implement the planned changes.

"Be thoughtful and transparent."

The "transparent" can clearly be argued in this case.

"We build trust through transparent and open communication."

Same as above...

Heck..probably Blondin doesn't even believe in it.....and if that is the case, how can he argue passionately for the creation of a Adult Continent. He's a paid employee who does his best......and maybe remaining silent is probably his best option in this case!

There is a serious price to pay for "staying the course".

Remember the opensim debacle? You could have stopped selling them - you didn't. You could have found the big offenders and corrected them - you didn't. You could have addressed the problem in a hundred ways. But your solution was to cut the prims and raise the price, following some obsolete management guide from the 60s. What was the result of your stubborness? How many simulators are now sitting offline and unused in Dallas - servers that you are still having to pay for?

The reasons Mainland is being underutilized have little to do with the adult stuff laying around. As you yourself have said, it makes up a small percentage. So marching headlong and without thinking about the problem like you are doing is not going to solve the problem. In fact, it will make things worse. I daresay the loss of income THIS time will force you to shut down parts of mainland, once they are all but abandoned.

You've a problem with mainland. The problem is one of your own making and going back many years. You did not want to be the inworld police, did you? Well, it's too late to change your mind now unless you are ready to accept the loss of income that forcing people who are minding their own business to give up their land will bring you. Most of us moved to islands simply because we needed better controls than were offered on mainland. The banlines and the ads and the griefers - that's what drove us away. It wasn't the sexclubs, although their impact on scripting was certainly a pain.

You've decided on a course once again. And once again, the users are almost unanimously opposed to how you are doing it. And also once again, you appear to be turning a deaf ear to our howling, and seem intent on driving straight ahead, no matter how illogical or damaging that will be. Your refusal to listen to your customers over the voidsim issue has cost you dearly. The damage this time will easily be ten times that, if you keep your blinders on and charge madly toward this cliff.

The definition of Madness is to keep doing the same thing over and over, and expect a different result. We are trying to give you better ways of accomplishing your stated goals. You aren't listening to us... just like you didn't listen in the voidsim disaster. We are willing to be good customers because we do love our virtual world and we want you to succeed. But we can't steer this ship away from the rocks - only you can do that. All we can do is tell you where the rocks are and how to get clear of them.

I would. Obviously, I have.

Apparently there has been a survey and business owners such as yourself have requested the predictability of dealing only with age verified or PIOF residents and, of course, the predictability of having fewer customers in your stores.

and they FAIL to forsee all the lawsuits from parents because their kids were propersitioned for sex by adults, not to mention the increase of pedopholes

Just like Discussion Guiding, another common tactic when dealing with a dissenting public may be happening here. The method of staying quiet LONG ENOUGH that the dissenters calm down and accept their 'fate'. To this I say: Do Not Give Up The Fight.

I have already read many posts where people have claimed that, since they have not heard appropriate responses, they are assuming the worst. This might be what is they hope to achieve. (If you don't hear a response fast enough and assume the worst, your opposition lessens).

Assume that the fight is still on and remain passionate. It is entirety possible that no conspiracy is happening and that the issue is just too complex to really merit precise and satisfactory responses. Or there may be discrimination afoot that sets sexual freedom and expression back 500 years. Either way, do not give up at all and demand better, more interactive debate. - GINA

No way that most SL Residents would EVER accept having their real-world name and address so transparently tied to their Avatar that Coca Cola or any other real-world company could take an order from an AVATAR, and deliver it to that person's real-world name and address.

"Age Verification" does not in any way, shape or form link your real-world name and address to your avatar in a database that anyone can access. If we find that LL and Aristiotle lied about that, you'll see the biggest Identity Theft class action lawsuit in history, in short order.

"Payment Info on File" or "Payment Info Used" with Linden Lab also does NOT give them any right to transparently give our real-world name and address, linked to our avatar account name, to any external company, for any purpose. Again, if they did that, they would have an identity theft lawsuit on their hands of historic proportions.

Sorry, but Ceera Murakami has absolutely ZERO use for "real world merchandise". She's a fictional character. If my Player wants to order real-world merchandise from some company, my Player will deal with that company directly, via that company's website or via their authorized retail locations, and not in any way, shape or form will they go through an ordering interface that relies on Second Life's buggy infrastructure.

I have already started this process and into very large groups too, some of which are my Groups.

The verification process effects every SL adult on the grid....every SL adult has to make their own decision on being verified or not. Be it with whatever system LL chooses or by placing financial details (bank a/c or CC). It effects everyone!

I am just so surprised how many people don't know one iota about what LL are proposing. I was speaking to a couple of renters (Europeans) in my Mall today....neither had any idea! I had to post them links to both the Blog and this forum....1 of them even apologized as she will need a translator to read the blog because of her poor English!!.

Now there lies the problem....a BLOG written in English and is LL's answer to keeping its customer base informed! What percentage would have read that blog? About 1%? .... a bit less than 1% maybe?.....maybe a little bit more than 1%??

Why aren't LL honest enough to place a message on the LOGIN SCREEN with a link to a Blog (translated in all the popular languages) .......so that its entire user base are aware of impending changes.

Why doesn't LL do this? .....you tell me?

Maybe Blondin can answer my very last question on this post!