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Upcoming Changes for Adult Content: Main Forum Thread

Ian Undercroft
Registered User
Join date: 3 Nov 2007
Posts: 86
03-18-2009 15:42
I honestly don't understand this so called private home exception. What if I have an open plot upon which there are no other items save for my sex bed with BDSM, 3 some and every sex position imaginable? How can that not be adult content on any objective basis?
Ilianexsi Sojourner
Chick with Horns
Join date: 11 Jul 2004
Posts: 1,707
03-18-2009 15:42
From: Lady Sakai
OK heres an idea that has been mentioned in various forms numerous times:

Make the new continent completrely PG.
Move the welcome areas there.
Let the buisnesses and Educators use this continent and leave the rest of your customers alone.

Seconded!
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Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
03-18-2009 15:46
From: Ilianexsi Sojourner
I still really don't understand why this 'Adult Continent' is necessary. As I said in a previous thread, I've been in SL almost five years, and in all that time, I have *never* accidentally happened upon extreme sexual or violent content.
I have, there's an open air sex farm one sim south and west of us. Kind of annoying, but they don't wander around and grief the neighbors or lag *our* sim, so what the hell...
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"And now I'm going to show you something really cool."

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Baska Babenco
Registered User
Join date: 11 Apr 2007
Posts: 6
On a serious note
03-18-2009 15:49
I actually think this is a good idea providing that it only effects those "free sex dungeons" that are everywhere. These places DO attract minors and having access blocked to people who have verified there age or provided payment info on file is a good thing.

However, I think most people are concerned about there own "private' land. I engage in BDSM activities in SL and my house has some BDSM furniture. It is on a mature sim for a reason and the outside looks like a normal house to the passerby. I, and many others are concerened that if they get someone who decides to look in one day, sees "perverse" content then files an abuse report.

Another example is that sometimes i like to roleplay being a human puppy and pulled around by a leash attached to a collar. Can I now only goto "adult" areas when I do this?

In PG sims which I frequent on occasion for building contests or shopping I do monitor my behaviour, dress conservativily and get rid of any adult titles and are not leashed etc. I do respect that some people dont want to see adult material in PG sims and I comply.

Do I now have to treat mature sims as PG sims and only feel safe from offending others and getting an abuse report by staying in adult areas?

This is all very confusing and I hope that clarfication is made.
Col Nikolaidis
Registered User
Join date: 22 Jul 2007
Posts: 13
03-18-2009 15:49
From: Urban Haystack
...so let me start by openly stating that I am adamantly in favor of the forced relocation of 'adult' themed content...

I happen to be a big fan of solo-exploratory skydiving. One of my favorite things to do is turn on the audio media stream, TP to an infohub, sail to around 4000 meters pull my chute, and drift around on the simulated winds until I land somewhere, then wander around wherever I've landed. I've found a lot of interesting little spots this way that I never would've found by using that crap-heap of a search engine.

A few days ago, I managed to catch a rather rude surprise. Drifting down on the digital breeze, I pull my cord, hit the ground in a nice, soft landing and find myself in a courtyard, with a fountain and a large building off to the left, devoid of any real markings and some innocent looking sim name displayed in the top bar of the viewer...so I wander in, curious. What greets my eyes was enough to make me physically ill. Roughly a dozen hermaphrodites, (I'm assuming...the ones I noted were herm, I didn't crotch-check everyone before leaving) all engaged in some sort of sexual activity, many of which were well beyond what most people I know would consider 'kinky'. If there's blood involved, it's no longer sex, it's perversion and one should seek therapy if they are getting sexual thrills from such behavior. Hate me if you must. I'll spare you the details of the graphic, violently sexual images depicted on the walls, or the hilarious IM conversation where smeone in the crowd had the nerve to call -me- a pervert because I was wearing a 'furry' avatar. (I don't even -own- any genitalia for it.)

.


A good example of the sort of "reasoning" that appears to have LL incapable of knowing which way to turn. Look in to my eyes Urban, I need you to be paying attention. You have a predilection for randomly dropping in on sims to see "interesting" things you might discover. You dropped in on a place (classification unknown) where people were having what I presume they decided was fun, it didn't look like fun to you. Now Urban, who's problem is that?
Phoenix Welles
Multiple Avatar Disorder
Join date: 6 Jan 2007
Posts: 111
03-18-2009 15:49
another question...

How will the question of adult shops that rent rather than own land be handled? The alt I will need to move is currently renting.

My plans were just to wait and use my remaining tier to acquire some adult land for her as soon as it goes live. But if they are to be handled differently then should I use the remainder of my tier to acquire some land now and donate it to her group?
Brenda Connolly
Un United Avatar
Join date: 10 Jan 2007
Posts: 25,000
03-18-2009 15:50
From: Ian Undercroft
I honestly don't understand this so called private home exception. What if I have an open plot upon which there are no other items save for my sex bed with BDSM, 3 some and every sex position imaginable? How can that not be adult content on any objective basis?


It does seem a bit loopy. The purpose and focus of a sex bed ..is sex. If selling it is an adult activity, and using it in a club or RP area is an adult activity, using it in a home is different how? While I get the idea of seperating business from personal, it still seems a shaky premise to go on. I'm sure there will be misinformed and misguided people who will be filing complaints of private residences. Are you prepared for that?
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Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
03-18-2009 15:56
From: Brenda Connolly
It does seem a bit loopy. The purpose and focus of a sex bed ..is sex. If selling it is an adult activity, and using it in a club or RP area is an adult activity, using it in a home is different how?
And what if my land is owned by a group named "Avalon Lagoon" that also owns a nearby parcel containing a store? Does that mean it's a club instead of a private home? What about group land that has group members homes in it?
_____________________
Argent Stonecutter - http://globalcausalityviolation.blogspot.com/

"And now I'm going to show you something really cool."

Skyhook Station - http://xrl.us/skyhook23
Coonspiracy Store - http://xrl.us/coonstore
Ian Undercroft
Registered User
Join date: 3 Nov 2007
Posts: 86
03-18-2009 15:57
From: Baska Babenco
"I actually think this is a good idea providing that it only effects those "free sex dungeons" that are everywhere. These places DO attract minors and having access blocked to people who have verified there age or provided payment info on file is a good thing.

However, I think most people are concerned about there own "private' land. I engage in BDSM activities in SL and my house has some BDSM furniture. It is on a mature sim for a reason and the outside looks like a normal house to the passerby. I, and many others are concerened that if they get someone who decides to look in one day, sees "perverse" content then files an abuse report."

This is similar to my own position Baska. I have a private estate with a large building which I call my "Chamber of Horrors" and which is full of stuff that might loosely be described as BDSM. I use my estate for no commercial purpose but anyone tp-ing there could access that building. My own assessment is that the contents of the building are "adult". In fact, I don't see how any reasonable person, approaching the assessment honestly and objectively could conclude otherwise. I feel that I ought to reclassify my estate as adult and this will result in me evicting friends who I allow to live rent free in buildings on other parts of the island and who have no PIOF or age verification. It's all very concerning.
Rene Erlanger
Scuderia Shapes & Skins G
Join date: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 2,008
03-18-2009 15:57
From: Tali Rosca
A short and descriptive sentence as the logon/teleport message would be one way. Just please don't hide it with some clever spin like the "more predictable" word game, but make it clear that what could arguably end up as a major policy change about day-to-day behaviour is about to go down.



It's my belief if the entire userbase were aware of the impending policy changes, there would be far greater uproar...and LL would be caned!

As it stands now, the part saying "we listened to our customers" could quite easily mean we recieved 500 complaints from our current userbase of 500,000 regarding Adult content in world......which justifies a policy change.....which funnily enough coincides with our CEO's roadmap vision of where SL needs to go.

The Open Space SIM scam at the end of day only effected several hundred SIM owners and a few thousand disgruntled residents living on them.......the "Verification" process effects every single adult person in SL! Every SL adult needs to make that choice!

If my little Portuguese friend Humberto spends most of his SL life having pixel sex in public sex area, he really needs knows that in the not to distance future he might have to drop a "cartão de crédito" (Credit card) to continue his little pixel gratification!
Brenda Connolly
Un United Avatar
Join date: 10 Jan 2007
Posts: 25,000
03-18-2009 16:02
From: Argent Stonecutter
And what if my land is owned by a group named "Avalon Lagoon" that also owns a nearby parcel containing a store? Does that mean it's a club instead of a private home? What about group land that has group members homes in it?


And if those group members decide to get together at your home for some....you know? ;) When does a home become a free sex club?
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Matthew Dowd
Registered User
Join date: 30 Jan 2007
Posts: 1,046
03-18-2009 16:03
From: Blondin Linden
No. Residents who have more risque toys in their private homes will not have to move. Sorry for raising the red flag of concern.


Like others, I'm curious whether this distinction will be made in practice - will a private home which hosts a lot of parties ARed by an annoyed neighbour get mistaken for a public location?

This is not idle speculation, LL does not have a good track record when it comes to consistency of policy enforcement. When LL banned gambling, they made it clear in the blog, forums and knowledgebase that the ban did not apply to any games reconfigured to be free to play. Yet, when the ban was implemented free to play game were sometimes repeatedly delete by Lindens, and in some cases accounts were suspended due to them having free to play games on their land.

Many are legitimately worried, therefore, that LL will not be consistent over adult content, and that the only way to be sure of avoiding unexpected deletion (and possible loss) of content or suspension (or worse) without warning, will be either to avoid any adult content, or move to the adult continent.

Matthew
Kazimir MacMoragh
Registered User
Join date: 10 Oct 2008
Posts: 34
03-18-2009 16:03
From: Baska Babenco
I actually think this is a good idea providing that it only effects those "free sex dungeons" that are everywhere. These places DO attract minors and having access blocked to people who have verified there age or provided payment info on file is a good thing.


True. Except that instad they will turn into "Private, membership-only sex dungeon" and require group memebership to access. Of course the group will be free to join.

"No Mr. / Mrs. Linden, I'm not running a public location. It's just for me and my 1000 closest friends".
Lady Sakai
Registered User
Join date: 19 Oct 2006
Posts: 22
03-18-2009 16:03
From: Rene Erlanger
It's my belief if the entire userbase were aware of the impending policy changes, there would be far greater uproar...and LL would be caned!

As it stands now, the part saying "we listened to our customers" could quite easily mean we recieved 500 complaints from our current userbase of 500,000 regarding Adult content in world......which justifies a policy change.....which funnily enough coincides with our CEO's roadmap vision of where SL needs to go.

The Open Space SIM scam at the end of day only effected several hundred SIM owners and a few thousand disgruntled residents living on them.......the "Verification" process effects every single adult person in SL! Every SL adult needs to make that choice!

If my little Portuguese friend Humberto spends most of his SL life having pixel sex in public sex area, he really needs knows that in the not to distance future he might have to drop a "cartão de crédito" (Credit card) to continue his little pixel gratification!


LMAO ... "pixel gratification" .. good one that ;)

(sorry just had to comment on that one, it just illustrates so well how comepletely insane this is )
Col Nikolaidis
Registered User
Join date: 22 Jul 2007
Posts: 13
Staying with the issue of definitions - adult
03-18-2009 16:14
I've been told that the fundamental thing LL is struggling with is a definition of adult, with the inference that how this is defined needs to cater for the "delicate flowers" who would rather not see anything that has a sexual element. (The enormous difficulty in catering for every person's delicacy on this is patently obvious, but I'm going to ignore that.)

Mature, adult, weirdo sexual, perverse fun: it don't matter what you call it. There is already an age verification thingy. Mature means what it says. Not for children or the emotionally bankrupt.

(Sorry about my sarcasm, but really, this whole issue is madness.)

Define "mature" as sims where everything may occur or be built or sold, other than child pornography, child prostitution or any other activity that could be reasonably considered as promoting sex with children. Add that despite the definition of a mature region an owner of a property in that region is at liberty to ban whatever behaviour or appearance that owner chooses to act on. Absolve any builder or seller of objects in a mature region from responsibility for any use of that object outside of a mature region, for the obvious reason that it is ridiculous to expect a builder/seller to police the use of the stuff they build or sell.

Instead of whisking owners of sims to "naughty SL" regions, make everyone in a mature region who prefers not to be in a sim with the definition I've mentioned to move to a PG or whatever classified sim or just suck it up and deal with it.
Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
03-18-2009 16:18
From: Brenda Connolly
And if those group members decide to get together at your home for some....you know? ;) When does a home become a free sex club?
I suspect it's when it's advertised as a free sex club, but I'd really like to get an official word on that.
_____________________
Argent Stonecutter - http://globalcausalityviolation.blogspot.com/

"And now I'm going to show you something really cool."

Skyhook Station - http://xrl.us/skyhook23
Coonspiracy Store - http://xrl.us/coonstore
Rene Erlanger
Scuderia Shapes & Skins G
Join date: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 2,008
03-18-2009 16:18
From: Argus Collingwood
Wouldn't that depend on what price the new land will be sold at? [assuming there will be land for sale there too] Interesting concept ~supply and demand;-)



I think you're being pedantic....you honestly think a 1024sqm on the new Adult continent would sell for anywhere near of the amounts paid for on Bay City or Nauticulus regions?
Vorren Voltaire
General Contractor
Join date: 4 Jul 2006
Posts: 78
03-18-2009 16:26
Maybe I'm over simplifying things but it seems to me that if its not public access or not listed in search or listed as Residential it's a private residence.
If not, its something else.


Is it really that hard to define?
Brenda Connolly
Un United Avatar
Join date: 10 Jan 2007
Posts: 25,000
03-18-2009 16:29
From: Vorren Voltaire
Maybe I'm over simplifying things but it seems to me that if its not public access or not listed in search or listed as Residential it's a private residence.
If not, its something else.


Is it really that hard to define?


Remember who we are talking about here. And conceding your point, it doesn't account for the wayward busybody/do gooder who won't make that distiction. Are the Providers ready to deal with those situations?
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Don't you ever try to look behind my eyes. You don't want to know what they have seen.

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Kara Spengler
Pink Cat
Join date: 11 Jun 2007
Posts: 1,227
03-18-2009 16:32
From: Col Nikolaidis
A good example of the sort of "reasoning" that appears to have LL incapable of knowing which way to turn. Look in to my eyes Urban, I need you to be paying attention. You have a predilection for randomly dropping in on sims to see "interesting" things you might discover. You dropped in on a place (classification unknown) where people were having what I presume they decided was fun, it didn't look like fun to you. Now Urban, who's problem is that?


Yes, a lot of us like exploring the grid somehow. But if we see something we do not like it is not the fault of whoever created the thing. To be offended by what that person liked would make as much sense as saying they had to do whatever amused you.
Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
03-18-2009 16:34
From: Kara Spengler

To be offended by what that person liked would make as much sense as saying they had to do whatever amused you.
Simon Says, "Hop on one leg."
_____________________
Argent Stonecutter - http://globalcausalityviolation.blogspot.com/

"And now I'm going to show you something really cool."

Skyhook Station - http://xrl.us/skyhook23
Coonspiracy Store - http://xrl.us/coonstore
Lance Corrimal
I don't do stupid.
Join date: 9 Jun 2006
Posts: 877
03-18-2009 16:35
From: Kazimir MacMoragh
Please don't take this as being sarcastic, but why not? What is the property of a private home makes it private and not public, when everything in SL is essentially public?



how about this, you take your girlfriend and come over to my SL home and have fun on my sex bed, and my psyke orb explains the concept of SL privacy to you?
or in less words, "coitus interruptus". if you even get that far in ten seconds.
Kazimir MacMoragh
Registered User
Join date: 10 Oct 2008
Posts: 34
03-18-2009 16:35
From: Vorren Voltaire
Maybe I'm over simplifying things but it seems to me that if its not public access or not listed in search or listed as Residential it's a private residence.
If not, its something else.


Is it really that hard to define?


I think that in a world where physical laws don't apply (teleportation, remote cameras, etc.) "public access" is actually rather hard to define. As I mentioned in an earlier post, unless a parcel is on a private estate, has ban lines around it, or a security orb that ejects people who enter it, *every* parcel in SL could be considered "public access".
Kazimir MacMoragh
Registered User
Join date: 10 Oct 2008
Posts: 34
03-18-2009 16:38
From: Lance Corrimal
how about this, you take your girlfriend and come over to my SL home and have fun on my sex bed, and my psyke orb explains the concept of SL privacy to you?
or in less words, "coitus interruptus". if you even get that far in ten seconds.


Then your SL home is clearly private. I never meant to imply otherwise.

But what about all the people who haven't bothered to place a security orb in their home for whatever reason. Are they now public by default? How many uninvited-but-not-unwelcome visitors does a parcel need to have before it's considered public? How many "friends" do I need to have that use my home before it's considered a public location?

*ding*... I just figured it out... this is all actually a clever plot by the security orb makers to boost sales.
Ian Undercroft
Registered User
Join date: 3 Nov 2007
Posts: 86
03-18-2009 16:40
Just checking out of curiosity my land. I have a set of 3 large couches offering poseball main menu options of, amongst others, 4-some, Fetish, Bondage, 3-some and Hardcore. Adult surely, or then again, seemingly not if there is no commercial activity on my land? The situation and uncertainty is completely bonkers.
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