Feedback on Ad Farm post

It would be an ok solution if LL wasn't doing something about malicious ad farmers. The problem I've always had with muting it that everybody has to do it.

Sure, you can mute the evil neighbors but any time you have guests, they'll need to do it, too. In any kind of high-traffic area, this just isn't a great solution. Not a horrible one but not a great one, IMO.

Alright, I will stipulate that they should have had the initial forethought to at least compensate or prorate those who have islands on order, and maybe some recent purchasers. However, they did, and it didn't take months/years worth of pressure to get it, either. As such, regardless of their initial aim, they made good on it enough to satisfy most everyone, save for the few who lost their shirt in region flipping.



The land value I am talking about most is what I *do* with the land. If I am trying to have a home or a store, then the value of that activity existing there is devalued when it is surrounded by spam and chopped land. I've paid an average of L$8/sqm for my half-sim. I pay around L$1/mo/sqm. I have already paid more in tier for my land than it cost me to buy. While I would like to think that I could get some portion of that purchase price back, I am not going to scream too loudly if I can get cheaper land elsewhere.

Yes, adfarms also contribute to the financial devaluation of the plot for the purposes of resale, but when I talk about devaluation, I am not solely talking about that specific value.

To me, the value that hurts the most (and makes the most difference in the long term) is tier. Initial cost is largely irrelevant to that cost (especially for private estates, where tier presently outstrips it in a rather short 3 and 1/3 months).

I most certainly did not! That would mess up the scenic pond on the other side of the wall and more.

Regardless, maybe you would be nice enough to come by and remove the crater so that your land is level with the rest of it. That would be the neighborly thing to do.

You donate your time to what exactly?
Something worthwhile?


If that is your true goal then why have you destroyed your reputation, as real businessmen although they can be ruthless beyond belief, do recognize that maintaining a clean reputation is essential.



For the majority of users the return is very small, when compared to time spent working in world, most people are here for their enjoyment.
Advertising will always boost business, in all of it various forms, thats why the lindens are not banning it.
You may think so, but I am sure its more likely to repair the economy.
No mainline company will touch a network of untargeted, embarrassing adverts controlled by someone who's name has become mud.
That is not name calling BTW but a statement of fact, hopefully you will take that on board and attempt to repair the damage you have made to your own reputation.



I am certainly not jealous of you, I just don't like the way you act, sometimes the better half of me feels sorry for you and other times I would wish to see you punished for the disregard you show to every other user.
The disdain you show to new members is rather misplaced as if they do not enter SL then the profitable network you dream of supposedly can and will never be.
SL simply doesn't have enough users at the minute to be making the returns you envisage.



So at least we agree on one thing, Advertising if thats what you choose to call it did get out of hand and has forced the Lindens to act the way they now are.
Yes he is paying tier but next to nothing in reality thats what allows that form of extortion to flourish, I indirectly hold a few 16sqm plots with information boards on them.
These plots cost me nothing effectively, so I can hold them for ever and a day, just the same way you can yours.
The difference is I am not doing it to hold out for that big pay day, yes it does distort view and decrease plot value, because as you well know any owner of the surrounding land cannot edit the terrain of your 16sqm plot and nor can they build anything on it.



No I would be in shock as here in the UK. I would be very surprised if he put his house up for sale in USD.
LOL
Thats a joke BTW I know its probably not a very good one but I am getting a little tired now.





You are right, sorry for calling you names, I cannot remember doing it, I apologize again and hope to have redeemed myself a little bit.

The issue of parcel muting that we have discussed is the ability to do it at the parcel level. If you are the owner of a parcel and you choose to visually mute a parcel/avatar(including all their objects), anyone on your property would no longer be able to see objects on this parcel/owned by this avatar.

You're joking... right?

Right, well, we're doing you a favor by stopping you from continuing to poison your own well.

(And "dreamer" wasn't really the first name that came to mind.)

Let's give Robo the chance to do something good for the first time in his second life!

[Edit] Other possibility: He could sell her the 32sqm for a reasonable price so she can fill the holes herself. At the moment the land is for 5000 Lindens.

I own 2 microplots on mainland myself to hold my SLX magic boxes. I payed 69 each. THAT's what I call a reasonable price!

First off all, thanks to everybody who showed up for yesterday's meeting. The fact we had to move to an estate sim (Thx Simeon Beresford ! ) because of a full mainland sim even before the start says enough. Over 50 avatars present at a meeting ! Are you watching LLC ? It proves many people truly feel involved and are willing to cooperate to solve this gridwide problem . Let us give you a short summary of the points that were discussed:

1- Forum Thread - Overall people were very pleased with this forum thread by Jack Linden but still many people have doubts. We cant blame them, as the cuttings will still continue and the announcements of some ad farmers looking to get a license throws a dark pall over the situation.

2- Recylcing Small Plots - We expect many microparcels to be dumped around the 1st of October. The Arbor Project, Direct Action Land Repair and other land recovery organizations will do what they can to absorb some of the surplus in preparation for recycling it to other landowners. To make sure these groups can hold the land for a while, some extra tier may be needed. Some landbarons among us have offered to donate some extra tier, or have already. We also encourage you all to spread the word about these organizations so a lot of land can be restored. Offering help to LLC in the reclamation process is a subject that will be approached with them.

3 - Advertisement License - When licenses are offered finally, we have decided to request some for ourselves. The more licenses held by responsible organizations, the less that will be available for those who have shown that they cannot be trusted to operate in a responsible manner.

4 - Mass AR's - It seems that when you file an Abuse Report at the same time with several avatars that you will get a quicker response. In urgent cases we can use the group chat to mobilize people to assist in getting gross issues resolved promptly.

5 - Celebration Party - We don't want to cheer that loud already now, but there will be a major event/some major events when this policy comes through. Several have offered their land to host and if anyone is interested to help organize this feel free to contact us.

6 - End of Ad Zoo -The Ad Zoo group will continue to exist. Most of the communication about ad farms will go through the Arbor Project but the Ad Zoo will continue with its weekly meetings. The Zoo itself will be renovated in time, but will remain functional, both as a monument to the past, and also to monitor future problems. In other words, the Zoo is not going away, although we naturally will need to adjust its purpose and focus to reflect the changing environment and landscape (pun intended). We also encourage Ad Zoo members to become part of Arbor as well.

For all those who missed the meeting, here is the link : http://www.d-zyn.nl/Meetings/adfarmmeeting.log

Not at all! I am very sincere that I would like his crater hole repaired so it blends with the surroundings like it did when he just had the ban lines. When he was forced to remove the ban lines by LL a month ago, he did come by and put them away, but sunk the 32 sqm parcel at the same time, and for what reason?

I am just asking. I will inform everyone if he is nice about it

Troll!

Anyway, if someone drags down the value of your land then that is harrassment, its ghettoisation, it's pretty retarded.

Shocker of the week that I agreed with ROBO, yes LL please bring in more people. Where we disagree though is that I believe the place wil be a lot more appealing without people who rp businessmen and do al they can to bend rules and actually break the law, we'll come to gambling soon but be sure those devices are illegal and no amount of "linden approved" will stand up in court. To Luke, you should try reading Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act 2006 - Safe Port Act.

http://www.rules.house.gov/109_2nd/text/hr4954cr/hr49543_portscr.pdf

That's why it wasnt LLs decission to make. Maybe the US government are communists nao?

**anecdote alert**
There was a time we had a 1/4 roadside for sale, I TP'd in and found a well known cutter and ejected him and removed it from sale. Five minutes later now ex ad farmer / current bay city price inflation expert appeared and told us how we shouldnt pick on poor adfarmer and how they would soimply buy the plot next door and fill that. Queue slbay signs, bte global signs popping up right next to us. So these people are only interested in harrassing.

Also for the people obsessed with throwing money at issues and how much licenses will cost, I for one would be much happier with an emphasis on conditions rather than cost. Again I agree, one of those conditions would be all of the proven extorters of micro parcels and the actual ad farmers should be denied/ banned/ crucified, whatever.

Another thought is that people who arent doing well talk about money all the time, thats why you dont hear people who are, they keep it to themselves and get on with it instead of banging on about free markets and being allowed to keep up their questionable practices.

For the talent challenged though that need to sell shares in their "company" and have other people pay for their extortion, I feel sorry for you, maybe you should have stuck in at school.

What if we bought the mainland land before private islands or adfarmers existed?

I'm sure you've got a rationale as to why we're the suckers in that case, too.

Maybe you're the one taking the risk, buying 16m2 plots on a Linden controlled estate that could be regulated at any time, to mark up, and forming a business model around that?

Yes it is all about money, dirty grubby greed, with no thought of any other person, that is the thought that fills the mind of an extortionist.

NOT

The time someone has put into their own creations on their land.
All this time they spent from learning to build in the first place, then formulating a design, slowly making that design become a virtual reality.

NOT

The feelings of that person, when they see their virtual dream collapse, as huge glowing blocks appear all around them.

NOT

Any form of moral decency, because morals cost money cut into the profit margins that are theoretically possible.





Then we look at the other side, four separate frames of thought :-

A.) Angry and as a matter of principle unprepared to pay for the virtual dream to be restored, but prepared to fight in the hope that one day a little virtual justice might be take place.
(People with this thought are many of the ones posting here and that worked tirelessly to help the Lindens see this step was necessary )

B.) Upset feeling under pressure, cannot bear to see their dream shattered so they cave in, pay figures that are just unrealistic because they really don't care about the money its a secondary concern compared to the dream they created.
(These people ruled by their hearts did what many call feeding the beast and I like to think allowed the beast enough rope to hang itself)

C.) Angry fed up, feel cheated by LL so sell up, or abandon land these are the people who think practically, its not worth that I am not paying so I either leave altogether or move somewhere else.
(These people again allow LL to watch a worrying trend and lead us to this point)

D.) Then finally there are a few people who don't really care just move into a sky box and carry on as before.
(Nothing wrong with this, at times I wish I was part of this category but they didn't help to stop the problem)


Rarely though do any of these victims worry about money, and the loss of it they experience at the hands of ADfarmers.
Their main concerns are the value of their SL experiences.
Because they are here to enjoy themselves not make fortunes.
These are the very people who spend money and make the economy of second life.

Its called RL. Some of you cry babies need to log in some time and check it out.

I have read through most of the banter and name calling and I see a virtual highschool in here. Where the heck is Screech? LOL

I understand if some of you just don't have a life but come on! You should read the crap you all post here when it is supposed to be feed back and suggestions.

Seems to me most of you like to do the blame game. Maybe I should start a grid called THE NAME GAME. Then you all would have a place to come and crap on each other.

Seriously... get a RL

Can't wait to see the IQ raise in here after this post.

Look, if you can't be bothered to read the thread how do you expect people to take you seriously? I suggested this several times, at a PARCEL level. Why at a parcel level? Because businesses need to be able to mute an entire parcel from EVERYONE in their shop to keep from being subject to extortion by an advertising griefer.

My proposal is to eliminate you and your compatriots entirely, remove everything you or your alts have built, delete all of your assets and prevent you from ever entering SL again.

Some might consider that a little half-hearted, but I must admit, I can be rather over-kind at times.

This is the sort of behavior that lead me to refer to him as a grubby little man.

not as name calling per say but to show his thought process is grubby if people see what I meant.

That's why the proposal is for the mute-list to be associated with the *parcel*, not the *avatar*. When you visit the parcel, you wouldn't see anything on any other parcel that had been muted from that parcel.

done ! ...

I'm sure this would need a major change in server/ viewer architecture. We all know the danger of those updates concerning stability. So, why risk further weeks of "public beta testing" instead of just kick the griefer's asses?

The JIRA and discussion of visual muting was before LL decided to finally take physical action against these extortionists.

Somehow I don't think they meant it that way.

LoL

Said the man who offered no ideas or suggestions, but rather a stream of insults and blame. Seriously, did you even read that before you hit "submit reply"?

I believe the add farm ban will be great for SL. Just curious as to why a 16sq/m lot was auctioned off the other day? Would it be better to support your decision by also banning auctions of less that 256 sq/m?

It is better to auction them off than throw them on the market at a severely reduced price and watch a landbot snatch them up.