Feedback on Ad Farm post

/me turns the other cheek.

Christians trashing the landscape just like other ad farmers does make people think. It makes people dislike said Christians. Maybe it even helps to turn people away from Christianity. You are right; a service has been provided.

It is fair for you to ask but the decision lies with the Lindens as to what they deem acceptable under their TOS.

Personally I don't feel harassed as such by adverts in general, but just that I don't like them and wish they were not there or made with a little bit more consideration.

Thats what I thought this policy was all about forcing advertisers to govern themselves in this context as clearly they seem to be unable to do it themselves.


Many builds in SL I look at it and wish they weren't there, but they are and not purely to harass me, someone built that for a purpose and whether it is to my taste or not is irrelevant.

This is the case with Mark Edwards signs they have a reasonable purpose, possibly they may be of poor design, an inconsiderate size or placement, I don't know as I have never seen one, that is a matter for the Lindens to decide, but certainly they don't appear to be placed with the intention of harassment.


Where I consider the term Harassment to come into play is where a person builds something for the sole purpose of upsetting someone or to force a sale of land, that doesn't seem to be the case with Mark Edward, but if it were an issue then LL will hold the details that prove otherwise and will no doubt act accordingly.

Don't we seem to be way off topic here.

In the UK we rarely have legal action taken for trivial things like this.
This is a discussion about the advertising proposal isn't it?

IF there is some strange conspiracy to sue on religious grounds then it is fairly unlikely the perpetrator of such a plan is in fact religious.

In which case this should come out in a court of law and the action be thrown out, if any sanity is involved.

So can we stop making aspersions about this man please.

It is not very nice, why can't you just give him the benefit of the doubt?

Group Notice From: MarkEdward Harvey

In yet another attempt to drive small parcel owners who use advertising or billboards out of business to make way for the big guys (SL CEO ex CEO of www.organic.com), once again there will be a struggle to keep the Gospel Message Billboards alive in SL. Please contact Jack Linden and let him know how you feel. Prayer would help

Please forward this message.

Because with each post he makes it more and more difficult to do so?

Isnt every post here is to Jack, and it is quite obvious that people are stating their position on advertising. Pls be part of the solution and not the problem.

Of course. However, they take certain matters, like religion issues and intolerance, pretty seriously.



I do. No matter if they are trying to sell me a hammock or salvation from eternal damnation. I get enough SPAM email, phonecalls, doorbell ringers, etc trying to sell me crap in RL (that includes all the kinds listed above, too). When they don't take "No, go away" as an order, I get rather hostile.



Absolutely, not matter what they are advertising.



Advertisers (and proselytizers) believe they have a purpose, a "mission", if you will, to inform people about something important to them. This isn't about the message they are spouting, but instead about how and where they are spouting it. Yes, taste is irrelevant, but where it crosses the line is when it is put in someone's space involuntarily, and there is nothing that those constantly and reluctantly exposed to said message can do to absolve themselves of it. Sometimes, people's right to express "purpose" does not trump others' right to not be subjected to such expression. THAT is why we have rules against harassment. Don't think for a minute that someone who puts up a laggy, spammy, garish build on their plot can't be ARed for it and have it removed.



*sigh* I am sure you and he believe it is reasonable. I don't share that belief. When it comes to religion, it is REAL easy to cross the line from being informative to harassing. It is best to literally keep religious beliefs out of the public eye, and most ESPECIALLY out of people's faces, because they WILL cause controversy, no matter how bright, positive, or subtle the message.



Advertising, by its very nature, is intrusive. It is intended to insert itself into your stream of consciousness and grab your attention. As such, the step from doing that to becoming harassing is all too short. Phonecalls, people knocking on your door, people filling your email inbox, people putting large, garish signs outside your front door or bedroom window, et cetera. All of that, without your tacit consent can easily be considered harassing, ESPECIALLY when it is done to excess, and that's usually the way advertising ends up, because people just don't know when enough is enough, and everyone has a different threshold. My threshold is VERY low. I admit that. However, I have lived a LONG life full of plenty of "advertising" that goes so far over the line that it is pathetic. Telemarketers hate me, and I make sure they have every reason to. Email spammers.. oh gads, they had better PRAY that I never meet them in RL, as there WILL be violence. > As such, my low threshold is where just about ANY non-consentual advertising crosses the line into harassment by default. I know that advertisers of all kinds can't help themselves to act responsibly and respect the wishes of those they target. They only have themselves to blame when the rest of us finally convince the government to help us wish them all into the cornfield.

So, as you see, it is not simply about intended purpose, but also about the effects of their otherwise "purposeful" actions. I have no doubt that advertisers (that includes religious ones, too) have what they feel is a legitimate purpose to do whatever they do, but when its effects start to hurt people, IT NEEDS TO STOP. Period. End of story.

You are implying that they are going after you because of your religious background: that is fallacy. They've been very clear that the issue is not some to go against a dominant religion. So, like others said.. have fun with that.

christians are not tolerant of other people's religions, they feel the need to spread the "good" word of their demigod to whomever they "feel" should be "saved" they ahve no respect for other people's beliefs or practices. if someone does not worship their demigod then they are considered false believers and told they will be going to hell. most religious fanatics RL here know not to preach at my door for they will be shot at for tresspassing.

PLEASE???!!!

nice jubjub brag and complain just what i would expect from an adfarmer/extortionist "child" that can only try and feel bad forhimself instead of improving oneself you only degrade yourself by speaking, so why not just keep silent b4 you get yourself in deeper than you can handle.

nice jubjub brag and complain just what i would expect from an adfarmer/extortionist "child" that can only try and feel bad forhimself instead of improving oneself you only degrade yourself by speaking, so why not just keep silent b4 you get yourself in deeper than you can handle.

You know that you are welcome to apply to LL for a license for your billboards under the new system, just like everyone else, right? You might consider it discrimination if and only if they turn you down for a license. You are an advertiser - you are advertising religion. And you should be, and so far have been, treated exactly the same way as everyone else who has something to advertise.

I see a lot of people, reasonable people even, advocating for continuing to use those 16 sq.m. lots on mainland roadside as adfarms - licensed adfarms.

While this at first makes me cringe, I can see that it may work under very tightly controlled conditions, and maybe it is something that should be considered as a compromise. I'd be glad to see advertising gone from everywhere except inside established businesses and clubs targeted to the clientele, but if licensed advertising is allowed to continue on mainland microplots, I would strongly suggest the following:

1. ONLY allow it on parcels directly adjacent to Linden Roads. Not on the parcels behind those, and certainly not in the middle of sims with no roads for hundreds of meters around!
2. They must be attached to the ground somehow. No floating, spinning cubes. A reasonable height limit should be in place as well.
3. NO PARTICLES OR LIGHT!!! Full bright is sufficient for people to see.
4. Signs should only be visible from the roadside - there's no need for advertising on the backsides of these signs. The backs of signs should be a neutral texture (wood, etc.) or transparent.
5. No 'mature' content. Even in a mature sim, I thought that mature content was supposed to be behind closed doors, not out on billboards for everyone to see.

Lindens, you may also want to look at the issue of people who dump a BIAB on a microparcel and set it to spinning for sale while the land is also for sale. While I would resist the idea of setting minimum parcel sizes for commerce, it seems pretty clear that a rotating BIAB on the 16 sq.m. parcel is meant to serve the same function as an adfarm, and I woudn't be surprised to see a lot more of this after your new restrictions go into effect.

Hello all! I have been away for a little while and see that I last posted on page 12. It is now page 36. Here is my Resident Question, if I may submit one: has anything occurred apart from adfarmers trying to justify themselves - in other words, is it actually worth my time reading fourteen pages?

Depends on how much popcorn you have on-hand.

Not really very much.

Odd, because, you know, all of these discussions have proved so _productive_ in the past. I have always enjoyed the educational back and forth of "you are a horrible spammer" / "I'm making money and you can't do anything". I would have thought that the addition of "this is SO UNFAIR" would not make that much difference. Oh well.

all the same no need to read them all

Um, twenty-four pages, sorry for my poor arithmetic.

My other question - rather tricky to answer I am aware - is: at what post did Jack Linden stop reading this thread?

Very early on but didnt he say in the blog that he wouldn not be replying for awhile due to SLCC or such? But he did say he would be reading

Thats quite untrue actually.




Couldn't agree more.

We are here to help the Lindens make a fair SL for all users, so we are now leaving the topic completely



Mark Edward please help to make SL better for all users, the Lindens are trying to help and are certainly not discriminative even if other posters in this forum seem to be.

Any antagonism looks bad on all sides whether over religious beliefs or advertising rights.

Childishness and greed are part of what made this policy necessary, further bickering just goes to show it is a necessary step.

We should be united in a common goal to help the Lindens stop some of the inconsiderate behavior that is carrying on in world.

I would hope that Jack is going keep zoning only on new sims and not zone the existing mainland, like he said in his Aug. 5 post.

Post #160 on page 11

gets my vote very similar to my own views