Just occured to me - who are any of us to judge who else is in love? In SL or elsewhere.
Pie ( . . . and as numerous threads here have demonstrated, the appearance of "love" is soooo easy to fake)
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Pie Serendipity
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03-09-2009 13:31
Quite. You can only judge others by their actions . . . Pie ( . . . and as numerous threads here have demonstrated, the appearance of "love" is soooo easy to fake) |
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Lindal Kidd
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03-09-2009 13:31
Not quite right Lindal. The Ancient Greeks had four words for love (you left out philia and storge) and one for lust, which is thelema *not* eros, sorry, whatever CS Lewis said. Pie (It's even more frivolous to love Bruce Willis or a dog than chocolate) Not having studied Greek, I concede your remarks. I was quoting Lewis, not Homer. "Philia" is obviously the equivalent for the frivolous use of "love". "I love (philia) chocolate". "I love (philia) what you've done with this room." I have no idea what "storge" is; it sounds like what I put things in...like attic storge, you know. I also concede that there is a subtle difference between lust and erotic love...which, obviously, is why the Greeks had separate words for them. Lust is generally a passion of the moment. Erotic love, "being in love", can last for weeks or months. Either one must eventually be supplemented with agape; they are not sufficient of themselves to base a lifetime relationship on. But it is NOT more frivolous to love Bruce than chocolate. How dare you say such a thing! _____________________
It's still My World and My Imagination! So there.
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Pie Serendipity
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03-09-2009 13:32
I didn't know we were arguing. You might as well have been quoting from The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind. Pie (Having a difference of opinion is different again) |
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Argent Stonecutter
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03-09-2009 13:35
Making an argument is very different from arguing. _____________________
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Pie Serendipity
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03-09-2009 13:39
Not having studied Greek, I concede your remarks. I was quoting Lewis, not Homer. "Philia" is obviously the equivalent for the frivolous use of "love". "I love (philia) chocolate". "I love (philia) what you've done with this room." I have no idea what "storge" is; it sounds like what I put things in...like attic storge, you know. I also concede that there is a subtle difference between lust and erotic love...which, obviously, is why the Greeks had separate words for them. Lust is generally a passion of the moment. Erotic love, "being in love", can last for weeks or months. Either one must eventually be supplemented with agape; they are not sufficient of themselves to base a lifetime relationship on. But it is NOT more frivolous to love Bruce than chocolate. How dare you say such a thing! Pie (This just demonstrates even more that what is being discussed here can not simply be labelled "love"  |
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Pie Serendipity
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03-09-2009 13:40
I didn't know we were debating. Pie (You were making my argument for me) |
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Clarissa Lowell
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03-09-2009 13:42
Quite. You can only judge others by their actions . . . Pie ( . . . and as numerous threads here have demonstrated, the appearance of "love" is soooo easy to fake) Well...we can't judge what someone feels, however. Especially when 'actions' may be dependent to some extent upon existing poseball options. The language arguments...who's to say language suffices. There are 31 flavors at Baskin Robbins, shouldn't there be at least that many shades of love in any lexicon? |
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Argent Stonecutter
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03-09-2009 13:43
Merely rephrasing it.
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Lindal Kidd
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03-09-2009 13:44
Again, Lindal you have it wrong. There was no Ancient Greek word for "love" that you could associate with feelings for chocolate. Philia was a dispassionate virtuous love. Storge was a more ambiguous love that you could feel for family, puppies or (ironically) something that you had to put up with from necessity. Pie (This just demonstrates even more that what is being discussed here can not simply be labelled "love" No, I'm right. I have a dispassionate virtuous love for chocolate. And I love the junk in my attic, or at least put up with it from necessity, so that works too. What's the matter with you anyway? Even when I concede a point, you insist on arguing it further. I think I am going to change the name of Lindal and Jig's Camp Followers to "Lindal and Jig's Pie Stompers". Betcha I get lots of recruits. _____________________
It's still My World and My Imagination! So there.
Lindal Kidd |
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Pie Serendipity
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03-09-2009 13:45
Well...we can't judge what someone feels, however. Especially when 'actions' may be dependent to some extent upon existing poseball options. The language arguments...who's to say language suffices. There are 31 flavors at Baskin Robbins, shouldn't there be at least that many shades of love in any lexicon? Pie (what is surprising is that chemical rections generate such apparently irrational results) |
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Pie Serendipity
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03-09-2009 13:47
No, I'm right. I have a dispassionate virtuous love for chocolate. Pie (is worried Lindal might not be female . . . ) |
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Clarissa Lowell
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03-09-2009 13:49
How about sincerity. Personally I judge that mostly by promises/word kept and to what extent grey areas are exploited. That goes for friend or other type of 'love'.
Constant flakiness is annoying, but beyond that it's a red flag for insincerity, which can include protestations of 'lurv' along with much else. Only in a desperate attempt to put a label on the feelings that others appear to have. What's desperate about language? Precision of language is a *good* thing, imo. (Don't most people say communication's vital in any relationship?) (what is surprising is that chemical rections generate such apparently irrational results) Not really, if you look at their purpose. What's rational about sex or childbirth? Without irrationality or at least pleasure chemicals, the species would be doomed. It also stands to a sort of animal logic that one would do irrational things at times to protect the source of that 'high'. |
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Argent Stonecutter
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03-09-2009 13:54
Only in a desperate attempt to put a label on the feelings that others appear to have. _____________________
Argent Stonecutter - http://globalcausalityviolation.blogspot.com/
"And now I'm going to show you something really cool." Skyhook Station - http://xrl.us/skyhook23 Coonspiracy Store - http://xrl.us/coonstore |
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Pie Serendipity
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03-09-2009 13:56
What's desperate about language? Not really, if you look at their purpose. What's rational about sex or childbirth? Without irrationality or at least pleasure chemicals, the species would be doomed. It also stands to a sort of animal logic that one would do irrational things at times to protect the source of that 'high'. Pie (This is demonstrating that communication about "love" *is* more difficult than you might think) |
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Lindal Kidd
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03-09-2009 13:56
Dispassionate? Pie (is worried Lindal might not be female . . . ) /me puts Pie and Pep back on Ignore. Cheaper than more blood pressure meds. _____________________
It's still My World and My Imagination! So there.
Lindal Kidd |
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Clarissa Lowell
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03-09-2009 13:58
Peppy Pie - Why assume that I disagree with you in the first place.
And yes it IS difficult to communicate feelings and quantify them with language, which is why it might be nice were there more words with which to do so. For instance do the French have a word for "like"? I only know of aimer (love). Still unsure why that is desperate, unless you are saying the whole thing is better left unspoken. Or undissected. |
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Argent Stonecutter
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03-09-2009 13:59
This is demonstrating that communication about "love" *is* more difficult than you might think _____________________
Argent Stonecutter - http://globalcausalityviolation.blogspot.com/
"And now I'm going to show you something really cool." Skyhook Station - http://xrl.us/skyhook23 Coonspiracy Store - http://xrl.us/coonstore |
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Pie Serendipity
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03-09-2009 14:03
do the French have a word for "like"? I only know of aimer (love). Pie (I haven't checked with any Italians yet ) |
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LittleMe Jewell
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03-09-2009 14:03
I am going to go on the record as saying I don't believe there is a mystical zen state you achieve with someone called "love". ... What is "love"? Can anyone define it? What I believe is that people simply find those with whom they are compatible—partially due to the instinctual drive to procreate, the social pressure to form a family, and a personal desire for companionship. Sure, we label that "love" but what does that do for us? I, for one, am ecstatic that I have experienced that feeling and I have no intention of losing it. _____________________
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-Lil Why do you sit there looking like an envelope without any address on it? ~Mark Twain~ Optimism is denial, so face the facts and move on. ♥♥♥ Lil's Yard Sale / Inventory Cleanout: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Triggerfish/52/27/22 . http://www.flickr.com/photos/littleme_jewell |
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Clarissa Lowell
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03-09-2009 14:05
They don't. I investigated this quite carefully with a close French friend, and they have "adorer" which is broadly what we would interpret as adore, and a range of words and phrases for the non-PG descriptions. "L'amour" tends to be less ambiguous a noun than "love" though. Didn't think so. Makes making a new French friend in SL a bit awkward at times... Pie (I haven't checked with any Italians yet )Lol, I'll have to ask one next time I 'see' one. |
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Pie Serendipity
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03-09-2009 14:06
Give it whatever name you want, but I believe that mystical state does exist - I have felt it. You can have all of that and not have Love. Why is a 'rose' called a 'rose'? Because that is the word someone gave it and it was adapted by the masses. Love is the word that was given to that feeling, that you apparently have never felt, since you do not believe it exists. The word is nothing more than the verbal expression of the feeling. And no, the word is not really necessary, per se, if the actions show it. You could say the same though about many of the words we use. I, for one, am ecstatic that I have experienced that feeling and I have no intention of losing it. Pie (Are they?) |
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Clarissa Lowell
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03-09-2009 14:07
But you said love isn't apparently rational anyway...
We're all circling the same wagon perhaps. (I thought she communicated well, though.) |
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Pie Serendipity
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03-09-2009 14:07
Lol, I'll have to ask one next time I 'see' one. Pie (Paging Key MacDonagh; please report to Love ER for translation duties) |
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Argent Stonecutter
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03-09-2009 14:10
So what does a Frenchman use to refer to a favorable relationship with a salad? Or is that the secret behind french cuisine: since they don't have the option of merely liking food, perforce they must love it?
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Argent Stonecutter - http://globalcausalityviolation.blogspot.com/
"And now I'm going to show you something really cool." Skyhook Station - http://xrl.us/skyhook23 Coonspiracy Store - http://xrl.us/coonstore |
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Clarissa Lowell
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03-09-2009 14:11
Is assumedly a matter of l'aime or la haine...
I keep wondering what that might signify of the national psyche but is that xenophobia peeping out. (I actually rather like 'the French') |