Does Virtual Cheating Still Count?

In this thread I have seen several comments along the lines of this:

There is something I just don't understand about this sentiment. Why the use of the word 'instead'? Do you think human beings are really that limited? I don't.

When I chat online, I don't do that 'instead' of talking face to face to people. I do both.

When I make a new friend, on line or off line, I am not their friend 'instead' of being friends with someone else. I can be friends with many people.

When I masturbate, I don't do that 'instead' of having sex with my husband. We have plenty of mutually satisfying sex.

When I fantasize about other people, I don't do that 'instead' of fancying my husband. I think my husband is hot and frequently have the urge to rip off his clothes when he is looking especially yummy.

When I cyber, I don't do that 'instead' of sharing sexual fantasies with my husband. We both have a dirty mouth and are not afraid to use it to excite each other.

When I form an intimate relationship with someone else, I don't do that 'instead' of having a loving and intimate relationship with my husband. I have enough love for more than one person.

So when is this 'instead' supposed to enter the equation? I really don't get it. How pessimistic must your view of humans be if you choose to believe that every contact outside of your primary relationship necessarily substracts something from that relationship? How can you deal with multiple relationships (spouse, friends, parents, children etc.) if you think that way? If even just a brief sexual encounter on line takes too much away from a relationship, there is no way one could possibly juggle meaningful relationships with more than one person at a time.

I think it is whether one or other party feels rejection that is the cause of determining whether it is deemed to be cheating. If your partner chooses to spend time with another, rather than with you, and this makes you feel rejected, then you are likely to see it as cheating. Remove the feeling of rejection and the issue goes away.

My opinion is that if an individual has suffered feelings of rejection in any relationship - RL, SL, with parents, friend or SO - once they have had that experience, they will not want to repeat it. So such a person will be very much more sensitive to any hint of rejection in their future relationships. That's why polyamoury is great - up to the point where one party for whatever reason feels rejection...and then it can all begin to go very sour indeed!

well i read whole thread...
and my conclusion is.... why even bother- single rl person behind an AV has his/her own oppinion about this delicate topic more or less, all is really greyish in this area- i think we all should act according to our principles and don't bug others with it. Do what u really think it is the right thing FOR U! SL has unlimited options of excitments... so find the one which suits u.
And just a thought- isn't a really deep and serious conversation in SL friend or partner, when u describe even your depest fantasies and secrets, or just enyoing the dance with a stranger or sl friend (i prefer all sl relationships calling 'frendly') so much it hurts even more 'critical' for RL relationship? Well I think it's really a matter of individual and question why is a bigger issue here. If there even is an issue.
Hawg.

That is an amazingly self-centred observation in a thread about relationships. What about the other person or persons? A relationship is a two way thing - you have to try and do what is right for all parties involved - and the test comes when you have to put what is right for another before what you think is right for you.

Again it's all subjective--but mainly you have to ask yourself, 'how emotionally invested am I in this relationship?'

That question should lead you to answers that you can base future decisions on.

And always never forget to put yourself in your partners shoes...flip it around and ask yourself how YOU would feel if the roles were reversed. As long as you're honest with yourself (sometimes that's the hardest thing to do), you will know what shade of grey you're living in.

One thing I've noticed about this thread and all its previous incarnations, people have a very limited view of relationship dynamics. There seems to be an expectation that a marriage that doesn't meet all one's standards should be ended as too flawed. You drew the wrong card, so draw another. Maybe it's because a majority of posters are fairly young, or with gf/bf instead of married, or simply don't get out much. Maybe it's because I'm of a different generation, with different expectations for commitment.

Life, and relationships, are much more complicated than presented here. It's quite possible to love someone deeply, and share many things in common, and still have areas of discontinuity. It's quite possible to have a relationship in which the partners no longer have sex due to emotional issues or health problems. It's possible for two people to have lives that are very entwined, but still want something all to themselves or need things their partner can't provide.

Some people are lucky enough to find an exact match that requires no compromises or to find ways to overcome problems. But not everyone can meet that standard, not everyone is infallible, not everyone copes well. Commitment is about staying with a person you love even while accepting that they aren't perfect, or that not all your needs are being met, or even that you can't meet theirs.

What I see here are a lot of people with a black/white view of relationships and the notion that leaving is a good solution when things go wrong. What don't see is much generosity, forgiveness, or simple acceptance of the notion that humans tend to be rather flawed and good people can still fail and make mistakes.

Beebo, well said.

There are so many possible scenarios and variables, that we can not judge on an individual basis. However, we can use our gut feeling (on a case by case basis) to determine the “right” and “wrong.”

Life is complicated. There are more shades of grey than PS could ever hope to achieve.

Yes. A very eloquent post.

In part, this is what I've been trying to get at (far less eloquently!) when I have been saying that there isn't a one-size-fits-all approach to these issues -- each relationship has its own dynamic and is particular to the people involved. Yet there seems to be an inexorable urge in some to universalize their own subjective experience or to simplify something that is in reality more grey and complex for many people -- something I suppose is to be expected according to human nature (we are generally less threatened by simplicity than we are by complexity, I think, regardless of where reality itself may be), but which strikes me as really inappropriate when dealing with a subject matter like this one.

Guilty as charged LOLOL..... Does this mean my wife has grounds for divorce? Or is it only valid if she knows who I see with my eyes closed?

BTW.... My wife has my passwords to everything on my PC... she is free to open my mail, and pick up and answer my phone(s)... Trust is a gift only you, can give to another.... and it is only them, that can reject it or make it worthless.

Thank you Beebo. This is well said.

A lot of married couples that have children and more than a few anniverseries, arent always going to have life simple and black a white.

Well said, Beebo. I've stayed out of this thread because it's just too complicated to define relationships in one post. Each one is different and each one has its own dynamic. It's grossly unfair to judge someone else's relationship by the standards you apply to your own. There's no such thing as black and white, and even if there were, humans are flawed. It's the flaws that make us each so beautiful. Without them we would be completely without depth.

You know you're in a thread about cheating, right? I shouldn't have to repeat the subject just because some in the crowd are slow.

*sigh So many loopholes, so few shoelaces.

Can we all agree that cheating is essentially "seeking the comfort of another and not being honest to the person you've made a commitment to"? I always thought it was pretty cut and dry. Many of the posts on this thread make me think otherwise, though...

If your relationship is such that you aren't required to be exclusive with that one person, then it isn't cheating if you go do it up with someone else since it's already an accepted action for all involved.

If you made a commitment to someone that you won't ride a motorcycle but go out and do it behind their back, you're essentially cheating even though we use different terminology for it. It's the same thing, though.

It has nothing to do with polygamy or monogamy or anything like that. Don't be silly. It has to do with the commitment you made to someone and whether or not you're being honest and faithful to that commitment.

I agree with the previous post that stated a lot of people don't seem to get out much.

Unlike the others, I'm sorry I can't applaud your post Beebo. I find the paragraph above condescending. It suggests to me that if someone is not as "open-minded" as you then they are young or inexperienced or not wise.

No, I would never expect my lover to give me all that I need. That would be parasitic not love. We clearly have many needs both material and spiritual that our lovers can't provide. It is one thing, in my opinion, to have friends online who you can relate to and share things with, etc. It is an entirely different matter to have "sex" with pixels to fulfill some need you aren't getting in life.



Having a judgment about someone is not a sin, it's human. Allowing a judgment to unfairly cloud your reactions is the problem.

That being said, the original post asked for peoples opinions on the matter. Just because people state their opinions which may not agree with another persons opinions doesn't mean they are judging that individual.

No I can't agree with that. Cheating is having sexual intercourse with someone else.

So kissing someone that isn't your girl (again, if you have a commitment that prohibits it) isn't cheating?

That's right. It isn't.
Kissing is preparartory to having sexual intercourse, but is not cheating in itself.

Squeeze...there really is no arguing with someone that posts a comment like this. He's either being difficult on purpose, or his view of 'cheating' is heavily skewed...

He'll find out quickly enough that you don't have to sleep with someone to be labeled a cheater. Let his next girlfriend work this out with him...he's got a lot to learn. Of course, if his next partner is a polygamist who prefers an open relationship, then he's in the clear...I'm generally speaking of the average man and woman.

You patronising prick.

Did you really expect not to get a few negative comments to your obviously 'ignorant' comment? I think you like the attention...negative OR positive.

No one would post what you said matter of fact, unless they were looking to get attention...it's just...TOO oblivious.

ps. I'm sorry for being a prick...you're right. I shouldn't stoop so low.

This topic is even more volatile than the voice argument. It is highly subjective and personal. No one's view is any more right or wrong than the other's. No one should be passing judgement on anyone else here.

Cheating is having sex with someone else. Period.

Except Michael's, which are as wrong as it is possible to be.

Looks like I prepare to have sexual intercourse every morning before I go to work and every evening when I come back!

I wonder why I'm not more exhausted all the time?

So we can't pass judgement on anyone except Mike?

This thread went downhill fast!