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Why do men pay for sl sex when there're so many orgy rooms?

Phil Deakins
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Join date: 17 Jan 2007
Posts: 9,537
03-09-2008 17:47
I'm more than happy to let it go, Sunni, but people keep popping in to post something cynical, or to have their little misguided say. You, and everyone else, let it go. Stop with the false accusations. Just let it go.
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Sunni Jewell
Who said so?
Join date: 22 Mar 2007
Posts: 748
03-09-2008 17:48
From: Phil Deakins
I'm more than happy to let it go, Sunni, but people keep popping in to post something cynical, or to have their little misguided say. You, and everyone else, let it go. Stop with the false accusations. Just let it go.


Sorry. Don't see any "false accusations" in my post. Just pure praise for you, dude.
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Damien1 Thorne
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Join date: 26 Aug 2007
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03-09-2008 17:48
From: Ann Launay
Holy water and a crucifix?

Oh, wait, maybe someone else should do it...

:eek:
Ricardo Harris
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Join date: 1 Apr 2006
Posts: 1,944
03-09-2008 17:53
From: Claire Silverspar
/me frowns at the continued sniping and attacks, and sidesteps back out of the thread...
:(





Come back here with me where's it's safe, cozy and warm.
Love Hastings
#66666
Join date: 21 Aug 2007
Posts: 4,094
03-09-2008 18:13
Phil, I think you get along pretty well considering that English isn't your first language.

I think Phil wants to get the last word in, which is why he can't stay gone.
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JamesMichael Morane
Chooses Liberty!!!
Join date: 13 Feb 2008
Posts: 421
03-09-2008 18:34
From: Ann Launay
Newp, I answered that they were free and I needed a flavor request. I hadn't seen one as of the last time I checked the forums before I left for the weekend.


Oh....I'm sorry! I must have missed that......hmmmmm well.....what flavors you got?
Phil Deakins
Prim Savers = low prims
Join date: 17 Jan 2007
Posts: 9,537
03-09-2008 18:38
From: Sunni Jewell
Sorry. Don't see any "false accusations" in my post. Just pure praise for you, dude.
Silly to the end huh? Very intelligent, I must say.

You're right, Love. I do feel a need to have the last word. Or to be more exact, I find it difficult to leave an open lie, cynical statement, false criticism, insult (like the one in your last post) whatever. So if everyone would like to leave me out of it, I am more than happy to stay out of it. If you bring me into again after this post, don't be surprised if I come into it again.
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Jade Angkarn
Always a Night Owl
Join date: 6 Oct 2006
Posts: 209
03-09-2008 18:50
/me drags out a dying horse, and starts to beat it.....

I am not a liar, but I will not attempt to prove this, as it's inappropriate to bring up the details of a past relationship in the public forums.

I will, however, quote something rather interesting that was said in an entirely different post on this forum:

From: Phil Deakins
I'm very late into this thread, but for me, an RL pic makes a LOT of difference. It's the reason that I don't want to know the RL age, shape and face of an SL person that I'm being in any way romantic with. In fact, I make it rule. It's not always kept, but it's my rule just the same.

The moment I see the RL person, that's the person who the relationship is with, and I change away from having the relationship with the SL imagination. My rule is sometimes broken, and I've found RL people who far surpass their SL avs, so it's not always bad, but if I'm in a relationship with someone, I don't want it to go bad, so I made that rule for myself.
/327/d6/235911/3.html#post1841181

And yet later on there is in this thread:

From: Phil Deakins
If any arousal takes place from seeing a naked avatar, for instance, it's surely got to be the likelihood of some real life sexual interaction between two real people. Avatars in themselves are not sexually arousing in the way that images of real nakedness can be. If they are to some people, then I do think it's sad.
So my question is, if it's not the RL info, and it's not the "animated" drawing, then what is it? Are you saying it's just the text alone? In that case, would you say a simple text-based chat room is just as effective as SL?

I'm not trying to stab at anyone. I could care less whether Phil or most anyone enjoys SL sex or not. I'm just noting what appear to be inconsistencies here.
Ann Launay
Neko-licious™
Join date: 8 Aug 2006
Posts: 7,893
03-09-2008 19:01
From: JamesMichael Morane
Oh....I'm sorry! I must have missed that......hmmmmm well.....what flavors you got?


All flavors!
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From: someone
I am bumping you to an 8.5 on the Official Trout Measuring Instrument of Sluttiness. You are an enigma - on the one hand a sweet, gentle, intelligent woman who we would like to wrap up in our arms and protect, and on the other, a temptress to whom we would like to do all sorts of unmentionable things.

Congratulations and shame on you! You are a bit of a slut.
Phil Deakins
Prim Savers = low prims
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Posts: 9,537
03-09-2008 19:05
Both of those quotes still hold true for me.

From: Jade Angkarn
So my question is, if it's not the RL info, and it's not the "animated" drawing, then what is it? Are you saying it's just the text alone? In that case, would you say a simple text-based chat room is just as effective as SL?
It's the real person at the keyboard. And, no, I haven't said that a simple text-based chatroon is just as effective as SL (sex). I said earlier in the thread, and again in my reply to you, that avs are an enhacement to SL sex.

You make a mistake by writing as though looks, shape and age, are the only RL things that connect RL people. They are not. You and I were very RL connected before we exchanged any of those things, and I have been very RL connected with plenty of other girls without any of those things being exchanged. It's the RL people at the keyboards, and not avs alone. I couldn't just sit back and watch a pair of avs 'at it' and get turned on, and I imagine that goes for many people (perhaps even most people ;) ) It needs to be the real people being intimate, and then the avs are often a good enhancement, as I think you could infer from the second of the quotes.
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fetalharvest Triskaidekaphobia
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Join date: 31 Jan 2007
Posts: 12
03-09-2008 19:06
From: Yosef Okelly
Quality

Probably to make sure thet are not with another guy too

thats not a proven case lol theres a lot of guys who become girls and then sell there pixels for sex never understood why maybe its the whole reversed roles thing
Victorria Paine
Sleepless in Wherever
Join date: 13 Jul 2007
Posts: 1,110
03-09-2008 19:33
From: Phil Deakins
It's the RL people at the keyboards, and not avs alone. I couldn't just sit back and watch a pair of avs 'at it' and get turned on, and I imagine that goes for many people (perhaps even most people ;) ) It needs to be the real people being intimate, and then the avs are often a good enhancement, as I think you could infer from the second of the quotes.


It is the projections of the RL people that you are interacting with. One mode of projection is the AV, and another is the text. In both cases it is a choice of the person behind the text or AV as to what they wish to project of themselves (maybe 10% maybe 90%) into SL's space, and that is what you are interacting with. Because of this, I think being turned on by text and being turned on by avatars is on the same level, as is getting off on text and getting off on avatars. All you are doing, in both cases, is interacting with, getting turned on by, and getting off on, the projection (graphical or textual) that the typist wishes to project into SL's space.
Agent Tairov
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03-09-2008 19:43
From: Ann Launay
All flavors!


Do you have any humble pie for Mr. Deakins here?

From: Phil Deakins

I couldn't just sit back and watch a pair of avs 'at it' and get turned on, and I imagine that goes for many people (perhaps even most people ) It needs to be the real people being intimate, and then the avs are often a good enhancement, as I think you could infer from the second of the quotes.

Your assumption has no established grounds. What do you base it on? Do you have any numbers?
Since I haven't seen it anywhere else in the thread ( I gave up after 15 pages,) I would assume that you are only going by your personal sexual preferences, which we have established are purely subjective, and not a valid means to generalize the sentiment of the population.
The depiction of an avatar isn't what turns people on. Just as in Hentai (which is quite popular, although "sad" according to your belief system**), it isn't the physical depiction itself which is the turn on. The same goes for real people themselves. Nudity isn't the turn on, the idea of sex is. It doesn't matter if there is a person behind the AV, as long as it's enough to make a person think of sex as they want it.
Heck, I bet that if I wrote up a clever enough chatbot, (ALICE FTW!) you wouldn't know any better and would like it. It wouldn't be "real" and it wouldn't be about RL sex, since that would be impossible; it would be about the idea of sex, and it would suspend your disbelief enough to succeed. (Your barrier is suspension of disbelief. You are easily de-immersed, apparently.)

**The popularity of hentai is easily explained: because of the stylized graphics and lack of detail, the mind of the viewer assumes that whatever shape is being displayed is the one most appealing to it. In other words, the imagination is filling in the details, but it doesn't have to work a lot since most of it's already done. Since stylized anime represents a rather western view of beauty, it takes all the modern stereotypes about how girls should look and pushes them to their logical conclusions. Also, there may be a loss of guilt, since the characters aren't fully human-looking.
Full disclosure: No, I don't actually like hentai, but the above analysis explains why many people might.
Colette Meiji
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Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
03-09-2008 19:49
From: Phil Deakins
(even more garbage)


You win Phil.

You aren't the least bit sexist, everyone else has a secret agenda to make you look bad. The Stupid people who read your posts but don't READ your posts are all out to get you.

Take heart! Never give in. Don't let one wrong statement or mischaracterization rest. You can do it! We are counting on you. Lets have a "GO PHIL!"

Your Ex is just jealous that you are so awesome, she won't even argue with you why she isn't a liar. Its not because she has more class than you, OH NO!

In fact Many if not Most of us who refused to see your explanations are really just stupid idiots and can't see the marvelous workings of your brilliant mind. Many if not Most of us wish we could be your trafficbot zombies. Many if not Most of us long to praise you, YES YOU PHIL!

But some who are not Many and definitely not most, but rather some if not least STILL seek to say lies, LIES! about your statements. They claim different. Some even have reasons they feel differently, BUT they are LYING, LIES LIES, THRONE OF LIES!

I too once thought Phil was wrong, but no longer. I now see he is perfect. Praise Phil! We should all vote for Phil to be the new King Philip! Get rid of that Rosedale guy. I am positive you will win Many if not Most of the delegates.

I think we should all chip in and give Phil a little pressie. Maybe a tinfoil hat.
Phil Deakins
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03-09-2008 20:03
From: Agent Tairov
Your assumption has no established grounds. What do you base it on? Do you have any numbers?
What assumption would that be? I don't need any numbers, or statistics. If you read the part of my post that you quoted, you'll see why ;)
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Colette Meiji
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Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
03-09-2008 20:08
From: Phil Deakins
What assumption would that be? I don't need any numbers, or statistics. If you read the part of my post that you quoted, you'll see why ;)


Damn straight. Many if not Most of all statistics on the internet are made up on the spot anyway!

Hmm, but then again Many if not Most implies some sort of rationale since it is also a statistic of sorts.

Ohh I'm sure its nothing, as long as we continue to use Many if not Most, no one will be able to disagree with us.

Well at least no one that isn't either stupid or a liar.
Agent Tairov
Registered User
Join date: 27 Jan 2008
Posts: 17
03-09-2008 21:18
From: Phil Deakins

From: Agent Tairov

From: Phil Deakins

I couldn't just sit back and watch a pair of avs 'at it' and get turned on, and I imagine that goes for many people (perhaps even most people ) It needs to be the real people being intimate, and then the avs are often a good enhancement, as I think you could infer from the second of the quotes.

Your assumption has no established grounds. What do you base it on? Do you have any numbers?

What assumption would that be? I don't need any numbers, or statistics. If you read the part of my post that you quoted, you'll see why ;)


Assumption: "I imagine that goes for many people (perhaps even most people" referring to "watch[ing] a pair of avs 'at it' and get[ting] turned on"
Discounted: Insufficient and contrary evidence to assume this.
From: Agent Tairov

...I would assume that you are only going by your personal sexual preferences, which we have established are purely subjective, and not a valid means to generalize the sentiment of the population.



Statement: "It needs to be the real people being intimate, and then the avs are often a good enhancement..."
Counter-Argument: The idea of sex is what turns people on, not the presence of others at the other end, that merely helps supend disbelief.
From: Agent Tairov

The depiction of an avatar isn't what turns people on. Just as in Hentai (which is quite popular, although "sad" according to your belief system**), it isn't the physical depiction itself which is the turn on. The same goes for real people themselves. Nudity isn't the turn on, the idea of sex is. It doesn't matter if there is a person behind the AV, as long as it's enough to make a person think of sex as they want it.
Heck, I bet that if I wrote up a clever enough chatbot, (ALICE FTW!) you wouldn't know any better and would like it. It wouldn't be "real" and it wouldn't be about RL sex, since that would be impossible; it would be about the idea of sex, and it would suspend your disbelief enough to succeed. (Your barrier is suspension of disbelief. You are easily de-immersed, apparently.)



It is unfortunate that you were either unable to infer what your own assumption was, or deliberately pretended that you could not in order to avoid directly answering my argument. Then again, perhaps you take it for granted. Of course, that does not excuse the inability to think critically about it.

Please respond directly to my counter-argument this time. Failure to do so will be taken as forfeiture (and therefore loss) of the argument and an admission that your view is incorrect.
Ceka Cianci
SuperPremiumExcaliburAcc#
Join date: 31 Jul 2006
Posts: 4,489
03-09-2008 22:10
From: Jade Angkarn
/me drags out a dying horse, and starts to beat it.....

I am not a liar, but I will not attempt to prove this, as it's inappropriate to bring up the details of a past relationship in the public forums.

I will, however, quote something rather interesting that was said in an entirely different post on this forum:

/327/d6/235911/3.html#post1841181/327/d6/235911/3.html#post1841181

And yet later on there is in this thread:

So my question is, if it's not the RL info, and it's not the "animated" drawing, then what is it? Are you saying it's just the text alone? In that case, would you say a simple text-based chat room is just as effective as SL?

I'm not trying to stab at anyone. I could care less whether Phil or most anyone enjoys SL sex or not. I'm just noting what appear to be inconsistencies here.

i could answer this one very easily..text can be much better than the visuals in sl..if done right and the imagination can draw the picture..i used to blame my letting sl get the better of me to wreck the way i used to express myself in my old IRC community i was involved with before coming to sl..My SL never has been as good as the text experiences i have ever had..if it ever gets better than the imagination then the world is pretty much screwed then and we have all became gesture junkies just sittin in a club going \O/ whoooooooooooo!! all day not typing shit..lol

why does a man think a woman almost nude is sexyer than one that is??because the imaginaion is still ticking away trying to picture what is under those last few garments..it's not the act of sex it is the trip getting to the sex..that is what is so exciting or the trip to seeing a beautiful body finally exposed..not seeing it exposed..you can hold a persons attention longer with an almost exposed body than after it is exposed..
as they say it's not the actual destination that makes it all worth wild ..it's the ride getting there..

In sl would i say it is the visual or the text??well there are alot of perfect looking people in sl pretty much a dime a dozen..and men can get sex just about anywhere in sl at anytime..
i would say the text would be what stands out over looks in this world..
but that is just my opinions on the matter from the little i have read in this thread..
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Oryx Tempel
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03-09-2008 23:22
/me peeks her head in...

This thread still going? Dern...

My answer to the OP is that perhaps men are more comfortable with the idea of paying for sex than women are, and they're willing to pay for the experience, which is probably "enhanced" by using an escort (compared to an orgy room,) whereas women aren't. I think, too, that maybe the idea of paying an escort might be rather titillating to a man who wouldn't or couldn't pay for a RL escort. Just one girl's opinion, who hasn't read all 33 pages of the thread, and who doesn't automatically think that all men want to have pixel sex with her. ;)
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Connor Jun
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Join date: 2 Mar 2007
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03-10-2008 05:12
From: Oryx Tempel
/me peeks her head in...

This thread still going? Dern...

My answer to the OP is that perhaps men are more comfortable with the idea of paying for sex than women are, and they're willing to pay for the experience, which is probably "enhanced" by using an escort (compared to an orgy room,) whereas women aren't. I think, too, that maybe the idea of paying an escort might be rather titillating to a man who wouldn't or couldn't pay for a RL escort. Just one girl's opinion, who hasn't read all 33 pages of the thread, and who doesn't automatically think that all men want to have pixel sex with her. ;)


Hiring an escort in Real Life is just a business transaction. It really doesn't involve any fantasy or build up. It is like hiring someone to come out and set up the cable. She shows up asks where the event will take place, takes her clothes off, etc.

An escort in Second Life is sometimes like that. Other times it is more like a stripper trying to seduce you into buying a lap dance. Which is more like how you'd image a prostitute to be if you had never tried it. Begging, pleading, seducing, tempting it all depends on the woman involved.

Most women frown on men entering into relationships for purely sexual reasons. Yet, they don't want you lying to them in order to have sex with them either. And then these same women are often the ones who are opposed to the idea of prostitution and even pornography. It is all a bundle of contradictions.

Having sex for free in Second Life is like having sex for free in Real Life. There is almost always an expectation of an involvement after. Even the friends with benies idea is an involvement. Since any man with respect doesn't take advantage of women who are drunk, you are left with two choices. Pay a professional with money. Or pay an amateur with time and most likely spend money on her anyway.
Phil Deakins
Prim Savers = low prims
Join date: 17 Jan 2007
Posts: 9,537
03-10-2008 06:00
Agent:

Your reply to my question, "What assumption would that be?", was...

From: Agent Tairov
Assumption: "I imagine that goes for many people (perhaps even most people" referring to "watch[ing] a pair of avs 'at it' and get[ting] turned on"
Discounted: Insufficient and contrary evidence to assume this.
I'll explain where you're mistaken (this is also for Colette, since she made the same mistake). I said that I imagine something. I didn't say that I assume it to be true, and I certainly didn't put it out as a statement of fact, so statistics aren't needed. It's just what I personally imagine to be true. To put it in other ways, I'd guess that it is true, I'd bet that it's true, I wouldn't be surprised if it's true, there's a good chance that it's true imo, etc. etc. Of course, if I want to assume that it's true, I'm free to do that and to post it, as long as I say that it's my assumption, as in *I* assume. I'm also free to imagine, and to write that "I imagine" ;)

From: Agent Tairov
Statement: "It needs to be the real people being intimate, and then the avs are often a good enhancement..."

Counter-Argument: The idea of sex is what turns people on, not the presence of others at the other end, that merely helps supend disbelief.
I trust you can produce statistics to support that general statement? My part in that quote was a reply about *me* to a specific question, asked by a specific person. Your generalisation doesn't apply.

From: Agent Tairov
It is unfortunate that you were either unable to infer what your own assumption was, or deliberately pretended that you could not in order to avoid directly answering my argument. Then again, perhaps you take it for granted. Of course, that does not excuse the inability to think critically about it.
I chose not to discuss your Hentai point, because I didn't see any relevance to it. You brought it up as a response to me anwering someone's question about me. It's a different view, and I've nothing for or against it, but I chose not to discuss it, and I still choose not to discuss it, as it had nothing to do with my answer to Jade.

From: Agent Tairov
Please respond directly to my counter-argument this time. Failure to do so will be taken as forfeiture (and therefore loss) of the argument and an admission that your view is incorrect.
lol. see above. I also didn't respond when someone posted that I rub shit over my body, but it wasn't an admission that I do it. And before Colette jumps in on that, yes, I mentioned it later - much later - but I didn't respond to it directly. If you want to have a discussion about exactly what turns people on, please do, but don't address it to me.
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Brenda Connolly
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03-10-2008 06:06
The fact that this thread is still going on, amazes, confounds and saddens me to no end.
Somebody, please, bad mouth a crooked land baron so it will disappear.
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Colette Meiji
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03-10-2008 06:09
From: Phil Deakins
Agent:

Your reply to my question, "What assumption would that be?", was...

I'll explain where you're mistaken (this is also for Colette, since she made the same mistake). I said that I imagine something. I didn't say that I assume it to be true, and I certainly didn't put it out as a statement of fact, so statistics aren't needed. It's just what I personally imagine to be true. To put it in other ways, I'd guess that it is true, I'd bet that it's true, I wouldn't be surprised if it's true, there's a good chance that it's true imo, etc. etc. Of course, if I want to assume that it's true, I'm free to do that and to post it, as long as I say that it's my assumption, as in *I* assume. I'm also free to imagine, and to write that "I imagine" ;)

I trust you can produce statistics to support that general statement? My part in that quote was a reply about *me* to a specific question, asked by a specific person. Your generalisation doesn't apply.

I chose not to discuss your Hentai point, because I didn't see any relevance to it. You brought it up as a response to me anwering someone's question about me. It's a different view, and I've nothing for or against it, but I chose not to discuss it, and I still choose not to discuss it, as it had nothing to do with my answer to Jade.

lol. see above. I also didn't respond when someone posted that I rub shit over my body, but it wasn't an admission that I do it. And before Colette jumps in on that, yes, I mentioned it later - much later - but I didn't respond to it directly.


Phil!!!

You sound paranoid!

You don't have to, I am on your side now!

I have seen the light!

(Many if not most)-body say hallelujah!
Phil Deakins
Prim Savers = low prims
Join date: 17 Jan 2007
Posts: 9,537
03-10-2008 06:11
You're not the only one, Brenda. I'll repeat...

From: Phil Deakins
So if everyone would like to leave me out of it, I am more than happy to stay out of it. If you bring me into again after this post, don't be surprised if I come into it again.
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Colette Meiji
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Posts: 15,556
03-10-2008 06:14
From: Phil Deakins
You're not the only one, Brenda. I'll repeat...


No no don't be modest!

If everyone will just admit Phil is right he will stop posting till this thread!

But as long as the liars and the stupid people keep questioning him, he will post!

FOR JUSTICE!!!
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