The Answer is "NO"

So - just from this brief bits here- u own teeny pieces of land right? And unlike adcutters there is no ugly spinny things- so is there anything at all on them that bothers people? Why is this guy targeting you?

No, that is not our plot

We were not notified to the land being taken.

We were not willing to trade anything, until this person resolved his history with our group.

Linden Lab has NO BUSINESS intervening in disputes between residents, particularily when it involves talking land from us without notice.

So they seized the original parcel, but are giving you a different one of the same size in the same sim in return, then?

They did mention when they revised the land policy that they would in some cases force land trades when warranted, to move microplots to an outside border instead of the middle of a larger parcel. I can't find it in the knowledge base, but remember that it was discussed. It sounds like that's what they did here. Basically, you got caught by the policy that was intended for the adfarmers and land extortionists - casualty of war. It would have been nice if they had notified you first, though.

Yes Puppet, it's about notification. There are thousands of plots in the middle of other plots, but I don't think LL is willing to move them at the whimsy of the neighbors.

They should, though.

they really shouldn't refuse to name a supervisor or manager, that's pretty shoddy customer service.

I sympathize with your situation, but if the person was just wanting a swap, no matter how much of an asshat he was, why not just do it and get it over with? Seems to me that it's an awful lot of unnecessary drama going on.

Not to mention that, again, punishing everyone for the sins of the bad isn't any better of a response, IMO. You all get good press because you offer to be fair to folks and do land swaps. Don't throw that away by posturing over one situation. Come here and tell us what happened, garner support, and we'll be willing to go to bat for you with LL over it. Come here and tell us "screw you all, too!", and we're likely to just shrug and end up having to do the same thing when that time comes for all of us (asking LL to forcibly swap your parcels when you outright refuse, as you have done here).

You all get good press because you offer to be fair to folks and do land swaps. Don't throw that away by posturing over one situation.

Hello, you have a small parcel in Aleksandr owned by the "Blue Button Holding" group. I own the rest of the sim and was hoping we could agree a trade where you could move to the corner of the sim so that we can manage our land with greater ease regarding terraforming etc.

[snapshot included here]

As you can see from the snapshot, the current location of the plot is an inconveniance to me so I would really appreciate you moving to the corner with a straight swap.

You can contact me in-world or via email - [email]ewan@metaanswers.org[/email]

Thank you for your time and consideration on this matter.

Ewan Mureaux.

Here is the content of the note card requesting the swap.



This request was ignored for days on end. Tried to send it to weedy too, then I tried to AR her as per advice regarding non-replying micro-barons but like the AR form couldn't find her, has she been banned?

Don't advertise swaps then when someone dare ask you for it ignore them. Pretending to do swaps so that you can fly under the cutter radar is not very wise.

At the risk of disclosure, let me give some background.

For nearly a year, there has been one owner in Alexsandr, who has been constructively griefing us. This person has been DEMANDING we sell our land to them. Our policy is clearly written and we respond amiably to hundreds of requests every month.

Not this guy though, instead has embarked on a fabrication of abuse reporting. It started at first by him placing a large building on the land with a tiny door. The door was located directly adjacent to our plot. It's very obvious, this was done to fabricate an abuse report against us for "blocking". That failed. Some time later, this guy openly distributed notecards in the Arbor Group of his conversations with Weedy, who refuses to deal him because of his abuses. I never read that notecards, but I've been told by others it incriminates him, not Weedy as the person being unreasonable.

The last few days, this guy has been "extreme-terraforming". I attended the plot two days ago, where his land was set at its lowest level, our land appeared a a spike on the land. I then smoothed it to even it with the current contours. I returned a day later to followup, and found the land raised to its highest extreme, giving our plot the appearance of a deep hole. This is very obvious, he was doing this to file an AR against us under the extreme terraform rules, but he is the insitgator.

Today I log on, the land was taken from our group, who paid for the land since 2005.

Guy Linden said he had no idea of the abuse report history with this person. This is proof, the left hand has no idea what the right hand is doing at Linden Lab and we are victims of this on a daily basis.

The ploicy is clear as mud and they have fed us to the dogs. Last month Harmony Linden asked us to "freeze expansion" of our group, pending a clearer definition of the policy and how it should apply to us. We agreed, but have not heard from her since, despite numerous efforts to re-connect with her.

In my opinion this is both theft and malfeasance from Linden staff.

Here is the content of the note card requesting the swap.



This request was ignored for days on end. Tried to send it to weedy too, then I tried to AR her as per advice regarding non-replying micro-barons but like the AR form couldn't find her, has she been banned?

Don't advertise swaps then when someone dare ask you for it ignore them. Pretending to do swaps so that you can fly under the cutter radar is not very wise.

The guilty dog has barked.

You threatened her numerous times, but the TOS prevents me from posting all of the abusive IMs, and manipulative tactics you been using to construct a case against her.

From day one, you have been unreasonable with your demands to turn over the land. You have manipulated your builds to give the appearance that we intentionally blocked you.

Your rant in the Arbor Group was defamatory and broke disclosure rules, causing her to leave the group. (She was an officer in good standing since the group was created and has donated 100s, if not 1000s of plots to the group.

You are an outright liar. If Weedy recieved that note that you claim to have sent, she would have dealt with you promptly. You attempt to paint us as anything else, only proves your contempt for us from the outset.

Since when was refusing to sell our land to you a TOS violation?

By your own admission, you stipulate to frivolous AR's against us. Then somehow you managed to manipulate Guy Linden into breech of contract with us. (not to mention intervening in a dispute between residents.

We fully intend to go to the wall on this issue, until our rightfully owned land is returned to us.

Talarus, this guy was unreasonable from day one.

Our group bought the plot on March 22nd (2009). My partner sent a notecard to Weedy, where is she btw? She doesn't show in search people. Anyway so Jack IM'd me last week after a snarky comment in concierge chat and I said that I was miffed about this unresponsive micro-plot owner cos they were in a super-awkward location in the sim with a parcel terraformed right up. Jack said that was the sort of thing the policy was about and micro plots should be low impact (corner of sims etc). Then Guy visited me and advised me to again attempt contact and if there was no response to file an abuse report to "get it in the system". Four days passed, the request was ignored but someone decided to come completely sink the plot so that no matter what we did with our land they would do the opposite. So I went to file an AR on the group founder but she wasn't found, is she on vacation from SL? Anyway so following instructions from Teagan Linden I filed the AR against a Linden employee (well Philip actually) with a note about who the real antagonist was. Then I was asked to cut out a 16m plot for a swap by Guy, did that, the annoying parcel was moved, mainland got slightly better.

Facts are great aren't they. Because with facts about sending AR's, sending requests by notecard and when you purchase land you get transaction and reference numbers instead of crazy bawwwing about how you're an ok cutter its the rest that are wrong.

Talarus, this guy was unreasonable from day one.

We don't mean to punish the rest of the community. That is not our attention. We froze trades about a year ago and reconsidered because of this reason. If you logged on every day to the abuses we see, perhaps ypu might feel the same way after months of it.

It's not right, we should be continuously punished for the sins of other either.

Our records show, over the past few years, Weedy has swapped about 100 plots per month. We don't get paid for that, we don't expect neighbors to pay for that and we consider it a cost of doing business.

LL systematically over the years have co-opted our profits to a point where we are maintaining our network at a loss. Having spent millions of Lindens developing it and with the prospect of our land having a greater useage in the future, we are currently operating without profit. We continue to make tier payments on the possibility of expansion into other things and as such, we are wholly unwilling to simply abandon our land for no return. The value of our group is based on the integration of local network capabilities and the sheer volume of our access, not the sum of it parts.

We too feel this is a harsh decision Talarus, but LL has our back's to wall while seemingly ignoring some very blatant abusers of the system.

It won't take much for us to resume our policy, but being brushed off by LL is not a good means to that end.

I've dealt with unreasonable people. A reasonable request from an unreasonable person is still a reasonable request.

I think you're biting off your nose to spite your face.

If it is indeed Ewan you are talking about here, he's probably one of the most level-headed folks in the Arbor project. Even still, we're only hearing two sides of the story; there's always at least one more: the Truth.

Regardless, if all that was asked for is a swap, why not just do it and get it over with?



Well, intention or not, that's what is happening. Again.

Uhh, dude; I helped orchestrate a War against adfarmers and extortionists that still goes on in some form or fashion to this day; I've had plenty of experience with people griefing me over it. However, if the cause is just, it is worth the price paid.



Well, if it isn't right for you to be punished for the sins of another, then why do the same to others?



I understand that you all have gotten a lot of grief since you started your business, but I also know that there are a LOT of people who have supported you and been nice to you both about your plots. Do they not count? Are the griefers the only ones that matter?



Again, I sympathize, but what does that have to do with other property owners trying to work with you to facilitate fair land swaps? I mean, it is your business, and you make a point of not sharing any intimate details with anyone about it otherwise, so why is this part important to tell us? There are plenty of business models and products that LL has and will obviate and/or co-opt at some point. Take a look at XStreet and onrez. It sucks, but that is hardly anyone's problem but your own, right?



Well, in this case, it seems like a fairly straightforward issue. A swap was requested; why did you not just grant it and call it a day, like the 100s to 1000s of others?



Well, assuming that LL doesn't reverse, for whatever reason, you do realize that others (including myself, btw) will be forced to follow suit at some point, yes?

Until 3 days ago, he never requested a trade.

He demanded we sell or give him the plot. After his attack in the Arbor Group, he was put on ignore. Ignore is a tool given to us by LL when people are unreasonable. ARing us for not responding to a muted resident is absurd.

That's a lie really because when i sent the notecard I got the "user offline" message but if you send to a muted person you get a "user declined" message, I checked this. But you arent going to buck your trend and say something truthful here. Oh and where is weedy?

Until 3 days ago, he never requested a trade.

He demanded we sell or give him the plot. After his attack in the Arbor Group, he was put on ignore. Ignore is a tool given to us by LL when people are unreasonable. ARing us for not responding to a muted resident is absurd.

Weedy is hidden from view, so asshats like you leave her alone.

To be fair, Dave, I don't know what happened. I didn't witness it. At the end of the day, it is your word against his, to me. All I know is that it sounds like a lot of drama over nothing of significance. The Lindens actually have the capability to know what did happen. While they aren't always the best at handling things, they can get it right.

Now, you are here in the forums, intending (or not; effectively it is the same, though) to offend everyone else because of a minor patch of drama. I mean, it is your choice to go this route; I just think that it will backfire on you to a much greater extent.

In simpler words, you're not making your case or situation any better by this public posturing. I said it the last time you and Weedy were here and did the same thing. What I said then is no less true today for this same kind of situation.