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Are Nazi uniforms considered "offensive"?

Bradley Bracken
Goodbye, Farewell, Amen
Join date: 2 Apr 2007
Posts: 3,856
10-31-2007 15:22
From: Oryx Tempel
Dang, you ARE a slut!


Trout doesn't just throw his ratings around foolishly.
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Alicia Sautereau
if (!social) hide;
Join date: 20 Feb 2007
Posts: 3,125
10-31-2007 15:26
so i get an informal warning after being reported but nazi favorism is allowed



that`s it, bunch of nazi`s
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Har Fairweather
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Join date: 24 Jan 2007
Posts: 2,320
10-31-2007 15:43
From: Tiana Whitfield
I could not agree with you more if I tried.

I have actually found some of the very violent posts in this thread more disturbing, worrying and upsetting then seeing someone running around in a Nazi uniform on a computer game. I am sorry if that makes me UN-PC...whilst I abhor anything that is associated to Nazism, I still cant take the stance that because I feel that way, everyone else should.


I don't mean to single this post out, just picking it as the most recent case as I write.

Putting an emotional cry of pain and revulsion by people who have reason to feel the effects of an evil - even when that cry is couched in violent terms - on a plane of moral equivalence or near-equivalence to the evil itself is at best stupidly blind and at worst and in the end is profoundly immoral. Unbelievably immoral. It comes of playing so much with words and intellectual games of moral "correctness" that one forgets reality and the real meaning of what one is mouthing.

If you see a widow grieving for her murdered husband and screaming in anguish for the death of his murderer, do you get on your high horse and lecture her? If you do, get the hell away from her, you arrogant, self-righteous prig, while the rest of us calm her down, comfort her - and put the murderer away for life if we can, as nearly always happens in fact these days.

There is a difference between compassion and justice - and operatic self-righteousness. Expect to get called out when you do the latter.

Alicia, I understand you are in pain. Certain people are too wrapped up in their smug cocoons of Political Correctness to even know that you feel such pain, or know what it is, or to even try to understand it. It will help to collect yourself, so you can get away from expressing your inchoate outrage, which only lets these vain posturers parade their "reasonableness" while denying your humanity. Better to calm down and restate your fundamental moral denunciation in terms that disgrace and discredit them to the point where even they will see that they are fools standing in a bucket of pseudo-intellectual shit. They won't admit it, you understand, you will be denied that satisfaction. But they will get it.
Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
10-31-2007 15:47
From: Alicia Sautereau
so i get an informal warning after being reported but nazi favorism is allowed


Mighta been all the death threats. I'd consider an informal warning veeeeeeery lenient, given those.
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I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
Showdog Tiger
Registered User
Join date: 30 Nov 2005
Posts: 404
The Old Lady's Two Cents
10-31-2007 15:49
Dearly Darlings,

For decades I've been painting little models of tanks from WWII. About five years ago Maneo asked me what I wanted for Christmas. I told him a ping-pong table. Naturally, I got it. He was stunned when I proceeded to cover it with dirt and started outlining tank battle plans from the North African Campaign. This does not make me a warmonger or a Nazi. I just like military history. Maneo would have loved me joining SL before we had sand all over the house. I do not find a problem with people role playing war/history games. However, that being said, I do not think that uniforms should be worn outside of the role playing sim. I did not think that way until I by accident offended a club manager by going into her club dressed up as the Marquis de Lafayette in battle clothing in honor of his 250th birthday. She is a pacifist. I found a shop and changed into civilian attire for the Marquis and was allowed back into the club. We have got to remember that our individual freedom to swing our fist ends at the other person's nose.

You all have a lovely evening.

Ever Yours,

Mrs. Showdog Tiger
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Dogdom Doge
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10-31-2007 15:49
From: Michal Milosz
Are Nazi uniforms considered offensive?

broadly! :mad:
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Bradley Bracken
Goodbye, Farewell, Amen
Join date: 2 Apr 2007
Posts: 3,856
10-31-2007 15:53
From: Har Fairweather
Alicia, I understand you are in pain. Certain people are too wrapped up in their smug cocoons of Political Correctness to even know that you feel such pain, or know what it is, or to even try to understand it.


While others may feel her pain, they can also be clouded in emotion when death threats are called. Compassion is not just for some.
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Har Fairweather
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Posts: 2,320
10-31-2007 15:55
To the OP - 9 extraordinarily emotional pages in less than four hours. I trust all this answers your questions - and gives you the reasons why.
Brenda Connolly
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Join date: 10 Jan 2007
Posts: 25,000
10-31-2007 15:56
/me watches Mrs Showdog exit and sighs in admiration. That is one classy broad.
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Tegg Bode
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Join date: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 5,707
10-31-2007 15:57
From: Alicia Sautereau
he comes near me and not only i will kill him but the entire family will jump on and knowing our neighberhood, not even the police will help him 1 tiny bit
Yes displaying of Nazi symbols is wrong but................

Someone should wipe out all the F#&kwit Fu$%ka%$e overaggro hormone frenzied F#&kwit murdering ar&eholes and their Fu$%ka%$e hormone frenzied families and their pro-murder neighbours families and their Fu$%ka%$e dilbit paperboy and corrupt scheming corner store owner too, who keep relentlesly F@#king pushing their F@#king seriously F@#king majory F&^ked up hyper aggressive "kill peoples family" F@#king attitudes on other people. it's F@#king power hungry Fu$%ka%$e b%^twipes like them that F@#king unquestionably murder and F@#king maim others in their F@#king untiring perilous quest for absolute F&*king F#&kwit unyeilding power that start major F&*king meglomanical based armegeddon bringing F@#king conflicts, enslaving and killing millions of nice people with their way overmaxed hyperzelious hormone unstoppable frenzied ego driven frenzied untamed wild corned animal lust for unethical absolute tyranous unhygenic manical unspeakable orgasmic power.

Damn what does it take to get a thread locked nowdays...................
If someone wants to dress as Sargent Shultz or Cornel Klink on Halloween, fine by me :)
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Nika Talaj
now you see her ...
Join date: 2 Jan 2007
Posts: 5,449
10-31-2007 15:57
From: Alicia Sautereau
so i get an informal warning after being reported but nazi favorism is allowed

that`s it, bunch of nazi`s
Alicia, I would send you a PM but they're not enabled, and I cannot go inworld now. I see you just put your island up for sale. If that's related to this thread, stop, please. Give it time. Cool down.

Your passions are strong ... but please - leave forum things in the forum, do not let it poison your SL. I know you love it.
Chris Norse
Loud Arrogant Redneck
Join date: 1 Oct 2006
Posts: 5,735
10-31-2007 15:58
From: Har Fairweather
I don't mean to single this post out, just picking it as the most recent case as I write.

Putting an emotional cry of pain and revulsion by people who have reason to feel the effects of an evil - even when that cry is couched in violent terms - on a plane of moral equivalence or near-equivalence to the evil itself is at best stupidly blind and at worst and in the end is profoundly immoral. Unbelievably immoral. It comes of playing so much with words and intellectual games of moral "correctness" that one forgets reality and the real meaning of what one is mouthing.

If you see a widow grieving for her murdered husband and screaming in anguish for the death of his murderer, do you get on your high horse and lecture her? If you do, get the hell away from her, you arrogant, self-righteous prig, while the rest of us calm her down, comfort her - and put the murderer away for life if we can, as nearly always happens in fact these days.

There is a difference between compassion and justice - and operatic self-righteousness. Expect to get called out when you do the latter.

Alicia, I understand you are in pain. Certain people are too wrapped up in their smug cocoons of Political Correctness to even know that you feel such pain, or know what it is, or to even try to understand it. It will help to collect yourself, so you can get away from expressing your inchoate outrage, which only lets these vain posturers parade their "reasonableness" while denying your humanity. Better to calm down and restate your fundamental moral denunciation in terms that disgrace and discredit them to the point where even they will see that they are fools standing in a bucket of pseudo-intellectual shit. They won't admit it, you understand, you will be denied that satisfaction. But they will get it.


Har, there is a big difference in your examples. The people who harmed Alicia's family were probably punihsed and in all probability are dead or near death now. The Nutzis running around today are nothing more than idiots. Attacking them will not be punishing those who committed the deeds years ago.
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Har Fairweather
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Join date: 24 Jan 2007
Posts: 2,320
10-31-2007 15:59
From: Bradley Bracken
While others may feel her pain, they can also be clouded in emotion when death threats are called. Compassion is not just for some.



As if "death" in Sl meant anything more in practice than being tp'ed home or at worst relogging, and being unceremoniously and unarguably rejected by someone. As if there was any chance in hell that Alicia could or would track anyone down in RL and literally do them in. Quit posturing and playing with words. Reality exists.
OneBeautiful Jewell
Registered User
Join date: 4 May 2007
Posts: 35
10-31-2007 16:01
From: Michal Milosz
Eh, I have a question that may be considered stupid (treat me like a newbie, I've returned after two years of inactivity):
Are Nazi uniforms considered offensive? I'm attempting to adapt WW2 German uniforms from Return To Castle Wolfenstein and I wanted to be sure how far do I have to go with "modifying" them - as we had some major media fuss in Poland regarding the tailoring and sale of RL Nazi uniforms.
So, do they have to be "German Wolfenstein version", or "worldwide, bigger, longer, uncut and with swastikas on"?




Yes Yes and Yes, fucking offensive! Its really sad that people are so insensitive to other people, sadly...that's why there is still so much killing and hate in the world as we know it now.
Bradley Bracken
Goodbye, Farewell, Amen
Join date: 2 Apr 2007
Posts: 3,856
10-31-2007 16:04
From: Har Fairweather
As if "death" in Sl meant anything more in practice than being tp'ed home or at worst relogging, and being unceremoniously and unarguably rejected by someone. As if there was any chance in hell that Alicia could or would track anyone down in RL and literally do them in. Quit posturing and playing with words. Reality exists.


No posturing or playing with words. No personal threat felt, but you can't expect people not to feel emotions based on the words said.
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Alicia Sautereau
if (!social) hide;
Join date: 20 Feb 2007
Posts: 3,125
10-31-2007 16:08
From: Nika Talaj
Alicia, I would send you a PM but they're not enabled, and I cannot go inworld now. I see you just put your island up for sale. If that's related to this thread, stop, please. Give it time. Cool down.

Your passions are strong ... but please - leave forum things in the forum, do not let it poison your SL. I know you love it.

disabled it cause of idiots as these along time ago

yes, i`m selling it cause of this, seeing as how the opinion is about it, i`ll be closing it down so i don`t have to deal with ppl like this and go rent a small plot from a friend wich is normal and next door to my best friend so i don`t pay LL a single cent and not interact with anyone i don`t want ingame or out of game

LL won`t ruine SL but it`s residents
never wanted or needed compasion, never wanted or needed help, never wanted anything from anyone unlike otherwsie...

i`m done with this...
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Har Fairweather
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Join date: 24 Jan 2007
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10-31-2007 16:10
From: Chris Norse
Har, there is a big difference in your examples. The people who harmed Alicia's family were probably punihsed and in all probability are dead or near death now. The Nutzis running around today are nothing more than idiots. Attacking them will not be punishing those who committed the deeds years ago.


Appreciate your comments as always, Chris, and as usual, everything you say is right.

But it is painfully clear that Alicia is distraught - and that some others are using that as an opportunity to point fingers at her and posture. I'm into comforting the widow, metaphorically speaking, in this case, and then sorting out what constitutes approximate justice in this situation. Let's do that.
Har Fairweather
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Join date: 24 Jan 2007
Posts: 2,320
10-31-2007 16:12
From: Bradley Bracken
No posturing or playing with words. No personal threat felt, but you can't expect people not to feel emotions based on the words said.


Exactly, Bradley. Exactly.
Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
10-31-2007 16:15
From: OneBeautiful Jewell
Yes Yes and Yes, fucking offensive! Its really sad that people are so insensitive to other people, sadly...that's why there is still so much killing and hate in the world as we know it now.


Yes. There's killing and hate in the world because someone wanted to recreate a computer game.
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I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
Michal Milosz
Amateur Piercer
Join date: 22 Oct 2005
Posts: 73
10-31-2007 16:20
Yeah, go ahead, go hang the tailor because he dared to ask a stupid question.
No need to get emotional over all of it. My grandfather's brother was in the Resistance and died fighting the Nazis. I just needed the first reply to understand that fiddling with this shit will get me in trouble. But no, some of you have to whine, whine, whine, call for lynching, whine, whine, post an obscene picture, whine, whine, whine. Just look at yourselves.
Seriously, think about it. By calling to kill everyone who dares to think differently (even if they're wrong), you're no better than Nazis or Communists. And I don't even want to get into a dispute who was worse.
Dictatorship is always dead wrong. No matter if it's brown, red, or in the flowery pastel pink of political correctness. Period.
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Michal Milosz
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10-31-2007 16:21
From: Har Fairweather
As if "death" in Sl meant anything more in practice than being tp'ed home or at worst relogging, and being unceremoniously and unarguably rejected by someone. As if there was any chance in hell that Alicia could or would track anyone down in RL and literally do them in. Quit posturing and playing with words. Reality exists.

Har ~ she's very scary. and altho i think it's all just hot air, you should take her tale of prior murder as a clue to 'her' reality... she's a loose cannon prone to acting upon impulse prior to thought, motivated by inner anger that has festered into hate, which is then spewed out any time a conflict arises. this is not the first evidence of such behavior, albeit the most blatant and provocative. i find that remarkably scary. i guess you'll discover on your own, when you dare to disagree. until then, i admire your stance and efforts to #1 ease the tension and #2 teach a lesson in open-mindedness. Har ~ we all need to be respectful and compassionate to another persons' plight and those who are not are just plain cold. doesn't justify the over-the-top responses, nor the hate and threats being spewed (completely unnecessarily), cuz those themselves are from a close-minded perspective.... something you should also consider in your quest to protect the misguided. i feel sorry for a person who is in such inner turmoil that they have to lash out in such fashion. i also wouldn't turn my back on them.... but if i did, i'd be standing on a swivel and holding a protective device, for certain! ;)
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Alicia Sautereau
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Join date: 20 Feb 2007
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10-31-2007 16:27
From: 3Ring Binder
Har ~ she's very scary. and altho i think it's all just hot air, you should take her tale of prior murder as a clue to 'her' reality... she's a loose cannon prone to acting upon impulse prior to thought, motivated by inner anger that has festered into hate, which is then spewed out any time a conflict arises. this is not the first evidence of such behavior, albeit the most blatant and provocative. i find that remarkably scary. i guess you'll discover on your own, when you dare to disagree. until then, i admire your stance and efforts to #1 ease the tension and #2 teach a lesson in open-mindedness. Har ~ we all need to be respectful and compassionate to another persons' plight and those who are not are just plain cold. doesn't justify the over-the-top responses, nor the hate and threats being spewed (completely unnecessarily), cuz those themselves are from a close-minded perspective.... something you should also consider in your quest to protect the misguided. i feel sorry for a person who is in such inner turmoil that they have to lash out in such fashion. i also wouldn't turn my back on them.... but if i did, i'd be standing on a swivel and holding a protective device, for certain! ;)

u are right and wrong, with this, every one i know thinks exactly the same, normal stuff we laugh about but this is no joke

edit: i`ve never learned fancy wording or political stuff, i started working working when i was 15 and live in a crappy neighberhood, yes, my temper got me in more trouble but being nice in even more with financial consiquences

yes i`ve allways played the nice friendly game no matter what was thrown at me untill recently that i`ve learned my final lesson, but this....
u wouldn`t even come close to underderstand how much hatred there is in the family about the nazi`s
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Oryx Tempel
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10-31-2007 16:43
From: Showdog Tiger
Dearly Darlings,

For decades I've been painting little models of tanks from WWII. About five years ago Maneo asked me what I wanted for Christmas. I told him a ping-pong table. Naturally, I got it. He was stunned when I proceeded to cover it with dirt and started outlining tank battle plans from the North African Campaign. This does not make me a warmonger or a Nazi. I just like military history. Maneo would have loved me joining SL before we had sand all over the house. I do not find a problem with people role playing war/history games. However, that being said, I do not think that uniforms should be worn outside of the role playing sim. I did not think that way until I by accident offended a club manager by going into her club dressed up as the Marquis de Lafayette in battle clothing in honor of his 250th birthday. She is a pacifist. I found a shop and changed into civilian attire for the Marquis and was allowed back into the club. We have got to remember that our individual freedom to swing our fist ends at the other person's nose.

You all have a lovely evening.

Ever Yours,

Mrs. Showdog Tiger


I'm totally impressed with the ping pong table. That's cool. Actually, I'm always impressed with Mrs. Showdog Tiger's posts. :)
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Brenda Connolly
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10-31-2007 16:44
From: Oryx Tempel
I'm totally impressed with the ping pong table. That's cool. Actually, I'm always impressed with Mrs. Showdog Tiger's posts. :)

Yeah, most of us would think different things about a ping pong table.......
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3Ring Binder
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10-31-2007 16:45
Alicia honey, i removed you from my ignore list because i see that you responded to me, and i feel i owe you the read, at minimum, since i put myself in your business.
i do understand you position. i dont think anyone is questioning it. but to be fair, you are not the only one who feels the way you do, nor are you the only one who has prior history of desctruction, trauma and violence.

i do not think you should be proud to be so impulsive. you really need to get a handle on that. here you are, this witty and inteligent woman who has a great deal of depth, and instead of highlighting your positives, you run people off with your temper and irrational behavior.

i think it is clear that while 2 topics entered this thread:
1) censorship sux
2) universally, naziism is not welcome

you did go a LOT too far, too fast.

i have previsouly put you on my ignore list because you are so hostile. i feel for ya girl. i do. but you really need to slow down, calm down, and realize that no matter how loud you yell, some people just aren't going to hear you. there are better ways to make a point. no one is asking you to be PC.... personally, i hate PC and i won't do it. but you simply must not attack people and make threats, even over a topic so personal and painful, and rael to you.

it may surprise you that there are a ton of people who have PERSONALLY suffered a violent and traumatic experience (by personal, i mean they themselves, not their relatives) yet they aren't running around claiming "i'm a victim" all the time.

i just had a little conversation about this with a friend, and i think some points made might help you out. #1 your dad survived. so, that's good. #2, he isn't playing a victim... dont' assume he wants you to, to protect im and honor him. i think he would be crushed to know your inner pain. #3 don't just survice, THRIVE! it's the best revenge, and a healthier approach.

no one is asking these horrid events be forgotten, and the OP asked innocently BEFORE taking action. i hope you reread this thread and see where it went terribly wrong, and perhaps how you might have been more effective with a different approach.

i'm sorry girl, for your pain. but it's eating you up for you to be so volatile s quickly. get a handle on that. for your own sake.

in the meantime, don't take it personally if i walk a wide line around you. you're just too angry right now. you really need to take a break and regroup... gain a new perspective. we're on your side on this. remember that.

and apologize about those threats. that's just scary!
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