An interesting bit of hypocrisy

the fact wthat Anshe was or spokesperson helped, but its about her presence in SL, not her money

I belong to the group Ravenglass Rentals. Prokofy called a vote to announce the formation of a group called Metaverse Justice Watch (I believe) and that anyone who had concerns about the future of SL was welcome to attend. There are MANY people in this group, so the meeting was hardly a secret.

Hiro, Sadly you disappoint me. I made a point of saying 80% of this group is a sham, because I want to give some (who I know to be good people) the benefit of the doubt.

I'm not convinced. I think you are going down a very dangerous road here and I'd hate to see otherwise decent folk used at patsies.

Anshe Chung: This is what we feel makes us stakeholders. More like you [Lindens] and in contrast to e.g. merely tourists, users, consumers, players etc

I motion that you be renamed Pwndari Lopez...

... do I hear a second?

Well i think Katt explained it well -

" think everyone is a stakeholder in SL, but SOME -- the ones who consider this to be just a game, will never consider themselves so. I don't know Anshe personally, and have not formed an opinion of her, but I really believe that is all she meant by that particular statement."

And I know from experience with posting against Anshe, she is not reserved

This statement deeply bothers me.

Why should someone's choice about how much they invest in the game give them more or less of a stake in it? We're all equally stakeholders, we all invest some type of financial capital to be a member of SL.

Then you understand my point eh?

Who is this prok that you speak of ?

The Lindens can basically do what they feel like when they feel like at any time. (didnt you read the TOS?)


Anshe chung IMO is a land baroness trying to control SL land market and get at the good graces of the lindens by acting concerned for the residents well being. If in fact she is concerened for the residents well being,to some it may not be obvious.

We could use that in the group to lighten things up when Prok pulls out his soapbox

And why weren't YOU at the town hall?

What I find hypocritical is that Profoky Neva was in attendance doing the very thing he so blantaly accused the "FIC" of doing. By his own definition, this appears to be very FICish: secret meeting held with Lindens to pursue special favors for a select group.

I couldn't agree more! The whole situation is pure comedy gold. I'm not concerned about the transcript and I'm sure most of the participants truly had their hearts in the right place (I pretty much agree with Seth's comments about it)... but Prok's involvement in this, of all things, a semi-secret meeting with top Linden officials to lobby for self interest and deny access to his arch-nemesis special interest group (content creators)... it goes beyond comedy to some kind of profound performance art. I'm actually giddy.

At the meeting with the Lindens, I, as a member of the press, was asked to leave by a small group of people (seven to be exact). However, when I asked Prok if I should leave, he (who organized this meeting to begin with) said I should stay.

The government in SL is not a democracy, but more of a monarchy, with Lindens setting the rules and policies for our world. Those who believe that SL is another world, like me, would like to have some say so in how our world is created.

At the end of the meeting, Prokofy said, "Perhaps you will one day sign a Magna Charta lol?"

How did we get an audience with Philip and Robin?

As for the media. I also voted that I did not want them there. This was a vote of opinion, nothing else, I mean what will the vote achieve lol? Why did I vote that way? It was based on my experiences of the 'media'. The only 'newspaper I have read is not much more than a drama rag, and it was a vote against that.

I couldn't agree more! The whole situation is pure comedy gold. I'm not concerned about the transcript and I'm sure most of the participants truly had their hearts in the right place (I pretty much agree with Seth's comments about it)... but Prok's involvement in this, of all things, a semi-secret meeting with top Linden officials to lobby for self interest and deny access to his arch-nemesis special interest group (content creators)... it goes beyond comedy to some kind of profound performance art. I'm actually giddy.

This is the kind of question that is debated in the meetings. Some parts of the agenda are to provide a fairer business platform, and so that will only interest those with any kind of business, be it land or hoochie hair. But those parts of the agenda in no wat affect those who have no business negatively.

There are other parts of the agenda that will be of interest to everyone, such the disciplinary process.

She is not acting as the saviour of SL. She has her own interests, as do others. We needed a spokesperson, and we all agreed Anshe would be the best person for that.

Hiro,
I do agree with most of what was on the agenda that your head spokes person outlined to Phillip. All seemed like valid issues and concerns. What I do not like is that someone created a group by themselves and outlined an agenda. You will find that my opinion is the popular one. This is very much the start of a player run government, the baee foundation you could say. I do not think the person who was self appointed leader is for the best interest of the community. THis person is already a very powerful figure with the economy of SL and I feel that it could turn into a situation where conflicts of interest will arise.

The person in this position should be one that is of top notch character and has proven to be for the people and not for the profit. I think most would agree the current head spokes person is not.

Not unusual if you are trying to hide something. QUOTE]

I have to disagree with you on this point. I was on the board for the Boys and Girls Club in the county I live in when it was first starting up. My county has a LONG history of failing to establish an organization that provides a variety of opportunities for children, so on the basis of that, the board decided to refrain from releasing information to the press.

However, board meetings were open to the public. If press wanted to attend and then write a story on the meeting, nothing could have been done to prevent that from happening.

Freedom of the press, anyone?

This group has their own reasons for waiting to release info to the public. But since Prok announced the meetings in an ENTIRELY DIFFERENT group, I doubt that hiding anything is the goal of this group.

But since Prok announced the meetings in an ENTIRELY DIFFERENT group, I doubt that hiding anything is the goal of this group.

Please join the group and come to the next meeting

This group was not intended to be about self appointed representation for everyone in SL. It started out as a discussion, and quickly snow balled into something else - its moved so quick that my head is still spinning. What is the group? Well at the moment, with so many opposing views in so many discussions in such a short time, I don't think that has been established yet, but its based on an agenda which is open to any one interested. So I can not urge enough those with concerns to join the group and come to the meetings with an open mind before sentencing.

Do not judge the group by one person. Not Mulch, not Anshe, not myself. It is just that, a group, a group with those who wish to put forward a loose agenda to LL. Of course you get people with self interests and extreme views in any group of people, but this group is not composed of those with all the same views. This agenda is at a very basic level and does not favour land dealers over content providers or consumers, or vice versa. Anshe was chosen as spokesperson for the group because of her obvious presence in SL. Is that wrong? Well you tell me - would you have asked someone who has been here 2 months on basic, or someone like Anshe? Being a competitor in SL with Anshe, our relationship has been pretty colourful - just review the forum history between us for examples, but this whole thing has vastly changed my views on her. She did a great job in being spokesperson for the group - putting across the groups views and not just her own. There were a couple of things said that were less than appropriate, but I put that down to nerves and the language barrier. I am not sure I could have done better.

As for the media. I also voted that I did not want them there. This was a vote of opinion, nothing else, I mean what will the vote achieve lol? Why did I vote that way? It was based on my experiences of the 'media'. The only 'newspaper I have read is not much more than a drama rag, and it was a vote against that. I do believe in freedom of speech, but I just hate some of the ridiculous stuff written and didnt want it to turn into a drama fest and ruin somehting that could lead to something interesting. Maybe I was wrong there.

How did we get an audience with Philip and Robin? I am sure many of you have arranged to meet various Lindens in world about all kinds of stuff, both as individuals and as groups. I see this as no different. Of course the fact there was more than one individual asking for the meeting, and the fact wthat Anshe was or spokesperson helped, but its about her presence in SL, not her money. If LL really bowed down to those who pay high land tiers, Anshe and others like myself would not have any concerns to raise.

I hope that Philips responses and the 'openess' of the group will pursuade you that this is no 'FIC' lol. Please, please, if you have concerns, come and share them in future meetings.

Not just a little self-importance here.

The notecard and meeting speak for itself really. Its the intense dislike some people have for others that have caused this reaction.

They power brokers everyone is concerned with don't even want to govern.

I belong to the group Ravenglass Rentals. Prokofy called a vote to announce the formation of a group called Metaverse Justice Watch (I believe) and that anyone who had concerns about the future of SL was welcome to attend. There are MANY people in this group, so the meeting was hardly a secret.

I attended that meeting and the one with the Lindens. Prok did ask if a press release should be sent to news publications, but the response from the majority of people was "No, let's wait. People will just assume that we are another FIC."
At the meeting with the Lindens, I, as a member of the press, was asked to leave by a small group of people (seven to be exact). However, when I asked Prok if I should leave, he (who organized this meeting to begin with) said I should stay.

I think everyone is a stakeholder in SL, but SOME -- the ones who consider this to be just a game, will never consider themselves so. I don't know Anshe personally, and have not formed an opinion of her, but I really believe that is all she meant by that particular statement.

I consider SL to be an alternate reality for me. I have a full life there, with friends, family and a business. I share the same concerns that Anshe mentioned. I want to see SL grow and prosper so that I can forever live there. Does that make me a bad person?

Maybe this is a grab for power. Maybe it is the efforts of the high and mighty. But how do you know? Instead of bashing the group and getting angry, why not take a "wait and see" approach?

The government in SL is not a democracy, but more of a monarchy, with Lindens setting the rules and policies for our world. Those who believe that SL is another world, like me, would like to have some say so in how our world is created.

At the end of the meeting, Prokofy said, "Perhaps you will one day sign a Magna Charta lol?" To which Philip Linden replied, "It would be so inspiring to have a document like that!"

For those of you who have forgotten your British history, here's a brief lesson:
The Magna Carta is an 1215 English charter which limited the power of English monarchs, specifically King John, from absolute rule. Magna Carta was the result of disagreements between the Pope and King John and his barons over the rights of the king: Magna Carta required the king to renounce certain rights and respect certain legal procedures, and to accept that the will of the king could be bound by law. Magna Carta is widely considered to be the first step in a long historical process leading to the rule of constitutional law.

To me, it sounds as though Prok believes that the residents of SL should have more input into the decisions LL makes regarding SL. It also seems as though Philip agrees. Isn't that what we would like to have happen? I don't understand how all of the anger and personal attacks will clear this up or make SL a better place to be.

I would also like to point out that I am not a member of this group, and that I don't agree 100% with what was said at the meeting either. I am not defending them. I am simply suggesting that we give them a chance to prove that they are not another FIC. Give them a chance to prove that they want what is best for ALL of SL, and not simply what is best for them.