I don.t get it, and they certainly don't

I think we got your point Prokofy. I don't think more half-page long lectures are going to help your cause.

You're apparently deeply offended by the fact that Pahoa questioned your motives for wanting the water, just as you questioned hers. So much so that you cannot contain your disdain for not just Pahoa specifically (as you stated in an earlier post), but apparently a mass of other old timers as well, all the while overlooking the fact that the demographics of the respondants to this thread that posted contrary to you represents a healthy cross section of player of all SL "ages".

It is noteworthy that Pahoa never mentioned your name in her initial post and that you basically posted long, drawn out, self-indulgent, wound licking, name-calling diatribes, targetting not just Pahoa. If you were upset with Pahoa, fine, tell her so, do whatever it takes to let the public know that you're offended, but when you start making broad, sweeping generalizations saying things like olders players were having "love fests" with the Lindens and other fantastical nonsense like that, don't be suprised if you get called out on it.

My word, what is worse? Pahoa making an assumption, or you, labelling a large segment of the populace with derisive, near paranoid accusations and assumptions?

Schwan, that smiley is dead on!

I agree Nolan.

Prokofy, let it go. Don't bother Pahoa anymore. It's quite clear she is not interested in dealing with you. The whole purpose of this thread is your bad attitude.

Oh, Pahoa gets to have the "last word" by posting a ridiculous hectoring comment because I merely said on an alt "Don't worry be happy?"????

I don't bother Pahoa. I respond to her when she posts on the forums because I don't take character assassination lying down.

I am not harassing Pahoa.

If anything, she is ranting and flaming me and creating untenable conditions for me.

She claimed that in effect I was lying, when she contacted this customer directly and claimed the customer never asked me about water purchase or expressed concern about the build, and appeared to claim that I was inciting this customer by asking her about artwork. It was all a misrepresentation on her part. I have the customers' IMs to me and her emails while I was offline, and trust me, she contacted me first, she expressed concern first, she said she wanted to cash out and move and get her money back, and it was I who talked about the artwork as only being dolphins, and followed up with her after talking to Pahoa, saying, no big store, don't worry. So however either this customer or Pahoa want to represent this transaction to their best lights, the record shows that they were the ones with concerns, not me, nor did I "incite" concerns.

Pahoa claimed that she didn't "trash" my development but in fact she lept to assumptions about my motivations, as you and others did, characterizing me as a rapacious land baron bent on cashing out and not building the community or remaining in the area in any fashion. She criticized the customer's build from what she belived to be universal, eminent-domain kind of oldbie aesthetics to the effect that the build was "crowded" or "jutted out" although she exerts her God-given right to build anywhere in the water anyway she wants and jut King Kong out if the spirit moves her.

She also neglected to include in her first rant that in fact she had a) inquired of my reasons and motivations making assumptions of the worst-- something she thinks she herself should be shielded from b) said the "tract" was too crowded and houses were plopped down side by side.

Er...why in your me-first world does she get to do this, and I get accused of "harassment"?

The Lindens can determine when or if someone is harassed, and they are always welcome to file harassment reports.

Please stop behaving as if you are the sheriff of SL. Weedy, I don't care how decent a person you are, how nice your builds are, how much you are respected, you are leading a posse on this forum, and that is unbecoming and downright nasty. The record shows it.

I'm presenting logic and facts in responding to this posse. You are hectoring and even bullying. The record shows it.

I'd like to request the Lindens to publish the transcript of that night's conversation so that the world can see that my inquiries were polite, my repeating of the question and concerns as not hounding, but an attempt to allay a prickly, over-sensitive, reactive neighbour who couldn't merely say "no it's not for sale" and "no we don't plan a big store" without getting into a major huff.

He's quite a character, isn't he?

Usually those who take the time to write long posts have a great deal of information to convey, while those who are being nasty stick to a couple of sentences. To our detriment, we now have in our forum a character who combines both -- posts that are nasty and long. As a bonus this character is also capable of tirelessly replying to each and every post over the course of many days with equal vitriol.

Perhaps we all could save a lot of time by having this character simply type a single sentence in place of the usual post: "I disagree with everything you posted and I hate not just your point of view but you as well." Given that the jumbo posts don't tend to contain logical arguments anyway, I think the reduction would capture the feeling accurately without loss of information.

~Ulrika~

*Pops a dime in the slot.*

Yes, I was a beta-tester after playing offline sims for 3 years and running several major clubs and websites for sim stories. Yes, I was a charter member. But I wasn't part of the self-appointed beta love-fest elite that hung out with the Maxis people whether Will Wright himself, the inventor, or liaisons like Tigger. I may have spoke once or twice to them, but I wasn't part of that pack that mobbed their lots and hung out and was generally "in" with them.

Ingrid, you didn't know me for most of my more than 2 years in TSO. I minded my business and didn't even know what gloving was for something like a year. I took on the tyrannical mafia organization SSG which had ruthlessly griefed half the population of TSO. I also took on certain BDSMers who refused to accommodate the fact that we had children, teens, and non-consenting adults in the game. So that meant I wasn't any kind of cossetted and feted beta test love fest kind of person. Far from it. I was notorious

So it's not like I lost some coveted standing in one game and traded it for humbling ignomy in another. Far from it. And I still belong to TSO and still have friends there.

Show me ONE example of Pahoa flaming you. Show me ONE example of someone other than Pahoa that assumed your motives (reselling it) for that land if indeed you had acquired it. The only indignation I have seen others take here is at your near hysterical view of a set of residents within SL.

You speak of baggage. I am not sure if you realize it or not, but your baggage from having lived in Russia is spilling out all over this thread and others in the form of a fantastical view of what some of the old timers represent here.

Posse my ass. You come out swinging at an unnumbered amount of people and then some folks swings back and now they're a posse? Take a look at my second signature quote, and think about it for a minute.

Your overwhelming need to have the last word Prokofy, it a case in point of your childish responses. Like always.

I lead nothing, its a dillusion that you have, by trying to twist the facts and diverting the purpose of this thread. You seem to think you can lead a posse of negative ratings against bad builders, and thats supposed to be ok?

This is your own undoing. Keep it up, I've met some wonderful people in-game because of this thread.

And the next "ruler" of SL crawls back out into the open from under the rock rejuvenated and prepared to jump on the slamwagon...

Wb.... or not.

Weedy has championed the selection of snippets from the whole thread as a wonderful tool to provide snapshots for people not willing to wade through this ridiculously long thread (more than half of which, BTW, is taken up with a battle between Korg and Nolan that isn't even about me, really, or the subject of this thread -- just in case you didn't notice.)

Here are examples of what I mean by smug, know-it-all, hectoring, often exaggerated, and usually condescending language in posts that in a few instances even degenerates to ominous threats, put out by people who believe they are absolutely right, should never be challenged, and who symbolize the oldbie eminent-domain attitude which I've been endeavoring to capture, and which Korg and a few others agreed exists:

I maybe the quiet one of the group but I never back down from my own battles. Pahoa Jade

Why, are some people so narrow minded as to think their vision or what they choose to do with their land should take presidence over others? Pahoa Jade

Why, after they buy land do they feel they have a right to demand what other earlier buyers around them plan to do with their land Pahoa Jade

Who are they to presume what I plan to do with my land is unacceptable? Or, worse yet, presume to know what my plans may be and judge it by that? Pahoa Jade

So in short, if you're concerned, get to know your potential neighbors, learn their vision before you buy. If your main concern is resell and you dont take the time, dont complain later and STFU. Pahoa Jade

Your customer has no business making such demands. Weedy Herbst

It is evident you want make money regardless of your neighbors, and are quick to judge others while shielding yourself from criticism. Weedy Herbst

He'd really like to have nothing but trees out his window but he doesn't have enough money to buy the land to enforce that. That's where he's coming from, but he's still a chuckle head. Rickard Roentgen

OMG a GORILLA! I demand my money back! What next? OMFG, a STORE!!!!!
The sky is falling. C. Little Weedy Herbst

You want to lay down the law, buy a sim. Tcoz Bach

You may not like "that attitude", or whatever, but that's just hard cheese in the semi-working world that is SL. Anything else is a waste of breath. Tcoz Bach

Dont presume to know what the outcome will be and judge by your nearsightedness when they have told you they are undecided Pahoa Jade

One very important thing you have to still learn about SL is that we are a tight knit community. There are some that are *very* highly respected in this community. To begin an argument against them accusing them of exaggerations and fabrications is a sure fire way to keep your argument from being read. Right or wrong, that simply *is* a fact. So in your first paragraph you just turned off a lot of people from even trying to see your point of view. Just a note of advice Pendari Lorentz

I believe you have an alternate agenda against a few people in SL. And that you will say anything to build your project up while tearing others down Pendari Lorentz

All this "consideration of neighbors" usually boils down to somebody that moved in and wants somebody else to do something, and when they say "no", they complain like this. You're just one in a very long history of the people who lose these battles, such as they are. Tcoz Bach

And if you wish to succeed in SL, when you're done complaining, you'll realize it and understand that if it's not your land, whining is pointless. Tcoz Bach

You know, not everybody plays this game to be part of some arbitrary community. Tcoz Bach

Read the owner before you run your mouth. Crimson Sunchaser

If it was me with the way you act I'd pave it and have Monster fights every Friday night. Crimson Sunchaser

It's a wonderful vision, to maintain a beautiful residential area people can live within in confidence. However, one of the prerequisites is a project leader who can play well with others. Lisse Livingston

Hmmm I see the TSO Refugee took this opportunity to assault my associates in my abscence. Shadow Weaver

Had you kept your mouth shut you would have never looked the fool as you do now talking in circles and basing things on you "YOUR" opinion of things. Shadow Weaver
I told her to report you for harrasment as you were infringing on her and the groups rights to do as we wished with our land. Shadow Weaver

Again what was your point.....
was it?
A)I'm a land barron and I am trying to make money selling plots of land to Newbies
B)I'm a Self ritious indignation anus attempting to impose my will on others
C)I'm a concerened citizen of Second Life and being such I want to make sure UGLY builds do not exist.
Your Choice pick one as I have more that possibly could apply as well
If you have issues with your customers because you make grandious promises that you cannot keep is neither my nor anyone elses problems in Second Life. Shadow Weaver

I don't give a shit if you like Kong or not. I do,I placed him there and I wont move him because someone dosent like his looks. He was put there as a joke to Shadow when he came back. I won't be taking him down just for Prokofy Neva. Crimson Sunchaser

The other things near Ravenglass were put there on OUR land because we like them. If you want to push it I own 3/4s of the stuff Starax has made. I could fill that plot with them. Crimson Sunchaser

Here is some rope and a shovel. I will cut you some more slack with the rope because you are doing a great job of hanging yourself. The shovel is for the pit you are digging for yourself. Weedy Herbst

You may as well return the nose clip too, because reading your posts, it's quite obvious your S--T don't stink. You will say anything, twist any comment, babble on in endless paragraphs about your self appointed zealot for harrassing anyone who's build does not meet your standards. Weedy Herbst

Go ahead, push the revert button. you will do the community a favor. Weedy Herbst

You said it, not me. Need a bigger shovel? Weedy Herbst

Reading your posts, it immensly obvious, your contempt is the issue of this thread. Not King Kong, or your customers, or your nieghbors. You don't have a humble prim in your avatar. Weedy Herbst

LOL, I almost don't have to reply to you at all. All anyone needs to do is hand you a bit of rope and you happily hang yourself with it. Your posts reek of arrogance and a sense of entitlement... and more importantly, a complete lack of empathy for anyone but yourself. Chip Midnight

So before you decide to impose your misguided sense of aesthetics on the world as a whole, I suggest you take a step back and ask yourself if you might not be the target of derision. Ardith Mifflin

So Prokofy take this as a lesson
#1 Dont bug people about their land as its thiers and as long as they follow the TOS they can do as they wish.
#2 Your issues with your customers is your problem Not mine, nor Pahoa's nor Crims nor anyone in Second Life's for that matter.
#3 If you Sell land, be prepared if you sell alot of it, your gonna be labled a Land Barron Period!!..get over it.
#4 If you think Neg rating are going to get someones attention you are sadly mistaken as some of us wear our negs like a badge of Honor or Courage in the face of adversity. Right now your our adversity with your incessant banter.
So suck up your pride pick up your lip and what ever else your stepping on with golf shoes and get over it. You were wrong your point wasnt made and you have no rights over anyone else unless they are on YOUR land. Deal with it and life will get much much better for you. Shadow Weaver

Yes I am arrogant, Yes, I am Cynical, Yes, I am rude beyond remorse when confronted. But, you either accept me as such or move on in avoidance as I will not change. Shadow Weaver

That's quite a generalization. Do you know all of SL's older players?? Cause I know alot of them and most of them are very helpful, generous and kind to newbs. Of course, most don't care for hostile players or idiots (older and newer), but the same can be said for alot of newer players as well. Chip Midnight

You are not the building police, not a Linden and not the owner of the land in question and its NONE of your business, even lesser, the right to harrass people about it. The broader issue is dealing with self appointed Zealots like you who think they have control over that which they don't own. Weedy Herbst

Think about your neighbors for a minute having a self rightous, name calling, arrogant, wannabe building inspector next door persistantly harrasing them over a LEGAL build. Its the reason why this thread was started in the first place and why you continue to bury yourself in your own verbal diarrhea. You don't give a rat's ass about anyone but yourself and your half baked ideals. Weedy Herbst

You spew alot of crap about setting examples for younger players. Pathetic example you are. Ignoring the TOS to get your way, making harsh unfounded judgments, name calling, sterotyping are your methods. You know nothing about resolution. YOU ARE THE PROBLEM. Take your punk attitude elsewhere. Nobody is buying into it. If people do things out of spite, its because you earned it. Weedy Herbst

You just don't get it do you? Weedy Herbst

How in the hell do you ever expect to gain any support and for your ideals? You are wholly disfunctional at mutual respect and civil decorum. 10 pages of threads which should have died, but yet you manage to spout off something to irk someone and follow up with your childish last word. Weedy Herbst

I'm really not sure where all these rights and entitlements are coming from. First a right to a good view...then a right to engage me in conversation...where will this all end?? A right to change my radio station and play tiddly-winks with *my* kitchen with *my* woman?? I say NAY, no further these ever expanding entitlements!! Alexin Bismark

Why bother to point it out in tirade after name-calling tirade? What is the impetus for these snarling, razor-clawed tirades then? Nolan Nash

You're all full of sh*t. Especially you, Nolan.
And Korg, nobody gives a damn what you think or say.
Peace out, pissants. Wall Street

You berate, sterotype and slough off your community mates as communists etc. Are you sure that SL is the right place for you? Does demeaning your game-mates make you happy? Weedy Herbst

...your belligerance and hypocracy is excessive and uncalled for. To me a tyranical zealot is 100x worse than any bad build. Your bad attitude is the problem. That is why this thread is still running and the rope gets longer and the hole gets deeper for you. Weedy Herbst


In all my time in SL I have never heard so much hate and generalization from one player. Pahoa Jade

I'm thankful these people NEW and OLD do not choose to believe the filth you spew and remain untouched by your venomous hatred of others not like you.

Some one like you never lasts in a community like SL and I have decided to just wait it out. Pahoa Jade

And NO, Im not happy to post here to confront you, but your beligerance and hypocracy is excessive and uncalled for. Weedy Herbst

Usually those who take the time to write long posts have a great deal of information to convey, while those who are being nasty stick to a couple of sentences. To our detriment, we now have in our forum a character who combines both -- posts that are nasty and long. As a bonus this character is also capable of tirelessly replying to each and every post over the course of many days with equal vitriol. Ulrika Zugzwang

Posse my ass. You come out swinging at an unnumbered amount of people and then some folks swings back and now they're a posse? Take a look at my second signature quote, and think about it for a minute. Nolan

I lead nothing, its a dillusion that you have, by trying to twist the facts and diverting the purpose of this thread. You seem to think you can lead a posse of negative ratings against bad builders, and thats supposed to be ok?

This is your own undoing. Keep it up, I've met some wonderful people in-game because of this thread. Weedy Herbst

Actually, I never wrote "hectoring, shmectoring" -- that's someone else's post, that's a glitch Nolan.

Er...I'm supposed to dig for examples of Pahoa flaming me? But her whole initial rant was a flame, and everything she and her confreres wrote afterwards.

Perhaps it's unfortunate that this minor and really inconsequential dust-up with her over this water issue should become an exaggerated lens to examine the issue of the oldbie inner elite. I quite agree that this needs to be taken up separately, and such sweeping claims need to be backed by specific examples that can illustrate this entirely controversial point. Korg and a few others conceded that yes, there is a clique/elite/whatever. Most communities have them. Most people play their game around them. What Korg captured best about this is their absolute inability to look at themselves

How many of these posts is it going to take you before you feel you have gotten your point across? You're not going to change some of our minds, period.

Btw, the "hectoring, schmectoring" was my way of saying "enough already with that word, you've beaten it to death."

I am exiting this pile of crap which is festooned with exagerration, assumption and paranoia. I understand that you think you are exposing the SL Skull & Bones club, it's loud and clear, and I think you are dead wrong.

Footnote: You would do well to consider that proverb yourself.

Do not measure by your own arshin.
Old Russian proverb

Do not spit into the well, you may have to drink from it--Old Russian Proverb.

Eggs cannot teach a hen.
Old Russian Proverb

Profoky is perfect, everyone else is wrong. Right?

In a quarrel, leave room for reconciliation. (Russian proverb)

Now all of you stop arguing... you're acting like spoiled infants.

No.. wait. I am always right. See, you are wrong again Weedy.

Dang

Don't come into another monastery with your bylaws--Old Russian Proverb

Another case of your "Do what I say, not as I do mentality"

Nobody believes anything you say here.

As you cooked the porridge, so must you eat it.

Not everyone who has a cowl on is a monk.

Do not cut the bough you are sitting on.

An empty barrel makes the greatest sound.

One good turn....gets most of the blanket

\


You need a sharp axe for a tough bough.

The devil is not so frighful as he is painted.

The scythe ran into a stone.

Every sandpiper praises its own swamp.

Whoever talks about what, the louse-ridden talks about the bath.

Go there, I know not where, fetch that, I know not what.

In America you can always find a party. In Russia the party always finds you.
-- Yakov Smirnoff

~Ulrika~