Why people buy or use weapons in this game ?

Oh, I know that there are woman who like uniforms... but just as many who do not.

My avatar gets also a lot of attention and yes, it is annoying at times.

Morwen.

Actually that's not quite true. Gun crime has sky rocketted in the UK since guns were banned it's true, but not "violent" gun crime. The increase in "gun related crime" is due to the fact that an offence of Posessing a Firearm was created and this articially inflates the figures. No more people have been shot or threatened with a gun than were prior to the Firearms Act (revised) 1997 - but a lot more peoploe are guilty of "gun related crime" simply by having a gun, whereas before they were not comitting an offence. These people are now included in the Home Office figures relating to gun crime.

This cooking of the books is a ploy by the police to secure greater funding to tackle gun crime. That's probably a good thing, to be fair. But it is a shame that it has become necessary to fiddle the figures in this way in order for the police to get the resources they should have had from the start.

Yes. My Rl fiance is also my alts' partner in SL too. So I can't get away with anything even on SL!

Well... I know what you mean there

(my partner is also in SL)

Morwen.

I think that in SL if you don't want people to wear hats, or any clothes for that matter, you have the perfect right to ask them not to, and ban anyone who does not remove theirs at your request.

In RL, it is a bit more complex, and depends on whether your land happens to be in a place people actually need to access for pressing reasons, and whether banning them is possible without resorting to actual violence, and stuff like that.

why do people buy or use weapons in this game?..........................

well.............heres my answer

people mostly possess weapons for personal use or the weapon is for fashion.

lots of responsible SL citizens are forced to put away their guns for good because
other people are not open minded about this subject.

if one person asks why can't i just wear my guns in its holster, 20-30 other people
come running out of nowhere with 1,000 reasons why they shouldn't even own a gun
in SL.

and for whatever your reason for not having a gun or even wanting to associate with
any weapons in SL is your business, but that does not mean that you should force
everybody who want to display their weapons on their avatar to see your point of
view.

i understand that you did not come to SL to be a target......nether did i, but you
should at least try to understand why we are wearing our weapons, just like you
want us to understand why we shouldn't wear our weapons, you might
be surprised at the answers you get from us.

to me and any other gun toting resident of SL its all about the look............thats it
the look of someones avatar may depend on attachments they have on(such as weapons
of reasonable sort.......rocket launchers or huge cannons may be too much in this case)
a ninja, samurai or knight avatar may need a sheathe sword to complete the look,
the same goes for a solder, police officer, assassin, urban gang member or just someone
who has an appreciation of weapons and are not affrade to show it (until now).

and please do not tell us that if we want all the guns we can handle then go else where
because SL is not that type of place, because in the same breath it would take you
to say that we can say that if you want a more weapon-less world then you can go
somewhere else...................right?

and for the people who are quick to quote "theres a time and place for everything"

yes this is true we don't need our guns on all the time.......no argument there.

but the tools that sim/parcel owners have at their disposal is the key to solving most
of your problems, just turn the scripts off...........if no scripts are running then no one
can shoot...........but oh.........wait........i forgot...............if you turn the scripts off
then the people who uses AO's are not going to be happy and not come there anymore
and i know that yall do not want to piss them off or lose their business.

and the one thing that really pisses me off is the places that has scripts turned off
and they still want to b***ch about the guns being worn, oh come on.......how anal
can you be, if you just took the one thing away that every weapon needs to operate
then theres no longer a threat.

there are simple things that people can do to recognize a threat from people with guns
if you go to view and turn on the thing that allows you to see invisible objects and
you see red guns in their hands then you there may be some trouble, but if you see
that there are no red guns in their hands.......then i think that its safe to say that
the guns are for show, i take the "action guns" off when i leave a combat zone and
leave on the "holstered guns" on unless i have to take them off as well.

and most of you dont even realize that a hud is cheaper and has more options than
any gun i saw on SL and it cant even be seen, so why are sitting there judging
someone who has holstered weapons on?

oh and i don't really care if you think that anybody who wears a gun is a griefer
but keep this in mind, if someone has put in alot of time and L$ to dress up their
avatar then i think that griefing is far from what they intend to do.

its true that sim/parcel owners have the right to make up whatever rule they see fit
and they have the right to eject and ban anyone that does not follow them.

people who want to dictate what others should do or wear to for fill their vision of
what SL should be should look else where because SL is a place for everyone and it has
something for everyone, SL is huge because of the amount of freedom one
has, unlike other 3d worlds that restricts the use of things like guns and sex or just
anything that will raise an eyebrow, SL is a place that lets you do whatever you want
or be whoever you want(within reason) and for someone else to try and control
what someone else can or can't wear based on what it is its just wrong.

im sure that if asked nicely and not given a 3 second ultimatum to remove our guns
then the responsible person will comply without argument or just leave
but to just ban someone without giving them a chance to comply with your rules
is just wrong........yeah.......i know.........my land my rules no questions asked
but we all have one thing in common, we all have rights.......you have the right
to ban people without a reason and i and other gun wearers have the right to
bear arms(for looks only).

and thats my thoughts on this subject(seems to me that this subject is getting touchy by
the minute)

Maybe they buy guns to defend themselves from the Zombies cuased by Thread Necromancers.

Boy, Ranya, have you touched on a lot of hot-button topics. And you are right.

There are people who have such a horror of - gasp - GUNSZOMG!!! - that they become bereft of all reason. You need to treat them like any other emotionally disturbed person - with compassion if you can, without mercy if you must.

"I laugh at those who think themselves good because they have no claws." - Friedrich Nietzsche

There is also an ideological agenda here - gun control is a decades-old issue among doctrinaire left-liberal types, and you will get no logic from them. They will get on their high horse and proclaim their moral superiority by denouncing you if they can for yo9ur symbolic defiance of their High Holy Doctrines. You have to blow them off. These, too, are emotionally troubled.

If your concern is purely self-defense, know that there are far more effective methods available than virtually all "guns" in SL. You can walk about prepared to send your average griefer, not merely several sims away, but several MILLION meters away, and no-one need know you have that capability until you send them off. So, guns are an option, not a necessity. Plus, apparently, you can equip many very effective guns very quickly, if need be.

Personal self-defense is an absolute personal right. Period, full stop. There are those so in love with nanny-state authority that they would like to deprive you of that right so you will be forced to turn to a Higher Governing Power for self-protection. Ignore them. Send ARs, use support, call on the landowner or his delegates, sure. But when it comes down to be a victim or not be a victim, protect yourself.

If you want to carry a weapon as a fashion statement, absolutely do so! If people can walk around as vampires and monsters and spike-clad murderers and every sort of pathological pervert in the known universe as a "fashion statement," walking around with a visible weapon certainly is too. And if someone hassles you about it, by all means give them an earfull. Hey, maybe send them a few sims or a few million meters away, if they are obnoxious enough to deserve it.

There is nothing so intolerant as a self-righteous ideologue, and visible weapons are something that seems to disturb certain of them mightily, for whatever reason. So do it, and enjoy! Tehy need some cognitive dissonance in their pathetically self-narrowed lives.

I haven't done much with guns here. I don't have either the time, or inclination.

I do, however, like the fact that facilities are here that enable people to use them. That way, I could if I wanted too.

It's the choices that are availible that keep me in SL. Nothing is more irritating that a morally indignant, self appointed guardian of the morals, telling me that any deviance from their way of life is utterly wrong, sad, stupid, pathetic etc. you'll usually find that anyone spouting this crap fills the description of what they are saying.

As long as their use is kept within the proper places, I really don't get why there would be a problem. You can wear so many guns you look like a gunpile with legs for all I care, just don't shoot them at me. You see people wearing guns all the time in SL, meh. If that's going to get you upset, you need to stop looking for reasons to get upset.

i do have guns in SL, mostly as part of costumes. Most clubs will allow a holsterd weapon as part of a costume, if they're having a themed event (like say, cowboy).

I can see the reason behind asking someone at a club or other gathering place to remove their gun, be it ornamental or active, but I think it's gotten out of hand and is more of an issue of control than "gun control".

People in SL can't compare SL guns to RL guns because they don't actually have the same effect on the world. If guns IRL only made you instantly appear at home or made you bounce super high I don't think the NRA would have a place and there would be no gun control debate at ANY level of society including SL.

So why sweat guns in land that is damage and push disabled? It's more a matter of the person being "offended" by the presence of impotent weapons wanting to control their surroundings than any legitimate concern for safety. They've either been programmed to think that anyone with anything that resembles a weapon is a griefer or that the principles of non-violence and pacifism apply in the same way to SL. Neither are true.

I know there are griefer weapons made specifically to lag people and crash sims and whatnot. I'm not talking about those. Most often you'll see those types of weapons on people that obviously look like trouble...n00b skinned tiny blue fat guy with a giant pot leaf hovering over their head and things like that...but not on people that look like they actually took time to craft their avatar and/or uniform.

I also know that isn't always the case and that there are exceptions to just about every rule but that doesn't necessarily justify discrimination in any form.

"DISCRIMINATION!!??" you say? Yes. A regular combat gun in a non-damage/non-push area is about as dangerous and laggy (and many times LESS) than some of the furry avs out there. They're both prims with scripts in them attached to an avatar.

Yet if I were to freeze any furry to come to my store and ask them to wear another av I would get raging accusations of discrimination thrown at me! I know I'm within my rights as a land owner to do this, but that wouldn't stop the accusations and isn't what determines whether it's ethical business-wise or socially correct behavior.

But why?? You can't say that people with guns are more likely to grief than furries or that furries tend to be less violent or harassing than those with guns!! I've been in PLENTY of situations that debunk THAT myth!

Again, I am aware that people will act stupid and bust out guns in places and try to wreak havoc just to watch their "victims" squirm, but honestly, do you really need a gun to do that in SL these days??

It's all more a matter of perception and control than anything else.

cause it`s fun to shoot griefers at home for target practice with push and eject bullets while they keep coming back

So thats why there is a big muddy hole in the forums and suspicious muddy tracks leading away...

I'll admit to be one who believes in RL gun control. Control, as opposed to banning them all outright. However, in SL, I have quite a collection of guns. They can be fun as long as they aren't being used for griefing. Oddly enough, the last gun I bought in SL has never been fired. Its purely ornamental.

i wear guns frequently. ironically, the real weapons are located on my hud.

I'm sweet, shy, and inoffensive.

I also love the workmanship of a fine sword, knife, or gun, and the skill and self-discipline involved in being able to use them competently. And yes, I *am* competent with weapons in RL...and am looking forward to being so in SL.

If you say, "no weapons on my land", I'll gladly either comply or simply not visit. It's your land, and your choice. But please, don't ban somebody who shows up with a weapon as part of his or her outfit without at least giving them a chance to know and follow your rules!

I guess what I'm saying is, ban the attitude, not the hardware.

i agree to a degree of what you said

my last post was not about self-defense but more of freedom of expression

i do not use my guns in non combat sims and like i said before, i always detach
the "action guns" from my hands and leave the holstered guns on(until asked to remove
them) but my post was more on how anti-gun people are so quick to say that
SL is not a combat game so theres no need for guns EVER, and im willing to bet that
if there was ever a day where if there was a vote to ban weapons it would be a landslide
vote and the no gun policy would win(or i could be wrong)

but the big picture is that weather its guns, AO's, wings, prim-hair or just something
that you feel that you have a right to wear then go right ahead and do what you want
and dont let the opinions of others dictate what you want to do(within reason)

if they dont want any part of the weapons thing then its their choice
but dont come here to the forums and preach about why guns should be banned from SL

its to my understanding that people tend to bash what they dont understand
and i know that it has more to do with what they think SL is more than what it
really is, a place that is full of freedom and where you can be just about anything
you want.

lmao, really good joke, saved my day, was it difficult to compose this punchline?

This is just a joke so dont take it too seriously.

All casino owners now need to own guns to shoot any one who comes on their land threatening to AR them.

Excellent idea. Did this ever work out?

my guns look like guns they are a part of my outfit and my charater in the game, they also will not work on your land, i do not wear the copies on my hands, there fore i can not 'draw' them they are only things attached to my legs, therefore they are not guns.



nice logic morwen

I have a nice looking gun which shoots lipstick and makes a kissing noise...I bought it because it made me laugh.

Ok.............to clear up some(or alot) of misunderstanding about guns in SL
i have decided to give those who dont understand guns and how they work
(in SL) more information that will hopefully put this topic to rest.

to start, i will clear up most of the misunderstanding about guns by starting
with the basics,

1, information to better understand guns.
2, why the misunderstanding in the first place.
3, the understanding of why we wear or use guns in SL.
4, and umm i dont know.....maybe come up with some type of gun etiquette?

ok.....shall we get started.

Information to better understanding guns

its to my understanding that people who are against guns do not understand
how they work or dont care and think that any presence of a gun spells trouble
but i hope that this information will help.

to start, guns are objects that look and work like RL firearms but with one major
difference.......SL guns scripted to do more than just shoot objects at other
people without harm, but shooting someone with a gun in SL will have a different
effect than shooting someone in RL with a gun, but the major problem is that
most people see a gun in SL and instantly think the worst, but the reaction
to being shot in SL with a gun will leave a sour taste in your mouth and a
abuse report against the person who fired the shot.

guns like any other object in SL needs scripts to work but they also need build
enabled land to work. (more on this in a minute)

most guns that are scripted to shoot are the guns that are most found in the
persons hand and not the holster(theres 2 freebie guns that attaches its self to the
back/leg but you can tell when its armed because the gun animation will work and
it will look like they are holding an invisible gun)

most guns bought in SL from known gun makers will have the guns set up
to use a simple holster system, the guns have two copies, the one in the hand
(i call these the action guns) and the one in the holster, the guns that are in
the holster are harmless because these guns are only scripted to make the
gun disappear and reappear on command from the owner, the guns that
disappear from the hands are still there but they are completely transparent
and the holstered guns appear, so the gun that is in the holster is never
active.......this gun is only for show, to put it another way(and more simple)
the guns in the holster are never directly attached to the hands at all,
the gun in the holster is being told to hide and the action gun is being
told to show its self by its scripts.

another thing is that guns can only work if build and scripts are on,
guns need the scripts to work and build to rez the bullets, if build is turned
off the the gun cannot rez a bullet to hit any bystanders because a gun needs
build enabled to create a bullet in the first place, the scripts can be turned off
by any land owner in SL, once the scripts are disabled then the gun wont work
at all eliminating any threats of griefing but at the same time the only scripts
that will run is any owned by the owner or designated group of that land.


Why the misunderstanding in the first place

most of the misunderstanding comes from griefers, SL anti-gun activist and
people who think that they have a right to defend themselves against griefers.

in the forums on the other hand, its all about word play, most people use the
word "carry" instead of "wear" and it can be difficult to determined what one
person is saying from the next, there are 2 other threads on this subject and
it always end up the same: gun carriers just ends up defending their right to
"carry" their guns, anti-gun people ends up trying to force everyone to see
their point of view and put away the guns PERIOD, and last but not least
the people who think that they can shoot back if shot by a griefer on safe land
because they feel that filling out an AR is just useless.

@any anti-gun activist

please stop trying to force your opinion on everybody and please stop judging
everybody who is wearing weapons, we know that if you dont want to be apart
of anything that has to do with guns then its you right to not even look at a
gun in SL and if you own land then its your right to make whatever rule you
see fit but please do not ban anybody for wearing their guns in its holster
without giving them a chance to comply with your rules but if they fail to
then they can be ejected or banned, if you eject or ban some one for wearing
guns then at least send them an IM letting them know why you did, also if you
own land and you make a public profile please have the rule posted there as
well, i know that you will have the rules posted on your land but everything
takes time to rez, it can even take minutes for everything to rez completely
even textures will take time till its readable.

i know that you will have your opinions but trying to make everybody see your
point of view is what upsets us in the first place, just think.........has anyone
who is into guns ever forced any pro-gun propaganda on you? yes,no, maybe
or i dont know?

the reason i ask i because when i read the other two threads on this subject
(one is "wearing weapons" and the other one is "whats wrong with weapons"
and it starts off as a simple question and ends up being a debate about guns
and why they even exist in SL and why do people feel the need to "carry" them
and its starting to get a little out of control, anti-gun people always have
comments on why we should put away our guns and only display them where
they are supposed to be used(in combat zones)and that if you want combat
so much then you should log out of SL and go play a combat game because
theres no place for it here, hummmmm funny you should say that
because the last time i checked, SL was a place for everyone and that
doing what you want(within the TOS) was possible, but i have never read where
anyone has ever suggested that you should get a gun or get out or anything
like it, its ok to voice your opinion, we all do, its just not ok when you force it
on everybody else.

@gun enthusiast and users

i know that we should have a right to wear our guns as a part of an outfit or just
because we feel like it and we all know how guns work but that doesn't mean
that the next person do and trying to get them to understand is not gonna help
if they are not paying attention or just being naive, but if they own the land that
you are standing on and they are asking you to remove any weapons that you
are displaying, then you have either two choices, leave or comply with their
demands and THAT choice is always yours to make, we have been put
into the same category as a griefer because of our weapons, we would never
use our weapons outside of combat areas but they don't know that and are not
taking any chances so we don't really have a choice in some places, *sighs*
i wish more people was opened minded about this but since that is not going
to happen, we are just going to have to get used to the criticism about SL guns.

trying to argue with any land owners in SL about why you cant wear your
guns on their land is not going to help your case at all, if they feel that your
gun is scaring everybody then they will do whats needed to solve the problem
and this might include you getting banned without warning, and if you dont
like being told what you can and cant wear on someones land then just leave
its not that serious and nobody will stop you, look at it this way, if you leave
by choice then you can always comeback later if you want, but if end up
leaving by force then chances are that you will be banned and wont be able
to return, another reason you may have been asked to remove your weapons
is because your gun might not fit whatever theme that they were going for
or they want to keep that false sense of security,

and do we really have to wear our guns everywhere? i know that we want
to have a certain look but we have to make sacrifices sometimes and
even though we don't like it and some times have no choice over such
things, also if you really feel the need to wear your guns and the owner
isn't having it, like i said before, you can leave by choice and return later
when you feel like following the rules of their land.

the image that guns cause nothing but trouble has been put into everybody's
mind, guns have not been associated with anything positive so you got to
understand why people are so against them in the first place, if the only thing
you see before you get flung way up in the air is a noob with a gun, you might
get leery of anybody wearing anything that looks like a gun too.

another thing that is giving us a bad name is those who think that the "you hit me
and i hit back" law applies to SL, it don't, so if you are being griefed then AR
them and tell the land owner to ban them because shooting back is not going
to make things better, just worst, you may end up suspended or find your
account deleted and permanently banned from SL all because you thought you
were right to defend yourselves, all you are really doing is proving any anti-gun
person right about us and we are knocked down another peg, and if you think
that you can getaway with such acts then maybe going to a game other than SL
where its allowed is a good idea.

@any griefers

ummmmmm........yeah......like they are going to take the time to read this.


The understanding of why we wear or use guns in SL

well the reason is very simple, we want to have a certain look for our avatar
its pretty much the same as the people who wear AO's or the people who
wear furry costumes or wings etc, its for looks, not action, but one person cant
always tell if its decorative or not, and the only thing that we can do is hope
that if no one says anything then its safe to assume that its ok right?

no.....doing this will make it even harder on us to have said look
it would be a good idea to ask though(even then you might get a no) its
better being safe than sorry-i-forgot-put-away-my-guns.

the look of an assassin,police officer,ninja or going for that bad guy(or girl)
look may require that we look that part with the help of wearing a few
weapons, we do this be cause we feel that our guns is more of a extension
of the look that we are trying to pull off,and that we do not intend on causing
any grief to anyone because we know when its the right time to use our guns
and when not to, we don't be trying to scare away people, its not our fault
that they think that we want to cause trouble, we just want equal treatment
because while you are keeping your eyes on us and our guns, someone else
without a gun showing is causing all kinds of trouble and you cant pinpoint
them because they are using all kinds of system defying weapons of sim
destruction witch does not look like a gun at all and you cant even see it.

other reason for us wanting to wear our guns is because we as gun consumers
want to show off somebody's hard work to craft the weapon, come on......you
mean to tell me that we cannot display someones hard work the time they
put into building the weapon, we do with everything else, just try to name
one item that was not put here buy another person(and no im not taking about
this game or non-game).

combat is another thing that sets this game apart from the other online worlds
and it was put here for a reason, and trying to tell us that combat has no place
in SL is wrong because if combat has no place here, then why do the elemets
of combat exist in SL?

you know, things like damage areas, elements in its scripting and the fact
that the TOS allows for combat in specific areas of SL, if there was no place
for combat in SL then i think that it would be no better then other worlds
like SL, but its not up to you or me to decide whats best for SL, that is LL's
job and until they say no more weapons of any kind we well have our fun.

and for those who are quick to say that if you want combat then go play a
combat game, its not up to you to tell us what we should do, we dont tell
you to go chat, shop ,dancing or have sex some where else do we?

and besides, if you still think that guns have no place an SL, then maybe its
you that need to go somewhere more restricted from all the things that
separate SL from the other online universes. (maybe hello kitty island
adventures or something)


well i was going to put the gun etiquette section here but ill let all of you have
fun with that.

well im done

i hope this helps, because all of this nonsense about guns in SL is becoming
redundant.

The whole weapon scene sure is different than the days when the wars were fought over homesteading the original outlands sims. How do people do combat these days with all of these shields and nuclear bullets, death rays and so on?

Even though I suck at using it, I love my SICS Katana. Up close and personal with Jannae.

Like GUNS UNCONTROLLED works, look at Iraq, Pakastan, South Africa, Cuba, Congo, Etheopia, USA
Sorry but most of us are happy with not needing a gun, get your own country perfect before telling others how to do it, besides we enjoy drinking too much to all carry guns in bars, I think it's funny how guns can be legal in places bulletproof vests and carrying a katana aren't

But if we want to virtual shoot a gatling at a transformer mech, or chop a primbots head off with a battle axe, why not I say?

Errr I don't think so. Urban myth in fact.

http://www.snopes.com/crime/statistics/ausguns.asp

I agree with you completely! While I can understand someone asking you to remove your gun if you have it in your hand and armed. But if you are just wearing a holstered weapon and are being asked to remove it, then that is discrimination. It really is no different if I go somewhere and am told that I can't wear my furry avatar. It is basically saying, you are not allowed to make your avatar the way you want it to be.

Yeah, I know, it is your land. You get to make the rules. But making people remove holstered weapons is just as ridiculous as making someone remove their hat (example from another post in this thread) or jewelry. You would rightly be ridiculed for making visitors remove their hats and jewelry, it should be the same for decorative weapons.