WebCam and Voice = Sex Acts/Porn in SL?

i know there are some women with men alts out there but it was a point of hearing people talking about how women and men are exploited the same or someone saying they are tired of hearing about how women are exploited..
it was my way of saying well we are kind of tired of it also and it's kind of in our faces everywhere we look hehehehe..

and the being asked to go on cam or give away pics was just another example that we are not the ones asking men for proof so if we are not being exploited then why would they have to ask us for proof to see if we are men or not??because people are running around as women that are not women thats why they ask us for proof lol

and the last part was ..well it is just crazy for someone to say men are exploited as much as women because it's all over the place..commercials of all kinds adds and plenty of magazines and businesses..it's what i meant by we are 90% of the reason for the slogan sex sells..not a factual number..
women like it to an extent but it's hard to sit there and hear someone complain they are tired of hearing women complain about it when it's not us exploiting us but the complainers exploiting us lol..

SL is safe and i did some escorting in my time and dancing and a few things that i've out grown in SL.it was for the fantasy of it all not for the money..
all these cam things came in and now they want to see us on cam and voice and i didn't come here for that..i came here for the fantasy not the reality..
i am a business woman in RL and can't be Dancer in RL as well..although i would have loved to tried it at some point.......outside of the house lol

I don't see video coming inside of SL putting anyone in danger or voice..i would be worried when they step outside of SL into unsafe programs is all i have been saying..
i sure don't see it as the down fall for SL..it may slow them down in reaching some goals in some things but i don't see anything killing SL but the Lindens themselves and that would be their choice not ours..

KK enough from me in this thread lol..

It looks good on you.

I can only be arrogant with someone like you - it's just tooooooo easy then. You started it by asking me 12 question in a short post - almost every sentence was a question, and none of them were worrh asking. It's on page 9 if you want to check back. Why on earth should I answer all your nonsensical questions?

As for my "inability to support my stance", I've already provided all the support it needs. I.e. speaking is much quicker and easier than typing. It's good, old-fashioned common sense, and is the actual experience of everyone who is able to do both - including you. No further support is necessary. Anything you care to say in opposition to that is nonsensical.

You need to learn how to discuss. Asking someone 12 questions in a shortish post, where almost every sentence is a question, is not the way to do it. The way to do it is to make your points, and ask a few questions along the way if you need to. It is not to write posts that consist of nothing but questions in the way that you did on page 9. That's where you went wrong - and it's where you compared webcams to guns, incidentally.

Now, if you don't mind, I don't have time for silly dialogues. Speaking is easier and quicker than typing. Get used to it.

LOL!

Thats one of the things I used to say in front of customers when I worked at a restaurant. We were told to watch our language when around the customers.

SO- I hated the job enough I'd say that, felching, snowballing and "Bukakke" really loud.

What person, in public, is going to admit knowing what those are??

1. I asked a question for every statement of fact you made. If you have a problem with being questioned, don't repeatedly present your opinions as facts.

2. I reserve the right to decide for myself what questions are worth asking, and that is predicated solely on my desire for answers. Your pompous assumption that I need to pass your pre-qualifications first is laughable.

3. Feel free to save us both time, plug your ears, and scream "lalalalalala". It's "easier". Good ole fashioned common sense tells us that. What it doesn't tell us is why the fact that nobody e-mails people in the same room has a damned thing to do with whether or not voice is "better" or "easier" than text in a global environment. That's your nonsensical, right there. As is your stated "reason" it's better: "Because it just is". Yeah, you've provided support. For the continuation of remedial education.

4. You're comically unfamiliar with the definition of "discussion". A discussion requires examination of both sides of an argument; not a default dismissal of everything in opposition to your own viewpoint. It also requires understanding that the facts you present are subject to being questioned - something that is done by someone interested in comparing your viewpoint to their own, and possibly finding a reason to change their mind. You are quite plainly not equipped to deal with that process. I provided sufficient background and an alternate viewpoint demonstrating the basis of every question I asked you, and had you provided something other than lame ass dismissals, I may have had reason to reconsider my views. Instead, you'll spin until you catch fire, and I'll not give a damn either way going forward. Wer gibt eine Scheiße.

In that post, you wrote only one sentence that wasn't a question to me, and you asked the following 12 questions:-

1. Couldn't one make the same statement about a gun?

2. No danger at all in and of itself, right?

3. So then you'd of course have no problem with universal access to them with no filtering and no pre-screening whatsoever as well as no direct and easily traversed path to punishing those who "choose" to use them to harm others - right?

[so far: 1 paragraph, 3 questions, 0 statements of your own]

4. Have you surveyed "most of us" then?

5. And why is voice simply better than typing - because you say so?

6. Why is it a whole lot easier to explain what's been said verbally than with typing?

7. If you have any degree of literacy whatsoever, wouldn't it be equally easy to type and say the same sentence?

8. But if one isn't a noob and typing is truly that uphill a journey then why would one join a world based entirely on typed communication in the first place?

[so far: 2 paragraphs, 8 questions, 1 one-sentence statement of your own slipped in between the questions]

9. And in what universe is your second point functionally relevant?

10. Should e-mail be done away with because you wouldn't e-mail someone in the same room?

11. How about messageboards?

12. What does one thing have to do with the other?


That's a total of 12 questions, and one sentence that isn't a question. Is that your idea of a discussion? Sheesh!

Here are my 12 answers:-

1. It's a nonsensical quesion.

2. Correct. I already said so, so why ask?

3. Nonsensical.

4. Nonsensical.

5. Because it is. Voice is superior to typing. Try watching yourself through the day and see see how often you type instead of talk, even when a computer is handy. It's a nonsensical question.

6. Because it is. Try it and see.

7. Absolutely not. Also a nonsensical question.

8. Nonsensical.

9. Nonsensical.

10. Nonsensical.

11. Nonsensical.

12. ??? Utterly nonsensical.


Don't you just wish you hadn't written that post? Let me give you a clue. If you have something to say, say it. Don't ask nonsensical questions, and especially don't fill posts with them. Get used to the fact (no research required) that speaking is much easier and quicker then typing.

No you did not ask a question for every statement of fact I made. See my previous post - and get your facts right.

Nonsense. Read your questions (see my previous post). Don't try to say that you genuinely wanted answers to them, because you'd be a liar. They are questions with built-in opinions and answers.

You get what you ask for. You write silly posts like that and you get a suitable reply.

Good grief. I don't know how to say it any clearer. Speaking to a person is simply quicker and easier than typing to them. What's so difficult to grasp about that? You've had a lifetime of experience that confirms it for you. It doesn't matter what environment you're in. Speaking is quicker and easier. It just is.

If you wanted to discuss, you should have discussed, rather than start out with a whole load of nonsensical questions. Did it not occur to you to state your views? Obviously not. Try doing it sometime - it will improve you discussing skills. Oh, and also try to learn which discussion to get involved in and which to leave alone - it helps. For instance, a discussion as to whether or not it's easier and quicker to speak than to type is not one to get involved in if you want to say that typing is quicker and easier, because the whole world knows the answer, and you set yourself up for a fall. Read this thread. You won;t find anybody saying that typing is quicker or easier. You'll find people saying that, in some circumstances, typing is better, but that's all. I hope that helps.

So in summary.....

Non-commerical Virtual sex is solo or mutual masturbation.

Hide as far as one tries, due to the way SL is built, Virtual Sex connot be considered private in SL. People using SL essentially have x-ray vision.
Therefore, it could be construed as public indecency and may be offensive to people.

SL contains Public Masturbation using Avatars and may impact SL's credibility as a non-sexual, business platform.

Due to the weakness of age verification, children could be spying on people engaging in Virtual Sex or Virtual Prostitution. People using voice for sex could even be recorded if a spy is nearby.

Commercial Webcam Sex is a form of prostitution. It is accepting money in payment for assistance in masturbation. Commercial Virtual Sex is essentially public prostitution and is part of the sex industry.

Non-sexual Webcam use is not related to Sexual Webcam use or Commercial Webcam Sex use. Non-SL Commercial Webcam Sex is a forn of prostitution and is part of the sex industry as is commerical Webcam use for virtual sex in Sl.

Written porn or spoken porn are both porn. Which one may be preferred by the parties is immaterial.


Voice is more efficient then typing in usual communciation, especially if the parties are engaged in virtual non-private, commercial or non commercial mutual masturbation, which is apparently quite common in SL, for the simple reason that ones hands are free. The exceptions would be when typing is preferred, for whatever reason, by the parties.

Lastly, those creating objects or other support items and othe suport staff. used for commercial or non-commercial virtual sex are part of the sex industry.

Did I miss anything?

Oh ya, using commerical webcam sex, where the sex worker only is using a webcam, could be exposing one's real life self to a minor and accepting payyment from a minor.

Even though participants in SL sex may not have fetishes, all virtual sex, could be construed as 'fetishistic," since avatars themselves are objects to facilitate the behavior.

Isn't this all really wonderful?

Then let others "speak" Phil.
It's just a thing I find so awkward about forums - that we can be disruptive and even rude to each other when, if we were in a pub, we would have manners and be less dogmatic.
I didnt realize this thread would "expand" - but I was talking to my sl partner this morning (who is in UK) who suggested that we are exploring a new form of sexuality and being who we are. I am not sure we can bring into sl our "realities" - I love sex BUT I love sex in real AND the sex I find in sl. They are different but sl sex is not the less for that. Maybe, because of my work in real, this aspect of sl intrigues me. I wonder if our typing and printing and being avatars adds a pungency to our relationships. After all, we dont make love in real and say to our partners "wow that was great porn!" - but here there is a sense that porn (pron to rhyme with tron)has been created since it is pictorial and typed/spoken though a machine.
Anyway, just thought I'd add that to see what kinda reaction I get.
By the way, I enjoyed your ideas Rebecca (above my post).

Just this: The highlighted bit would seem like a definition of commercial pornography, not of prostitution which implies physical contact or at least physical proximity.

Cybersex, phonesex and camsex would all seem to fall into the same category to me, whichever that might be since putting them under "porn" would leave out the interactive, cooperative element that's common to all three.

Considering the nature of the service, nope. There is no case for public indecency, due to the fact the lands in SL are rated.

the platform has business uses and is recognized for that even with the sexual oriented items in the system. Much like the internet, television, magazines, et all are recognized as having business uses with the proliferation of suggestive and outright sexual content.



OMG think of the poor children that lie and commit crimes in order to get onto a service they are under age for! And most juries know that if a kid is falsifying the information to use the service, then said minor is also hiding their age while using the service. In which case there is no reasonable expectation that the person that interacted with them was aware they were under age.

As for prostitution, most laws require physical contact (especially the ones that apply to LL). And you forget in many municipalities and locations it's perfectly legal! Otherwise the many phone sex, stripper clubs, and related non-touch services in the real world would have been shut down hard.

And you forget, many prefer the text because they can do it in private. Being good at it means you don't even need to use the pose balls like a crutch ...

And I do remember a post from you that indicated you had a menu driven bed with adult animations in it.... and you ported out of your home when it was being used by strangers in a manner you should have reported in an AR.

Oh for heaven's sake. This thread gets dopier each time I look at it, but since it won't fall off the front page... Look, people are gonna have sex in some virtual world. Some people are going to allow themselves to be exploited by virtual sex the same way they do in real life. Some people are going to compromise their own privacy in virtual world sex the same way they do on webcams and phone and IRC and--yes, even at ill-chosen meet-ups in real life.

Some people are stupid. Some people are self destructive. Some people are gratified by self-degradation. It is not possible to "protect" people from these things--witness the utter futility of the "War on Drugs" and other forms of prohibition since man first scrawled dirty pictures on the cave wall.

Some people use webcams, whether or not accompanied by a virtual world stimulus. Some fancy themselves Casanovas of the microphone, or just aren't satisfactorily aroused without the sound of feigned moaning in their headsets. (As in real life, some folks just need more hardware. )

And some of us will keep scrawling those dirty pictures for as long as somebody shows interest.

True, true, true, Qie.

Or to put it shorter, "Folks is folks", and the internet and virtual worlds don't change that.

Let's all go have coffee. I think Ann's made some fresh pie.

A webcam sex girl is a prostitute. Plain and simple. These kinds of word distinctions mean nothing.....how bout a "lazy prostitute?"

And some folks will sell it to them.

Actually in a court of law they do.

The laws define prostitution as selling of sex, not the selling of imagery or text.

oohhhh Rebecca, I love *Skil*, but I think it is only men that are able to find the pain in it..

And... you can prove that... how?

http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/6299/weirdo1ge1.jpg

*This may frighten small children. It may be their father.

Thats frightening period.

*jaw drops*What in the world is that thing??!!




.

That's the new face of SL as envisioned by Mitch Kapor. The Pragmatic.

BTW Great Pic. Can I borrow it?