So are there any threads a Res Mod hasn't locked?

Yeah when you look up at the "Spot the Willie" thread , I think the averages are OK.

I don't see any response to this ... soooo .... people don't like the situation, but aren't willing to do anything to change it? Fine by me ... the current moderation doesn't bother me at all.

I do see your point, but if you're not willing to do anything to change it ... not even make an alternate proposal ... well ... how is that different from whining? *confused*

I read a thread about spam that was locked with the reasons of "trolling" and, I think, personal attacks. For the life of me, I couldn't see any such thing going on in that thread.

I just decided that we are in the Twilight Zone, and there is no use in trying to figure it out.

coco

That sort of thing worries me and confirms my fears. A good number of decent threads have been derailed and if it weren't for the derailment I would have ignored. If a thread is going to live a normal life then I'll probably ignore it (unless its got some horrible defect) but if the thread is going to live on forever I'm going to keep a closer eye on it.

Take a thread like: "Arse Folding is Back" /327/70/208660/1.html
I don't want to lock it but it goes off-topic at times. There is essentially nothing wrong with the thread except for intermittent derailing.

For the last 4 or 5 months I've been giving everyone a free ride, thread locks didn't lead anywhere. There wasn't much worry of repercussions. If a thread innocently wanders off-topic thats one thing but intentional derailing is another. I've been noticing the intentional derailments for the last couple months become more frequent. I've started sending more threads to LR.

Threads once they pass the 200 post mark just take too much time to read. Threads that get to that point end up going in circles forever. Allowing a thread like that to be reposted with the circles integrated into the OP can allow a discussion to move past any sticking points.

It's not fair to the topic when it is derailed but when it is done intentionally as a way of killing a topic that is even worse. If I'm going to be complicit then I will not turn a blind eye to those responsible. Those who throw the stones will face LR.

If the trends continue I will be submitting more cases to LR for Trolling & Flaming violations. This may result in some members loosing posting privileges to the RA forum or worse. Investigating Trolling & Flaming takes time, and if things get bad enough that I can't keep up with the workload I will inform LL that I can't keep up with the workload. I will ask LR for more Moderators & ResMods like I have many times before but they won't. The only other option LL has is to close RA or the entire forums. I don't want that to happen, the forums fill a vital niche for the community. My only option to combat an inevitable close is to step up enforcement.

Now I've been very impressed recently at how well things have gone, I've seen some threads that are classic trolling topics not get derailed by deliberate trolling.

We are at a cross roads, on the left we have things getting better, in the center we have things staying the same, and to the right we have things getting worse.

I'm at the point where I can say to LR: "In six months time if things have continued to improve that reopening the General Discussion forum should be considered." I think the community is at a point where it can be seriously considered.

Now next week in the later half I'm unlikely to be able to get on the forums. When I return I will look at how things have been going and determine which path has been taken.

Don't sell yourselves short on this one, you can do this.

That would be because the search function for VBulletin sucks. No one can find answers to anything using that useless tool

That's the whole cryin shame of this. They will not add more moderators, and Strife essentially does the whole thing single-handed.

If he STOPS doing the whole thing single-handed, the implication from LL is that we will have no more forums.

coco

Narly every topic gets repeated so often that derailment really isnt nearly as bad as all that.

Look at it another way Very few actual specific questions arent answered within the first 5 pages of any thread.

They might not like the answer - NONE of us might like the answer.

But the knowledge about a particular question DOES get to the OP fairly quickly in nearly every case.

Also the humor derailments are a lot less bad than the flame war ones as far as distorting an issue.

On humor derailments people still feel comfortable giving answers to the original question.

During flame wars they dont becuase they dont want to be the next one attacked.

I'd rather have the silliness and humor derailment than vicious flame wars like I have seen on SC. I had to stop reading there.


Pie not war!!!

I went to SC in May and I have not posted very much here since that time. It is not perfect, way too much drama and stupid and needless flame wars, BUT if you something to say there, you can say it.

Basically, Strife finally locked one too many threads for my taste. I haven't been around much since then, so things may have changed. I just got tired of informative, entertaining threads being shut down because, it seemed to me, too critical of LL.

Its a company forum so they squelch whomever they want. Me? I voted with my fingers and I post there now.

Sooz

/me waves to The Sooz

I'd like to point out that of those 2 threads, I'd say both needed locked just for teh OP's post. Comming on and slandering others (or "naming names" as it's PCly called.), or basically jsut making a stoopid (with two O's) post that has no relivance other than silliness, or inciting trouble.

If there's an iota of possibility of reasonable function, Strife usually lets the thread have a chance.

*Back to the general topic of this thread*

Keep in mind, before you lable me an "ass-kisser", I've had my arguments with Strife myself. Both by ARing locks, as well as debates in IMs. Doing such on the public forums is not only crass, but is just setting bad examples to new posters.

Do I think Strife does a bad job? No.
Do I think she does a perfect job? No.
Do I think she does the best job she can? Yes.
Would I want her job? HELL NO!!!!!!

Like AR's in-world, I imagine there is a lot of false reporting going on too. This takes time to wade through and, personally, I think those people should be stepped on harder than those making posts that need locked.

Threads going on and on and on for that 200 post count mentioned above, should be locked. I agree with Strife on that one.Who wants to read through 30 odd pages to see what's going on? I don't.

The ones that are locked within a post or two....well....they need locked then. You can usually spot them by the "IBTL" posts. *smirks* So any such threads of that nature can be ruled out in any data gathering.

So, I think there's a better question that should have been asked with this thread. That is:
"Is there any thread(s) that were locked by a RezMod that should not have been?"

While the answer to that would undoubtably be "Yes.", then ask yourself "Could I do better?". From all I've seen, Strife never claimed to be perfect, and any locked thread does go to LR, so if LR thought Strife was abusing her authority, wouldn't you think they'd have called her on it by now?

Or more aptly, don't you think the Resident Posters here would have made a big stink over it before now? Because, yes, every AR on the forum may go through the RezMods, but Support Tickets, and Live Chat do not. I myself have contacted Live Chat to advise them of threads that need "looked at, with the possibility of locking them" for various reasons.

So a RezMod does not have the final, or even the only, say-so.

~Jessy

I agree with most of your post, Jessy. However, while I would love to thing that Live Chat or other Linden support mechanisms could act as a check on ResMod judgement, I doubt they do. Threads get sent to LR for FURTHER action (e.g. suspension /banning), not to validate the resmod'd judgment, I would think.

And I think there HAS been some outcry among posters, to the point of people leaving the forums for SC over single decisions.

The only way for people to feel this is fair is to spread the burden. Perhaps by having more resmods, and allowing them to monitor each other. Or for more residents to be involved in reviewing ARs against resmods, as well as bannings.

/me mumbles through hot pie and wipes icecream off her chin....

I'm a Brit.. What's Warrant...???

thanks for the Pie.. Now i know i belong here, I got pie...

imogen

A horrible, horrible 80s hair band, best known for the sparkling gem, "She's My Cherry Pie."

Which is kind of the forums theme song.


Who did that 80's cover of "Once Bitten, twice shy" again. That would be sort of a theme song too, that is is you want sex now.

Great White.

And to get back on topic, if this rant is about the Nerdagra Falls ad being moved, I don't sympathize. You already get plenty of press here, Sarah, you don't need yet another ad for your services in Resident Answers. Put it in the right place. Tell your friends. But don't get pissy if it gets moved.

They have me boxed in ~_~
I try not to think about it.
Trapeze artist without a net.
I don't understand it, I don't want to understand it... its too ugly a truth to be truth. I've asked them about their intentions. They say they aren't setting me up to fail. As someone who was against the war in Iraq, this has given me allot of insight into what it must feel like to be a soldier there.
This job can really get you down if you let it.
I try not to think about it that way.

I think about walking the line and the nature of the line I walk.

Over the course of this task it has given me much to think about: the nature of society and underlying structures. A crash course in how societies are designed.

Strife, as far as I am concerned, and many others, you are doing an outstanding job moderating these forums. Lest people forget, Resident Answers is not the only forum you have to deal with, and save for an occasional effort by Torley or Cybin, you're going it alone, and doing it fairly and consistently, and most people don't even realize the other work you're involved in with the wiki and JIRA.. If there was a Second Life Resident of the Year, I'd nominate Strife, hands down.

I'll take these forums over SC any day of the week. No, it's not a democracy here, nor a free for all place to post vulgarity and sling mud at one another, and for that I am grateful.

-zk

he has a point. But things have changed since a few power needing drama filled lindens when on a witch hunt and bannded people they didnt like or wanted out of the game. Since then those lindens would not darn pullin gthat drama filled "let`s force out these people we don`t like" witch hunts. Hence this type of freelance LLABS griefters will not darn band do this again. When sending in reports ( LOL its those same lindens reading the reports that filed about you just throws then out ). Now that is fairness right? Typical ( not refering to Strife Onizuka but a few of those Lindens . they know who they are )

*shrugs* The times I've dealt with Support about the forums, I've gotten a satisfactory result. Not always the one I wanted, but every time I have gotten a result, and if not "my way" it has been explained why. And not jsut "because we say so". Perhaps I ahve gotten lucky, but for all the grief I give LL, I highly doubt I'm on their "favored" list. (more like the "this b**ch is a pain in the @$$" list lol)

And Strife has sent threads to LR without locking them. One to help people out that realy realy need LL's attention (See the psot on SKy's avatar problems), and at times when she feels the "line" is too blurry. I suck at forum searches or I'd pull up those examples, but there have been such.

The majority of people that have "outcried" over being locked or admonished are typically the ones that needed locked and admonished. If you want an example, go to SC and make any type of post you want there asking about opinions upon Strief's handling of RezModing here. The absolute childish response make the worse day here look like a somber church sermen.

Strife, and any other RezMod, does have a set of checks and balances.
1) Is LL. Yes, even with how we all feel about LL's lack of management, they STILL own the buisness, so still do look after it *Shrugs*. (Even if we think that "management is lacking (as I do), it is still part of the accounting).
2) Is us. Really. I'm sure there are enough Forum Residents that could IM/e-mail/PM/phone/write LL to make even LL pull their head out of the sand. That may mean the closing of the forum, so that power is held in check by that.

RezMods really want what we all want. A continuation of the forums in a decent mannor in which we can all enjoy. Every one of us, Strife, me, Ann, Collette, each and every one, has a different ideal of what a "decent mannor" is.

I, personally, thank Strife for the work she does here. I'm also going to PM her and argue if I feel any post of mine (or one I feel strongly about) is locked when I don't feel it was needed. I have in the past. Until then, I'll appreciate all the work done for FREE in a job that LL could not pay me enough to do.

~Jessy

Strife, I moderate another forum and know what you go through. That being said, I think you are asking too much of people not to have a little fun with threads that were misguided and never appropriate for the forum to begin with. It is harmless fun and certainly doesn’t deter people who need actual questions answered – the support that gets offered here in RA is far more than anything LL has ever given us. If threads that are trolling/whining/flamefests get derailed, why does this matter? It wasn’t constructive communication in the first place. Maybe we go a little overboard, but that is where gentle moderation could kick in with an “Ok, kids, enough with the pie for today, you’ve made your point that the thread was ill-advised. Let it die.” Not everything needs a lock and without the high likelihood of a thread being locked it may help us contain our mirth a bit. Creative people are legendary for being hard to manage, which means that moderating them requires an equal amount of creativity on your part. Locking threads is a blunt tool where maybe a subtler one used with more finesse might work equally well.

I’ll also suggest that you turn off the ability to create polls here in RA, they serve no purpose in this environment and most of the time they are just used to further someone’s agenda, as is evidenced by the poll options. Many of the polls are harmless amusement, but more often than not the poll is merely a means of inciting drama.

As for a General Discussion forum, it’s a bad idea. It didn’t work the last time and it won’t work if tried again, at least not until LL fixes the stability issues with SL and deals with their customer service failings. A General Discussion forum at this point in time just turns into endless numbers of whining threads that repeat the same message of “LL suxxors!111!” – we can go read the blog if we want that level of commentary. Resident Answers may get silly at times, but it serves a purpose and is generally a positive experience. Anyone who needs to figure out how something in SL works is 99% likely to get answers here, which are far better odds than with LL support or the Wiki.

Anyway, my unasked for .02L ….

"Or worse" could equal complete forum ban and/or in-world suspension (and thus freezing of assets) and/or in-world ban (and thus, loss of assets).

I'm not aware of an in-world permaban due to forum "misbehaviour" yet, but fear of such a thing after disciplinary action was taken against another user for voicing what I thought were valid concerns about your style of moderation drove me to start using a forum alt. It's driven countless others away from these forums completely. There is ample evidence of this in other forums (and I see at least one of those users just delurked and added her opinion to this thread).

If derailment is now your major concern and if your intention to "submit more cases to LR" involves the pie, panties and pics clique, then I wouldn't worry about those "the forums wouldn't exist without Strife" rumours because there wouldn't be much of a forum community left afterwards anyway.

So really, between the refugees and "the rumour" , it seems you'll be the cause of the end no matter what.

If Strife leaves, LL will close the forums.
If Strife stays, a proportion of users will continue to leave due to concerns about your style of moderation -- and more importantly, its ramifications; and the dwindling active forum userbase will give LL an excuse to close the forums.

I would say that that is a rather small minority, albeit very vocal. The 10 or so in the usual pie, pantie and pics clique does not the whole forum make. And even then, I like to think that these people are all mature enough to handle it. Strife has been pretty light with the locks in the last few months and I think this whole issue is being unnecessarily magnified. If Strife locking a thread 6 or so pie panty pages later than it started is reason for leaving, then I think we are not losing a hell of a lot.

The moderation is far from fair.

The worst thing Strife does is to lock a thread with the lame words - "This isn't a discussion forum" when he knows full well that there are many discussions already taking place.

It's like having a security guard walking into a 'no smoking' room where there's twenty people smoking and telling just one person to put their cigarette out.

LL can see what's happening and while I'm sure that they've not told Strife to behave the way he does, they're certainly not trying to stop him. So I hold LL responsible for the state of the forums.