No-fly zones are killing the fun

I'm gonna start timing and noting then. Those things are very often the first and only warning that one's about to hit a private home rather than a shop that's bizarrely at 600m.

Actually, another "wouldn't it be nice" thing would be if there was a way to tell if there were banlines up in the land one is flying over, to save that nervous worry when dropping altitude without knowing if you're about to hit something like that.




So do I!

Ban lines DO NOT GIVE YOU A HAVEN AWAY FROM THE GENERAL PUBLIC. I don't need to go on your land to "visit" you unexpectedly.

Phantom zone or parcel basements would give you your haven, but you're so hung up on your 18th century view of the world you can't see that.

I do.

It doesn't do any good.

I had a neighbor who had ban lines *and* a security orb that operated with no warning *and* used a physical object to orbit you if you were in range... even on your own adjacent land. I had to sell out and move, reporting it did nothing.

Of course I ended up with another set of banlines at my new location:



So do I, chuckles, and the banlines my neighbor put up at the end of my runway (for no apparent reason, their skybox was over the ban limit) meant I had to give up and remove the whole build.

99.44% of the time banlines serve no useful purpose. And 99.44% of the time the people MOST screwed over by the banlines ARE ALSO PAYING TIER. This isn't a "noble landowner versus scruffy free account" issue at all.

The alternative suggestions that people are proposing would provide the privacy you claim you want. And ban-lines don't provide it.

I was referring to paying teir on that particular patch of land. I don't see you paying my teir so consider that 10% of problems little quirks of sl. I accept others banline caused effects quirks of sl. The only place I drive anymore is at the speedway in Garage (unless I'm showing someone in sandbox what a nonfreebie car looks like). Besides, I'm right by a void sim, a protective ocean. You have a whole sim to boat and fly in, you don't need my 4096m2 and its 1 meter of water til shore.

As for your neighbours, they had a right to do it, but since it didn't have any effect don't see why they would (aside form being a word that sounds like bass). My build is at least protected a bit by the lines since its at ground level. but open grass and their skybox is out of range? No reason, they can use an orb.

I suppose I have to say this again, the easiest solution to this:

Instead of bouncing off banlines, teleport the avatar to the nearest point in the direction they were travelling that they are not banned from.

And Banking, owning your land does not allow you to orbit people standing on their own land just across the border with yours. If you can assert your rights strongly and legalistically so can everyone else

Edit - FWIW: http://secondlife.com/vote/vote.php?get_id=2834

Yes, I know. But the tier on the sim is paid for by everyone on the sim... not just you.
I don't know where your parcel is, so I can't say if I might ever need access or not... but parcels *like* that elsewhere have proven to be a major obstacle to boating when they block the only possible channel around a landmass.

The problem I have with your comments, by the way, isn't that you (or anyone else) is doing anything against the TOS, but the implication that the TOS is the only standard by which actions should be judged.

Don't forget to include the vehicle they were on, and anyone else on that vehicle.

I've always said to limit it to your own land. Any guns to prevent flyovers would also have to only work on my owned land.

The teir on my parcel is only paid for by me, and the teir on the rest of the sim is paid for by the other owners. Its limited to their parcels, I don't support them and they don't support me.

And I wholeheartedly approve the teleport to other side suggestion - problem is 2 of my sides are sim border. But thats a server issue, not my parcel.

I pay a tier and I consider it one the major draws of SL that one can, at least in theory, fly about all over the place in a vehicle or by the power of... however it is that avatars fly. Add on to that the problems associated with living right next to banlines. More than once I've had banlines go up and block easy passage from one plot to another. While I can intellectually understand the wish for privacy, I'm far too tired of having to fly up and over and down when walking would be easier, of getting bouced or ejected because I misjudged and descended too soon, or - a classic of the genre! - getting trapped between two or more banlines and bounced about until I have to teleport away to escape. While no one is on the land in question. Joy!




That sounds about as private as you'll get on the mainland. And as has been mentioned, at least of the problems with banlines are the *unexpected* nature of them. If I'm at 350m and decide to land, I have no way of knowing what's on that ground until I get there. I can aim for an empty-looking plot, but that's no guarantee of no banlines even assuming that open space exists.

Warning is an issue for LL since there's nothing landowners can reasonably do to let people know, other than maybe putting it in the name ("Blah blah, private land". We don't know what's private land until we hit it. That's an issue right across SL and problematic for both sides of this particular debate. I'd personally like a bit of warning, one way or another.




Arg! Why can't it just eject me with my vehicle still with me?! WHY?!

We bought some land to build a house on the SL mainland. Some of fellow land owners had no entry markers up. My partner IM'd them and interduced herself and got to know them. Without fail, there owners added us to the access list or removed the barriers completely. One owner even removed the land ajoining our property so we could have ocean access.

Chav- unless its owned by LL consider it private land. Problem solved.

I would put people I trust on access, on the grounds they didn't walk in just because. If they did they would be off it in a snap. On neighbour probably likes my ban lines because they sail a ship right out beside our land.. and the ban lines keep them from beaching on accident.

So... the answer is "don't go anywhere"? That's not really a virtual world then, is it? That's a virtual roadway in a bunch of land that's counter to the entire concept of the thing.

No, its saying be aware any private land may be using ban lines. Be prepared. Same with Orbs.

No, its saying be aware its private and there may be ban lines or security orbs.

Disabling "Object Entry" affects vehicles even more than ban lines, and offers no visual indication on which way to turn or go.
Flying 50m above the land gets you past any access restricted parcel just fine so I don't really see much of a problem there either.

That leaves only the visual aspect on adjoining land and as someone pointed out, in most cases all it takes is having a friendly talk with the neighbours, or land owners could automatically be exempt from restriction lines on neighbouring parcels (an explicit ban would still take care of any problems).

The one time I had to use ban lines was to eject an unwanted visitor from my house, who turned out to be a real griefer. He then stood on the edge of my parcel (which is quite small) and started pushing prims through the ban lines!

However, I got rid of him

Farnham's Freehold is one of your favorite novels, right?

I've had my plane returned and myself hurled 9 kilometers underground by restricted parcels... when I was flying over 1000 meters up.

This morning I got stuck on a sim-corner and spun round for no good reason. At which point one of the border parcels returned my vehicle for crossing into it a split-second, leaving me for some reason floating round in circles in a sit-pose until I had to log out. Banlines on a border? That's just evil!

See my comment here.

[7:07] Second Life: Can't move object 'vehicle wing' to
{ 2.49514, 207.054, 2641.82 } in region Morris because the parcel does not allow objects to enter from other parcels. Notifications from this region are temporarily deactivated.
[7:08] Second Life: Your object 'vehicle wing' has been returned to your inventory lost and found folder from parcel 'Welcome Area' at Morris 8.93395, 203.814 because it went off-world.

I was 5 sims away from Morris at the time. I was at cloud level (not 2641.83)

Protection is important but this system has major bugs.

One obvious solution would be to treat ban walls as "terrain" for nonallowed people. That is, the same exact rules would apply. If they could angle the first meter, you would be able to "climb" over it in the same matter. An option to see such obstacles at longer range (for vehicle drivers) is also called for.

I own two parcels in separate sims. One is group only, the other is full access. Every time I see somebody bounce against my wall, trying to figure out the best path around, I feel bad. I have a need for it, and SL gives me the power and right to do it, I'm not responsible for the lameness of their method. As someone who loves to explore, I would much prefer one that works for everybody.

To decide that the community has to follow your example is counterproductive to the evolution of a community. Lets find a reasonble way of respecting each others' boundaries. Belittling them won't help.

I suspect that the infamous Sim Corner Mojo didn't help matters. Vehicle was returned to inventory, my avatar spun into some bizarre lag-like loop that crossed all four sims. It was an experience, at least.


.

Some sort of radar for banlines would be nice. Just a warning that x metres away is a barrier I need to avoid would be very useful.

Any solution, really! A small interval of time to get across at a sensible height, a protected altititude... anything.




I did a bit of a survey this morning in the sims near where I live. It varies, but it seems that at least 20% of SL is banlined. Line those up and you get situations like three banline-boasting 512s cornering you. It's atrocious in a vehicle, but even on foot or flying, it's irritating beyond words.

I can see a couple of legitimate reasons for wanting an area private. Sex. Err... sex... *has a think*... changing clothes is one... um... sex. Oh, and sex. (Were it not for security orbs being worse, I'd actually LOL at the stupid of people who have banlines at ground level that force me up to where their skybox floats above the restrictions.). I live in a country that has no trespass law. A real place with real land. So you can imagine my bemusement that so many people seem to be traumatised by the idea that I might pass briefly through their empty plot of imaginary land. It's practically a low-level form of griefing, since it works against the spirit of a shared and creative virtual world and is in spirit antisocial.

Have we never heard of right of way? Public footpaths? Not making your neighbour fly up over and down to get across a few metres of land that separates parcels and might mean they have to walk across the corner of the ground under your skybox full of weird sexual objects. (Yes, I looked. And?)

*/pointless dull rant*

There's SUPPOSED to be a protected altitude.

It's bugged.

I just filed an updated version of the debugging I did in the Second Life bug reporting database directly, at Blue Linden's urging. Hopefully that will help.

How about building, scripting, talking to a friend or friends, wanting some peace and quiet without a newbie walking over every 5 minutes (literally) and poking their nose into everything like they own the place and who can't be bothered to respond to chat?

If someone is in public, they're probably not going to mind being walked up to and having someone try and start a conversation. If, on the other hand, they're in their house, they're probably not wanting to be disturbed, or they'd list their house as a hangout, so intruding on that is actually the antisocial behaviour.

If I was left alone by random strangers while in my house or if people didn't treat my house as their personal home when I'm not there, I wouldn't need to restrict the land. If I didn't have to clean up litter I wouldn't need to turn build off. If I didn't have to clean up vehicles people just decide to leave around, I wouldn't need to disable object entry.

Hurrah!




All good uses for *temporary* banline use. Never done it myself but I can see the appeal of some temporary respite. (I don't seem to get as many random visitors as everyone else does, but there's always the ejection option.)





And again everyone's more popular than me... (Really need to work on that.) I've usually got autoreturn on at 5-10 minutes. Scripts off unless someone I know wants to play with scripted stuff. Am I really just a lot luckier with newbies and littering than various people right next to me are or have been?

Though, in full disclosure, I don't have a house anymore. I've just never got enough use from one for it to feel worthwhile. I'm not even sure what people do in houses (other than the obvious). I used to build on a platform above my land, but it got really solitary so I moved back to sandboxes except for when testing something that could cause problems or being naked while making clothes. What goes on in houses? I want to know now.