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Coup d'Etat in Neualtenburg

Margaret Mfume
I.C.
Join date: 30 Dec 2004
Posts: 2,492
06-01-2006 15:38
From: Dianne Mechanique
... By saying that I am not referring to your comments at all Kendra, but a certain other person.

lol Sounds like an old sitcom.

"Tell your father I'm not talking to him"
"But, mom, he's right there; he can hear you."
"Just tell him!"
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hush
Alex Fitzsimmons
Resu Deretsiger
Join date: 28 Dec 2004
Posts: 1,605
06-01-2006 15:40
From: Selador Cellardoor
Well, I am not a citizen, but I care in the sense that this whole process has been an exemplar of human fallibility, and a demonstration of how difficult it is to design a system of government that is resistant to corruption.


It's impossible to design a democracy (or a partial democracy) that won't eventually be taken over by an elite, opportunistic and generally morally bankrupt few from the inside.

In fact, it has never been done. Ever.

And given the intelligence and understanding of the average person, I remain unconvinced that it would be desirable even if it were possible.

But this drama is interesting, even if I don't know much about the people involved.
Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
06-01-2006 15:46
From: Dianne Mechanique
This is a different issue from the ones I objected to that Ulrika raised, which I won't comment on right now.

I just wish we could stick to the facts instead of immediately going off the deep end into giant exaggerations, personal accusations and pissy language and so forth. By saying that I am not referring to your comments at all Kendra, but a certain other person.



I expect the SC to resign as moderators on the "Projekt" forum after they remove their post about it being closed --and unlock all the threads they have locked. I would do it --but I tried earlier --and they keep getting locked without my approval to do so.

Sadly all my posts of today have already been "hard deleted" without authority to do so.
Once the smoke clears, I will offer a long post as to what I see the role of the Projekt as vis a vis Second Life -- and open discussion can once again commence.

In the meantime I wish the SC all the luck at moderating the new Official "City:" Forum on the Neualtenburg website.

The "Neualtenburg Projekt" is and has always been a larger entity in scope than the "City" of Neualtenburg --and you have been using it for official business at the discretion of the founder of the Projekt --and the forum upon which it's named.

I'm glad the City has found a new home for its forum. Now please show some courtesy and stop running rough shod over a forum you have no claim to.

Thank you
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Lorelei Patel
was here
Join date: 22 Feb 2004
Posts: 1,940
06-01-2006 15:55
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Broadly offensive.
Puck Goodliffe
Your humble Foole
Join date: 22 Dec 2005
Posts: 200
06-01-2006 16:07
From: Vares Solvang
Isn't it amazing how she thinks any of us care?


Isn't it amazing how the SL forums don't force you to read any posts you don't care about?
Phedre Aquitaine
I am the zombie queen
Join date: 26 Jan 2006
Posts: 1,157
06-01-2006 16:11
From: Puck Goodliffe
Isn't it amazing how the SL forums don't force you to read any posts you don't care about?


It held me down and TAPED my eyes OPEN.
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From: Billybob Goodliffe
everyone loves phedre
(excluding chickens), its in the TOS :D
Dianne Mechanique
Back from the Dead
Join date: 28 Mar 2005
Posts: 2,648
06-01-2006 16:12
:D This would so be a great Jerry Springer show!

Ulrika in her skin tight black leather jumpsuit,
Kendra in her Viking outfit...

Hmmm... I think I would wear this:



Less punches thrown at me that way. :)
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.
black
art furniture & classic clothing
===================
Black in Neufreistadt
Black @ ONE
Black @ www.SLBoutique.com


.
Puck Goodliffe
Your humble Foole
Join date: 22 Dec 2005
Posts: 200
06-01-2006 16:12
From: Phedre Aquitaine
It held me down and TAPED my eyes OPEN.


No honey, that's *my* job.
Aliasi Stonebender
Return of Catbread
Join date: 30 Jan 2005
Posts: 1,858
06-01-2006 16:18
From: Ulrika Zugzwang
Expect RL legal action. Since you have terminated negotiations for use of my intellectual property and prior investments, I have no other alternative but to enforce my longstanding copyright for the name and to seek restitution. I recommend anyone who's involved in the project, who's not a party to the coup, to get out immediately.

Beyond violating RL copyrights, the members of the coup have completely delegitimized the virtual-world government. I'm sure you're hoping to sweep this coup under the carpet so you can resume your governmental role playing but as long as your facade exists, I will be there to remind others of the truth.

~Ulrika~


Hey, Ulrika, there's already a procedure to handle all this. It's called "filing a DMCA notice with Linden Lab". You aren't interested in resolving this issue in the least, you're interested in shit-stirring. I, for one, am not fooled.

Also, who's "you"? It's not me, since - as you might have noticed - I gave up all that crap. I'm holding on to a single small plot to see how it all comes out, but other than hosting the Wiki, I'm pretty much out of it.
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Red Mary says, softly, “How a man grows aggressive when his enemy displays propriety. He thinks: I will use this good behavior to enforce my advantage over her. Is it any wonder people hold good behavior in such disregard?”
Anything Surplus Home to the "Nuke the Crap Out of..." series of games and other stuff
Ghoti Nyak
καλλιστι
Join date: 7 Aug 2004
Posts: 2,078
06-01-2006 16:28
And the people that want resident-lead government... pay attention.. this is what you would get.

Y'all are on crazy pills.


-Ghoti
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"Sometimes I believe that this less material life is our truer life, and that our vain presence on the terraqueous globe is itself the secondary or merely virtual phenomenon." ~ H.P. Lovecraft
Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
06-01-2006 16:34
From: Ghoti Nyak
And the people that want resident-lead government... pay attention.. this is what you would get.

Y'all are on crazy pills.


-Ghoti



Don't look at me --my original plans called for an artist's work collective, eventually becoming whats known in Nburg as Die Gilde.
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
06-01-2006 16:35
From: Aliasi Stonebender
It's called "filing a DMCA notice with Linden Lab".
Expect it. Beyond the farce that is the N'burg governmental experiment, this is more seriously RL IP theft. Since the cabal behind the coup has withdrawn from negotiations and are playing lock-Ulrika-out-of-the-forum, I have no other options.

~Ulrika~
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Chik-chik-chika-ahh
Cristiano Midnight
Evil Snapshot Baron
Join date: 17 May 2003
Posts: 8,616
06-01-2006 16:36
From: Chance Abattoir
Where can I obtain one of these fashionable items?


You need to assemble a few ingredients:

1) Ulrika plushie doll, from Kendra Bancroft. Ask for a mod/no trans version so that you can make it giant.
2) Starax wand. Only 1,000,000,000L (about $1.35 at the current rate). Not totally necessary, but it is very cool and Starax needs a new summer home. Plus you can set people on fire.
3) Optional: sound clip of the Carmina Burana (I can provide it if you would like). You will also need a small script so the sound plays when the giant Ulrika rezzes.

Mix all these things together, force Midnight, then type /101beetlejuice three times and voila!

:cool:
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Cristiano


ANOmations - huge selection of high quality, low priced animations all $100L or less.

~SLUniverse.com~ SL's oldest and largest community site, featuring Snapzilla image sharing, forums, and much more.

Vares Solvang
It's all Relative
Join date: 26 Jan 2005
Posts: 2,235
06-01-2006 16:37
From: Jack Harker
Isn't it amazing how complicate the running *one* single sim is? How many threads it generates, and how much public conflict?

I run 1/4 of a sim, and I have no conflicts at all. Could it be that something like virtual goverment actually *attracts* drama and people who *enjoy* drama and squabbling and petty conflict for it's own sake?

Naw...couldn't be. ;)



*ding ding ding ding ding* We have a winner!!!
Selador Cellardoor
Registered User
Join date: 16 Nov 2003
Posts: 3,082
06-01-2006 17:03
From: Alex Fitzsimmons
It's impossible to design a democracy (or a partial democracy) that won't eventually be taken over by an elite, opportunistic and generally morally bankrupt few from the inside.

In fact, it has never been done. Ever.

And given the intelligence and understanding of the average person, I remain unconvinced that it would be desirable even if it were possible.

But this drama is interesting, even if I don't know much about the people involved.


The whole concept of democracy, at least as practised in my country, is an interesting one. Because in a sense it *does* depend on an elite. Members of parliament come from grass roots political groups, but the process ensures that the ones who do make it tend to be of above average intelligence and also people who think about moral issues.

This means that they can be at variance with popular sentiment. When this country removed the death penalty (a piece of legislation we can all, now, be grateful for) at the time a survey of the general population would have found the vast majority in favour of retaining it.

I bore everyone by telling them about a virtual world to which I used to belong, which had a player-led government. At the time it was mired in corruption, to the extent that life there became a misery. This is why I have always opposed self-government in sl. Unfortunately the government of Neualtenburg also proved to be not robust enough.

However, the experiment was worth trying, if for no other reason than it demonstrates clearly the pitfalls that can face even the most carefully-wrought system.
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nimrod Yaffle
Cavemen are people too...
Join date: 15 Nov 2004
Posts: 3,146
06-01-2006 17:12
From: Cristiano Midnight

2) Starax wand. Only 1,000,000,000L (about $1.35 at the current rate). Not totally necessary, but it is very cool and Starax needs a new summer home. Plus you can set people on fire.

LOL! This is great! XD
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"People can cry much easier than they can change."
-James Baldwin
Gwyneth Llewelyn
Winking Loudmouth
Join date: 31 Jul 2004
Posts: 1,336
06-01-2006 17:16
A Coup d'État presumes that a group of people overthrows a government through unconstitutional means by a part of the state establishment that mostly replaces just the top power figures (quoting from the Wikipedia).

When it's just the government making decisions (under the limitations and controls of a constitution), it hardly qualifies as a "coup d'état".

An analogy would be claiming that George Bush staged a coup d'état to seize power in the United States. Actually, he just was elected — and making decisions is what an elected official of the government is supposed to do.
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Logan Bauer
Inept Adept
Join date: 13 Jun 2004
Posts: 2,237
06-01-2006 17:18
Ghoti - I wish you would have explained this to me about 8 months ago. :mad:
Cristiano - When did Starax's wand go on sale?!? :eek: :)

I'm thrilled that this thread has finally evolved into something I can both appreciate and participate in, and wish the city of Neualtenburg itself would follow suite.




(meine Arbeit hier wird erledigt)
GrayFriar Mendicant
Committed-or about to be
Join date: 7 Dec 2004
Posts: 58
06-01-2006 17:25
The history of a fictional project.

Take a corporation wanting to get some free PR/advertising and create a "special project"/contest.

1.Toss in one megalomaniac.

2."Randomly select" the megalomaniac as the winner of the "contest".

3.Donate the virtual means and ostensive "corporate support" to keep the megalomaniac in front row center of public view for six months.

4.Add a few dollops of mini-megs and a dash or two of wannabes and other attention-seekers.

5.For good measure, make a public forum in order to allow the drama to simmer, then boil over, then explode.

6.Randomly change the heat setting (once every 28-32 days seems appropriate).

Lucky 7.Bottle and age for a year or two.

Voila - "instant" ****stew!
Joannah Cramer
Registered User
Join date: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 1,539
06-01-2006 17:29
From: Gwyneth Llewelyn
When it's just the government making decisions (under the limitations and controls of a constitution), it hardly qualifies as a "coup d'état".

As long as decisions are indeed made within constitutional limitations. Otherwise it falls under misconduct in office, and can be used as ground for impeachment.

So well, are these decisions made within granted limits..? o.O
Jake Reitveld
Emperor of Second Life
Join date: 9 Mar 2005
Posts: 2,690
06-01-2006 17:33
for all experiements in democracy keep this in mind: Hitler was elected.
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ALCHEMY -clothes for men.

Lebeda 208,209
Ghoti Nyak
καλλιστι
Join date: 7 Aug 2004
Posts: 2,078
06-01-2006 17:35
From: Gwyneth Llewelyn
An analogy would be claiming that George Bush staged a coup d'état to seize power in the United States. Actually, he just was elected


Uh, NO .
(but that's a story for another thread)

-Ghoti
_____________________
"Sometimes I believe that this less material life is our truer life, and that our vain presence on the terraqueous globe is itself the secondary or merely virtual phenomenon." ~ H.P. Lovecraft
Jack Harker
Registered User
Join date: 4 May 2005
Posts: 552
06-01-2006 17:47
From: Phedre Aquitaine
It held me down and TAPED my eyes OPEN.


It made *me* listen to Beethoven while doing that!
Cocoanut Cookie
Registered User
Join date: 26 Jan 2006
Posts: 1,741
06-01-2006 18:14
From: Cristiano Midnight
You need to assemble a few ingredients:

1) Ulrika plushie doll, from Kendra Bancroft. Ask for a mod/no trans version so that you can make it giant.
2) Starax wand. Only 1,000,000,000L (about $1.35 at the current rate). Not totally necessary, but it is very cool and Starax needs a new summer home. Plus you can set people on fire.
3) Optional: sound clip of the Carmina Burana (I can provide it if you would like). You will also need a small script so the sound plays when the giant Ulrika rezzes.

Mix all these things together, force Midnight, then type /101beetlejuice three times and voila!

:cool:

A Starax wand is a million dollars? Seriously?

coco
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Cocoanut Cookie
Registered User
Join date: 26 Jan 2006
Posts: 1,741
06-01-2006 18:16
From: Selador Cellardoor
The whole concept of democracy, at least as practised in my country, is an interesting one. Because in a sense it *does* depend on an elite. Members of parliament come from grass roots political groups, but the process ensures that the ones who do make it tend to be of above average intelligence and also people who think about moral issues.

This means that they can be at variance with popular sentiment. When this country removed the death penalty (a piece of legislation we can all, now, be grateful for) at the time a survey of the general population would have found the vast majority in favour of retaining it.

I bore everyone by telling them about a virtual world to which I used to belong, which had a player-led government. At the time it was mired in corruption, to the extent that life there became a misery. This is why I have always opposed self-government in sl. Unfortunately the government of Neualtenburg also proved to be not robust enough.

However, the experiment was worth trying, if for no other reason than it demonstrates clearly the pitfalls that can face even the most carefully-wrought system.

As far as I've been able to tell, the government of Neualtenburg still exists, it's just that Ulrika's not running it anymore.

coco
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