The Rampant Anti-Business Climate in SL

I agree with you Buster, but like Juro I just don't see that happening. Shopping is among SL's most popular pasttimes... not picking up freebies, but shopping. SL's economy (not counting land) is completely fad based. Yesterday's "must have" item is tomorrow's "huh? never heard of it"

Not to quibble, but I received a modifiable motorcycle for free, from a(n apparently bottomless) box of free motorcycles, for which I must admit, I was thankful. I don't happen to use it, though given it's modifiability, I could improve it. But I'm here to create new things, not improve on old things

I am a newcomer. I wish that I knew the definition of "an established player".

Ok, Chip:
How is SL economics different from FL economics?

When we started to dollar store in Davenport it was done with a very 'teach a man to fish' philosophy. We tried to convince people to make items that, although could be used in their own right, were more teaching by example. A stepping stone to bigger and better things.

The reasons for starting the project were a lot of new players were coming into game (just after the land vs prims change) getting their first 512 plot, blowing the rest of their money on a 400 prim mansion they couldn't rez and couldn't get refunded.

Not a terribly great experience, being bankrupt on a barren plot for your first week.

The idea was to give them a place they could go and get themselves started for under 20 bucks, set up, and then hopefully think 'well this is very nice.. but I could do better'.

Items they would outgrow - and hopefully learn something from - as they progressed further into SL.

In some ways I think it worked... The project wasn't what I'd call an outstanding success - but it did have its moments.

Siggy.

Yes, you are wrong. Go experiment and see.

Consumer psychology is very different. The factors that drive the popularity of a product are different (not at all needs based, completely fad based, with price not being the same kind of factor it is in RL). The life cycle of a product's potential popularity is much shorter. There are no ongoing material costs for production. There is no supply chain. An individual entrepeneur has big advantages over collaborative ventures. I'm sure I could come up with lots more but I'm tired and my brain is jelly.

Well, we now know where you're coming from.
Btw, Communism failed (except in three nations) for very good reasons.

That prolly explains why you claim that what is true in FL is true in SL, but not true in FL.
Yes, I know that this sounds contradictorally circular, but, reduced to it's essence, that is what you said.

I'm not sure who you are saying is wrong here, but I posted a screenshot a few minutes ago that shows exactly what Juro -who is very might right in this case- is talking about.

Errr, no... Chip has made a pretty consistant point in every one of his posts (Well, most of them. I only went back a few pages to confirm this, but it seemed pretty darn consistant):

While SL may share some of the same basic principles economicly with FL, it is so wildly different on many other levels (Supply, material costs, product lifespan, market saturation levels, customer turnover... Well, pretty much all of the nuts-and-bolts details of ecnomics) that any 1:1 comparison with FL is fundamentaly flawed.

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When we started to dollar store in Davenport it was done with a very 'teach a man to fish' philosophy. We tried to convince people to make items that, although could be used in their own right, were more teaching by example. A stepping stone to bigger and better things.
<

I don't understand this, but it sounds significant. Could you please expand on it for us relatively clueless newbies?



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The reasons for starting the project were a lot of new players were...blowing...their money on a 400 prim mansion they couldn't rez and couldn't get refunded.
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How is this possible?
Please remember that *I* am a new player, and don't know many things that are taken as obvious here.



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Not a terribly great experience, being bankrupt on a barren plot for your first week.
<

I'm afraid that I don't understand 'bankrupt' either, given the LL stipend and relative ease of making money in this MMPOLW.



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The idea was to give them a place they could go and get themselves started for under 20 bucks, set up, and then hopefully think 'well this is very nice.. but I could do better'.
<

I haven't even claimed my first Land. I squat on others' land, while giving them Dwell, in the process. It seems to work out for everyone.



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Items they would outgrow - and hopefully learn something from - as they progressed further into SL.
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"Outgrow and learn something from", what?



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In some ways I think it worked... The project wasn't what I'd call an outstanding success - but it did have its moments.
<

I'm sure that I missed something, but ,*what* worked?
Please forgive my newbie ignorance.

I don't think I am... but I will experiment when I get home. To clarify the scenario which is what I think Prok was running into:

Prok sees object A owned by AV Z.
Prok right clicks and chooses edit on object A
Prok sees a message in the Edit window "You are not able to modify this object".
Object A has all the permissions 'checked' allowing the owner, AV Z to copy, mod, and transfer at will.

I think the pic posted by Reitsuki supports this, but I will test it out and report back.

Well I hope Nashville will keep the stamina and the testicularity requited to brazen out (edited). Jebus.

RL economics better have something to do with SL economics or SL economics will go the way all other communist/socialist/utopian experiments where, as Nashville noted, they failed and don't even exist any more except in "all but three countries".

(Let's see...is this a quiz? I'm going to say: Belarus, Cuba, North Korea -- where they only still have communism due to still disappearing people, jailing dissidents, starving people, etc.)



Thank you. Could you use your FIC status to get that in the ear of the "right* Linden. I really really would like to see genuine public domain stuff in here.

I think freebies did flood the market, Buster. Gah, have you SEEN my inventory???

Me too. I would guess that it's anyone who's been around longer than a week. But, what do I know.

We've been asking for something to allow full perms, yet no 'resale' for, oh, about a year now. So far - we've not been lucky in using our FIC powers for that one.

Not sure what you are getting at here Tex, I am not Communist.

Also you should get more historical veiwpoint. Just because Communism failed last week, (*if* I agree that it did), doesn't mean that Capitalism wont fail the week after.

The simple presence of something is not necessarily an indicator of it's robust health.

Besides all of that, all I said was that SL "sometimes seems" (or words to that effect), to be a rampant Capitalist playground. That does not mean it seems like that to me all the time, or that I think that this is *all* SL is.

One of the things that attracted me very early on in the game is that it also seems to have altruism programmed into it, which is the exact opposite of capitalism. I lost all my money within an hour of starting the game and survived for two more weeks on the kindness of strangers.

I love this game, and it is much more than a simple game to me.

I, like others I have met here, would just like to see something better than US brand capitalism evolve. Something more sophisticated that is actually more functional like democratic socialism. (just an option, not necc. my group).

Think of the Star Trek "economy."

People working for things because they want to and because they enjoy it and are good at it as opposed to wage slaves and consumers.

In other words, it was designed as a place where people could get a few things that would make their early SL experience more enjoyable, without them spending money they wouldn't have yet, and at the same time leave it open and tweakable so they could see how it was done and do their own stuff, or at least modify the existing freebies to be a little more personal.






I don't even get the question, I don't think. How is what possible? That newbies were buying things they couldn't even use? Easy. Despite being only a simple property-tab away, "how many prims does my land support" seems to be one of the most common questions in SL.






A weekly stipend is, of course, weekly. Logging in the for the first time, buying something, and then not being able to do jack-all for your first week because you bought something you ended up regretting is hardly a good first experience.

Not many players have money on their mind the first week. Even if they do, it will probably take them that long to get a handle on the building tools and/or scripting language.

Many never do - SL is not all about the content creators.




So? I don't mean that to be snide... What does that have to do with the situation here?

I hope you are asking these people who's land you squat on, though.



See my first paragraph.




See my first paragraph.

It's not kind to inflict socialism on people, trust me on this.

Capitalism has a lot of altruism built into it. By building a system created on the notion that I do what is best for me in an economic decision process, I enable everybody to have that same right, and the aggregate of those decisions creates the basis for freedom.

To be sure, capitalism can be harsh and needs its correctives.Where it is liberal and democratic it has a better chance of being beneficial to people than it does where it is statist and oligarghic.

I'm glad the strangers helped you. But anybody who has a computer, a DSL connection, a $9.95 to spend on a credit card can also go to www.gamingopenmarket.com and like the name says on the can, buy as little as $4.25 for 1000 Lindens and not "rely on the kindness of strangers."

I'm sorry, but people in Darfur hounded out of the RL huts by murderous genocidaires are people who need to rely on the kindness of strangers, not spoiled Internet users in America.

BTW, did I have the wrong Mechanique about that OTHER thread? Bah. Shame on me. It is SO easy to mix up these frigging last names in here. To be researched.

Simply put - I give you something thats simple enough for you to rip apart and see how it was made - you can make something similar for yourself.. If just give or build something for you, you don't really gain anything other than that one single object.




After the amount of prims you could rez on your land was tied to the amount of land in the sim you owned folks would get a 512 plot and not realize they could only rez 100 prims.
They would go out and buy a prefab that had many many more prims, and couldn't rez it on their land.. When they return to the seller of the item they get 'so sad - too bad'.. they have no money left to buy something they can use - and are frustrated by a lack of success with the build tools..



Day one you're bust - now you get to sit around with few skills and fewer ideas until next week when you get your stipend.... Not too much fun for a new player.



From the items they picked up - seeing how scripts worked, how you could use different prim cuts and textures for different effects - how to make a shirt.... etc. Outgrow by learning from how they were put together and making their own stuff that was better.



The Davenport dollar store project - what the entire post was about.

Prok, a lot of people -myself included, and I'm hardly unique - refuse to use GOM or it's bretheren. Either to cash out or to buy from.

Actually I was thinking of posting it on the voting page - I didn't know I'd been inducted into your imaginary secret society! I'll just call Philip up on the bananphone and get him right on it pronto!

Sorry - but I don't pidgeonhole into your lil compartments that easily...

Siggy.

Well, when you put it that way, sure. But, we're talking about SL here.. not RL genocide.

You have your opinion on the freebie goods and I have mine. So be it. It won't stop me from giving them away though.

I know this is a troll and I should not respond but you are being such a jerk I can't resist.



Why you think, (maybe because you saw it on the teevee), that you know *anything* about history or politics or economics is beyond me.

You are wrong about five times over here, but I don't have the time to fill pages with all the reasons, and I don't think you have the "testicularity" (whatever that is) to respond in kind. It seems certain that nothign anyone has told you has affected you or your "point of view" at all so why should we bother?

I would rather be playing the game.

Where do you get off calling everyone here "fucktards" anyway?

Go back to your trailer park and suck on a beer with Nashville.
Your "Bushisms" offend me greatly.

sincerely,
godless, foreign, commie, pinko, dyke, etc ...

Dianne Mechanique

Welcome to SL, Dianne!

Hey! I live in a trailer park in Chaos! prrrrrbt! hahahaha