Abortion: Putting A Face On The Issue

Oh, so you get to make all the decisions?

Look, pro-choice, pro-life or something inbetween, it's often not easy to give up a baby for adoption, even if you have misgivings about becoming a parent. As ZuZu, I believe, pointed out, there are many women who are emotionally scarred by giving up children for adoption. My husband was adopted; his birth mother NEVER got over that hurt.

You seem to think things are so simple. What's it like to live in a world where there is nothing but black or white?

How beauteous mankind is! O brave new world, that has such people in't!

I understand it's hard to give up a baby, but is it easier killing it than handing it over to a good family?

a) Taking a morning after pill, or having an early term abortion
-or-
b) Going thru 9 months of pregnancy, giving birth and then giving your baby away

Some women would say that b is easier, but not all of them.

Having never had to do either, I'm not qualified to say. Are you?

Tell my kids what? That every parent has days when they wish they didn't have kids to deal with? It's already written in a journal that I plan on giving to her when she is about to become a mother herself.

I am not ashamed of feeling this way. It's a normal part of parenting. I am not perfect and have NO desire to be.

Kevn, are you even a parent yourself? You spout off all the time like you know everything, and some of your attitudes and comments make me wonder.

There's an activist group dedicated to getting the word out about the darker side of adoption:

http://www.exiledmothers.com/

Personally I know many adoptees and for most of them it has been a good experience. I also know one woman who gave up her baby for adoption. She seems mostly okay with it, at least to the extent she has spoken of it. Generally, I think adoption is a good thing, but the truth is that every person will have their own unique experience. To say it is always good or always bad is to be naive.

I usually threaten mine im going to sell them to the circus.
its effective because a) It signals to them dad is getting pissed off
b) It makes them laugh and defuses the mood the little buggers
have created.

My mom used to tell me she was gonna sell me to the Gypsies (yeah, like there were roving bands of Gypsies in Tennessee in the 70's )

I sometimes use a different tactic: I'm going to run away and join the circus - they laugh and I don't feel guilty for making them think I wanna get rid of them (yes, I believed my mother when I was 5, but got over it)

What happens to newborns that are abandoned at firehouses or hospitals or police precincts?

The dalmations raise them as their own and name them Kevn.

Are you the new Savior? Shall we alert the press?

Why are you limiting it to early term abortion? Do you support the right of a woman to choose or not? Are you limiting her right to choose to the first trimester?



"Easier" isn't always the better choice.

LOL I used to tell my son that until I started playing WoW, now I tell him I'm selling him to the Chinese farmers.

I don't get it. Were they wrong saying you are a theist? You have certainly espoused to be one. You then make the assumption that because you are called a theist (which you have claim to be anyway), others are not theists. Simply agreeing that you are a theist and that your brand of theism has different doctrine than others would be much, much more correct and clear. And if I wasn't clear, no one in this thread is pro-abortionist. So everytime you say things like "the pro-abortionists of this thread" cause me to scratch my head and say "who is he talking about????".




US Law is not different concerning the personhood and acquisition of foreign newborns vs. local ones. Also, US Law currently says abortion, in many circumstances, is okay. So discussing outlawing abortion is instead discussing your morality (or something other than existing law). And thus far, your morality? says it is 'ok' for foreign unborns to be killed. And what exactly do you consider 'newborn'? (0 days, 5 days, 1 month, 3 months, 1 year, etc?) I ask this because you seem to care very little if they are not that status.

If you DO want to only talk law, you'll have to start citing some existing laws as basis for new ones. Or at least have some sort of legal ground to stand on before asserting huge changes to existing law.

Newborn to him means, fresh out of the mother, covered in the cheesy stuff and blood.

If it's one day old, I doubt he considers it new born...since by now it's one day old.

Kind of like a loaf of bread....everyone wants it when it's fresh out of the oven, but not many people want the day old stuff.

The day old stuff is still pretty good in soup.

I think it would be extremely unrealistic to assume you could ever find a baby THAT newborn available for adoption. I'm suprised that 3 and 4 year olds are not more sought. Not only should they be weaned, but they might even be potty trained with still a good 8-10 years of quality 'childhood' ahead of them. For someone as lazy as Kevn, I would think breastfeeding or formula (and the weaning from such) would be an extremely difficult task. Not to mention diapers, bedwetting, and potty training.

Oh, now just babies aren't good enough to adopt, they have to be NEWBORN??

You keep adding requirements, why don't you state EXACTLY what you want/think instead of going around in circles, changing your mind, bringing in unrelated topics, etc??? Oh that's right, I forget you're incapable of doing that.

Don't forget the lack of sleep since the baby only sleeps for 2 hours stretches for the first few months. It's awhile before the baby sleeps through the night.

I just took a two day break from the forums to come back and still see this thread at the top of the OT forum. FFS people let this thread die.

Yes, newborns (as I always stated) are the ones who are adopted instead of being aborted. That's why it's an alternative to abortion.

Nothing here to further discuss. Read the whole thread.

ahhh. So you're pro-torture!

What happens to newborns that are abandoned at firehouses or hospitals or police precincts?

There's nothing to discuss only because you won't discuss it.

A quick glance at a variety of dictionaries indicates 'newborn' as birth to 4 weeks. I'm having trouble finding the information that says all newborns are adopted. In fact I'm finding out that this rate is not 100% (in the USA) and possibly very far from it. Please provide data to back up your spurious claim.

Later I will be able to post statistics to back up my counterclaim, as I am still accumulating data. One interesting take I have found is that some people are pushing for better adoption legislation. I think this is a much better idea (or angle) than pushing for making abortion illegal. As I've said before, you can only make abortion illegal when adoption is 100%.

Also, how do you feel about in vitro fertilization? Do you think it should be illegal? As an extension of that, do you think a doctor should be counted as a murderer for each unimplanted blastocyst that is either discarded or used in stem cell experiments? As a further extension, do you think drugs that prohibit implantation should be illegal?