Nice game, but...

This post is meant as constructive criticism for the Developers. If this has all been said before...then skip it.

I am a new player. I found out about this game through a recent article in Discover magazine. I am a veteran of many MMOGs (Everquest I and II, Anarchy Online, World of warcraft, City of Heroes and most recently, EVE).

The article described the game and I was immediately intrigued. It seemed to be pretty open ended, mostly self regulating (one of the things I like most about EVE), and best of all you can actually create your own unique objects in the game. The number of variables for each avatar model was pretty staggering as well. The creative potential of this game dwarfs what I have seen in other MMOGs, and I thought the game was a neat idea. I really wanted to like this game.

Unfortunately, the reality came far short of the dream for me. Here are the main problems I had with it.

1) The engine is obsolete. This wasnt a deal killer for me though...it looks about on a par with the original Everquest engine. Considering all the stuff you can do with it (like importing custom high-res textures, scripting, ect..) it wasnt horrible. A night cycle with real-time lighting would have been cool.

2) Movement is awkward. Maybe I just dont know how to re-map my keys yet, but even with a keyboard interface, movement could be a lot more intuitive than it is.

3) Most of the game seems to be a jumble of half completed projects. I saw that a covenant system is in the works...maybe this will fix the problem. None of the player controlled areas seemed to have a theme...some were boringly conventional, and others were really loopy.

4) Infrastucture definitely needs to be addressed. All the newbie plots look like they are sitting in the middle of an open field. No streets or roads or sidewalks? No landscaping? At the very least I'd like to see major roads to all the remote areas. More trees wouldnt hurt either. Covenants could address this issue too I suppose (weekly taxes maybe?).

I will probably stick with the game at least another month. I am not up to date on the covenant discussions...so maybe they are addressing the last two issues. I certainly hope so. The game does look cool, but what I've seen so far isnt enough to keep me hooked.

While I agree with many of your comments, your premise is flawed: SL is not a game, it is a platform. For some people it can be treated as entertainment, but others use it for business, education, collaboration, and much more. There's no leveling, no grinding, no monsters to kill, no quest, no real purpose other than those you give yourself.

The reason it it so much more difficult to get good performance in Second Life is literally EVERYTHING is streamed. Most games - such as EverQuest - have 99.9% of their data neatly tucked away on your hard drive, with just a trickle of player information (what's being said, movements, etc) streamed back and forth. In Second Life, all of the graphical content - textures, 3-D maps, primitives, terrain, sound - is streamed. Its a whole different animal, one that's far more complex than any of the games you have named.

Regards,

-Flip

In this context, the semantics are irrelevant. Because there are resources(L$), and those resources are limited. It is a game in the same way Sim City or Roller Coaster Tycoon is a game. You can do whatever you want...but within the limits of what you can afford. The economy could be considered a game.



I understand that...which is why I did not include performance in my criticisms. When I referred to the game engine I was mostly talking about the graphics. What I would like to see is a graphics engine on a par with the current games, that can be tuned downward by people whose systems cant handle it. That gives everyone options.

And as I said, the engine is not a dealbreaker for me. The other options the game provides makes up for it. If I see that the Developers are really interested in exploring the potential of the game, I will be happy to stay (At $10, the game is not that expensive). The game as it stands now has too many flaws for me though.

The covenants discussion is a really good sign I have to admit. But the infrasturcture thing really bothered me.

The fact that SL residents feel obligated to explain that SL isn't a 'game' (which is a debate unto itself among residents) is evidence enough that first time users and those who are just considering trying it out really don't have any idea what to expect. I think more often than not, they expect one thing and get something wholly different which ultimately negatively affects their first impression and drives people away never to return.

Some day I'm going to scrounge up enough time to create a sort of "introductory tutorial" video for Second Life that will help explain to potential new residents just what "SL" is because there *very cleary* is a need for such education. I'm totally serious. It's something I've though of doing for over a year now but hadn't had the time.

This says a ton.

Maybe. That doesnt apply to me though. I knew what to expect.

If it has a player based economy, it can be considered a game IMO. Resource management is an obvious aspect of the game.

Though a tutorial as you describe couldnt hurt, it would not have affected my opinion. I dont have a problem with SL not being a conventional game, as you can see from my list of criticisms above...nowhere did I mention the lack of a goal or levelling as being a problem. My problem is with the implimentation. Intuitive movement is still important even if it is just for social reasons. Good graphics are still important (maybe even moreso than other games, since creating unique items in-game is such a big deal) even if it is not a real game. Infrastructure and covenants can only enhance the experience, even if it is not a real game.

There are things players cant control. When it comes to changing what the engine allows, that is something the developers have to do. That is what I mean by my comment.

I don't understand how the movement isn't intuitive. Clumsy, maybe.

What do you think there is a need for infrastructure?

This was something i really struggled with when I was new. I still find it very clunky.



Totally agree... first impressions are important. Sometimes I think new players should be shown a few sims worth of completed, themed areas and really well built stuff to show them the possibilities before they hit the rest of the grid, which is largely chaotic. That's why the old "top picks" worked. They were areas chosen by the Lindens that showed up on the map with an icon.

Firstly, welcome.

Secondly, don't bother trying to convince people that SL is not a game .... I've been trying for months and nobody listens. It's almost as if the word 'game' is somehow derogatory, yet many of the aspects of what could be classed as 'online gaming' are present within SL. But no, it's a "platform", "creative tool", "economic model" or any one of a number of other terms that try and get around the fact that it's just something people play for entertainment.

I totally agree with you about the roads and suchlike ... part of the problem is that everyone (both LL and the land sellers) want to squeeze as many plots into a region as they can to make as much money as they can, without giving any regard to the actual aesthetics and practicality of it for the end users. There's absolutely no reason why a gridwork of roads, with 6 x 2 512 sq m or 4 x 4 1024 sq m plots per "block" or similar cannot be created for people to work within, so they can expand by buying multiple plots if they want larger areas to call their own.

So many people are caught up in the 'economic' side of SL without any real consideration to the aesthetic value of good building. Ever wondered why so much of the mainland is such a complete eyesore?

Lewis

It would add to the atmosphere of the game IMO. Even minimal infrastructure would be better than nothing.

Houses just look weird sitting in the middle of nowhere.

Thia is a statement that becomes no more true through repetition. The performance stinks because the code is "write it as fast as you can" proof-of-concept demoware sold as real product.

In a way I tend to agree with this.

As of right now, a lot of Sl seems very dis-jointed. People doing what they want on their land which is good) but everyone treating their own property like their own personal sim (ie no consideration for their neightbors.) As such this ends up creating a landscape that looks less like a world and more like everyone's individual sandboxes slammed up next to each other. Couple this with the lack of Linden-provided content linking these things together (When was the last time you saw a Linden-made sidewalk?) has always left me very disappointed.

However, I could be totally offbase about what he's going about, but here's something to think about:

How many new players do we constantly spout the line, "It's not a game, it's a platform"? So far, only the residents of SL make this distinction, and that fact hasn't been made public in the press either.

If enough residents come here looking for a "game" then one has to wonder why no one has given it to them...

The only times I've seen large plots dedicated to games is usually during the game expo every year. Other than that, this leaves a segment (apparently growing) that views and will view SL as a game and no one caters to that.

Possible need here waiting to be filled.....

Well, that's cool. It would add to the atmosphere for you. For me, I can't think of anything less desirable. The minimal road system as is, is fine for me - just enough to create ban-free lanes through the grid. Nothing stopping anyone from creating their own infrastructure, either.

I havnt seen any yet, but yes, it would definitely have made a better impression on me.

How do areas become themed if there are no convenants? Do small groups of players just buy up large tracts of land?
I dont get why that would even matter...the land is virtual anyway. They can expand on it almost indefinitely. So why would the developers care?
I would think that aesthetics would feed into the value.

When I first read about the game, I got an image of a virtual world where you could buy land anywhere...sure there would be in-demand plots (expensive enough to be out of my price range), but I could buy land on the outskirts of the city, or maybe even a more remote location in the countryside.

What I found instead was about 6 plots total to choose from, and those randomly placed in a field next to other houses also built randomly in a field. Some of these plots were surrounded by houses on all sides...so my house would be burried back behind a bunch of other properties. That just doesnt seem as appealing to me.

Personally, think roads in SL are worthless. Most of us Teleport or fly everywhere we go. I know that there are vehicles, and some people use them. But myself, every time I have attempted to use a vehicle I end up frustrated. Either I carsh crossing a sim, get bounced by a script, or something that makes it just frustrating. I have been playing for two years and find raods totally irrelevant.

People dont "travel" a lot, so there is no real need for roads. One of the things I really miss in SL are good vehicles... Some scripters are doing a great job, but still the cars are just "moving prims" and not cars at all.
Maybe if the vehicles got better, ppl would travel more.
Traveling has even become less now we have p2p teleport. When you had to TP to a telehub you at least saw SOMETHING of the environment..
So my idea would be: GOOD vehicles (cars, planes) and no longer p2p teleport.
And I agree on the clumsy movement too. I cant "strafe" unless I'm in mouselook, and mouselook in SL is awkward. I play all my games in first person perspective, but I switched to 3rd person pretty soon...

As for you other remarks: I once read this comparison: If you have a matchbox car, it always looks good, but you cant change anything about it. If you have a Lego car, it never looks as good as a matchbox car, but but you can completely make your own car. SL is Lego...

Yes, basically friends get together and takeover a sim and either build in theme or just build stuff that appears to be finished at the very least. . They wait people out, buy up the plots, one by one which can take ages. Now it's a bit easier because people can buy whole sims on the mainland on the auction boards.

There are some good looking sims on the mainland. Check out Seacliffe, Aqua, Taber, Boardman, Lusk, Perry, Cowell, Abbotts, Gynamede is also a nice sim, Deimos is coming together. And Miramare and Grignano are city sims, those are pretty cool i think. There are more, I hate to only mentioning the ones I can think of off the top of my head...

By that measure, Neverwinter Nights, Half-Life 2, and GURPS aren't games either. They're platforms too. They're much better, less buggy, and much more popular platforms as well. They're better games too.

If that is the case, and it is going to remain that way, it will save me a lot of time and a bit of money. If I am really in the minority on this I'd rather find out now than 3 months from now, when I have already invested a lot of effort into the game. That was one of the reasons I started this post.

As for the game semantics...I am not going to argue it. To me, Roller coaster Tycoon and Sim City are still games, even if you play them in sandbox mode. This game is no different than that from what I can see. There is still competition in the form of money and plot locations. To me that = game.

I wasn't focusing my post direct directly at you Frack since you clearly understand the platform nature of SL. It was more about your use of "game" and the often misconceived notion that label has on SL as a platform.

In the end, it's purely semantics. You are correct that SL can be called a game but the fact that it's played on a computer (ie. a computer game) places SL in with a group of software titles that are absolutely nothing like SL. That's why calling SL a 'game' is often frowned upon.

It's sorta like labeling all animation as being purely for children.

To me, a computer/video game is something that when you stop, has no resulting consequence on your real life outside of your enjoyment. Since many people use Second Life to impact their real lives in ways outside entertainment (such as a source of real-world income or as a real-world learning tool) it no longer qualifies as an ordinary video/computer game. To call it a game may be accurate in the dictionary the definition doesn't exactly set the proper expectation.

No you're not... It's been an issue for a lot of players since sl got off the ground 3 years ago. So many threads over the years from residents complaining about the neighbour's "ugly, massive, build".

I'm hooked because I love to make content, and also I grouped together with some people and we ended up making some nice areas to hang out in.

Perhaps that the reason everyone teleports or flys everywhere is because of the lack of roads? I spent an entirely pointless yet amusing 20 minutes driving round Boardman the other day with my 'short bus' just purely because i could..... it was actually quite relaxing.

Just because you find them irrelevant, doesn't mean we all do. If LL would open up new region design to players for suggestions, I'd be right in there with an infrastructure plan. If you have a moment, drop by the Warmouth infohub which I recently rebuilt, and walk up the ramp to the road.... it's got a bus stop on the roadside. Many people have commented on that - not because it's a particularly outstanding piece of design, but because it's so instantly recogniseable and because of its 'everydayness' is actually rare - if not unique - in SL.

Lewis

As an aside, we're trying to do the same thing with Jessie and so far, response has been positive. I find the lack of order sometimes to be chaotic, which is exciting and annoying at the same time.

Since I'm not a gamer, I can't speak to the points about engines or movement. Works fine for me. As I evolve as a resident, there are things that pop up from time to time, but I think success comes from the fact that I'm reasonably empowered to work around any problem that exists.

I'm happy with my second life.

ER/Spin

And Gibson.

Don't forget Gibson.