The New "Help Island"

There's no personal attack in that. It's about freedom and openness in a society. Not closed clubs, or a group of players having access to new players in a way others don't.

This is how I feel about it, and I've said my piece.

coco

Aforementioned deformo-av just started push-weaponing people with a huge battle axe while yelling 'IM BEATING YOU UP'. I suppose I was wrong to judge by appearances.

My point is, Coco, you can go to the WA *AT ANY TIME* and see and experience this crap. The fact that you haven't seen it is, well, awe-inspiring to say the least.

So far this 'person' has sent at least five newbies flying... no, now six... And counting...

Nothing like rezzing in and getting thrown offworld.

You have the same access as anyone. All mentors and greeters ask is for a place to meet new residents in peace, without grievers and asshats.

Accusing mentors of being a closed club is utter nonsense.

Agreed. As I said, anyone can be a greeter or a mentor, you just have to drop the inane childish behavior.

Meanwhile, looks like even LL doesn't want to get their hands wet in the WA. (Kinda like one of those games where you keep killing the monsters, and they just keep respawning. )Two abuse reports and a page to a Linden, not much happened to the folks causing trouble. Perhaps they know it's a lost cause.

All the more reason to change the structure of the new user experience.

Geez! What the heck? I've been listening to all the posters throughout this thread and hearing good points which were being made from many views. But these last few posts seem so defensive and more and more insulting to anyone who doesn't agree with you. . The earlier posts made me think and listen.

This is a big thing that LL is doing; all input and discussion should be welcome. LL creating a help center is an acknowledgement of the problems associated with the new user experience and their retention. Nobody is being off topic by discussing better documentation. Why are you dictating what can and can't be posted here and insulting them if they don't comply? The sitting on the can and reading comment was when your presentation began to take away from your message. I'm not addressing the effect on the people you disagree with, they can speak for themself. What I am trying to speak to is the diminishing effect on your own argument and your credibilty as a speaker by doing so. Yes, I know how you are coming across to me most likely matters not at all to you.

That's the same person whom I mentioned in my earlier post that was ghosting players last night thanks to the pushscript axe. Ironically enough, that same axe used to be wielded by a WA griefer who was suspended for axe attacks so many times her account was deleted last week.

How is what Forsetti said in post #2 all that different from what Vivianne elaborate on? Why didn't you chastise him for daring to suggest something other than what is proposed?

Vivianne, I think most of us agree that it is not the best use of resources, however, since LL has made a decision not to ban (or take any action at all) those who abuse new residents and who have turned the WA into a metaverse sewer, the only alternative is to create a Help Island.

The sensible response would be to just deal with the problem people since we have a perfectly good Welcome Area that simply needs policing and a few perma bans, but that is not the road LL has chosen for whatever reason. I expect it comes down to a freedom of speech thing that they want to defend, even at the expense of costing them business (a short-sighted choice, IMHO, but it's not my company) so rather than booting the assholes, they will expend an entire sim and a lot of time creating an area that is actually welcoming. It is taking the long road to be sure, but the destination is still the same.

Just wanted to remind everyone to please refrain from personally attacking one another.

How is the mentor program/greeters a closed club? Anyone can join them, unless they have disciplinary problems.

Because "taking away from man-hours for documentation" is a red herring. I think it's a ridiculous angle to take as to why we shouldn't have a helper island. People are skirting around the truth of the issue - that people who don't want there to be a mentor/greeter island are people who somehow get kicks out of the current WA situation.

I have yet to see anyone come up with a REAL negative to having this island put in place.

There's the key term, Cristiano.

This really got me thinking. Wouldn't it be helpiful to send customer surveys out after 1 and perhaps 3 months? How about the community Lindens, Robin, Jeska and Pathfinder, holding round table discussions open only to residents between 1 and 3 months of age?

Actually, they're doing just that with post-greeter experiences.

So if you think someone is ridiculous you get to insult them?

Another question, do you suppose that a new resident like Vivianne is someone LL is hoping to retain?

No, actually I thought that Vivianne was someone who was trying to give a weak diversion as to why the island would be a negative. Maybe she just picked this thread to beef about lack of documentation; but a lack of documentation, as I began before it accelerated into a tete-a-tete, is not mutually exclusive in regards to restructuring the new user experience.

Do I "get" to "insult someone" if I think their argument is ridiculous? When's it an insult, Margaret, and does it depend on which side of the argument you're on? I believe I responded in kind. Your bias may lead you to believe otherwise.

Where do you come off accusing me of bias? Did you read my post? I said I was listening to everyone and that good points were made by all.

Obviously, dude, people who have discipline issues have them because evil ficcing bullies egged them on and then when they finally snapped, of course they got nailed by the Lindens. So the club who can be greeters are only people who are clever enough to make other people explode. Which makes them evil, man.

Really, Anito. Must we connect the dots for you all the time?

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also try..

Make yourself sound smarter

We can all make the documentation better by working on the help wiki, variously known as the Support Wiki or the Second Life Wiki. It's url is easy to remember, it's just secondlife.com/help.

Notecards are a rather primitive form of presenting information, but even so, putting them (or something similar) into people's Library folders does make sense.

Why not put some help videos on the help menu instead of expecting people to find simulated viewscreens in the buildings at the welcome area? Is it really that important that we sort of pretend that we are watching a sort of pretend TV set?

Last time I checked, people could bypass orientation or go directly to the WA. If they reached the temple they get the Explorer's Guide or a landmark to the WA. The explorer's guide has several places to enter at that aren't the WA. They are the Balloon Tour, the Orientation Island training rerun site, the SL Historical Museum, Seacliff Northeast, the Prim Drilling Rig, Lauks Nest, Riverwalk, and Transylvania.

We need to know how the Help Island fits in to this scheme.

Where will people who bypass Orientation Island go to - the so-called Welcome Area or the Help Island or one of the other places listed above selected at random?

Will people who haven't bought land or joined a landowning club ever get a choice of home location ?

I have wanted for so long to have a choice made available to new users, and the terms I want to use for the choices are Spicy and Mild. The Mild place place would be one where you are expected to be polite to each other, not cuss, keep your clothes on, and generally act in a manner that would be appropriate while dealing with strangers that you want to make a favorable impression on who have offered no evidence that aren't fairly straightlaced sorts. The Spicy choice would be a lot more lax - not without constraints at all, (for example, no Nazi stuff, no racist, nationalist, sex orientation, etc. hate speech )but you could say shit and fuck and wear your penile prosthetics and talk about the various bodily secretions the discussion of which seems to be the primary occupation of some people.

Poor documentation isn't an impetus for opening or closing a Newbie Island. In fact, they are barely related.

It's like saying "I don't have any ham, so you can't drive the car." They are wholly unrelated as to make a non-sequitor.

Furthermore, we have the familiar argument of "Well, *I* don't see these so called 'problems' at the WA, therefore they must be hoaxes. After all, those cuddly rascals are just having fun."

Whatever. Conversations about blowjobs and BDSM lifestyles isn't the kind of thing Joe Q Average wants to hear upon immediate entry into our weird world. The same goes for looping Numa Numa Dance, the Badger dance, push scripts, racial slurs, poorly typed pickup lines, and everything else that pollutes the WA.

The WA should be there to help people get used to the game, period. It should not be used as a raunchy AOL chatroom. It should not be used as a singles bar. It should not be used as a weapons platform. It should not be used as a soapbox for racists and 12 year olds.

Oldbies. Helping. Newbies. Period.

LF

good points suezanne. I've lost track of this thread but this caught my eye:

My additional thoughts: we are in a 3D world and lets use that to our advantage. I'm not talking about watching a video in SL versus a browser, but rather using the software that cause so much difficulty. Some help doc is always going to be text, so an in-world kiosk with notecards and URL links to the wiki is great.

The reason why I am so in favor of a dedicated help island is that people learn by doing. Text often only gets you halfway there and is quickly forgotten. We need to build exercise and example areas. That is why the ivory tower is so effective, and to this day I think the ivory tower is only discovered through word of mouth. The particle laboratory is cool, but could be made so much more hands on and beginner-friendly. How about an area where you can pick up some textures and then try to place and manipulate them on different shaped prims? etc etc

Furthermore, questions about SL don't stop at 3 months. That's why I'd like to see a help island for all.

It does need to be initially organized by a leader (preferrably linden) otherwise it will be chaos and the ensuing confusion would defeat the whole purpose of enhancing clarity.

I don't see why such a thing as this would need to be exclusionary (unless you earn a boot) at all to either teachers or students, if it's managed well.

There will always be people that need a live person to help them, and refuse to read self-help material. But I look at LL's goals of explosive growth and think -- one month of really high growth could totally overwhelm and burn out the existing volunteer staff. Thus LL needs more high-profile, easy, FUN, infrastructural help resources and experiences.

/End forseti beating-dead-horse


Edit: this really is a separate topic from whether or not LL should do something special for new players. I am all in favor of them trying to provide better options for brand new residents. This and my dead-horse are not mutually exclusive.

I didn't pick this thread to beef about documentation. If all I wanted to do was bitch about documentation, I would have done that. Nor is my argument weak. You may think it is but you thinking it is doesn't make it so. It is sound business practice to FIX SHIT THAT IS BROKEN before implementing new items that may also break.

However, regardless of whether or not my argument was sound, weak or whatever, that doesn't explain your personal attacks and baseless accusations against me because I happened to disagree with you.

Microsoft and it's multi-billion dollar bank account would beg to differ with you, as would almost every other software development company ever in existance.
LF