Any Land Owners interested in a class action suit?

I imagine the loss could be taken on ones income tax - That is of course if everything had been properly reported as profit in the past .......... I bet that is a can of worms most do not want to open up.

if they are cashing it out, then i would expect so(i hope so, since the IRS is supposedly turning their beady lil eyes upon us). but if they are leaving it in world. its not considered income.

Once again you are using words like could and can. Even should can be tossed into that mix. you are not entitled to any sort of guarantee that land prices will not change or even that your account will be available from day to day.

To take quotes from the ToS.... I have copied the bold titles of these but reading the entire section listed here should clarifty any misconceptions about what you have a right to and what you are entitled to as a resident of the game.


for those of you who haven't taken the time to read the entire Terms of Servce... here is that URL...

http://secondlife.com/corporate/tos.php

As you can see, and as has been stated repeatedly, you're basically here on Linden Labs whim and if they want to change, alter, close, delete you account, or whatever, you agreed to allow them to do that when you signed up to play the game. So I'm not sure what grounds this lawsuit would be filed on that would hold water.

Here is free and valuable advice: it's legal to lower prices. Now back to your original programming.

It was not always illegal to run a Casino in SL. In fact at one stage LL even promoted being a Casino Owner as a means to make money in SL.
Please check your facts before presenting the "history" of SL.

Well its always assumed if that is the case. How many times does newbie people come up to us and ask "Can you really make money" Why is this asked? because all the false stories about making money. Whats worse now is LLABS is tellign companies that build island style islands that their product will get alot of exposure due to the "BOOM" in VR worlds.......But as some are finding out this is not the case. Companies that can stand spending 10,000.00 US Monies for advertizing buget can deal with issues and problems. But for those smaller companies trying to reachout and get people to ( in simple terms Brain Wash them) people to buy showing their products in second life and then carring that image of said comapny product in to their rl. Soon pull out because the lack all the promises that there are future buyers or users of their products and services.

BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! someone with a sence of second life history...........Thank You !

My belief is that the activation price coming down is because the honeymoon of corporations and SL is over. When the prices were raised it was the height of corporations coming into to SL. Some companies made big money to make a presence for them within SL. Once corporations found it to be a money pit they began pulling out and word was getting around on the news that SL had sexual age players and other things that put a bad light on it.

Once the corporations who could and would spend about 1700 and more to make a presence here began to slow way down LL knew it was time to get a price out there to entice the residents again.

I don't think it is about server prices falling, etc. LL just knows what to charge to attract more sells.

While I appreciate the position of the land owners who feel they have been wronged and I am in no way stating that Linden Labs is handling things as they should the fact remains that it's not call for a class action lawsuit, as no laws have been broken and no contracts have been violated. It is what it is, like it or not. Again, a successful lawsuit will may provide indemnity to the users it will only serve to crush the very project you are so passionate about.

While I'm not a legal expert, I do know that a TOS means nothing if it contradicts the law of the land, or existing case law. You can't create a contract that permits you to commit a crime, and you can't negate existing government regulations with a disclaimer. No company would spend anything on safety or fraud protection if all they had to was slap a TOS on the label or website and they were automatically immune from criminal or civil litigation. IF, and this is a very big if, the persons in this suit could prove LL had violated certain laws or that their TOS was overly broad in its protection, this strategy MIGHT work.

However, it would be years before anything got settled, UNLESS LL decided to settle out of court and give in to certain demands and pay legal fees, to prevent legal precedent being set. Also, if it is a class action suit and there is merit, many attornies would take the case for free as LL would wind up paying them if settled or won.

From http://www.kyroslaw.com/articles/online_gambling_law.html



The entire page is relevant as well.

Don't like federal laws and the laws of your state? Lobby to have them changed. Hell, I'd be for legalizing gambling at a national level and taxing the hell out of it. However, do not ask LL to allow you to break the law and put themselves at risk.

i understand what you are saying. i have been approached as well by new residents wanting to know how to make money. but when you tell them, they either give up and leave, or say something derogatory then hit me or anyone in the area up for lindens. those that are serious about making money in this venue, know that research and a lot of hard work goes into it. many don't have the patience, just want the quick bucks(hence the last spate of content creation thievery).

i do however agree with you on the approach LL is using the lure Big Business in here. why have a walmart when over half of the residents can make their own clothing/furniture/shoes/ etc? LL should come clean with them on that. i don't know the whole story, but i have read how a few companies were disappointed when the numbers dwindled, if any showed up at all to their corporate sponsored sims. IBM seems to be the exception.

either way Usagi, when a new resident joins without doing reading about what they agreed to, you get threads like this. LL did nothing wrong, it basically made it much more easier and viable for more people to buy land. thats not a crime.

Macphisto, nice piece of writing!!!!!!!!!!! many that agree but a few of the builders that rely these companies for their jobs would not agree.

My God...noone at all understands what all this is about...it has nothing to do with the gambling ban...It has to do with 'INTEGRITY'....I've been in SL long enough (alot longer than most of these forum posters to this thread) to see all the changes they have imposed and NOT ONCE have they ever given us an explaination with truth or cared who they were stepping on....back in the beginning we all came here and stayed because of what SecondLife stood for. At that time they appeared to care for every user...those days are gone...I came here for an escape from the real world and all the laws, it was awesome. I know who were the heart and soul of Secondlife cause I watched and experienced it but it appears that the majority of those users nolonger have their hearts in the game...or is it a game?
I've never been a creator to make that cold hard cash so their changes have not directly effected me ...but I've been here to watch the changes and to see how Linden Labs have handled things....and I understand what Chilly and the 1000's of others are saying.
'INTEGRITY' means so much and when you have a lack of it ...it will catch up with you.


Why you all have that need to flame and ridicule someone that has offered so much to this community shows just how many of you have 'Integrity' yourself. Everyone of you that stay in this game will someday understand exactly what all this is about.

What crime was committed by lowering the price for land? For a crime to have been committed, in this case fraud as you seem to allege, that would mean that Linden labs said they would never lower the land price and then lowered the land price. That would be fraud. But in fact this has never been stated, anywhere, and no company worth it's weight is going to make such a ridiculous statement like that. In fact, the ToS cleary points out that this kind of thing CAN, WILL and DOES change and if you are willing to play the game despite this knowledge then you only have yourself to blame when it doesn't go your way. Sure it might be a shitty thing to do but that doesn't make it illegal.

Companies spend large amounts of money on fraud protection so they can guard themselves and the interests of their shareholders against frivolous lawsuits from people who refuse to read the ToS, which is a CONTRACT that you are agreeing to when you use their service.

Yeah it sucks, big companies have all of the control in situations like this but that's how it is. The only way to fight this sort of behavior is to cease using their products and services but no one wants to do that. So you can't have it both ways, you either play the game the way it's played or you don't play the game at all.

And if you ever needed an example of a large company being protected by a ToS, Microsoft is the hugest example one can provide. It's ToS provides the end user with basically no rights whatsoever, and as a Windows user (if you use Windows), or any other MS product for that matter, if Microsoft decided one day that we can no longer use Windows, well then you better start learning Linux or Mac OS with a quickness.

Don't know about that page, and not much interested in reading it either. Whether it was illegal in the US to gamble online prior to LL's ban I highly doubt. Otherwise why would LL have promoted running a Casino as an occupation one could have in SL?

As for if I don't like it, well if I lived in the US as you so obviously assume everyone does, then I probably would.
But then I don't gamble at all in RL. Not even Tattslotto. So I doubt I actually care that it is illegal.

My point was that you made an incorrect point and presented it as SL history.

As for what has pushed Chilly over the edge, again you were making a broad assumption. I doubt he is the only one that has got to breaking point with LL. Just most leave quietly and we never hear about them again.

Am I missing something?

I've always thought of SecondLife as a 'VIRTUAL WORLD' like a game to play ....my head is beginning to spin...SecondLife is now a BIG CORPORATION or COMPANY?

What you are saying here is exactly right. It's about Integrity and in that regard Linden Labs needs a few lessons. However that's STILL not what this post is about. It's about a lawsuit which has no business being discussed because there is no cause for a lawsuit. Just because you don't like their position doesn't provide you with any legal recourse if Chilly bothered to read the contract that was accepted when they joined the service it would be glaringly obvious.

to my knowledge I didn't flame or ridicule anyone I was simply stating that the entire thing is a lost cause.

HMMMMMM....Maybe his first recollection of the TOS was way back in 2004 when everything was legal and when SecondLife wanted this to be a 'USER CREATED VIRTUAL WORLD' ....they have flipped flopped so much Im not sure anyone knows what really is in that TOS or the meanings.

I was with you up until the end there. All companies want you to believe that you can make it big by following their business model. There are hours and hours of infomercials on the TV about making it big with the newest Real Estate system or setting up Internet Businesses and making thousands of dollars a day while you sail in your brand new Yacht. Anyone who attempts to be blissfully unaware of this practice is only setting themselves up for a fall.

If you come to Second Life and drop a ton of money without bothering to read through the available information, I mean how many forums are there where we hold discussions like this, then you are obviously ignorant and will do poorly in business overall because you didn't do your research.

One need only spend half an hour on this forum or any of the other ones to find posts like these which should assist them in making the proper judgment call. simply saying... they told me I could make alot of money and I didn't so they are wrong is just.... well you get the picture.

The ToS is posted clearly on the website and everyone should take the time to read it completely. In addition, each and everytime Linden Labs makes an adjustment to the ToS you must agree to it before you can log on and it is presented to you 'ingame' for you to read before making that agreement. So anyone who claims they are unaware of what's in the ToS is simply not reading it.

The more I read the more Im convinced that all of you guys are behind the closed doors of Linden Labs.....you all know EXACTLY why Linden Labs do exactly what they do do.
I'm wondering how many closed doors there is cause you all have different answers and you are all sure you are right.

I don't think I claimed to know anything about WHY they do what they do and no where in this discussion do I attempt to explain the whys. The overall discussion centers around the issue that you cannot sue someone for something they haven't done, namely breaking a contract. As far as lowering the land prices, this, in and of itself does not violate any agreement Linden Labs has made with the users of it's service.

When real world money is at stake, real world laws will apply.