What are Ginko Bonds worth? - 2
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Wilhelm Neumann
Runs with Crayons
Join date: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 2,204
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09-14-2007 16:03
From: Brodsky Zapedzki Full disclosure: Dzonatas works in the slquotes.com marketing department. ah so last week she is nick and this week she works there? not totatlly sure what kind of games either of you is up to or what but this is starting to look like alt abuse here .......
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From: Raymond Figtree
I know the competition that will come along someday is learning from LL's mistakes. But do they have to make so many?
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Talarus Luan
Ancient Archaean Dragon
Join date: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 4,831
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09-14-2007 16:09
From: Dzonatas Sol This is next statement is the closest you will get to a face value on a pertual bond, BUT remember that NP fixed the yields to 1 cent a month instead of the equation below: No, they yield 3% of the FACE VALUE every quarter. You can redefine it however you want, but it doesn't change the FACTS: 1) They have a FACE VALUE of L$1 each; yeah, that's right, the value on the FACE of the bond, if they were printed. NOTHING NOWHERE IN THIS UNIVERSE says that perpetual bonds CANNOT have a FACE VALUE. PERIOD. You have YET to prove this otherwise, because you CAN NOT. It's ludicrous. 2) The interest rate is computed from the FACE VALUE, as stated by Nick P himself. From: someone Since there is no calculation for a discount rate, there is no face value as you say. There are just the market values and yields. It doesn't need one. The FACE VALUE simply is. Since there is never a maturation, the FACE VALUE is all the bond has to base interest on. Look, it is really simple... I am company Alpha; I want to sell a bunch of perpetual bonds. I want to sell each at a face value of $X each. I will pay the buyers of my bonds 1% of that value a month quarterly forever until such time as I either buy them back by paying the face value, or my company goes bye-bye, or the universe explodes and makes the entire situation moot. At no point in that situation do my bonds NOT have a FACE VALUE. In fact, it is important to my interest calculations that they DO have such a thing. There's no need to calculate prices of this or that because there is NO MATURATION. Once worth $X, they are ALWAYS worth $X at face value. Now, the market may decide that the paper I sold for $X is only worth some small percentage of that value, due to fluctuations in the market interest rate as a comparison. At no time does it change the fact that some poor schmuck bought them for $X a piece for the paper (or in Ginko's case, the bits). In RL markets, the PRESENT VALUE of a Perpetuity changes with the market interest rates. From: Wikipedia To give a numerical example, a 3% UK government War Loan will trade at 50 pence per pound in a yield environment of 6%, while at 3% yield it is trading at par. That is, if the FACE VALUE of the Loan is £100 and the annual payment £3, the value of the Loan is £50 when market interest rates are 6%, and £100 when they are 3%. Next? |
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Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
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09-14-2007 16:15
From: Talarus Luan No, they yield 3% of the FACE VALUE every quarter. You can redefine it however you want, but it doesn't change the FACTS:
Its Deja Vu - All over again. |
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Cristalle Karami
Lady of the House
Join date: 4 Dec 2006
Posts: 6,222
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09-14-2007 16:23
Tal, it's hopeless. Just go on...
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Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
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09-14-2007 16:27
From: Cristalle Karami Tal, it's hopeless. Just go on... shhhh let him work. He's scarier than me, maybe someone (not naming any names or singling anyone out) will listen this time. |
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Talarus Luan
Ancient Archaean Dragon
Join date: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 4,831
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09-14-2007 16:29
Well, I DID say that it was a hopeless case when I got started again.  |
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Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
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09-14-2007 16:31
From: Talarus Luan Well, I DID say that it was a hopeless case when I got started again. Yeah but we didnt take that statement at Face Value. |
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Wilhelm Neumann
Runs with Crayons
Join date: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 2,204
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09-14-2007 16:31
From: Talarus Luan Well, I DID say that it was a hopeless case when I got started again. where you the dragon i'm to lazy to flip pages back if so that might explain it..
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From: Raymond Figtree
I know the competition that will come along someday is learning from LL's mistakes. But do they have to make so many?
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Brodsky Zapedzki
Registered User
Join date: 30 Mar 2007
Posts: 337
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09-14-2007 16:32
Well, I didn't think this would be necessary but I've been contacted by numerous concerned residents so here's the official statement: Dzonatos Sol does not work in the slquotes.com marketing department. 'cause we just sacked her. ROTFLMAO  |
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Cristalle Karami
Lady of the House
Join date: 4 Dec 2006
Posts: 6,222
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09-14-2007 16:32
lol... Strife... where arrrreeee yoooouuuu
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Wilhelm Neumann
Runs with Crayons
Join date: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 2,204
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09-14-2007 16:35
From: Colette Meiji Its Deja Vu - All over again. I've been having that a lot lately something about "call it whatever you want but it wont change the facts" we can watch this thread bumped over again with the same cyclical discussion and it will end the same way with someone wanting to poke their eyes our or shoot their brains out of something but until then we can watch...
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From: Raymond Figtree
I know the competition that will come along someday is learning from LL's mistakes. But do they have to make so many?
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Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
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09-14-2007 16:38
From: Wilhelm Neumann I've been having that a lot lately something about "call it whatever you want but it wont change the facts"
we can watch this thread bumped over again with the same cyclical discussion and it will end the same way with someone wanting to poke their eyes our or shoot their brains out of something but until then we can watch... Hey LOL That is what Nick called it! I remember becuase I told him it wasnt worth the face value at the time. I distinctly remember fighting it out with Nick He even called me a bad person, remember? |
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Wilhelm Neumann
Runs with Crayons
Join date: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 2,204
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09-14-2007 16:39
From: Cristalle Karami lol... Strife... where arrrreeee yoooouuuu I think strife is watching and lauging in glee right now. Its a kind of entertaining thread to say the least but it umm should come to a close if people would stop responding to "that person who shall remain nameless" but someone just can't help themsevles always and then we are off to the races again...
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From: Raymond Figtree
I know the competition that will come along someday is learning from LL's mistakes. But do they have to make so many?
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Wilhelm Neumann
Runs with Crayons
Join date: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 2,204
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09-14-2007 16:39
From: Colette Meiji Hey LOL That is what Nick called it! I remember becuase I told him it wasnt worth the face value at the time. I distinctly remember fighting it out with Nick He even called me a bad person, remember? you just want to watch my head explode dont you?
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From: Raymond Figtree
I know the competition that will come along someday is learning from LL's mistakes. But do they have to make so many?
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Brodsky Zapedzki
Registered User
Join date: 30 Mar 2007
Posts: 337
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09-14-2007 16:40
actually strife doesn't get back till monday.
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Wilhelm Neumann
Runs with Crayons
Join date: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 2,204
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09-14-2007 16:43
this forum/thread is so doomed..
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From: Raymond Figtree
I know the competition that will come along someday is learning from LL's mistakes. But do they have to make so many?
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Brodsky Zapedzki
Registered User
Join date: 30 Mar 2007
Posts: 337
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09-14-2007 16:48
Before this thread gets locked we should seriously address the following 2 questions regarding Ginko bonds:
a) what is their face value?
b) and when do they mature?
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Cristalle Karami
Lady of the House
Join date: 4 Dec 2006
Posts: 6,222
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09-14-2007 16:48
Why don't we do a little self policing here... and just make like it never happened. Really. We have enough info about the inworld holdings to know that the trading price may yet still be too high to match what WSE can take in the event of default. And as Qie noted in another thread, we have to wait until November 1 (last quarterly payment was August 1, not on calendar quarters). We cannot keep this up until November. I don't need any gray hairs over this stupid thread, do you?
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Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
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09-14-2007 16:49
From: Brodsky Zapedzki Before this thread gets locked we should seriously address the following 2 questions regarding Ginko bonds:
a) what is their face value?
b) and when do they mature? ROFL a) 1 L b) when Nick comes up with the money, Flees, Dies or Hell freezes over whichever happens first. |
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Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
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09-14-2007 16:51
From: Cristalle Karami Why don't we do a little self policing here... and just make like it never happened. Really. We have enough info about the inworld holdings to know that the trading price may yet still be too high to match what WSE can take in the event of default. And as Qie noted in another thread, we have to wait until November 1 (last quarterly payment was August 1, not on calendar quarters). We cannot keep this up until November. I don't need any gray hairs over this stupid thread, do you? Ive switched from being annoyed to finding this whole face value debate funny. I know Im a bad person. Ask Nick |
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Wilhelm Neumann
Runs with Crayons
Join date: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 2,204
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09-14-2007 16:51
i'm pretty sure people want to watch my head explode 
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From: Raymond Figtree
I know the competition that will come along someday is learning from LL's mistakes. But do they have to make so many?
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Brodsky Zapedzki
Registered User
Join date: 30 Mar 2007
Posts: 337
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09-14-2007 16:53
From: Cristalle Karami Why don't we do a little self policing here... and just make like it never happened. Really. I'm all up for it. Which bit, though? |
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Cristalle Karami
Lady of the House
Join date: 4 Dec 2006
Posts: 6,222
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09-14-2007 16:54
lol, well... thanks, friends, but I'm out... it's been real! See you in the next pertinent Ginko thread!
edit: to Brodsky: the middle 20 or so pages where we Clintonize "face value"
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Avacea Fasching
Certified
Join date: 23 Dec 2005
Posts: 481
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09-14-2007 16:56
From: Brodsky Zapedzki Before this thread gets locked we should seriously address the following 2 questions regarding Ginko bonds:
a) what is their face value?
b) and when do they mature? A) nothing, really, if you think REAL hard about it.. B) in something like 8 years if i understand correctly... Offers a slice of cherry pie to Strife, says and smiles...... or perhaps a Lamington? IBTL Should I mention how much the Amish are enjoying this thread?
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post spelling was checked using - Speak & Spell
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Strife Onizuka
Moonchild
Join date: 3 Mar 2004
Posts: 5,887
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09-14-2007 17:02
From: Cristalle Karami lol... Strife... where arrrreeee yoooouuuu In a meeting room on 945 Battery St. San Francisco aka Linden Lab. Guess it's time to lock this.
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Truth is a river that is always splitting up into arms that reunite. Islanded between the arms, the inhabitants argue for a lifetime as to which is the main river.
- Cyril Connolly
Without the political will to find common ground, the continual friction of tactic and counter tactic, only creates suspicion and hatred and vengeance, and perpetuates the cycle of violence.
- James Nachtwey
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