What are Ginko Bonds worth? - 2

Correct - it does not matter to him, his debt remains the same.

Unless he cheats and buys them up with an alt.

It did matter before WSE slapped that restriction on him that he couldnt buy the bonds at the market Value.

You completely missed the point. There is absolutely no guarantee for that L$1 liquidation dividend. What investor in their right mind is going to say it is worth that L$1 based on the liquidation dividend? None. It is a junk (perpetual) bond.

Im a bit lost by your apparent priorities.

You will call Nick a Screw-up and a F'n Liar over the use of the term "Face Value"

However - the fact that he claimed the scam wasnt a Ponzi, or that he wont divulge where the money went - gets no similiar reaction.

The only guarantee is the one made by Ginko.

Which is basically meaningless. Which is the whole point of this thread.

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Not everyone read these forums all the time as you do nor always have such time to read them. There was no official statement being made that could have been posted to group notices or likewise to say "there is an option." In fact, there was no such thing. What you posted above is good as word-of-mouth.

Where the hell did I ever say there was a guarantee? I am not the one that trusted him with large sums of cash and didn't even question where it was going! The one missing the point is YOU. You run down these tangents and lose the point every time, and then you want to make out like some kind of victim when people try to correct your facts. That you "don't have time" to read the forum is a bullshit copout for the fact that you have been talking out of your ass, NOT LISTENING, and were unwilling to get informed. All people wanted you to do was be informed. But NOOO, you had to be a f**king victim, because you were right and so not dumb. You were a victim if you had any money with Nick - but that's where your victim status ENDS. Don't come here and argue without knowledge, and then refuse to get caught up.

When you used those colorful magic words: "f*** v****".

Oh, excellent. A new "F" word.

But there IS a guarantee.

Ginko's Guarantee.

They are the ones guaranteeing the value of the bond.

Someday.

Wont say when.

Wont say how.

But they are *good for it*

At least according to Nick P.
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Doesnt mean their guarantee is any good. But thats the guarantee.

I know this question may not belong here, but just out of curiosity: how much do you think Ginko bonds are worth at the moment, right now and as we speak, Dzonatas?

that's cause we are dealing with an obsessive compulsive type personality here who is fixated on one thing and one thing only. That regardless of who said what when and who's mouth it came out of they are wrong and face value is what it is according to them. They are trying to apply "book learning" to a situation with no book or rules and are fixated on this. Truly you are talking to a wall and realy just should ignore it as this will never change.

The problem here is that some people didn't actualy see what happened with ginko and are trying to apply some sense of standardized methods to this. Long ago nick stated that every investment he had and ginko itself was very high risk. Now all of a sudden he puts out a so called bond which he eventually force people to take because they would not voluntarily take it and calls it low risk, but nothing has changed. How can a high risk situation suddenly convert into a low risk situation? well the answer is it can't and its just "what nick says" at any given point in time. He has not even published a redemtion date (maturity date) for these things. Even perpetual bonds mature to the (insert evil word here) eventually. They are typically put out by people who won't be defaulting anytime at all not high risk situations that have gone into heavy debt and ran out of money to pay with only 25% of the assets it says it has> (again i'm using my I only believe what I see rule here so i have decided long ago that if he wont tell its cause it doesn't exist and so far it seems to have worked lol)

Anyhow you can't explain this to her because she is on a totally different page and will never get off that page because someone taught her long ago or she learned it on her own that this is the way it is with this kind of bond. The fact that he basically invented a newfangled high risk to low risk bond debt dumping scheme and gave it a name and most of what he says is BS including this bond is irrelevant to her. She is looking at this from what "normally" happens. There is nothing normal about this situation or these bonds.. and for her to think outside the box and apply meanings in a slighly different fashion just doesn't work. Some people are like this. So he must have made a mistake or lied. Well in such a thing like that there is no mistake or lie in this sense he printed a bond and gave it a value he saw fit to make it look good and called it face value (which for some bonds the face value is printed on the front) if it were a printed bond it would say 1L on the face and there would be no argument. However there is an argument simply because this paper doesn't exist and they can't think outside the box and are totally obsessed with making you and everyone using that word in the way in which it was intended for THIS bond using the word because somehow its wrong.

There is a replica of the bond someone made I saw it on the net actually I should see if i can fish it up and post it. It said 1L on the front except that nick didn't create it but at the time I saw it I wante to make a particle poofer that would poof these bonds when I saw it and sit it on ginko's doorstep (except that would make me evil and get me banned so..)

Anyhow your trying to explain something to a brick wall and the only purpose of them being in this thread is to have people who are "misusing" the book definition in here eyes stop doing it and no matter what you show her she wont be changing anytime soon because she is going to beat on you until you say she is right and everything you showed her is wrong and make you submit and change your mind. Its a no win situation I dont know why you are bothering with it unless its fun to you I dont know? For me it made me want to blow my brains out at this frustrating personality but go ahead hehe..

I'll accept any answer between 0.0L$ and 1.0L$.

Very negative, Wil. Open you mind to the possiblity of many type of people out there, or surely you just try to piss off most of them.

There is a phrase out there used quite often when doing any bit of investigation or research, and that is peer-review. Here, the only brick wall being created is the one by your own hands. Just give some facts, and your own wall might break.

What you do is try to paint a picture of someone, doesn't matter if it is true as long as you make sure people know who you are talking about, and then hint that picture is ugly and should be alienated. I would say you are bullying, but I highly doubt you actually invoke such social power.

I'm not bullying anyone i said long ago if you want to call it that its fine by me and pulled out of the argument

I will go one step further and say you are right and i am wrong and face value is what you say it is.

Eventually, I guess, but they were offered in June, so... well, my hunch is that they were offered in preparation for an engineered run.Yeah, actually I'd repressed all that; thanks for the memory-jog. Yep, in those cases they were being *sold* at L$100; dunno if there were any takers.Yep, that's how I understand what happened, where "debt" here refers to the remaining bank deposits, and a few days later, the Ginko Currency Services stuff.

Oh no, you can't do that Wilhelm.

BTW Dzonatas, if you need a new calculator just let me know.

Are you positive it is that easy?

Market value plus yield. For depositors that haven't sold, that would be 2 cents worth.

If this was a timed question, please do tell next time instead of implicitly hinting upon something.

I was patient at first, but gave up after 10 or so posts by Dzonatas.
Its repetitive and the pattern is very simple,
In each incident, she is misses or ignores a key fact, and jumps down your throat, saying "prove it prove it!" Then when you spell it out, clearly identifying where exactly she was wrong, generously giving her the benefit of the doubt, and treating her as you would a small child incapable of understanding the simplest of ideas, she suddenly changes her story. As if this somehow makes her original argument correct. Yet, she apparently is not embarrassed by this, as it does not change her attitude in the forums the next time she disagrees with something. Every time there is an inconsistency between her belief set and the plain facts being stated by others, she IMMEDIATELY jumps on the other person, and places the onus of proof on us. Every. Time.
Anyway, i gave up around post 380 of the previous thread.
Colette and Cristalle and others have shown super patience, much more than I could muster.

I'd advise that everyone follow my example and ignore her, if for nothing more than their own self-preservation, as Wilhelm has graphically described. However, i understand that it is important that misinformation not go unchallenged, lest the casual reader of these forums might get the wrong idea. So its up to you how much time you want to waste^H^H^H^H^Hspend on it. If I were you, in responding to Dzontas, try to use as little time and effort as possible, and just focus on correcting blatently incorrect information for the benefit of the onlooker. Use one sentence replies. Don't worry about repeating yourself if the one sentence didn't make a difference last time. You could type a whole page (as you have) and it still won't get through her thick skull. Your main concern is the integrity of the information in this thread, Just point out the incorrect information quickly and move on. Forget the debate. Its pointless with her.

What's 2 cents worth? Your valuation or the bonds?

Still waiting for the flame to tell me "your wrong, stupid, compulsive,.." etc ....

Can you repeat your questions as a single question? Or, should I be like others on here and avoid it?

My question was how much do you think Ginko bonds are actually worth at the moment.

Your response as I read it is:

Market value plus yield: market value now is 0.07 + yield (unknown).

And you're saying thats 0.02 for depositors that haven't sold.

You really like to twist it. Now that you been negative towards me, yep, that'll make you more popular. Happy?

What's your point Adz? Are you going to be like Wil and do a hit and run? Either that, or you'll grab a flamethrower.